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who knows he might be right about the fight he watched i think the typical judging guideline is "disregard punches unless they inflict clear damage". some judges may need a knockdown for that
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May 6, 2011 17:40
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BlindSite posted:Yeah, I don't know what I'm talking about since when I was loving in thailand and went to Patong stadium that's exactly what was said by the ring announcer, that's exactly what my friends who train MT told me and that's exactly what I was told when training there. Uhh WBC Muay Thai Rules, Section 15, Scoring Procedure posted:15.1 When the boxer uses his fists, feet, knees, and elbows as Muay Thai fighting weapons to attack his opponent powerfully, accurately, unprotectedly, and accordingly to the rules. Well I guess, its possible they might do things different in Thailand... Lumpinee Stadium Laws 1957, Item 18, Points Given posted:(7) The giving of points will be given, according to the following rules: Welp. I understand that there are a metric rear end-ton of promotions with varying rules and scoring criteria but I have never heard of a single Muay Thai event where punches didn't count at all. Its generally understood that they aren't scored as favorably as kicks, elbows, and knees but saying they don't count at all is very wrong. I haven't been to Thailand, and I've never been to Patong Stadium, and I can't find their laws posted online, I guess I can't say with certainty that punches do indeed count at Patong. What I can say is that this is a general thread, for general answers to general questions, and since its generally accepted in most of the Muay Thai world that punches do infact, count, I guess we can choose to disregard you, your friends, the gym the trained at, and the stadium you went to as outliers and not reflective of Muay Thai in general. Ciprian Maricon fucked around with this message at 19:41 on May 6, 2011 |
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May 6, 2011 19:31
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Is it true that the emphasis on elbows began as a reaction to modern laws requiring that competitors wear boxing gloves, instead of the traditional broken glass glued-on to the fists?
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May 6, 2011 20:00
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I believe that's an urban legend. Fighters did used to wrap their hands with hemp rope, which created more opportunities to open cuts on each other.
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May 6, 2011 20:40
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BlindSite posted:Yeah, I don't know what I'm talking about since when I was loving in thailand and went to Patong stadium that's exactly what was said by the ring announcer, that's exactly what my friends who train MT told me and that's exactly what I was told when training there. tell me about loving in thailand. did you catch a disease that made you dumb + wrong
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May 6, 2011 22:57
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Gomi Pile posted:tell me about loving in thailand. did you catch a disease that made you dumb + wrong i think he was admitting to being a pedophile/ a gay
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May 7, 2011 00:00
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Coitus_Interruptus posted:Uhh Keep in mind that I did say "traditional" and I may be wrong in other promotions, but it was clearly said and I am repeating verbatim "punches do not score points".
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May 7, 2011 00:05
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BlindSite posted:Keep in mind that I did say "traditional" and I may be wrong in other promotions, but it was clearly said and I am repeating verbatim "punches do not score points". I'd imagine if you went back so far that punches "didn't score" you'd be going back so far that there were rope bindings, no rounds, and no real rules anyway. Even the earliest texts we have describing Muay Thai techniques list and illustrate punches as central techniques. Its far more likely something like this happened to you. Fight Passport posted:Well, the saying “if it seems to good to be true, it usually is” held true tonight because what was marketed as a “fight” turned out to be nothing more than a 2 round demonstration. I actually paid the admission fee for this event too because it was a packed house (I’m usually able to get myself waved in without actually buying a ticket). And that was at Patong Stadium actually. Either way I wasn't calling you a bullshitter anyway, I'm pointing out that this is a thread about general stuff. Your very unique experience in Thailand, while interesting and possibly made up, isn't really reflective of organized professional Muay Thai now or maybe ever. Since this thread is intended to help introduce and integrate new fans to our beloved gay sports its probably important to point out that what you posted isn't really the norm in any way shape or form.
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May 7, 2011 02:53
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I didn't go to an exhibition I went to a card of about 6 fights, I've still got the flyer and I've got stamps in my passport I'm happy to take photos of if you think I'm full of poo poo. I can even tell you the number of the seat I sat in. I don't really want to continue arguing over this anyway. I'm happy to disagree with you and leave it at that. On an unrelated note, does anyone have a link to that video that was crapping around a while ago of Dana White with Rashad Evans wife after he got knocked out by Machida where she's hysterical and he has to take the belt into the ring.
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May 7, 2011 05:30
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BlindSite posted:I'm happy to disagree with you and leave it at that. To make this educational, you or others should find out what the scoring rules are for the stadium title belts in Thailand, and describe what they are in non-Thai MT organizations.
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May 7, 2011 06:10
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BlindSite posted:I don't really want to continue arguing over this anyway. I'm happy to disagree with you and leave it at that. No need man. I believe you and apologize for being a little passive aggressive, just trying to be funny with the "possibly made up" line. I think we can both agree though that those rules are hardly the norm and that generally speaking punches are scored in Muay Thai though generally they are given much less weight than kicks, knees, and elbows. Ciprian Maricon fucked around with this message at 07:38 on May 7, 2011 |
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May 7, 2011 07:35
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BlindSite posted:I didn't go to an exhibition I went to a card of about 6 fights, I've still got the flyer and I've got stamps in my passport I'm happy to take photos of if you think I'm full of poo poo. I can even tell you the number of the seat I sat in. i'm not convinced
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May 7, 2011 08:23
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punches are scored in muay thai hth
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May 7, 2011 12:14
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To me this was always the coolest muay thai move: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5zBlvwCUfow
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May 7, 2011 17:12
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In Boston, there's sizeable Khmer and Lao populations. Some gyms are really jingoistic about teaching pure Muay Lao and Pradal Serey, not Muay Thai. Lot of history between those countries, obviously. One of my coaches went to train with the head coach at some Muay Lao gym, and was getting these looks of death for wearing shorts with the Muay Thai script on them. He was about to get thrown out when the head coach cooled everyone down. I'm sure you could confirm the same sentiment if you ventured to the comments section of that video. But yeah, they pretty much are all the same art.
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May 7, 2011 21:17
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kimbo305 posted:In Boston, there's sizeable Khmer and Lao populations. Some gyms are really jingoistic about teaching pure Muay Lao and Pradal Serey, not Muay Thai. Lot of history between those countries, obviously. If anyone wants to see these types of rivalries there's a series of DVDs called Muay Thai: The Beginning featuring some brutal fights between from memory Burmese fighters and Thai boxers. There's also some old tale can't remember the name of it but supposedly a thai boxer was captured and killed or defeated a bunch of burmese guys in a tournament and rode off into the sunset in a bad rear end way with wives after he won his freedom. edit: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muay_Thai#Nai_Khanomtom found it. There's some interesting history to be read, some other super human martial arts reading for those interested http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Masutatsu_Oyama (founder of kyokushin) who apparently used to kill bulls with his bare hands after he ran out of what he considered fair human opponents. A while back I was going to start an origins of martial arts thread might have to put some work into that.
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May 7, 2011 23:34
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So someone on another forum brought up the argument that allowing knees and kicks towards the head of a downed opponent again (like in the Glorious Pride Days or whatever) would eliminate the "unfair" advantage that wrestlers have in American MMA nowadays. I remember that this has been discussed on here as well and I think the conclusion was that wrestlers, who are better at getting top position, would actually gain even more of an advantage if they were allowed to use kicks and knees on the ground. However people still argue that this rule would help "strikers" because then they would be allowed to use knees to defend against double leg takedowns and other kinds of takedowns where the opponent goes down on one knee to shoot in. But aren't fighters actually allowed to use knees against takedown shots even today, despite the rule against kicks on the ground?
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May 9, 2011 19:05
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Yes they are.
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May 9, 2011 19:09
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That's what I thought. Doesn't seem to help strikers much. I guess fighting is just unfair.
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May 9, 2011 19:12
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Having knees on the ground would mean more wrestlers would finish fights, IMO. Or at the very least dudes would scramble a lot more instead of hanging on and hoping for a ref standup.
1st AD fucked around with this message at 20:15 on May 9, 2011 |
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May 9, 2011 20:08
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Also it's not like people didn't LnP in PRIDE.
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May 9, 2011 20:13
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gunblade posted:However people still argue that this rule would help "strikers" because then they would be allowed to use knees to defend against double leg takedowns and other kinds of takedowns where the opponent goes down on one knee to shoot in. But aren't fighters actually allowed to use knees against takedown shots even today, despite the rule against kicks on the ground? But that's not wrestler kryptonite anyway. Wrestlers won fights with knees to the head from the top position in PRIDE.
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May 9, 2011 20:19
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Halloween Jack posted:But that's not wrestler kryptonite anyway. Wrestlers won fights with knees to the head from the top position in PRIDE. See: The Greatest Moment of Mark Coleman's Life. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i8hQczEosCc&t=6m40s
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May 9, 2011 23:08
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I was actually looking for that Coleman fight to use as an argument in the discussion. Thanks!
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May 10, 2011 06:16
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fawker posted:See: The Greatest Moment of Mark Coleman's Life. Philistine! This is the actual Greatest Moment of Mark Coleman's Life: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DS9vdoX3Ju0
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May 10, 2011 10:40
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I was hoping for a giant banana king commercial.
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May 10, 2011 11:54
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I will never not click that link. That's some slick poo poo
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May 10, 2011 14:15
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How common are concussions in MMA?
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May 10, 2011 23:27
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Sue Denim posted:How common are concussions in MMA? Well any loss of consciousness due to trauma to the head is by definition a concussion so pretty drat common. edit; hell according to some classifications you don't even need to have lost consciousness to be considered concussed, just confusion or degradation of motor skills. So any time you see a guy "rocked", that's a concussion. A Pale Horse fucked around with this message at 23:37 on May 10, 2011 |
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May 10, 2011 23:31
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Sue Denim posted:How common are concussions in MMA? Surprisingly you don't see a lot of suspensions for concussions. Obviously taking punches to the face for a career isn't what you'd call conducive to long term brain health that being said however, due to the prevalence of kickboxing, wrestling and BJJ you're less likely to end up with as much damage being done to your brain when compared to boxing. The other thing to keep in mind too is that boxing gloves are apparently worse than 4oz ones when it comes to brain damage. The argument is that the added weight to the glove combined with the extra distribution of the entirety of the force of the punch means that a fighter can take more overall damage over the course of a fight using gloves than fighting bare knuckled or with 4oz gloves while feeling less of the negative effects associated with the smaller gloves ie. broken bones, swelling etc. EDIT: The above on the glove thing is something that has been disputed by some in both sports. I'm no doctor so I don't really know how true it is, consider it food for thought. MMA is still pretty young and even the guys we consider pioneers are only just reaching the ages of 45-50ish now so there's no real long term case study you can do on what kind of impact a life of MMA fighting has on your brain when you get older. Consider too that most boxers for example will have a lot of amatuer fights before turning pro. Sugar shane Mosely for example had something like 99 fights as an amatuer and over 150 in his entire career. Compare that to Anderson silva who at 3 years younger has 34 fights, probably a few more amateur ones thrown in that I can't find a source of. That's a big difference in the mathematical number of impacts his head has suffered. MMA is in no way good for your brain, but I'd argue in a big way it's a lot less dangerous than boxing, or american football for that matter. I know you didn't ask for a comparison but boxing is known for producing old guys who end up punchy and near invalid from their brain injuries, in MMA there's simply not a long term study because of the age of the sport to quantify the data of brain injuries but by in large there seems to be almost no medical suspensions due to suspected concussions. BlindSite fucked around with this message at 01:02 on May 11, 2011 |
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May 11, 2011 00:01
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BlindSite posted:The other thing to keep in mind too is that boxing gloves are apparently worse than 4oz ones when it comes to brain damage. ehhhh
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May 11, 2011 00:11
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more like sadistic boxing refs
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May 11, 2011 00:44
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Paul Pot posted:ehhhh Yeah I always thought the reverse was true but there was an article I read that said otherwise. I should have mentioned the standing 8 count and downed counts doesn't exactly help either.
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May 11, 2011 01:00
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there hasn't been much if any serious research done on head trauma in mma. but if you read about concussions in football it's pretty disturbing
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May 11, 2011 01:02
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I adjusted my post to include what I'd read and a "this may be bullshit" disclaimer.
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May 11, 2011 01:05
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BlindSite posted:I agree that MMA is the lesser of two evils when it comes to brain damage. In MMA, fights generally stop after a flash knockout (a fairly serious brain trauma where they regain consciousness quickly) because of the ground game. Compare that to boxing where if you get a flash knockout, the ref pauses the fight. If you can recover enough to stand back up in 10 seconds, the fight continues. So there's a lot more potential to accumulate serious damage in a boxing match, and it's part of the reason that the brains of boxers have calluses develop over the front of their brains by the end of their careers. I think it was covered by Real Sports, but the major danger in contact sports is sparring and repetitive small concussions during training, rather than huge knockouts during fights. It's the daily grind kind of minor brain injuries that are more dangerous, because they accumulate over time. They put impact sensors in HS football players' helmets, and they received a lot of sub-concussive impacts over the course of a single practice, even on 'easy' days. Don't most athletic commissions hand out mandatory 30 day suspensions to all fighters on a card after an event?
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May 11, 2011 01:07
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Bundt Cake posted:there hasn't been much if any serious research done on head trauma in mma. but if you read about concussions in football it's pretty disturbing Though I don't like professional athletes using the "my brain is broke that's why I'm a poo poo human" excuse there does seem to be more and more evidence, albeit circumstantial that the excess trauma these guys would've suffered from highschool through college in the years where your frontal lobe (impulse control etc) is still developing properly could be a contributing factor as to why these guys have such poor impulse control. Many players end up with allegations of sexual assault, domestic violence and other assorted scaliwag behaviour, of course they could just be as I eluded to before poo poo humans with an over indulged sense of entitlement coupled with a less than stellar upbringing but it's at the very least something to be considered.
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May 11, 2011 01:11
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Bundt Cake posted:there hasn't been much if any serious research done on head trauma in mma. but if you read about concussions in football it's pretty disturbing there hasn't been much serious research done on head trauma in boxing either, despite what dante and fatherdog tell you
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May 11, 2011 02:50
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BlindSite posted:Though I don't like professional athletes using the "my brain is broke that's why I'm a poo poo human" excuse there does seem to be more and more evidence, albeit circumstantial that the excess trauma these guys would've suffered from highschool through college in the years where your frontal lobe (impulse control etc) is still developing properly could be a contributing factor as to why these guys have such poor impulse control. Many players end up with allegations of sexual assault, domestic violence and other assorted scaliwag behaviour, of course they could just be as I eluded to before poo poo humans with an over indulged sense of entitlement coupled with a less than stellar upbringing but it's at the very least something to be considered. Case in point: War Machine.
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May 11, 2011 03:42
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Bundt Cake posted:No one based in TKD has ever done poo poo, 
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May 11, 2011 03:52
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