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Also, if you want Space Persia look to the Thousand Sons. In addition to the obvious Egyptian theme, A Thousand Sons gives them a distinct Persian undercurrent, especially Zoroastrianism - one of their main characters is even named Ahriman.
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Aug 28, 2014 16:37
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At least the black Marines are the good guys and not the thieves of the Space Marines.
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Aug 28, 2014 17:08
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maev posted:The Word Bearers were goth pale in the descriptions from the Word Bearers trilogy, while this might be ten thousand years of warp skin lightening I always thought they resembled highly ornate Catholic madmen. Choosing to render them dusky skinned or 'persian' as ADB said isn't bad in itself, but is clearly a bit of a space muslim vibe. You can call it babylonian or 'abrahamic' but it doesn't stand entirely well with me that the most fanatical religious evil marines are now middle eastern. ADB's word bearers are pale also, if I remember correctly. The native people on that planet that the Ultramarines toasted were the dusky-skinned ones. Edit: other highly fanatical religious evil marines: Black Templars, Red Hunters, Raptor cult troops and cult troops in general... Word Bearers are the only Chaos marine legion to have religion as their central shtick but they hardly have a monopoly on it in the 40k universe. I say this as someone who generally goes out of his way to get offended about this sort of thing. If ADB actually changed them to be super tan or whatever, I might see it. Edit again: to be clear, I might be wrong about what ADB wrote. Post some quotes and I'll change my tune. Sulecrist fucked around with this message at 17:33 on Aug 28, 2014 |
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Aug 28, 2014 17:14
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kanonvandekempen posted:You don't see how a bunch of religious zealots, with brown skin, from a desert environment remind you of a certain group of people on earth? And when those religious zealots are made out to be the most evil space marines of all the evil space marines, you don't think that's problematic? Yeah sounds pretty anti-semitic to me too. If you want space arabs that's Tallarn. berzerkmonkey posted:No, no - you're all wrong! When people race to conclusions like that, they are protecting the downtrodden who obviously can't speak for themselves. And not like golden like a tan, golden as in literally inked in gold tattoos VanSandman posted:At least the black Marines are the good guys and not the thieves of the Space Marines. I was legit annoyed when they retconned them to not actually be black people OXBALLS DOT COM fucked around with this message at 21:00 on Aug 28, 2014 |
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Aug 28, 2014 20:57
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Salamanders moved into our system a week ago, and all our pict screens are missing? Heretics
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Aug 28, 2014 21:11
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Cream_Filling posted:Yeah sounds pretty anti-semitic to me too. Celestial Lions are legit black in ADB's Blood and Fire and seem to be rater cool guys, as far as Dorn-descended chapters go.
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Aug 28, 2014 21:31
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Cream_Filling posted:
Wasn't it Ward who did the "they're black because of a flaw in their gene-seed!" retcon? Maybe it can be ret-retconned now that he is gone.
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Aug 28, 2014 21:52
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It isn't a flaw - their geneseed darkens their skin as a protection against to the high levels of radiation of their homeworld.
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Aug 28, 2014 21:57
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PupsOfWar posted:Wasn't it Ward who did the "they're black because of a flaw in their gene-seed!" retcon? No for once it wasn't Ward that did that, that was Nick Kyme in the Salamanders stories and if you really believe him then it was the editor or something like that who forced him to make the change. So it was stupidity and/or executive meddling that caused the retcon.
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Aug 28, 2014 22:21
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berzerkmonkey posted:It isn't a flaw - their geneseed darkens their skin as a protection against to the high levels of radiation of their homeworld. I distinctively remember they were actually black in the old editions.
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Aug 28, 2014 22:22
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berzerkmonkey posted:It isn't a flaw - their geneseed darkens their skin as a protection against to the high levels of radiation of their homeworld. I thought this was the Salamanders, who are black skin/red eyes a la Darth Maul.
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Aug 28, 2014 22:24
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kanonvandekempen posted:You don't see how a bunch of religious zealots, with brown skin, from a desert environment remind you of a certain group of people on earth? And when those religious zealots are made out to be the most evil space marines of all the evil space marines, you don't think that's problematic? lol was this poo poo written with a straight face?
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Aug 28, 2014 22:42
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Any opinion on Gav Thorpe? I heard he was not very good and i need to know if that is true because i was given a Omnibus writen by him.
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Aug 28, 2014 22:49
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Sramaker posted:Any opinion on Gav Thorpe? I heard he was not very good and i need to know if that is true because i was given a Omnibus writen by him. He's pretty bad, but if the damage is done and you already have the book, go ahead and try it, you can always dump it later if it's awful.
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Aug 28, 2014 23:03
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Sramaker posted:No for once it wasn't Ward that did that, that was Nick Kyme in the Salamanders stories and if you really believe him then it was the editor or something like that who forced him to make the change. I don't believe him, I think it was him. Either that or Kyme tried to be "culturally sensitive" and the editor's butthole started puckering at Nick Kyme's depiction of black people and said, you know what Nick, the contracts are already signed so why don't we just say that they're not actually black they just have magic black skin.
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Aug 29, 2014 01:14
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Mechafunkzilla posted:I thought this was the Salamanders, who are black skin/red eyes a la Darth Maul. Yeah it is - VanSandman posted: "At least the black Marines are the good guys and not the thieves of the Space Marines.." and I assume he was talking about Salamanders...
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Aug 29, 2014 02:03
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The thieves of the Space Marines would be the generically white Blood Ravens.
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Aug 29, 2014 02:23
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Night Lords no?
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Aug 29, 2014 02:24
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Waroduce posted:Night Lords no? They're more terrorists in the purest sense of the word. Blood Ravens are the ones with a tendency to grab everything that isn't nailed down and bring a crowbar for the things that are.
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Aug 29, 2014 02:44
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Night Lords are terrorists on a scale that would make Al Quaeda or the Ustasha look like girl scouts. The theft is just a small side benefit.
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Aug 29, 2014 02:45
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Cythereal posted:They're more terrorists in the purest sense of the word. Blood Ravens are the ones with a tendency to grab everything that isn't nailed down and bring a crowbar for the things that are. And then they steal the nails too. On a more serious note, how is Down Amongst the Dead Men? Or Baneblade and its spinoff short stories? I'm especially keen on the second one because, you know, Baneblade.
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Aug 29, 2014 03:00
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Cythereal posted:They're more terrorists in the purest sense of the word. Blood Ravens are the ones with a tendency to grab everything that isn't nailed down and bring a crowbar for the things that are. The Blood Ravens have that in common with the Thousands Sons or at least the pre-Heresy ones.
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Aug 29, 2014 03:02
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Sramaker posted:The Blood Ravens have that in common with the Thousands Sons or at least the pre-Heresy ones. Isn't it more like, the Thousand Sons were interested in acquiring and cataloging artifacts, but it wasn't like the fanon version of the Blood Ravens where they're like, "Oh, yeah, we just found this Custodes bolter lying on a battlefield, it's ours now"?
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Aug 29, 2014 03:09
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JerryLee posted:Isn't it more like, the Thousand Sons were interested in acquiring and cataloging artifacts, but it wasn't like the fanon version of the Blood Ravens where they're like, "Oh, yeah, we just found this Custodes bolter lying on a battlefield, it's ours now"? Uh, it's not exactly fanon when the Blood Raven armories include relics of around thirty different Space Marine chapters (some turned to Chaos), the Custodes, the Sisters of Battle, the Inquisition, and a freaking daemon primarch's weapon, assuming the Dawn of War games are canon. Blood Magpies.
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Aug 29, 2014 04:32
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And a ton of those items have flavor text like "This bolter bears the mark of the Blood Angels; nobody knows how it came to be in the Blood Raven armory" or "The Blood Ravens looted this off of a Gray Knight's corpse" or "This thing owned by the Blood Ravens dates back to the Great Crusade and nobody knows of any legit way they could have gotten their hands on it".
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Aug 29, 2014 04:47
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Khizan posted:And a ton of those items have flavor text like "This bolter bears the mark of the Blood Angels; nobody knows how it came to be in the Blood Raven armory" or "The Blood Ravens looted this off of a Gray Knight's corpse" or "This thing owned by the Blood Ravens dates back to the Great Crusade and nobody knows of any legit way they could have gotten their hands on it". Or the gun located next to an inquistors corpse. Man, remember when I had my first argument with Baron Bifford over this? Good times.
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Aug 29, 2014 05:02
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Or the Chaos items with descriptions like "We peeled this off a dead Alpha Legion marine back in Dawn of War 1," or "This was retrieved from a Death Guard battleship."
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Aug 29, 2014 05:19
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Cythereal posted:Uh, it's not exactly fanon when the Blood Raven armories include relics of around thirty different Space Marine chapters (some turned to Chaos), the Custodes, the Sisters of Battle, the Inquisition, and a freaking daemon primarch's weapon, assuming the Dawn of War games are canon. Blood Magpies. Right, I might have phrased that poorly but I didn't want people to think I was representing a 1d4chan article as full-blown canon. 
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Aug 29, 2014 05:34
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Oh uh i thought there was another chapter/legion that did that before the Blood Ravens were created, oh well sorry.
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Aug 29, 2014 05:58
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Sramaker posted:Any opinion on Gav Thorpe? I heard he was not very good and i need to know if that is true because i was given a Omnibus writen by him. JerryLee posted:Right, I might have phrased that poorly but I didn't want people to think I was representing a 1d4chan article as full-blown canon.
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Aug 29, 2014 06:11
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SRM posted:I read his Last Chancers omnibus when I won it in the first or second Oath thread. It was merely okay. It was basically the Dirty Dozen in space and it was readable. Any opinion on his Path of the Farseer, Path of the Outcast, Malekith, Shadow King and Caledor? I searched on google for reviews or similar stuff but didn't find any useful one.
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Aug 29, 2014 06:27
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Sramaker posted:Any opinion on his Path of the Farseer, Path of the Outcast, Malekith, Shadow King and Caledor? I searched on google for reviews or similar stuff but didn't find any useful one. The Eldar Path books are bad.
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Aug 29, 2014 06:37
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Finished Vengeful Spirit, pretty long for a HH book and most of it was pointless and disjointed. Nice story about a new perpetual woman who made a promise to JOHN! She says Okay a lot, this is weird and funny plus Abnett wrote it so lets write it again. She reads a danish book (or is it from the ancient Faroes of Gyptia?!) to her kids and brainwashes some ultramarines to help her lock a door she doesn't actually lock but ok thanks mcneil for this story. Also a Blood Angel climbs a tower. Perpetuals are beyond tiresome, Abnett pulls off John decently occasionally but then more and more are added and they start doing increasingly more important stuff and other authors take charge of them then all of a sudden the Horus Heresy has at its core a bunch of Highlander immortals calling huge shots from nowhere, stabbing Vulkan recruiting the Alpha Legion locking the Door on Molech and so on. Garviel Loken is insufferable as are his band of chuckle brothers. Legion stereotypes together in a squad follows predictable lines. Multiple times Chaos makes 'offers' and are rejected Cartoon Network style in what seems to be exactly the same scene over and over but with different names. Horus' offer to Loken and the subsequent rejection just makes the HH series weaker and more one dimensional. It would have actually been interesting and unexpected if it occurred differently but that's already expecting overmuch from Mcneil's book. The book would have benefited a great deal from a massive refocusing towards the key players in the book which had the basic ideas done well. The Sons of Horus and their gradual descent into Cthonian tradition and melding it with Chaos, the new direction of the legion and the Mournival, Fulgrim and Mortarion getting more than spot appearances. I enjoyed the plot device but it was far too few pages and the slog to get to it felt like a waste of my time indulging McNeil's bad writing and story telling. I've really enjoyed other McNeil books but this one sets itself up with so much then proceeds to waste space with pointless characters, side stories and indulgences that it hurt to read most of the time.
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Aug 29, 2014 11:56
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I thought it was fairly interesting that with the Unremembered Empire audiobook, the perpetuals were the only characters in 40k I've ever heard voiced with american accents. I like listening to the audiobooks before I reread if I can, just to hear if there's anything I didn't pick up on during the first read. The only thing that I don't like, but they can't really help, is the reading of primarchs. You have these massive demigods whose voices should come out like thunder and the reader doesn't really capture that but they're not really audio dramas either but hearing Magnus sound like an accountant is off-putting. Poor Angron sounded like an angry Barney Gumble from the simpsons. I did like how soft and kind Lorgar sounded though.
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Aug 29, 2014 13:05
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Khizan posted:And a ton of those items have flavor text like "This bolter bears the mark of the Blood Angels; nobody knows how it came to be in the Blood Raven armory" or "The Blood Ravens looted this off of a Gray Knight's corpse" or "This thing owned by the Blood Ravens dates back to the Great Crusade and nobody knows of any legit way they could have gotten their hands on it". The best part about the Blood Raven flavour text were the items they made themselves. The text was like, 'this power axe was made to honour the noble Space Wolf, Ragnar Blackmane but when we tried to give it to him he laughed at us and told us to gently caress off so I guess you can have it now.'
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Aug 29, 2014 13:15
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Blood Ravens are loyal 1000 sons so it makes sense in a way.
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Aug 29, 2014 13:45
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Sandweed posted:Blood Ravens are loyal 1000 sons so it makes sense in a way. whoa whoa, lets not go crazy here. Blood Ravens are a lovely chapter made up by Relic/THQ to sell DoW games.
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Aug 29, 2014 13:47
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As opposed to lovely chapters made up to sell plastic miniatures
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Aug 29, 2014 14:11
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Kegslayer posted:The best part about the Blood Raven flavour text were the items they made themselves. The text was like, 'this power axe was made to honour the noble Space Wolf, Ragnar Blackmane but when we tried to give it to him he laughed at us and told us to gently caress off so I guess you can have it now.' There's also a funny one where they try to give a sword to either the Black Templars or Blood Angels, I forget which, and their chapter master goes "Blood Ravens? Who? Never heard of them."
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Aug 29, 2014 14:19
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maev posted:As opposed to lovely chapters made up to sell plastic miniatures And books, but at least those lovely chapters are legit/canon.
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Aug 29, 2014 14:19
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