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Latest news: Etrian Mystery Dungeon out April 7th in the US; Untold 2 this Summer! What is It? Etrian Odyssey began as Sekaiju no Meikyuu (世界樹の迷宮 or 'Labyrinth of Yggdrasil'), brainchild of Kazuya Niinou. He wanted to make a game that recalled the old first-person dungeons crawlers of his youth, like Wizardry and Bard's Tale. Defying everyone's expectations, including his, the series achieved a quietly prosperous level of success which sustained it through 4 mainline titles (with a 5th in the wings), 2 remakes and, most recently, collaborations with the Mysterious Dungeon and Persona series. How did it happen? First, because the developers continued to refine and tweak the formula since its inception. Each of the main games have built on the ones before, maintaining the same basic concepts while rebalancing the mechanics and the numbers behind them. People can and do quibble about the details, but each successive entry in the series has worked better as a game than the ones before. Second, because it turns out the combination of a challenging difficulty curve where failure leaves you with the foreknowledge to do better next time, chiptunes and cartography is really, REALLY addictive. The previous megathread ran 200+ pages across several years of goons talking about mapping, party builds and battle strategy. It's easier now than ever before to get into the series. Getting out is much harder because there's really nothing else quite like it on the market today. Art insert for EOIV bonus booklet by Alexandra 'Lexxy' Douglass (click to view her tumblr) The Games: Nintendo DS: OG dungeon crawling action! Possibly OG 1.5 since there's so much Wizardry DNA in there. The original trilogy established all the features the series is known for: first-person dungeon crawling, using the bottom screen of the DS to draw your own map; a customizable 5-member party you can develop as you see fit; and of course the F.O.E. Represented in the original games by fuzzy floating orbs of various colors, these are powerful enemies that appear on the map and move with each step you take, or turn that passes in battle. They can also join battles already in progress. Don't be deceived by appearances! Bambi's mum will more than likely wreck your poo poo. Of the 3 games, EOIII features major improvements in playability as well as the series' most distinctive class list. The first two aren't bad by any means, and many of the posters in this thread owe their addiction to playing them. However, with faithful-but-more-polished remakes of I & II available on the 3DS, there's little to recommend them beyond historical curiosity. If you want to try the series, and you only have a DS, buy EOIII. Nintendo 3DS: The great leap forward! Right off the bat, the series' move to the 3DS allowed for many improvements. Better graphics capabilities resulted in far superior draw distance while exploring the labyrinth, as well as actual enemy models so you can tell a a F.O.E's facing and what it is before you fight it. And this is all before you get to the mechanical improvements: EOIV has a smaller class selection than other entries, but it's easily the most balanced. The game can be completed with almost any party composition, and there are no 'traps' in the skill tree resulting in wasted points on useless skills. If you want to give the series a try, start with Etrian Odyssey IV. 'Untold' is the moniker applied to the remakes of the first two games in the original trilogy. In addition to the graphical improvements of EOIV, they also added a Story Mode. Story mode restricts your party composition to the 5 classes you start with, but they're a powerful, flexible mix. In exchange, your characters get, well, actual character: voice acted dialogue, plot, etc. Fairly bare-bones by JRPG standards but for some players that means the difference between trying the series and not, and who can complain about that? Both remakes also feature a Classic Mode, allowing you to explore the Labyrinth with whatever combination of classes you choose. The remakes do have a downside, however: classic mode eschews the carefully balanced skill & class selection of EOIV for something closer to the original games. There are very clear winners and losers there. Instead of subclassing they introduced the Grimoire system. In theory this is a good way to branch out the story party's skillset and jury-rig subclassing into the classic mode parties. In practice it's a confusing mess at the mercy of the RNG. Collaborations: Etrian Mystery Dungeon is another throwback of sorts, a Rogue-like developed under the umbrella of Square's long-running Mystery Dungeon series, which you may already be familiar with in its Chocobo and Pokemon-related flavors. You still make a 5 person party, but now map layout and enemy placement is randomized and you've got to consider each character's position on the map individually. Talking about Rogue-likes in-depth is a little beyond the scope of this thread, but there are alternatives. There is a good chance, however, many of the posters here will buy this one too. Persona Q is an honest-to-God canonical spinoff/crossover of Persona 3&4. It owes more in gameplay and art style to the Etrian series than Persona (in particular, the mapping and FOE aspects) but this too has its own, dedicated thread where you can discuss super important topics like whether Kanji still counts as a gold-star gay after he fingerbangs the robot. Overall: good game, if you enjoyed it without being familiar with the Etrian series, there's a good chance you'd enjoy exploring Labyrinths in Etria as well. General F.A.Q
Artist's depiction of a typical F.O.E Useful Links
Rangpur fucked around with this message at 21:47 on Mar 19, 2015 |
# ? Mar 11, 2015 03:53 |
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# ? Jun 10, 2024 11:07 |
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Series Overview: aka The Quest for Balance The core of the series' gameplay remains the same across all entries (spin offs like Mystery Dungeon excepted), but Atlus continues to tinker with the math and the overall balance with each new game. Usually for the better, but ocassionally... less so. If you would like to try one of the older games, this will also serve as a way of knowing just how much typical Atlus bullshit you're in for. Etrian Odyssey Class List: Landsknecht, Protector, Alchemist, Survivalist, Medic, Troubadour, Dark Hunter, Ronin, Hexer (For this and future games, the spoiler'd classes are unlocked as you advance the story. These are not considered big secrets when discussing game mechanics, and will not be blanked out beyond this post, but they are spoilered here as a courtesy to those of you just looking for basic information on the individual games.) As the game that launched the series, almost everything that makes EO distinct has its start in this one. However, it also lacks many of the quality-of-life improvements added later. The mapping tools are bareboned, you can't sidestep while exploring, there's no auto-battle function, or item storage... But its biggest design issue is the utter lack of context when it comes to picking and improving skills. The only reason that information exists is slow and painful experimentation on the part of the more dedicated fans. If you change your mind, respeccing isn't available until level 30, it costs you 10 levels, and there's no good way to speed the grinding process up. This becomes a major problem when you unlock the extra classes, because it requires starting a character from scratch when your main party is already likely to be settled. However, while I am hard on the game (and I really can't emphasize enough how much better EOIII is if you want/need a recommendation for one of the DS games) it does have strong points. For one thing, the classes are all balanced, in the sense they are all good at what they're meant to do. A bog standard RPG party of Landsknecht/Protector in front, and Medic/Alchemist/Survivalist in the rear can meet any challenge in the game. It is also the only game to feature healing springs, which are a godsend for long expeditions and level grinding. Etrian Odyssey II: Heroes of High Lagaard Class List: Landsknecht, Protector, Alchemist, Survivalist, Medic, Troubadour, Dark Hunter, Ronin, Hexer, War Magus, Gunner, Beast Etrian Odyssey II was released unusually hard on the heels of the first game. Because of this, it is unfairly criticized as an 'expansion pack.' However it is no smaller than the first game in any measure. On the other hand, it does seem to have been designed to challenge people who already finished the first game, and it entirely fairly criticized for poor QA. The Japanese version was very buggy; the NA version less so, but a couple of skills don't work correctly. Notably, this is also the only game that allows you to tie your old file together via a very, very long password. This imports your Guild's name, a handful of nerfed endgame bonuses, and lots and lots of extra 'gently caress you' events. What else changed?
Etrian Odyssey III: The Drowned City Class List: Arbalist, Buccaneer, Farmer, Gladiator, Hoplite, Monk, Ninja, Prince/ss, Wildling, Zodiac, Shogun, Yggdroid Third, and most polished of the original DS trilogy. It also has the most content, despite a 25 floor Labyrinth instead of the previous games' 30 floors. Although the class lineup is radically different, most of them are roughly equivalent to a class from EOI&II. Hoplites are tanks, Monks are Medics, Zodiacs are Alchemists, etc. Ninja and Wildling deserve special mention--they both make use of that 6th formation slot that's always gone unfilled until now. But they can't both use it at the same time. Farmers meanwhile, are exactly what they sound like. A party of 5 Farmers is the tradional way of making money in the game until you unlock sub-classing. (Then it's Ninja/Farmers.) New to this Game:
Etrian Odyssey IV: Legends of the Titan Class List: Dancer, Fortress, Landsknecht, Medic, Nightseeker, Runemaster, Sniper, Arcanist, Bushi, Imperial When it comes to recommending a 3DS title to sample Etrian Odyssey, the reason EOIV gets the nod over either of the Untold games is simple: balance. The classes are all carefully designed to function on their own, and synergize well. Nearly any party composition can work in EOIV, and the solo class challenges exist to prove it. The trade-off is that there are fewer total classes than EOIII, and the real oddities like Ninja & Farmer are gone. The biggest complaint is that the Labyrinths are smaller, and individually they are; but between side areas and the world map itself there's still plenty of ground to cover. New to this Game:
More to come later. Rangpur fucked around with this message at 02:17 on Mar 20, 2015 |
# ? Mar 11, 2015 03:56 |
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Guys, I have a suspicion that EOU2 might actually be awesome.
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 04:00 |
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As imbalanced as Story mode might be, I might try that first instead of Classic. Also, the Jack Frost Gunner is the best portrait in the entire series.
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 04:17 |
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Pureauthor posted:Guys, I have a suspicion that EOU2 might actually be awesome. Me too. I can't wait to find out what all this squirrel nonsense is about.
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 04:17 |
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Dr. Fetus posted:As imbalanced as Story mode might be, I might try that first instead of Classic. Also, the Jack Frost Gunner is the best portrait in the entire series. OG Protector 4 life.
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 04:23 |
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Should probably be somewhere in the OP.
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 04:28 |
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Here's to another 1000 posts about inputting numbers and getting different numbers output. Super excited for Untold 2! Pureauthor posted:OG Protector 4 life. Actually I think you'll find that the best character design is <-- right over here
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 04:28 |
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Just a heads up, Mystery Dungeon is more a Chunsoft thing than a Square thing - Chunsoft created and owns the IP and I think the Chocobo game is the only one they didn't also make.
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 04:46 |
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Is Mystery Dungeon gonna have skill point allocation? Because I hate that poo poo and as boring as a lot of Persona Q was at least it got rid of it.
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 04:48 |
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Controversial opinion: Untold story is worth playing entirely for the canadian party girl.
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 05:00 |
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Countblanc posted:Is Mystery Dungeon gonna have skill point allocation? Because I hate that poo poo and as boring as a lot of Persona Q was at least it got rid of it. It's kind of the core mechanic of the series so uh no
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 05:01 |
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Countblanc posted:Is Mystery Dungeon gonna have skill point allocation? Because I hate that poo poo and as boring as a lot of Persona Q was at least it got rid of it.
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 05:08 |
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I'm excited for EMD, but I think it's a party of 4 max instead of the usual 5. Does anyone know if you control the whole party or just the pointman? Videos of the game make it really unclear.
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 05:09 |
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Lakbay posted:I'm excited for EMD, but I think it's a party of 4 max instead of the usual 5. Does anyone know if you control the whole party or just the pointman? Videos of the game make it really unclear. I think you can switch between 1PC/3AI and 4PC turn based but I'm not certain.
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 05:11 |
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I am well pleased by the thread title.
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 05:11 |
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Lakbay posted:I'm excited for EMD, but I think it's a party of 4 max instead of the usual 5. Does anyone know if you control the whole party or just the pointman? Videos of the game make it really unclear. Same as Pokemon Mystery Dungeon, You can only control one member at a time. I have no idea how difficult that game is, but looking at other accounts of the game, it seems like it's easier than Shiren the Wanderer. No idea how it compares to PMD.
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 05:13 |
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I'm interested in finding out the 'correct' approach to exploration. During the demo livestream they stuck to using a single character, which goes against all my instincts in an EO game. Trying to control & position a 4 member party in a roguelike was one of the main aspects I found intriguing, so I hope it's balanced around using a full lineup.
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 05:17 |
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Hivac posted:It's kind of the core mechanic of the series so uh no Sorry I was under the impression that the core mechanic of the game was combat, my b.
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 05:25 |
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I am... confused by what you think they'd use as a replacement for a skill point-based system of character growth/customization. That flexibility is nearly always considered a point in the series' favor, if anything. You could replace with Materia, or a License board or any of a number of other systems, I just don't think it would be an improvement. EDIT: Unless you're referring to EMD specifically? In which case I still have no idea, because I was under the impression most Roguelikes did something similar.
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 05:37 |
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As another take on the difficulty question, I think it would also be accurate to say the games are very difficult at the start because you are so limited in your options. Once your characters have enough skill points to unlock some options worth using, you can start actually responding to the threats the game throws at you instead of running from them. Etrian Odyssey 4 is often said to be the easiest game in the series, but I think that's just because of how they streamlined the skill trees. Meanwhile 2 is considered to be the hardest, and that game has the most frustrating skill point tax out of all of them.
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 05:40 |
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they really should make the return on investment uniform, or failing that not completely retarded some of the time
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 05:40 |
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Rangpur posted:I am... confused by what you think they'd use as a replacement for a skill point-based system of character growth/customization. That flexibility is nearly always considered a point in the series' favor, if anything. You could replace with Materia, or a License board or any of a number of other systems, I just don't think it would be an improvement. I mean, I guess an auto-levelling option that allocates your skill points for you, maybe based on your choice of one of a short list of build options, would be possible to implement and wouldn't be the worst thing in the world for people who don't want to fiddle with character customisation. Even that would start to get complicated once you introduced features like subclassing, though. Cake Attack posted:they really should make the return on investment uniform, or failing that not completely retarded some of the time EO4 was mostly pretty consistent about that, at least for active skills: small power increases with no downside at most skill ranks, and big breakpoints at 50% and 100% investment with a significant increase in both TP cost and effectiveness. Passive skills still got a little weird sometimes, but in general you got the largest benefit from the first point you invested and smaller benefits with gradually diminishing returns after that.
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 05:49 |
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The DS games were really imbalanced. EO1 had Defender and Immunize. EO2 has a lot of things, but the Hexer stands out as the most broken class. EO3 had subclassing, which completely shattered any bit of difficulty in the game. And Warrior Might.Rangpur posted:I'm interested in finding out the 'correct' approach to exploration. During the demo livestream they stuck to using a single character, which goes against all my instincts in an EO game. Trying to control & position a 4 member party in a roguelike was one of the main aspects I found intriguing, so I hope it's balanced around using a full lineup. The Wanderer skillset looks like it benefits a lot from using them solo. Some of their skills are terrible to have in a team, like they have the ability to make a getaway from enemies. Which only affects them.
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 06:00 |
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Thuryl posted:I mean, I guess an auto-levelling option that allocates your skill points for you, maybe based on your choice of one of a short list of build options, would be possible to implement and wouldn't be the worst thing in the world for people who don't want to fiddle with character customisation. Even that would start to get complicated once you introduced features like subclassing, though. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe in one of the streams it was shown that EMD has exactly that. LightningSquid fucked around with this message at 06:31 on Mar 11, 2015 |
# ? Mar 11, 2015 06:28 |
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Woo, ground floor. I love this series and I'm really psyched for EOU2, should be great. I'll probably buy all the DLC though.
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 10:53 |
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Smdh if you buy the hot springs DLC
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 11:10 |
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Pureauthor posted:Smdh if you buy the hot springs DLC Day 1 preorder if possible.
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 11:34 |
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Doesn't the hot springs one lock off part of the 14th floor, along with one other DLC? Do the unique monsters have spaces in the Codex? If yes, then drat straight I'm buying all of it, regardless of how terrible it is. Not all at once though, I'm not that crazy.
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 13:10 |
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The hotsprings DLC does have a unique boss that counts as part of the Codex. If you really want 100% completion, but don't want to deal with the creepy stuff, then play that part in Classic mode. There's no hotspring scenes there, it's just an extra boss you have to fight, like a bunch of the other DLC.
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 13:47 |
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I just want to fight that frog boss. How can I be finished with the game if I haven't killed everything in the Labyrinth?
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 14:16 |
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Volt Catfish posted:Controversial opinion: Untold story is worth playing entirely for the canadian party girl. The only controversy is whether this opinion is correct or super-correct.
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 15:13 |
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Counterpoint: Arthur.
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 15:26 |
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Arthur is the only story-mode character that I like Pureauthor posted:Smdh if you buy the hot springs DLC Except if you play it in Classic. No anime nudes there and 100% codex completition.
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 16:05 |
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Txn posted:Arthur is the only story-mode character that I like
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 16:47 |
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Raquna was the only interesting part of story mode. The other characters were static and uninteresting, and the actual story was a cliche and a much less interesting version of EO1's plot. I hope EO2U's story mode is better, but I'm not holding out too much hope for it. At least there's no moral ambiguity to butcher this time.
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 17:17 |
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For as powerful as KoF is, I hope that EOU2's plot focuses more on the actual main character because holy crap while I like Frederica's design she is such a boring character. Also, EOU brought up stuff about the Highlanders early on and to my knowledge it pretty much got dropped and I don't think it was ever brought up again beyond some vague mention later. Also gruff anime tank is a pretty cool character design.
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 17:22 |
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I'm currently doing the coolest Untold quest to get five Gold Antlers. I've gotten three in half an hour. Woo. I kinda liked the Highlander when you could act goofy and get everyone flustered. Thankfully you can do the same for U2, if I remember right from that stream way way back.
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 17:47 |
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Crosspeice posted:I'm currently doing the coolest Untold quest to get five Gold Antlers. I've gotten three in half an hour. Woo. The best quest in Untold is the "Spend 5 days on the 8th floor" one. Just set an auto walk path in the Wyvern's room and press GO. Be sure to make the path cross the center spot where the Wyvern shoots lightning cause watching your party ram it's face into it a few times every couple of laps out of the corner of your eye never really gets old.
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 19:44 |
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# ? Jun 10, 2024 11:07 |
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So I've been playing Etrian Odyssey 3 and just got access to Yggdroids and I know people say they arn't a great class but I'm interested in trying them out. I was just wondering what people think would be the best subclass for them? I was thinking of going for monk and using Ascetic Deeds and Breakfire Fist to off set the damage from Overheat and then maybe the Red Bot to chase the fire from my punches.
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# ? Mar 11, 2015 20:07 |