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Gapey Joe Stalin posted:Being worried about house-based reading judgements implies that you will forgo comfort and true expression in your own home for the sake of perceived conformity. That is really pathetically sad on multiple levels. I agree with stalin Lol if you do not proudly display literature such as The Outcast Dead and the Ultramarine omnibuses next to DragonLance The Annotated Chronicals and the novelizations of the Transformer movies Simply lol
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May 4, 2015 01:43
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I'd judge a person by how messy their living area is over what books are on their shelf. Unless it's Hitler Did Nothing Wrong and Glenn Beck: An American Legend in a light box.
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May 4, 2015 01:46
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I personally vet and assess every guest that will be coming to my house and assemble an appropriate book shelf for the image I wish to convey. Like if a hot girl is coming over I'll have some Dostoevsky and Sartre out to make her think I'm deep but totally have 50 shades tucked discreetly to one side so she knows I'm down to bone. This is a joke. Girls get to see the same silly spaceman books as everyone else since every other book I own is on a Kindle at the moment due to moving countries twice in the past few years and not being able to take a small library of books with me. Also girls never see the inside of my house.
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May 4, 2015 03:08
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Reading this thread is making me re-think about having my signed copy of Mein Kampf proudly displayed on my mantle piece.
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May 4, 2015 08:29
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I would be far more judgemental of someone with a bookshelf of carefully chosen "classic" titles that scream "I don't actually read widely" than someone with a mish mash of w/e te hell they wanted to read.
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May 4, 2015 10:31
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itt we are being shamefully self-conscious about reading bad pulp if you enjoy reading bad pulp, at least own that, there's nothing shameful about it unless you completely sperg out on it, in which case it's the sperging that's shameful and not the pulp
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May 4, 2015 11:55
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I understand where Zephyrine is coming from. I don't keep books unless I really like them and would read them again if given time. A lot of 40k stuff does not make that cut. As far as letting vast bookshelves of McNeill "define" you, I understand that too. I don't judge people for liking porn, but if I walked into someone's house and he had a giant framed myfreecams screenshot displayed unironically over his couch, it would define my impression of him.
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May 4, 2015 12:20
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you really shouldn't be reading only pulp though if you enjoy reading, one would hope you'd make the occasional foray into more sophisticated literature
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May 4, 2015 12:27
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V. Illych L. posted:you really shouldn't be reading only pulp though I don't think anyone else on either side of the discussion is talking about a situation where the only books in the house are lovely genre fiction paperbacks. That's much weirder than merely having a ~~collection~~ dominated by Black Library. Sulecrist fucked around with this message at 12:38 on May 4, 2015 |
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May 4, 2015 12:34
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V. Illych L. posted:you really shouldn't be reading only pulp though I did finish Atlas shrugged recently. Not going on the mantle either. Even though I agreed with the message. It's just too ham fisted. I worry that someone who genuinely liked the book might see it and strike up a conversation I'm not interested in. It's the reason I don't display the wheel of time books because I considered the series below average. Ups and downs. Mostly downs. a 4/10. Wheel of time fans are like cryptonite for me now and I have to pretend that I haven't read the books to avoid discussions. 1984 is worst of all because most people who reference it have never read it. And the book itself seems horrendously irrelevant in an age where we film and document our own lives in minute detail and then publish it for the world without the government even having to lift a finger.
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May 4, 2015 12:49
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I once went on a date with a girl and brought a WH40K book with me to read on the train, and she saw it my bag during the date and said it was funny I was reading trashy sci fi books, then later when we got to her place she had actual Warhammer fantasy figurines in her living room standing out to dry after a fresh paint job. Then it was just the straight to bonetown from there. It was the 1st Soul Drinkers omnibus
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May 4, 2015 12:56
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Zephyrine posted:I did finish Atlas shrugged recently. Not going on the mantle either. Even though I agreed with the message. It's just too ham fisted. I worry that someone who genuinely liked the book might see it and strike up a conversation I'm not interested in. I'm currently reading 1984 as its one of those books Ive heard so much about and figure why the hell not. With that sort of stuff I like to read it so I can get an idea of the mindset of the writer back then. Not because I want to be cultural or any such wank. Many of the "must read" books I've read have been utter shite. Where as many of the Black Library books have grabbed me far more than any considered "serious"
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May 4, 2015 13:10
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Zephyrine posted:I did finish Atlas shrugged recently. Not going on the mantle either. Even though I agreed with the message. It's just too ham fisted. I worry that someone who genuinely liked the book might see it and strike up a conversation I'm not interested in. so you're saying that actually existing mass surveillance and makes a cultural anticipation of such a society less relevant? e. wait you agreed with the message of atlas shrugged which part of the message, exactly? the one where everyone who disagrees with ayn rand is a hideous villain and deserves to die in a train crash or the one where gold has magically objective value or what
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May 4, 2015 13:11
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Which is worse, a shelf full of 40k or anime
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May 4, 2015 13:18
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Demon Of The Fall posted:Which is worse, a shelf full of 40k or anime John Galt's "monologue."
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May 4, 2015 13:19
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i think i legit have all william king's gotrek and felix novels between my bible and the complete works of albert camus
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May 4, 2015 13:21
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V. Illych L. posted:so you're saying that actually existing mass surveillance and makes a cultural anticipation of such a society less relevant? Well 1984 was coming from the position that such surveillance would be performed and utilised by the state itself, by and large that kind of aggressive totalitarianism has failed to manifest in part because much of that surveillance is available to all rather than the purview of the government. Now it could have an appropriate message for something like email monitoring a la Snowden but even then the message of the book was focused on people who were aware their every move was being watched by their government overlords in an intrusive and controlling manner. As he said the idea is carried in so strongly that in the modern reality Orwell's vision seems at best naive and really rather ham-fisted in the creation of system of social control. Now Huxley's Brave New World had a much stronger idea of how society would be controlled. That poo poo actually does ring true as far as a vision of a manufactured society goes. Of course 1984 is way for 40K, it would be interesting to see a writer take more of an Aldous Huxley view of human nature and 40K though and throw out a world where Imperial control is through carefully regulated pleasures, kept pointless ephemeral and generally vapid enough that Slaanesh type cults couldn't get a hold, perfectly engineered to maintain productivity and control. Then a Tzeentchian plot happens and fucks everything to poo poo and the world gets Exterminatused.
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May 4, 2015 13:37
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Wow, I solve those "problems" easily by making my bookshelves a headache-inducing mess. (Randomly taking out books to read, followed by putting them back in random order tends to do that.) In effect, everyone visiting me will first get a migraine trying to process the chaotic mass of books displayed in my shelves, then stumble over the piles of science, history and programming books I keep in easy reach of my desk and break their neck. Problem solved. 
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May 4, 2015 13:38
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MrNemo posted:Well 1984 was coming from the position that such surveillance would be performed and utilised by the state itself, by and large that kind of aggressive totalitarianism has failed to manifest in part because much of that surveillance is available to all rather than the purview of the government. Now it could have an appropriate message for something like email monitoring a la Snowden but even then the message of the book was focused on people who were aware their every move was being watched by their government overlords in an intrusive and controlling manner. As he said the idea is carried in so strongly that in the modern reality Orwell's vision seems at best naive and really rather ham-fisted in the creation of system of social control. States do, as you note, practice mass surveillance, though, and 'everyone knows it', they're just more underhanded about it than Orwell's dystopia is. This does not make the book less relevant to the modern era, let alone irrelevant - it remains a huge cultural touchstone, and it introduces a number of concepts that remain very much relevant, if not exactly as Orwell imagined it (e.g. newspeak, the omnipresence of propaganda, the controlled opposition etc).
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May 4, 2015 13:49
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Libluini posted:Wow, I solve those "problems" easily by making my bookshelves a headache-inducing mess. (Randomly taking out books to read, followed by putting them back in random order tends to do that.) To get this thread back on track, I listened to Klaw of Mork the other day. As per usual with BL audiodramas, I give it a "meh" rating, but it had a little something going for it - it was an Ork story told from the POV of the Orks. I felt it could have been greatly improved if the Ork voices had been gruffer and deeper, with more cockney accents, but it was surprising BL did something from Ork POV. One of the better parts was when a couple of Evil Sunz Meks were in a Speedsta and the driver hits the "Squig Juice" (nitrous) button, and they go tearing across the plain. One of them sticks his head out and lets the wind catch his tongue, like a dog. The other one winds up with pinprick pupils and is slack-jawed and drooling from the dose of speed. I'd recommend it if you like Orky stuff, though BL really needs to get some readers who know that Space Marines aren't supposed to sound like geriatrics and Orks aren't supposed to sound like sniveling grots.
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May 4, 2015 14:56
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I don't know why BL doesn't just hire the voice actors from the Dawn of War games for all their voicework. An entire audio drama of nothing but screaming would be 40k as gently caress.
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May 4, 2015 15:17
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You shouldn't be ashamed of having 40k or genre stuff in your bookshelf, but you should definitely be ashamed of having only 40k or genre stuff on your bookshelf because it means you only read one kind of book.
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May 4, 2015 15:42
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SRM posted:I don't know why BL doesn't just hire the voice actors from the Dawn of War games for all their voicework. An entire audio drama of nothing but screaming would be 40k as gently caress. "MARINE SQUAD DEPLOYED" "ENGAGING THE ENEMY" "INITIATING ATTACK PROTOCOL 2" "CHARGE!" "NONE SHALL STOP US!" "EAT BOLTGUN!" "TAKING FIRE!" "SQUAD BROKEN!" "SQUAD DESTROYED" Novel complete. I think it tells a pretty nice story of the hubris of a Space Marine squad who took on more than they were prepared for. berzerkmonkey fucked around with this message at 16:07 on May 4, 2015 |
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May 4, 2015 15:51
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berzerkmonkey posted:"ORDERS RECEIVED" THE TROPHY IS MINE!!! DO YOU HEAR THE VOICES TOO?! DRIVE ME CLOSER, I WANT TO HIT THEM WITH MY SWORD! MORE CORPSES! OI, GRIBBLIES 'ERE! SPACE MARINES SHOULD BE LOYAL...
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May 4, 2015 15:55
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berzerkmonkey posted:Novel complete. I think it tells a pretty nice story of the hubris of a Space Marine squad who took on more than they were prepared for. "HEHE. THEY DO NOT STAND A PRAYER."
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May 4, 2015 16:32
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V. Illych L. posted:which part of the message, exactly? the one where everyone who disagrees with ayn rand is a hideous villain and deserves to die in a train crash or the one where gold has magically objective value or what It's pretty accurate in how people who work for self interest are considered evil while they are literally carrying society on their backs. I live in Sweden and we pay about 50% in tax here to cover our vast welfare system that makes is so that education and medical care is free and no person ever has to be without food or somewhere to live. When I work an 8 hour day. 4 of those hours are taken by the state and given to the people. Which is something I'm fine with. But with the remaining 4 hours I can buy myself a house, a car, a nice computer and other luxuries. But for this I am demonised. Left sided political parties want to add and raise property taxes so that I get to pay higher arbitrary fees on my house that I bought in part with those 4 hours. People who speak out against such laws are villainized for not wanting to "Pay their share" A student that lives completely on the system I pay for can easily take a moral high ground over me simply for visiting some rally to speak out against the flavour of the week social injustice. The book is 95% garbage but I do not regret reading it. V. Illych L. posted:so you're saying that actually existing mass surveillance and makes a cultural anticipation of such a society less relevant? We did it to ourselves. And no thought police is needed as long as there are funny cat pictures and celebrity gossip then no human will have time to stop and think about things. When I found out that some digital cameras log your GPS coordinates and add them to the images I was horrified. I did some google searching for more information but the first thing I found was some photography website lauding it as a fantastic feature. Travel communities of people talking about how cool it was when you travelled. We are screwed worse than anything Orwell could imagine because we're doing it to ourselves voluntarily. Zephyrine fucked around with this message at 18:32 on May 4, 2015 |
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May 4, 2015 18:15
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Counterpoint, Ayn Rand was a horrible, vicious hypocrite with nothing of value or worth. Her writing is toxic.
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May 4, 2015 18:20
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Could we please bring this back to stuff like GW overcharing (9$) for old ebooks like Pawns of Chaos instead of starting a discussion on the merits of Ayn Rand.
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May 4, 2015 18:24
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So I'm reading "Betrayer" They bring out this female General. She's strong, brave. Very likeable. She is confronted by Angron. Everyone else just freezes or starts crying but she stands her ground. Then he becomes really belligerent so she "empties her bladder" out of fear before he grips her head in one hand and crushes it. Whoever wrote this. I get the feeling that he just came out of a really messy divorce and that he was probably masturbating while writing it. This seems to be a recurring theme. They bring out a strong female character and then have her fail in some way and then die in a degrading manner.
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May 4, 2015 18:44
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Zephyrine posted:
Also, the only female character I remember from Betrayer is Lotara, and she pretty much doesn't give a drat and pretty much makes it through to the end...
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May 4, 2015 18:51
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The "likable female general" in question is a throwaway character at Desh'ea serving the upper caste who were all clearly doomed the minute that their names were written down. Was it a particularly demeaning death? Sure. Was it hyper-misogynistic the same way that Zephyrine imagines? Not really. And, yeah, poo poo, Lotara Sarrin is actually likable and strong and is brave enough to shoot a goddamn World Eater Centurion in the face in front of his Company just to prove a point. She's the one that deserves more attention here.
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May 4, 2015 19:03
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berzerkmonkey posted:Sigh. So if it was a male general that peed his pants and got his head crushed, it would be ok? Granted most established male humans also end up dead but more often than not they die in some heroic last stand by the space marines side (the chain gang comes to mind). As female characters go there's Sanguinius's ship Captain who is assaulted by maddening chaos power. She endures for a while but then succumbs. Killing her own command crew before crashing the ship into the planet. Or that female assistant that accompanies the ultramarine ambassador to the planet of Bastion. She receives an important task to get his weapons but then she wanders astray and is killed off by an enemy. Angrons ship Captain has been a fantastic character so far. She even shot a space marine in the face. My money is still on her getting killed of in some demeaning way. Like a space marine caving her face in with a backhand. Or she falls to the ground and cracks her skull open when an enemy shot hits the ship.
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May 4, 2015 19:04
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Libluini posted:Wow, I solve those "problems" easily by making my bookshelves a headache-inducing mess. (Randomly taking out books to read, followed by putting them back in random order tends to do that.) I order my books based on the "how do I fit all this poo poo in here" system
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May 4, 2015 19:07
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My books go on top of the pile, and then when the pile is taller than my side table I go find a box to put the pile in. If you can fit all your books on shelves then you aren't reading enough.
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May 4, 2015 19:35
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Zephyrine posted:Granted most established male humans also end up dead but more often than not they die in some heroic last stand by the space marines side (the chain gang comes to mind). You also have Roboute's governess from Know No Fear who stood up to Kurze (and I think Alpha Legionnaires).
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May 4, 2015 20:05
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Unremembered Empire, and she is the bomb.
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May 4, 2015 20:07
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Mechafunkzilla posted:You shouldn't be ashamed of having 40k or genre stuff in your bookshelf, but you should definitely be ashamed of having only 40k or genre stuff on your bookshelf because it means you only read one kind of book. That was me when I was fifteen, though I quickly grew out of it an now have lots of other stuff cluttering up my bookshelves. I'll say this for 40K despite all the criticisms they did reawaken my love of reading, I'm working through War and Peace and its all thanks to that copy of Grey Hunter I picked up at an airport bookshop. Riso posted:Could we please bring this back to stuff like GW overcharing (9$) for old ebooks like Pawns of Chaos instead of starting a discussion on the merits of Ayn Rand. Really? I've been curious about that one for years, is it any good? Zephyrine posted:
Well not really, this is one of the things BL seems to be okay on, there are quite a few female characters scattered about that either do alright or just get blown up like everyone else. Off the top of my head I can think of Ciaphas Cain's series, those Arbites books (though I only read the one with the Astropaths, and didn't like it so y'know) there was Necromunda book about a female gang that was just as absurd and over the top as all the other gangs, (survival Instinct?) and the Female ghosts. If anything this seems to be a part of the pattern in fiction of quickly establishing a threat by making the people and things it knocks around with ease be (allegedly) strong and competent themselves. This is a setting where virtually everyone runs into a bad end if they live long enough. In Betrayer Angron gets something pretty close to one later on. And I'm sure another user pointed out how Fulgrim (a Male mutant) was tortured and anally raped, by his own "sons" no less, can't get much more degrading than that.
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May 4, 2015 20:17
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How should I know? I am not going to pay 9$ for an ebook.
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May 4, 2015 20:38
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Lotara Sarrin is probably my favorite 30k character.
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May 4, 2015 20:43
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Everyone in my home has their own bookshelf. My dad's a huge Tom Clancy/Clive Cussler fan with a ton of classic Science Fiction thrown in, my mom has more fantasy books than anyone else. My brother has a boatload of Discworld novels on his shelf, and I've got Black Library, Star Wars and David Eddings books all over the place. Nobody whose come into our house has ever judged us for our taste in novels. Nobody loving cares.
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May 4, 2015 21:10
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