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insta posted:Use the 4-in-1 and power your camera off the balance lead of your battery. This is risky business with Littlebees ESCs with the latest BlHeli. The active braking sends huge voltage spikes through your system that can fry your camera. Happened to me. You should put your camera and VTX on some sort of regulated power supply.
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Oct 17, 2016 19:04
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Dessert Rose posted:Tiny whoop stuff I've been looking at this for awhile as well. Looks like the easy way is just get the new fpv inductrix, and the orx module for the taranis.
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Oct 17, 2016 19:25
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Combat Pretzel posted:F3 and upwards are higher clocked, have more IPC, actually a FPU and more RAM. Eventually there's going to be a point, that people want to implement more advanced stuff and get held back by a huge userbase of F1 platforms ("My quad flies, why would I need a new FC? What do you mean Betaflight 4 doesn't run on my Naze32? Y'all suck!"). SPracingF3, DTFc, Airbot Omnibus, Sparkyv1, OP Revo and whatever only cost little more than those plain Naze32 clones. I'm well versed in microcontrollers. Yeah, you get more space to do stuff when you crank up the clock speed. But the ~critical feature~ of a flight controller is "Hey, does this thing fly, and fly well?" The crankypants on youtube was fixated on loop time. "Hey, watch what happens when I move from 1khz to 8khz, amazing the CPU is pegged at 100%" I did some digging, Steele makes his living flying on a KISS flight controller. It's loop time is 1khz. If you're trying to run "other stuff" like say.. a LED matrix, or interesting data reporting. I can understand the justification for more processor. While "more feaures" are nice, does that make the F1 flight controller "worse for flying?" I'm not sure it does. But I'm also not a good enough pilot to really say so. I'll have better opinions later, as I fly them more. But I suspect the bigger difference I'll see is Cleanflight, Baseflight, Betaflight software changes, rather than being able to blame "F1 vs F3" for how the frame flies. Geburan posted:The amount of woo and mysticism with this stuff reminds me of parenting forums. I'm seriously about to rub coconut oil on my ESCs and put a drop of lavender essential oil on the gyro.
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Oct 17, 2016 19:56
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Eh, as soon you want to go beyond PIDs, the computational requirements increase a lot. That's my point. Like that LQG controller I've ported from Taulabs, while the LQR has not really much more math than a PID controller, after the solver calculated the parameters, it runs an EKF as state estimator, which pushes an F1 to its limit (lack of a FPU is a big contributor), at least in that implementation. Other predictive controllers probably have similar higher requirements. From my practical experience with adhoc supporting dRonin in IRC, people seem all too happy to try different ESCs and motors, but the drat flight controller seems holy for some reason. If you have an inadequate userbase in regards to hardware, a developer might question the motivation for even doing it. That's half what's happening over here, because people still insist on getting OG CC3Ds. As far as loop time goes, don't get me started. I'll start to throw up bile again. Typical open loop response times for miniquads are around 10ms and upwards. 1KHz is more than enough for Nyquist and some oversampling. --edit: Regarding why one would want to go beyond PID to begin with, if you have a decent quality system identification of your plant, a predictive model may actually allow to cut down on the system response time, because it's proactive and not reactive. Combat Pretzel fucked around with this message at 20:28 on Oct 17, 2016 |
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Oct 17, 2016 20:24
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If you want people to support for (new) FC, you need to fly and put out videos. Sperging on forums/IRC wont get you anywhere.
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Oct 17, 2016 20:47
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McMadCow posted:This is risky business with Littlebees ESCs with the latest BlHeli. The active braking sends huge voltage spikes through your system that can fry your camera. Happened to me. You should put your camera and VTX on some sort of regulated power supply. A good battery is quite the low impedance buffer though, and running the camera setup off the balance lead will put that buffer in between the spike and the victim.
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Oct 17, 2016 20:55
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insta posted:A good battery is quite the low impedance buffer though, and running the camera setup off the balance lead will put that buffer in between the spike and the victim. Wouldn't it unbalance the cells though?
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Oct 17, 2016 21:15
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Geburan posted:Wouldn't it unbalance the cells though?
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Oct 17, 2016 22:09
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Oh cool, Hobby King finally released the Turnigy Evolution radio. Really interested to see what the reviews wind up looking like as someone coming from a gaming (rather than RC planes/helis) background, because telemetry and a touch screen LCD in a gamepad form factor for $70 is pretty neat-o. EDIT: Overview video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4-L1WjxrLx8 Seems to be a rebranded Flysky i6S in a gamepad form factor, which is pretty clever. nah thanks fucked around with this message at 01:25 on Oct 18, 2016 |
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Oct 18, 2016 00:02
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I don't really understand transmitter/receiver terminology or protocols at all. Can I buy anything to make this BNF FPV Inductrix flyable with my rebranded FS-i6 transmitter? (ed) And still preferably be able to fly my Eachine? Ciaphas fucked around with this message at 01:50 on Oct 18, 2016 |
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Oct 18, 2016 01:44
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Ciaphas posted:I don't really understand transmitter/receiver terminology or protocols at all. Can I buy anything to make this BNF FPV Inductrix flyable with my rebranded FS-i6 transmitter? The FlySky version of this should work: http://m.banggood.com/Beecore-F3_EVO_Brushed-ACRO-Flight-Control-Board-DSM2-For-Inductrix-Tiny-Whoop-Eachine-E010-p-1089021.html No clue how well it flies, but it's a drop in replacement for the stock Inductrix FC. If you're going to go that route, though, buy an Inductrix frame, props, and upgraded motors separately (you'll want those to compensate for the extra weight of the FPV camera). Don't bother with buying the BNF Inductrix if you get that FC since you'd be replacing everything except the frame and props. EDIT: note this won't work for the FPV Inductrix unless you don't mind a tiny bit of soldering to remove the camera from the stock FC. nah thanks fucked around with this message at 02:36 on Oct 18, 2016 |
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Oct 18, 2016 02:22
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squidgee posted:Oh cool, Hobby King finally released the Turnigy Evolution radio. Really interested to see what the reviews wind up looking like as someone coming from a gaming (rather than RC planes/helis) background, because telemetry and a touch screen LCD in a gamepad form factor for $70 is pretty neat-o. Nice! I've been waiting for this thing forever, just bought it. Everything I own has a LemonRX sat in it though so I'll have to swap something over to give it a try.
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Oct 18, 2016 02:27
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Ciaphas posted:I don't really understand transmitter/receiver terminology or protocols at all. Can I buy anything to make this BNF FPV Inductrix flyable with my rebranded FS-i6 transmitter? nope. they use different protocols, and that receiver isn't upgradeable. you can pick up a basic spektrum dx4e or dx5e from ebay for cheaper then the RTF kit. but you'd need to have a fpv system.
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Oct 18, 2016 02:33
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bring back old gbs posted:Nice! I've been waiting for this thing forever, just bought it. Everything I own has a LemonRX sat in it though so I'll have to swap something over to give it a try. Please post your thoughts whenever it arrives! I'm really tempted to pick one up, but I'm holding off for reviews because I've already spent like $400 on quad stuff in the past three weeks.
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Oct 18, 2016 02:38
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Combat Pretzel posted:From my practical experience with adhoc supporting dRonin in IRC, people seem all too happy to try different ESCs and motors, but the drat flight controller seems holy for some reason. I've found that people usually do this when it's something they don't understand. A motor makes sense. You put electricity in and the spinny part spins. Bigger motors mean more spinny. Okay, I understand, I can try different motors out. A flight controller makes no sense. You put the receiver in and the motors out and ~somehow~ the magic box makes the quad stay upright. Don't touch it! I got it working, I don't want you to break it! What did you do? I said don't touch it! No, this one works, I'm not going to try anything else, what if the magic stops?
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Oct 18, 2016 04:17
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I'm pretty sure people don't understand motors or esc's either.
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Oct 18, 2016 08:04
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insta posted:A good battery is quite the low impedance buffer though, and running the camera setup off the balance lead will put that buffer in between the spike and the victim. Isn't that a needless extra step though? I know there ARE PDBs out there without 5- and 12-volt supplies, but why bother? My PDB has both of those, as well as a filtered passthrough for the video signal and it was like, $12 from Ebay, 2 day delivery.
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Oct 18, 2016 08:41
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Yay! I now have three batteries for my Doinker. I need to go abuse that some more. I'm working on a "higher" performance tiny whoop. I want a solid 4 minutes of flight time.... This weekend I am doing a class at the local hackerspace, we're building some flite test sparrows. I hope that goes well.
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Oct 18, 2016 08:44
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McMadCow posted:Isn't that a needless extra step though? I know there ARE PDBs out there without 5- and 12-volt supplies, but why bother? My PDB has both of those, as well as a filtered passthrough for the video signal and it was like, $12 from Ebay, 2 day delivery. The suggestion was only for a super tight build that's already using a 4-in-1 ESC. I have a buddy who did exactly this and it worked out great for him.
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Oct 18, 2016 13:16
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Sagebrush posted:I've found that people usually do this when it's something they don't understand. I'm watching a youtube video about this right now and it's got me eyeing some ebay FCs in the $30 range. My quad's FC doesn't do optical flow and or talk to the telemetry when the gps is plugged in so I think I might change it. How do you know when your build is getting to the point of sunk cost fallacy?
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Oct 18, 2016 15:01
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DreadLlama posted:How do you know when your build is getting to the point of sunk cost fallacy? You don't want that answer DreadLlama. You really don't.
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Oct 18, 2016 15:46
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Are there any good smaller, more ergonomic radios out there? I've still got my Taranis that I started out on but I've honestly hated it from the beginning. The design is ugly and uncomfortable, it's got way more switches and knobs than I'll ever need flying miniquads, and it's just too big. Ideally I'd like something more clean and minimal. I know frsky has the X9E and Horus now which look tons better but they're still huge and way more than I need (and expensive) Something like the TBS Tango would be sweet, without the integrated VRX and display. edit: Well poo poo, the turnigy evolution a few posts up looks like exactly what I was looking for. I wonder if I'd be able to notice the quality difference in the gimbals between it and the Taranis. It almost looks a bit too cheap. CheddarGoblin fucked around with this message at 16:29 on Oct 18, 2016 |
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Oct 18, 2016 16:20
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n.. posted:Are there any good smaller, more ergonomic radios out there? I've still got my Taranis that I started out on but I've honestly hated it from the beginning. The design is ugly and uncomfortable, it's got way more switches and knobs than I'll ever need flying miniquads, and it's just too big. Something like this? .jpg) http://www.hobbyking.co.uk/hobbykin...te_Mode_2_.html I know nothing about it, but it's only just been released by HobbyKing.
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Oct 18, 2016 16:27
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Slash posted:Something like this? Yes exactly, just noticed that right after I posted. I'm going to look into it for sure (and its corresponding receivers, i've only dealt with frsky stuff before. looks like it supports SBUS and PPM though) gently caress it, ordered one. Cheap enough that it's worth the risk. I may have a Taranis and a few receivers for sale in the very near future (on the cheap) CheddarGoblin fucked around with this message at 16:57 on Oct 18, 2016 |
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Oct 18, 2016 16:34
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n.. posted:Yes exactly, just noticed that right after I posted. I'm going to look into it for sure (and its corresponding receivers, i've only dealt with frsky stuff before. looks like it supports SBUS and PPM though) They did a video on it here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4-L1WjxrLx8 Even had some of the rotor riot guys trying it out.
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Oct 18, 2016 19:04
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n.. posted:Are there any good smaller, more ergonomic radios out there? I've still got my Taranis that I started out on but I've honestly hated it from the beginning. The design is ugly and uncomfortable, it's got way more switches and knobs than I'll ever need flying miniquads, and it's just too big. There's some openTX hardware out there. You can "build your own" if you're so inclined. I plan on repackaging a DX6i into something... more portable. Most of the DX6i case is empty airspace.
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Oct 18, 2016 19:13
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insta posted:The suggestion was only for a super tight build that's already using a 4-in-1 ESC. I have a buddy who did exactly this and it worked out great for him. Oh right- I didn't even think that a build like that could do without.
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Oct 18, 2016 19:22
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Nerobro posted:You don't want that answer DreadLlama. You really don't. the timestamp is available every time we reply to him so I don't know why hes confused as to when
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Oct 18, 2016 19:33
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Slash posted:Something like this? If they had made it frsky compatible in anyway, this one would fly off the shelves. I'm still tempted to get one to use on the simulator, as my Taranis is usually stored in the workshop.
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Oct 18, 2016 20:48
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Combat Pretzel posted:--edit: Regarding why one would want to go beyond PID to begin with, if you have a decent quality system identification of your plant, a predictive model may actually allow to cut down on the system response time, because it's proactive and not reactive. PID is great as long as you know the limitations, It's just error, and the integral/derivative of error. Feedback is all you get. There's all sorts of literature about predictive control, and the gist of it is that you absolutely need to characterize the system you're controlling before you achieve anything measurably better than PID. That does not lend itself to plug and play interchangeability of ESC and motors. I work on industrial tuning, and even they don't care that much about being dead on for tuning. It's got to be big bucks before anyone cares.
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Oct 18, 2016 21:01
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McMadCow posted:Oh right- I didn't even think that a build like that could do without. I've got a 4in1 ESC on one of my 150mm builds. It's nice.. but I think I would have been better served by individual ESCs. That said, at the time, the tiny 20amp ESCS weren't on the market.
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Oct 18, 2016 21:09
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Vaporware posted:PID is great as long as you know the limitations, It's just error, and the integral/derivative of error. Feedback is all you get. There's all sorts of literature about predictive control, and the gist of it is that you absolutely need to characterize the system you're controlling before you achieve anything measurably better than PID. That does not lend itself to plug and play interchangeability of ESC and motors. I did engineering at a company making some high speed servo controlled industrial motors and before I left they started working on a state space controller rather than PID. We were starting to see ~30% improvement in response times. I left before it ever became a product and I don't see it offered for sale today so I don't know what became of it or what its quirks were. The biggest change I've noticed in getting my quads to fly better was 1. Move the battery and go pro as close as possible (instead of battery on bottom and gopro on top) to reduce MMOI and 2. Change to light HQ props instead of heavy DAL's. The HQ's break easier but they make it fly much smoother.
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Oct 18, 2016 21:39
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ImplicitAssembler posted:If they had made it frsky compatible in anyway, this one would fly off the shelves. It does come with a receiver, and additional ones are dirt cheap as well. That's partly what sold me (http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__108663__Turnigy_iA6C_PPM_SBUS_Receiver_8CH_2_4G_AFHDS_2A_Telemetry_Receiver.html)
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Oct 18, 2016 22:21
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Vaporware posted:PID is great as long as you know the limitations, It's just error, and the integral/derivative of error. Feedback is all you get. There's all sorts of literature about predictive control, and the gist of it is that you absolutely need to characterize the system you're controlling before you achieve anything measurably better than PID. That does not lend itself to plug and play interchangeability of ESC and motors. Might even be such a state space controller, like Bionicle mentioned. I forgot what he called it.
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Oct 18, 2016 23:22
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n.. posted:It does come with a receiver, and additional ones are dirt cheap as well. That's partly what sold me (http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__108663__Turnigy_iA6C_PPM_SBUS_Receiver_8CH_2_4G_AFHDS_2A_Telemetry_Receiver.html) I'd like to see the range, but diversity and sbus + ibus output, telemetry (does it work with cleanflight?) and tiny, sounds like everything most people are looking for with a multirotor receiver
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Oct 19, 2016 00:14
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A Yolo Wizard posted:It kinda sucks that those new f3 based brushed flight controllers have such weak fets- only appropriate for the 6mm sized motors (maybe 7?) IT's not like it's hard to drive bigger fets from whatever output it does have...
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Oct 19, 2016 02:32
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I think I'm about ready to upgrade my motors. I've been using Gartt 2206 2000KV motors for about 6 months now. They're pretty robust and they were awesome early on when I had a much lower camera angle. Their great efficiency meant I could stay in the air for 5-6 minutes on a 1.5amp pack, but now with the angle and speeds I run, it murders batteries because of (I assume) the need to use a much higher throttle to make up for the lower revs. Has anyone had any experience with the new DYS 2205 2300KV Pro Race motors with the solder pads? I really like the idea of them since I hate worrying about motor wires. I'm wondering if that's enough of an advantage to go with them over something that's a known quantity like Emax red bottoms. They're supposed to have the similar 1kg thrust/motor performance rating.
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Oct 20, 2016 03:45
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Oh God please tell me the pin spacing on the PCB is the same as the pin spacing on the new BLHeli_s 20A ESCs. A big fat copper strip between each pad sounds fantastic.
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Oct 20, 2016 04:35
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Oh man, that would be awesome. I was getting excited by the potential for short silicon wires.
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Oct 20, 2016 04:39
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I'm looking at getting a used Phantom 3 Standard tomorrow and the owner is going to demo it for me. What common issues should I check for?
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Oct 20, 2016 04:41
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