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The Iron Rose posted:I mean do you not want to read about space marines shoving a spiky metal pear up their primarch's butt in great detail I dunno this sounds real hot but I don't know if I can deal with more excessive descriptions of the singers body or the cutter last jabbing herself with a quill.
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Nov 8, 2016 21:36
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SRM posted:Legion owns, glad you liked it. Some people get grumpy because it doesn't have much of the actual Alpha Legion in it, but I thought it ruled. Only thing I hated about Legion was I felt the final plot could have been much cooler.... When the Cabal reveals themselves to the Alpha Legion, it would have been a much better twist if they'd just gone 'We know. We've been with Horus from the start.' *Hail of Bolter Fire* as it would have suited their character entirely to the ground that the assumption throughout is they didn't have their fingers in there already. Instead, we got the kind of lame SUPER SEKRAT LONG TERM PLOT (which obviously in the end means nothing, as we see them in the 40k setting. Just felt like a missed opportunity for just one more betrayal.
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Nov 9, 2016 14:28
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Roboute Guilliman is a big fat nothingburger of a book
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Nov 10, 2016 14:08
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Guy Goodbody posted:Roboute Guilliman is a big fat nothingburger of a book Tell us more
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Nov 10, 2016 15:37
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Waroduce posted:Tell us more Roboute Guilliman looks forward to the future where Space Marines are not needed. After discovering the planet they're fighting Orks on used to have a human population until they killed themselves in a civil war, he's like, "that's an unfortunate situation" Literally the only new characterization RG gets is that every chapter starts with an excerpt from one of his writings, and that reveals that he's a lovely author.
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Nov 10, 2016 22:30
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There's the books all about ultramar and their weird little empire I guess? I thought I bought it last time someone mentioned it but I can't find it, any help on the title?
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Nov 11, 2016 00:03
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Uhm... Umremembered Empire?
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Nov 11, 2016 00:12
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Waroduce posted:Uhm... Oh cool I think that must be it. I did buy that but didn't think it was sorted under HH novels, thanks.
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Nov 11, 2016 00:36
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Moose-Alini posted:There's the books all about ultramar and their weird little empire I guess? I thought I bought it last time someone mentioned it but I can't find it, any help on the title? Know no Fear goes into some detail on Ultramar and the mini-empire. You see RG's vision of his marines also being statesmen when they're no longer needed to be warriors. Then, you know... poo poo happens.
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Nov 12, 2016 10:20
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I'd be interested to see what the emps endgame for the space marines was. Like he killed off all the thunder warriors when he won earth....I guess he could put em all on an eternal crusade and call it a day, but what to do? The smurfs can govern and be part of a government, the wolves probably content on Fenris but I don't think many Marines are going to slot into civilian life very easily.
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Nov 12, 2016 14:47
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Waroduce posted:I'd be interested to see what the emps endgame for the space marines was. Like he killed off all the thunder warriors when he won earth....I guess he could put em all on an eternal crusade and call it a day, but what to do? There is only ever like 1 or 2 million Space Marines. The endgame for the Empire of Man was a galactic manifest destiny. I would bet that a galaxy spanning empire could find a use for a standing army of 1-2 million.
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Nov 12, 2016 15:29
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The Emperor is such a dick He probably would've just ordered the less civilized chapter to stop making new Marines, and let them slowly die out fighting Ork flareups and Eldar incursions.
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Nov 12, 2016 15:31
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Waroduce posted:I'd be interested to see what the emps endgame for the space marines was. Like he killed off all the thunder warriors when he won earth....I guess he could put em all on an eternal crusade and call it a day, but what to do? It's pretty explicit in the earlier books he expected them to excel at noble domestic pursuits as much as they did warfare. He explicitly designed the Astartes to make up for this failing the savagery of the Thunder Warriors. He sent the remembrancers and iterators to instruct the Astartes about the people and culture they were fighting for. It's just that the Astartes conditioning kinda kept them one track minded on battle. The Ultramarines and the Emperor's Children best embody this intent to have Astartes devoted to both martial and civil excellence. It's just the former is a perfect Mary Sue chapter and the latter, well... But yes post crusade they would be expected to transition to statesmen, artists, remembrancers, and iterators in their own right probably with the creation of new Astartes winding down unless otherwise needed.
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Nov 12, 2016 16:18
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Waroduce posted:I'd be interested to see what the emps endgame for the space marines was. Like he killed off all the thunder warriors when he won earth....I guess he could put em all on an eternal crusade and call it a day, but what to do? 
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Nov 12, 2016 19:08
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really, though, the emperor wasn't THAT stupid or ignorant and knew that the space marines would always be needed, that conflict would never end. The idea of a life after the crusade was always a lie, the crusade would never end.
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Nov 12, 2016 20:08
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hopterque posted:really, though, the emperor wasn't THAT stupid or ignorant and knew that the space marines would always be needed, that conflict would never end. The idea of a life after the crusade was always a lie, the crusade would never end. Not really, some of the more recent anthologies have touched upon the fact the emperor at some point in the crusade had found the key to start using/building his own web ways, which is why he hosed off from the great crusade so fast to work on building his own route into the eldar(old ones) webway system. The khan stumbles across the golden throne before he leaves terra (how early on the khan first went to terra I'm not sure), he asks what it is to which emps replies "the end of the crusade". The khan goes to surmise that with no need for traditional warp travel there's no need for navigators no need for astropaths and his dream of a truly secular society to kill off chaos might have worked. I also might be misremembering here but I seem to remember that yes while guilliman and some others say that Astartes would have to become statesmen etc when the crusade was over, I seem to recall a short story where fabius is looking at Astartes DNA and notices that eventually gene seed will start to degrade to the point where all legions will not be able to recruit any longer some reaching that point quicker than others, and that the emperor mist have known when creating them. rocket_Magnet fucked around with this message at 21:57 on Nov 12, 2016 |
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Nov 12, 2016 21:54
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rocket_Magnet posted:Not really, some of the more recent anthologies have touched upon the fact the emperor at some point in the crusade had found the key to start using/building his own web ways, which is why he hosed off from the great crusade so fast to work on building his own route into the eldar(old ones) webway system. The khan stumbles across the golden throne before he leaves terra (how early on the khan first went to terra I'm not sure), he asks what it is to which emps replies "the end of the crusade". The khan goes to surmise that with no need for traditional warp travel there's no need for navigators no need for astropaths and his dream of a truly secular society to kill off chaos might have worked. I also might be misremembering here but I seem to remember that yes while guilliman and some others say that Astartes would have to become statesmen etc when the crusade was over, I seem to recall a short story where fabius is looking at Astartes DNA and notices that eventually gene seed will start to degrade to the point where all legions will not be able to recruit any longer some reaching that point quicker than others, and that the emperor mist have known when creating them. Hmm i guess the implication being that all the rampant gene-seed mutations 10k years after is just the natural degradation taking effect.
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Nov 18, 2016 05:05
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Kharn_The_Betrayer posted:Hmm i guess the implication being that all the rampant gene-seed mutations 10k years after is just the natural degradation taking effect. That and people not super understanding how it all works.
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Nov 18, 2016 09:10
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Guy Goodbody posted:The Emperor is such a dick He probably would've just ordered the less civilized chapter to stop making new Marines, and let them slowly die out fighting Ork flareups and Eldar incursions. loving this. if everything had gone peechy keen, the world eaters and the night lords were gonna "taken care of" at some point. lorgar too would probably been put out to pasture if he kept on with his jackassery. the rest probably would done ok if chaos didn't intervene.
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Nov 19, 2016 01:33
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so whats up with the whole invasion of fenris thing and the angels parking the rock? are they still being released as one off ebooks? I read the first one when the wulfen came back and it seemed pretty great.
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Nov 19, 2016 02:04
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Dapper_Swindler posted:loving this. if everything had gone peechy keen, the world eaters and the night lords were gonna "taken care of" at some point. lorgar too would probably been put out to pasture if he kept on with his jackassery. the rest probably would done ok if chaos didn't intervene.
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Nov 19, 2016 03:08
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mango sentinel posted:If everything had gone peachy keen Angron and Conrad wouldn't have been sent to the rear end in a top hat murderworlds that shaped them and their legions. In their extant, pre-heresy versions yeah, you're certainly right, but I don't think that was the Emperor's aim to begin with. If Magnus hadn't landed on Prospero, all the Thousand Sons would've turned into freaky flesh bags. And the Blood Angels had the Black Rage before they found Sanguinius I think the Emperor kinda sucked at making Space Marines.
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Nov 19, 2016 03:12
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Guy Goodbody posted:If Magnus hadn't landed on Prospero, all the Thousand Sons would've turned into freaky flesh bags. And the Blood Angels had the Black Rage before they found Sanguinius You mean Red Thirst, but both of those are because of early CHAOS TAINT maybe 
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Nov 19, 2016 03:15
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The irony is that chaos taint is probably stopping the genetic degradation from happening.
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Nov 19, 2016 04:03
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So did anyone else have trouble comprehending the scale of certain things in the universe when first starting out? Hives, starships, tanks, everything always ends up being orders of magnitude larger than I first imagine, mainly the hives though. poo poo be BIG, yo.
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Nov 19, 2016 08:24
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Yeah, they talk about trillions of people but it's more like quadrillions. TBF though the Imperials being off by a couple orders of magnitude is par for the course.
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Nov 19, 2016 08:56
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Yes, we are going to invade this Hive world of some hundreds of billions of people with 5,000 guardsmen. This makes sense and is good and cool.  I think in the Sabbat Crusade lorebook they talk about macaroth commanding like 2 million men at some point as of that's a big number.
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Nov 19, 2016 09:44
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bango skank posted:So did anyone else have trouble comprehending the scale of certain things in the universe when first starting out? Hives, starships, tanks, everything always ends up being orders of magnitude larger than I first imagine, mainly the hives though. poo poo be BIG, yo. I've got a friend who is just getting into 40k and he keeps calling me to say "am I reading this right?". He's also loving the absurdness and macabre insanity of it. I've realised that after 25 years I'm kind of used to accepting that criminals, heretics and political opponents are broken down to become lobotomized automatons to do basic tasks because there was a galaxy spanning Terminator style war that nearly wiped out humanity (mere footnote in WH40k), dead babies are turned into flying cybernetic cherubs to swing incense around 12 foot tall genetically engineered super soldier religious zealots, entire worlds are turned into grinding, manufacturing hell-holes to create ammunition for wars that have been raging for 20,000 years, tens of thousands of children are snatched from their families to be fed into a machine that may or may not be sustaining a giant corpse that is responsible for keeping mankind from being killed/eaten/raped for one more day and battles that make the Somme look like a paintball game are mere skirmishes as the entire galaxy teeters on the brink of being overrun by marauding green fungus based orcs, swarms of horrific bugs that will literally strip planets like locusts, souless robotic zombies, advanced anime mecha-ripoffs, actual gods and the very real possibility that at any moment half the sector could be dragged into literal hell because that corpse on a giant throne being fed 10,000 souls a day is the only thing holding a dimension crossing black hole shut and untold billions of people are being systematically oppressed because if they were allowed free thought they can actually make things worse. And these are the good guys. The brainwashed, blinkered, fanatical preachers singing hymns in the gigantic gothic cathedral built on the shoulders of a 100ft tall walking war machine laying waste to cities below are the reason why mankind isn't extinct yet. Sure, it might LOOK like the Spanish inquisition sent hundreds of inhuman armour plated killing machines to go full Rape of Nanking on a city the size of a continent wiping out more women and children than are currently living on earth, but they probably just stopped an infestation of giant space locusts or the birth of a new god or some poo poo. None of that warp drive bollocks in this world. Hell no. Here we breed mutants with a freaky eye in their forehead because we don't do anything of that faster than light poo poo - we rip a hole in the fabric of the universe, fly our space monasteries into the hole and get the screaming three eyed guy to tell us when to turn so we don't fly into the teeth of a gigantic hell-demon or take a wrong turn 5000 years into the past and wind up with tentacles for eyes. And when we come out the other end with half our forces either lost, insane or 10 years behind us we don't do any of that air support poo poo. We rev up our swords with built in chainsaws, recite prayers to our guns, strap ourselves into a free-falling diving bell and hurl ourselves to the surface with the intention of ruining the poo poo of everyone and everything regardless of if it's human or not. God, I love 40k...
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Nov 19, 2016 09:52
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Welp, just finished Sabbat Martyr.  Is the rest of Gaunt's Ghosts worth diving into right after this? I'm thinking of maybe reading one of the one-off BL books after powering through the first seven books over the past two months. Not that I'm not interested in reading more of the story, but with the way everything led up to this one and got tied up by the end it's as good an ending I could ask for. Does the rest of the series hold up to the same level of quality?
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Nov 19, 2016 09:59
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bango skank posted:Welp, just finished Sabbat Martyr. Traitor General is really, really good and the ones immediately after are pretty high up too though I personally didn't think much of most of Only In Death. All the books in the third omnibus are very different in tone from the rest of the series and that continues into Blood Pact and Salvations Reach. The last two are part of the last series and are supposed to conclude with Warmaster but I don't expect that book to ever be written at this point.
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Nov 19, 2016 10:08
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The one guy at the Imperial Census wasn't able to defend his budget properly during the Great Crusade ("We need your budget for golden eagles, sorry Fred.") and everything has been terrible since.
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Nov 19, 2016 10:13
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Dog_Meat posted:I've got a friend who is just getting into 40k and he keeps calling me to say "am I reading this right?". He's also loving the absurdness and macabre insanity of it. There was a moment in Straight Silver where one of the minor ghosts is drunk and having a bit of a meltdown over how grim and dark the galaxy is, and for them there is no peace, there is only war. I get that they put it at the front of every book, but it really can't be overstated.
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Nov 19, 2016 10:21
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bango skank posted:There was a moment in Straight Silver where one of the minor ghosts is drunk and having a bit of a meltdown over how grim and dark the galaxy is, and for them there is no peace, there is only war. I get that they put it at the front of every book, but it really can't be overstated. A few Astartes in the Horus Heresy books also freak out when they think about this. It's noted to be why Rogal Dorn and the Imperial Fists look down on Papa Smurf and the Ultramarines. Papa Smurf wants the Ultramarines to be more than warriors, that someday the Astartes will be needed for more than warfare and that they will need other skills for when that day comes. Dorn and the Fists don't think that day will ever come, there will never, ever be an end to the war.
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Nov 19, 2016 17:14
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bango skank posted:Welp, just finished Sabbat Martyr. I like all of the books after Sabbat Martyr quite a bit. Even if I agree that Only In Death is probably the weakest of the bunch it still has some really good moments and ideas, even if they aren't usually as fleshed out as they could be. But that's Gaunt's Ghosts for you.
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Nov 20, 2016 05:07
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You're past the worst. Sabbat Martyr is the low point for the series, and the books after it are some of the best in the series.
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Nov 20, 2016 05:09
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I think I need help because every time I see the word "Warmaster" my brain reads "Warhamster" and it is really undermining my reading of these books when I imagine Horus to be a giant rodent.
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Nov 21, 2016 01:50
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In a certain sense the Primarchs were just the Emperor's guinea pigs anyway.
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Nov 21, 2016 02:03
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Endman posted:I think I need help because every time I see the word "Warmaster" my brain reads "Warhamster" and it is really undermining my reading of these books when I imagine Horus to be a giant rodent.
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Nov 21, 2016 02:13
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Dog_Meat posted:I've got a friend who is just getting into 40k and he keeps calling me to say "am I reading this right?". He's also loving the absurdness and macabre insanity of it. This is one of the most cogent descriptions of why 40k is so awesome that I have ever read. Fearless fucked around with this message at 02:53 on Nov 21, 2016 |
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Nov 21, 2016 02:50
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MMAgCh posted:In a certain sense the Primarchs were just the Emperor's guinea pigs anyway. this. I am honestly curious what his end game was gonna be. i mean i get what he says he wanted. a super awsome human secular universe where peace and order reign and my philosopher warriors keep guard. but clearly that was hosed from the beginning. i assume he was gonna despose of the gently caress ups and keep the others in line. Fearless posted:This is one of the most cogent descriptions of why 40k is so awesome that I have ever read. this. it really really is.
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Nov 21, 2016 05:40
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