Star Citizen: Big MoMA's House

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D1E: Nov 25, 2001

XK posted:

Hey, FAU. We give you a lot of poo poo in this thread, but I just want to say I think you ended up making the right decisions, and those decisions have earned you respect from me.

I feel the same way.

FAU: you are right that the forums have to have rules (and that they need to be enforced), and mods should be held to the highest standard. More than anything, you owned up to making mistakes (like appointing an IK) and promptly walked them back.

I absolutely respect when someone can publicly admit they were wrong and move on in a positive direction. Especially in the kind of hostile environment you entered.

# ? Nov 24, 2016 02:44

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# ? Jun 9, 2024 04:31

D_Smart: May 11, 2010; by FactsAreUseless; College Slice

Ramc posted:

My favorite part is the implication that his Expensive Attorneys not only make sure he doesn't break actual laws, but also advise him on SA forums rules

Wrong. I made no such implications. The SA rules were obviously written by a complete moron. So they're easy enough to follow.

What I mentioned about my attorneys pertains to illegal activities such as doxing.

# ? Nov 24, 2016 02:44

no_recall: Aug 17, 2015; Lipstick Apathy

Sickening posted:

RIP Moma, looks like you are about to be spending :tenbux: soon.

It comes from CIG's coffers anyway.

Hey reddit,
Archive this!

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# ? Nov 24, 2016 02:44

FactsAreUseless: Feb 16, 2011

D_Smart posted:

I believe he has since deleted the post. I have the original bookmarked; and will send it along if you want.

Please do.

MeLKoR posted:

Don't ban MoMA for poo poo that happened a year ago, man. No one likes him but no one gave a poo poo back then - otherwise they would have reported it to you - and no one gives a poo poo now.

We want MoMA around when this ship goes down. Don't snatch the reward for putting up with him now that we can almost smell it.

I just need as much info as I can if I'm going to make a decision.

# ? Nov 24, 2016 02:45

big nipples big life: May 12, 2014

peter gabriel posted:

MoMA should get a day probation for that belt he bought at the very least

He has to live every day for the rest of his life with the knowledge that he kick started, of all things, a loving belt. I think that is punishment enough.

# ? Nov 24, 2016 02:45

A Neurotic Corncob: Nov 12, 2016; A light wind swept over the corn, and all nature laughed in the sunshine.

XK posted:

Hey, FAU. We give you a lot of poo poo in this thread, but I just want to say I think you ended up making the right decisions, and those decisions have earned you respect from me.

same.

# ? Nov 24, 2016 02:45

Tokamak: Dec 22, 2004

D_Smart posted:

There are NO rules on SA which prohibit what I did. Not a single one. Don't take my word for it though, here, go read all the rule pages

quote:

Please do not post others' personal information (phone number, addresses, emails, etc.). Try to stay out of other peoples' personal lives as well.

Also you have a very dumb definition of doxxing.

# ? Nov 24, 2016 02:45

Beet Wagon: Oct 19, 2015

Ol Cactus Dick posted:

He has to live every day for the rest of his life with the knowledge that he kick started, of all things, a loving belt. I think that is punishment enough.

Plus he's got the everlasting shame of still having money in Star Citizen.

# ? Nov 24, 2016 02:47

D_Smart: May 11, 2010; by FactsAreUseless; College Slice

lazorexplosion posted:

Welcome back Derek, wouldn't be the same without you

I know telling a warlord this is hopeless, but if you have to rely on 'well, although it looks like doxxing techinically it isn't doxxing' you're playing with fire and it isn't worth arguing about it. Doxxing is bad enough that mods don't even want the appearance of doxxing. Who cares if some nobody gets away without being exposed, like we could all assume Deloria was a fat hairy 30 year old without rooting through facebook for confirmation.

Agreed. And that's the "line" that I was talking about.

However to me, something as serious as doxing is not something that I take lightly.

# ? Nov 24, 2016 02:46

The Titanic: Sep 15, 2016; Unsinkable

peter gabriel posted:

Why was I not made aware of these rabbits before now?

look at it

I have no idea what kind of bunny it is, but it's very cute! :3:

# ? Nov 24, 2016 02:47

no_recall: Aug 17, 2015; Lipstick Apathy

Tokamak posted:

Also you have a very dumb definition of doxxing.

It's what happens when legal is done with it :woof:

# ? Nov 24, 2016 02:47

A Neurotic Corncob: Nov 12, 2016; A light wind swept over the corn, and all nature laughed in the sunshine.

perma-ban moma

# ? Nov 24, 2016 02:48

MeLKoR: Dec 23, 2004; by FactsAreUseless

D_Smart posted:

I disagree. Just because Deloria was deserving of it, doesn't make it right. It's a fine line, and I have principles.

And there are no rules on SA that were broken.

I have no opinions on mods either way. They are both regulars, they know how things run in this forum; so I don't have any reason to opine on whether or not they will do a good job because I know that they will.

MeLKoR posted:

He should have posted it on his forum/blog and never mention it here. Someone else was bound to find it soon and after spreading a couple of hours on discord the effect would end up being the same. The scammer would be outed and that was the point.

I laughed as all hell but it's just one of those things that isn't worth the bother if there is any way to do it anywhere else not here. At best it's going to be a waste of time rules lawyering, at worst, well, you know.

# ? Nov 24, 2016 02:48

Colostomy Bag: Jan 11, 2016; C-Bangin' it

Wrecked Angle posted:

I like this one further down because I love it when shitizens start trying to wrap their head around game mechanics which CIG has obviously given no thought to whatsoever.

So yeah, multicrew ships. What happens when the owner of the ship has to log off? The ship disappears and leaves the other 5 10 25 commandos floating in space? Or, the ship stays and the captains pride and joy gets smashed into an asteroid while he's logged off? Or all the crew get magically teleported back to a friendly station (totally not exploitable).

Don't worry though, I'm sure CIG has this all worked out with a system that will keep all players happy.

Some subsumtion (or however you spell it) AI NPC will take over and deliver you to your port of origin. That is of course if it fits in with their line of work and schedule.

Three point oh will have this.

# ? Nov 24, 2016 02:49

D_Smart: May 11, 2010; by FactsAreUseless; College Slice

MeLKoR posted:

Don't ban MoMA for poo poo that happened a year ago, man. No one likes him but no one gave a poo poo back then - otherwise they would have reported it to you - and no one gives a poo poo now.

We want MoMA around when this ship goes down. Don't snatch the reward for putting up with him now that we can almost smell it.

And that's why I didn't ban him at the time.

# ? Nov 24, 2016 02:50

Ghostlight: Sep 25, 2009; maybe for one second you can pause; try to step into another person's perspective, and understand that a watermelon is cursing me

Saint Drogo posted:

please everyone keep quoting Derek's latest unreadable tantrum in full, tia

D_Smart posted:

OFFICIAL STATEMENT

I am going to keep this short; though I did consider writing a blog.

First of all, I have been around and an Internet Warlord for decades now. I know the drill. I've seen flamewars errupt and evolve from BBS teletype, to badly formatted Usenet postings, to articulate blogs.

I am well versed in the ways of online discourse.

I do not support, condone, nor engage in doxing.

Aside from the fact that the law is very clear on doxing.

Back in 2013, I wrote a primer on it in fact.

And there are additional resources on specifically this, what is legal, illegal etc. READ:

Doxxing: It�s Like Hacking, But Legal

The Problem With �Doxxing�

The Illegal Activity of �Doxing�: Revealing �documents or personal information� about a person, without their permission, with the intent to Threaten, Harass, Intimidate, Shame, Humiliate or Place at Risk

Basically, the doxing and stalking laws are

Pointing out someone's social media page, isn't doxing.

Pointing out that person A is really person B under an alias, isn't doxing.

Posting material that the person themselves made public, isn't, never was, and never will be, doxing.

If the above were doxing, every single person in the media would be guilty of having committed a crime.

What MoMa did here months ago, was doxing. And it's 100% legally actionable. He posted that I had a traffic citation. There was no context or reason for it to be here in a forum where we're making fun of grown men buying JPEG space ships. He posted it with malice, and with the intent to harass and harm. The only thing he didn't do, was post the actual citation itself; but anyone incited by his posting, could very well go seek it out for themselves. They never knew about it before he posted it.

I didn't dox Deloria (now banned). Though the post has been removed here, it is still on my website (post # 4905) for anyone who cares to go and read it for themselves.

All I did was out a scammer using material they themselves posted here (e.g. this post) and on social media.

Period. End of story.

There are NO rules on SA which prohibit what I did. Not a single one. Don't take my word for it though, here, go read all the rule pages

Then FAU, after emerging from what I can only imagine must have been a meltdown recovery process, switched from "doxing" to "helldumping". Which, to me - and anyone with a brain that's in working condition - was hilarious; seeing as the latter isn't even an SA rule. That aside from the fact that the very notion of "helldumping" is so far removed from "doxing", that in and of itself, is NOT a bannable offense. Probation? Yeah, maybe' it depends on the mod.

The fact of the matter is that since FAU tried to close down this forum - and failed; he's been gunning for me because not only did I have it brought back, but I was made mod. Heck, we just had yet another spat mere months ago over this same thing.

This sub-forum is moderated on a honor system. As a mod, I never had to take any action other than probating some people (4) when they cross the line. Once, after several probates, I probated someone for 30 days. I didn't perma-ban.

This sub-forum has never - ever - broken ANY of the SA rules. We encourage off-topic posts (recipes, memes etc) because it breaks from the monotony of making GBS threads on Star Citizen and Shitizens 24-7.

A LOT of people followed me to SA and paid 10 bux to be able read what I post, interact, find the lols etc. That too is a solid fact.

Yet, somehow, for some bullshit reason, FAU is of the opinion that I am not a "good" mod. The regulars here and I had a good laugh about that on on Discord, for the sheer hilarity of it. And when pressed, like the absentee landlord, he simply couldn't point out a SINGLE reason WHY he thinks I'm not a "good" mod. Not one.

Aside from the fact that I didn't even ask to be a loving mod. In much the same way that Beer4TheBeerGod and Beet Wagon didn't get asked either. He made them mods, then installed an IK buffoon who subsequently shat up my nice sub-forum, while attracting all the rear end-clowns from FYAD and elsewhere - and who otherwise didn't even know we existed here in our niche corner.

This is bullshit. What the gently caress is the matter with you people; that a forum with such HIGH TRAFFIC and quality posters who are otherwise behaving themselves and abiding by the rules, can't be left alone?!? The money is going into Lowtax's coffers, so what do you care, and why be salty about it?

Look, I am not a stranger to being banned. Heck, I was banned TWICE on FDev for breaking the rules. And in both cases, it was a matter of a "shady" areas in which 1) I was using asterisk to bypass the bad word filter 2) I posted material from here on SA

So, if I had somehow broken an SA rule, and been banned as a result, it won't have been any big deal. I would pay the 10 bux, re-reg, and get right back into the poo poo-posting.

As I am 100% certain (and I have high priced attorneys who ensure that I don't do/say stupid poo poo that will get me arrested or sued) that I hadn't broken an SA rule, let alone guilty of doxing, I refused to re-reg on principle alone. And I made that clear to everyone who asked.

As the regulars here on my Discord can attest to, I said that I wasn't coming back here unless the ban was reversed. Then a group (7 at last count) of people (one of them being a backer here on SA who I had saved money by helping him get a Star Citizen refund) offered to pay the 10 bux if I came back. I still refused. Then some made the case that as long as I wasn't the one paying the 10 bux, it won't break my principles and that I should consider it.

So I did.

And here I am.

Nevertheless, seeing as there is a mod actively holding a grudge and who I believe is going to keep finding ways to either get me probated, banned or who I believe wants to see the forum die, I won't be as prolific a poster as I used to be because this is bullshit.

# ? Nov 24, 2016 02:51

thatguy: Feb 5, 2003

D_Smart posted:

The SA rules were obviously written by a complete moron. So they're easy enough to follow.

# ? Nov 24, 2016 02:51

John_A_Tallon: Nov 22, 2000; Oh my! Check out that mitre!

Berious posted:

Fuzznot was fine. The thread tolerates much worse in gimmick posting. She deserved that probation but the thread turning on her was lovely. This thread needs drama or it will eat its own for example uncle Derek

Are you on drugs or something?

# ? Nov 24, 2016 02:52

peter gabriel: Nov 8, 2011; Hello Commandos

I just want to make it clear I did not write the SA rules

# ? Nov 24, 2016 02:53

TheLastRoboKy: May 2, 2009; Finishing the game with everyone else's continues

MeLKoR posted:

Don't snatch the reward for putting up with him now that we can almost smell it.

When the heat is on the first thing that jello-spined man is doing is melting himself down a drain don't even pretend he'll be here.

# ? Nov 24, 2016 02:53

thatguy: Feb 5, 2003

Derek Smart posted:

Once you outline the address or location of a person, within which a person can be placed at risk, YOU HAVE VIOLATED THE LAW.

Proceeds to post the address, name, email, and phone number of someone.

:lol:

# ? Nov 24, 2016 02:54

D_Smart: May 11, 2010; by FactsAreUseless; College Slice

Tokamak posted:

D_Smart posted:
There are NO rules on SA which prohibit what I did. Not a single one. Don't take my word for it though, here, go read all the rule pages

quote:
Please do not post others' personal information (phone number, addresses, emails, etc.). Try to stay out of other peoples' personal lives as well.

Also you have a very dumb definition of doxxing.

This would be the part where you show me where I did any of the above.

TIP: It's not "my" definition. Maybe take some time to actually read the resources, before engaging fingers to keyboard.

# ? Nov 24, 2016 02:54

MeLKoR: Dec 23, 2004; by FactsAreUseless

TheLastRoboKy posted:

When the heat is on the first thing that jello-spined man is doing is melting himself down a drain don't even pretend he'll be here.

Then I'll mock his coward rear end, I know he'll be reading anyway. :qq:

God drat, one year listening to his poo poo I better get something out of it in the end.

MeLKoR fucked around with this message at 02:59 on Nov 24, 2016

# ? Nov 24, 2016 02:57

Marching Powder: Mar 8, 2008; stop the fucking fight, cornerman, your dude is fucking done and is about to be killed.

remember when derek tracked down a literally severely retarded star citizen backer confined to life in a wheelchair and owned him? remember when that other citizen did a threat assessment and within about a minute derek got him fired?

remember when moma bragged that he was one of what must be like a thousand people on the planet sad enough to kickstart a loving belt and posted a photo of the belt which was next seen around toast's waist, the same toast who derek said moma was?

he is either an employee of cig who genuinely believes cig can do it and shills in his spare time, or he's paid specifically to try and undermine the points in this thread. both are unbelievably pathetic, and living in that reality constitutes sufficient punishment for daring to warlord with the warlord.

also, an addendum to the sadness, no one itt even engages him anymore because his thoughts and opinions are of so little worth.

# ? Nov 24, 2016 02:59

thatguy: Feb 5, 2003

D_Smart posted:

This would be the part where you show me where I did any of the above.

You did all of the above. How are you even attempting to argue this?

# ? Nov 24, 2016 03:00

D_Smart: May 11, 2010; by FactsAreUseless; College Slice

thatguy posted:

Proceeds to post the address, name, email, and phone number of someone.

We know that some of you are slow, but at the very least, try not to make it so drat obvious. That's why the word "context" exists. And that's why the law makes allowances for "intent"

It would have served you well if you had actually bothered to read - and comprehend - the paragraph above what you excerpted.

quote:

�Doxing� is a legal term that means revealing �documents� about a person. This can range from revealing the name of a person who uses an alias, but more commonly refers to revealing whatever the person doing it feels will harm, shame, humiliate, endanger, or put the person at some risk. Doxing is a form of stalking or threatening and is illegal under many different federal and state laws, depending on the exact facts and location.

Revealing a �name� per se� may, or may not be considered �Doxing� depending on the level of anticipated anonymity. However, in this law, the term �restricted personal information� means, �with respect to an individual, the Social Security number, the home address, home phone number, mobile phone number, personal email, or home fax number of, and identifiable to, that individual.� This is an important distinction to remember.

Once you outline the address or location of a person, within which a person can be placed at risk, YOU have VIOLATED THE LAW. PERIOD.

In all cases if you outline the physical location of any individual with the intent to harm, shame, stalk, humiliate, endanger, or otherwise compromise the safety and security of ANY individual you have placed that person in a position of risk and you are in violation of ALL State Stalking laws.

THIS is the most commonly crossed line.

However, in some cases, such as federal agents, or in Mark Osterman�s case his anonymity as a Federal Air Marshal, just revealing his name crosses the threshold for illegal activity.

I CAN FIND THOSE PIECES OF INFORMATION USING GOOGLE SEARCH. IS THAT STILL RESTRICTED? YES. It is illegal to announce or disseminate or post those listed pieces of information for the purposes listed in the law (18 USC � 119). Those are purposes such as threatening or intimidating or making it so others can harass or harm the person. This law is about acts that endanger the safety of or encourage attacks against a person or a person�s family. It is not about where you found the information.

TIP: That article is about a FEDERAL employee and is NOT about a regular person. Hence 18 USC � 119 which I also mentioned in my 2013 blog article.

# ? Nov 24, 2016 03:00

XK: Jul 9, 2001; Star Citizen is everywhere. It is all around us. Even now, in this very room. You can see it's fidelity when you look out your window or when you watch youtube

Saint Drogo posted:

please everyone keep quoting Derek's latest unreadable tantrum in full, tia

That's part of the fun.

# ? Nov 24, 2016 03:01

MeLKoR: Dec 23, 2004; by FactsAreUseless

Marching Powder posted:

remember when derek tracked down a literally severely retarded star citizen backer

not retarded

# ? Nov 24, 2016 03:01

D_Smart: May 11, 2010; by FactsAreUseless; College Slice

thatguy posted:

You did all of the above. How are you even attempting to argue this?

Nice try.

# ? Nov 24, 2016 03:02

VealCutlet: Dec 21, 2015; I am a marketing god, shave that shit

Marching Powder posted:

remember when derek tracked down a literally severely retarded star citizen backer confined to life in a wheelchair and owned him? remember when that other citizen did a threat assessment and within about a minute derek got him fired?

remember when moma bragged that he was one of what must be like a thousand people on the planet sad enough to kickstart a loving belt and posted a photo of the belt which was next seen around toast's waist, the same toast who derek said moma was?

he is either an employee of cig who genuinely believes cig can do it and shills in his spare time, or he's paid specifically to try and undermine the points in this thread. both are unbelievably pathetic, and living in that reality constitutes sufficient punishment for daring to warlord with the warlord.

also, an addendum to the sadness, no one itt even engages him anymore because his thoughts and opinions are of so little worth.

Remember when people used proper capitalization? Learn to be a better poster you poo poo rag.

# ? Nov 24, 2016 03:02

Tokamak: Dec 22, 2004

D_Smart posted:

This would be the part where you show me where I did any of the above.

TIP: It's not "my" definition. Maybe take some time to actually read the resources, before engaging fingers to keyboard.

Posting someone's facebook is personal info. Making a big post about someone's personal life is 'getting into someone's personal life'. They also have a catch all clause because you aren't the first person to try and rules lawyer this stuff.

Even by your own definition it is still doxxing, as you are posting their information to intimidate them.

# ? Nov 24, 2016 03:02

Runa: Feb 13, 2011

Hell wasn't that's him in the wheelchair part of why the thread came under scrutiny in the first place

FactsAreUseless posted:

Link? In PMs, for preference.

It does look like he deleted his post which is probably for the best, because even though everybody (including derek) let it slide at the time, it was not okay.

# ? Nov 24, 2016 03:03

A Neurotic Corncob: Nov 12, 2016; A light wind swept over the corn, and all nature laughed in the sunshine.

I already know what MoMA is going to say when the souffle fails to rise, its gonna be alot of "I never claimed to know whether this would work out or not but at least I was open-minded about it :smug:

" and "I was happy to take the risk going in :smug:

" etc. The only good meltdowns are going to be the ones we poach from citizens in their native environment. moma is going to completely deprive us of his inner-meltdown out of spite.

The only way to get entertainment out of him is forcing him to put skin in the game with a mod-challenge.

# ? Nov 24, 2016 03:03

MeLKoR: Dec 23, 2004; by FactsAreUseless

MeLKoR posted:

I'd suggest someone pay to have his account reinstated but I doubt he'd return anyway.
[..]
There is work to be done and shittizens to piss off but our Warlord will now die on this hill just to prove the point that no one punishes him unfairly without him taking his ball home.

Good thing I didn't :toxx:

# ? Nov 24, 2016 03:04

Blue On Blue: Nov 14, 2012

Wow Derek came back into the thread full force and doesn't seem to lifting off the gas, this should go well

# ? Nov 24, 2016 03:04

XK: Jul 9, 2001; Star Citizen is everywhere. It is all around us. Even now, in this very room. You can see it's fidelity when you look out your window or when you watch youtube

D_Smart posted:

I disagree. Just because Deloria was deserving of it, doesn't make it right. It's a fine line, and I have principles.

We all know Derek. Warlord is going to warlord. We love you because you're the type of person who would do what you did. This thread wouldn't be the same without you.

Great to have you back.

# ? Nov 24, 2016 03:04

big nipples big life: May 12, 2014

c'mon guys how can you say threatening to call some kid in a wheelchair's dad in his home state could be interpreted as trying to intimidate someone?

# ? Nov 24, 2016 03:04

XK: Jul 9, 2001; Star Citizen is everywhere. It is all around us. Even now, in this very room. You can see it's fidelity when you look out your window or when you watch youtube

Oh, yeah, also, keep MoMA. That post is ancient history by now, and he's settled in pretty well.

# ? Nov 24, 2016 03:05

peter gabriel: Nov 8, 2011; Hello Commandos

What a delightful tapestry of characters this thread is, long may it thrive

# ? Nov 24, 2016 03:06

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# ? Jun 9, 2024 04:31

MeLKoR: Dec 23, 2004; by FactsAreUseless

Tokamak posted:

Posting someone's facebook is personal info. Making a big post about someone's personal life is 'getting into someone's personal life'.

Pointing out that the Facebook page of the Nigerian Prince is not in fact a Nigerian Prince is not doxxing the nigerian dude running the scam.

# ? Nov 24, 2016 03:08

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