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ImpAtom posted:The thing is that the Spirit Bomb isn't about power level though. It in fact explicitly isn't about power level but rather gathering power from many different sources instead. It's a move specifically designed to emphasize the idea of overcoming a single stronger foe with a technique. It is why (even though it fails 2 out of 3 times) each time it is used it is with the help of other people. Plus, the Spirit Bomb is explicitly destroys evil. Kid Buu was pure, elemental evil so it was extra effective.
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Sep 7, 2017 23:06
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I dunno how Frieza was the last time power levels really mattered. I mean it was the one time where they REALLY focused hard on it with "I'm only using 1% of my full power!" over and over again, and literally just saying people's levels a bunch. But like, Cell kept getting new forms until the only way he could be beaten was by having Gohan power up by getting mad. I'll give you Buu I guess though.
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Sep 7, 2017 23:11
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My point is in both cases the Z Fighters didn't learn anything or get clever: Gohan destroying Cell with a kamehameha and Goku + Earth destroying Buu with the Spirit Bomb are still both brute force methods based on completely overwhelming power and particularly in Cell's case the solution is literally just for Gohan to become so strong he doesn't have to care about Cell's regeneration. The Spirit Bomb is a more elegant way of delivering the climatic energy blast but it's still fundamentally about hitting Buu so hard he can't recover at all, the only difference between that and Gotenks and Piccolo attempting to double tap him in the Hyperbolic Time Chamber is magnitude.
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Sep 7, 2017 23:14
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Yeah but, and this is why I cite Freeza as the last time PURE power was important for the villain Cell would have been dead long before he even got Semi Perfect. Android 16 would have wrecked his poo poo. Perfect Cell would have basically lost against Vegeta if he wasn't able to heal from the Final Flash. And Buu would have died to Majin Vegeta if he didn't have regeneration. Regeneration made all the difference in the world there. With Freeza, he took their strongest attacks and shrugged them off because of how much stronger he was. None of the other villains could really say that until Beerus
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Sep 7, 2017 23:18
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Kashuno posted:I am making a very real guess the next arc skips a few years and focuses on Uub Literally no chance the show focuses on anyone but Goku ever again.
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Sep 7, 2017 23:27
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One-armed and missing half his torso Cell would have still beaten Vegeta.
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Sep 7, 2017 23:28
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multijoe posted:
Well Piccolo realized the mistake once he reformed. And stated their problem was they only blasted and burned the bits that were left instead of erasing them.
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Sep 7, 2017 23:33
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sailor saturn can beat all of them
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Sep 7, 2017 23:39
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Zedd posted:YGO-Abridged did quite a few clever things, It's main issue (even from the start) was running stuff into the ground. I liked the one based on Season Zero with green haired Kaiba. You need to know YGOA pretty well for the main gag to land, but also vanilla Season Zero is buckwild. Yugi sets a dude on fire without giving a single gently caress. That's my post. Thank you.
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Sep 7, 2017 23:41
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HitTheTargets posted:I liked the one based on Season Zero with green haired Kaiba. You need to know YGOA pretty well for the main gag to land, but also vanilla Season Zero is buckwild. Yugi sets a dude on fire without giving a single gently caress. I always liked the rules for yugi's bullshit mindcrush games. Like, it seems he can make the rules to be whatever he wants.  - I am thinking of a number between one and six trillion.  - Uh... Seven? - Mind Crush!
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Sep 7, 2017 23:52
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Who would win in a fight: Freeza at 100% levels on Namek or Dabura?
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Sep 7, 2017 23:53
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Dabura. He can turn dudes into stone.
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Sep 7, 2017 23:55
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seiferguy posted:Who would win in a fight: Freeza at 100% levels on Namek or Dabura? this is the good poo poo. Does dabura have his sword? I think dabura would spit and hit a limb, frieza would try to go for the death beam, but daburas hard body wouldnt let it through. Then frieza would try a destructo disk and yes i would say it lands and severs his head.
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Sep 7, 2017 23:55
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Half of why I like Dragon Ball is all the bullshit what-ifs you can come up with when bored and daydreaming Recent scenario ideas includes an Earth Is Hell arc where instead of Namek, Freiza and his army goes to Earth, after Namekians with the Namek Dragon Balls going to Earth to find Kami/Piccolo and their balls, and when they arrive it's right after the androids wake up, and all the ensuing power ruckus brings Majin Buu about, along with the time travel happening as Cell arrives Cue an ultra arc where Goku and the entire Z-crew have the war of their loving lives and everyone has to be 100%
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Sep 8, 2017 00:20
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HitTheTargets posted:I liked the one based on Season Zero with green haired Kaiba. You need to know YGOA pretty well for the main gag to land, but also vanilla Season Zero is buckwild. Yugi sets a dude on fire without giving a single gently caress. He also electrocutes a bunch of dudes, puts Kaiba in a coma, and either physically breaks a man apart into plastic toys or puts him in a coma where he believes that to be the case. Season Zero Yugi loving rules. Kild posted:? he's faster than light. He fought Hit who can stop time. Every variety of Lantern can go faster than light, too. Moving faster than light is not a big deal in Superman's universe.
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Sep 8, 2017 00:28
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Glagha posted:The whole power level thing comes up all the time because it's portrayed really inconsistently. Every time someone gets a new power up everyone is in awe and sometimes literally blown away by how powerful they are. Villains get new transformations and then proceed to show off how they're so cool that they can literally just take punches full to the face without flinching like Cell. Then another time they show a character defeating a much stronger opponent through trickery and technique over raw strength. Like, being a super cool martial artists is rad and all but what are you going to do to someone who can flick a finger and level multiple city blocks and can no-sell anything you throw at them. Unless the plot says you should. This has gotten extra bad in Super, God Ki was shown to be this thing that if you didn't have it then you could not scratch a person with it or even sense them, then they get to these tourneys and they never really mention it.
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Sep 8, 2017 00:53
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seiferguy posted:Who would win in a fight: Freeza at 100% levels on Namek or Dabura? Isn't Dabura roughly as strong as Cell? Frieza wouldn't stand a chance
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Sep 8, 2017 00:56
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CharlestonJew posted:Isn't Dabura roughly as strong as Cell? Frieza wouldn't stand a chance Rewatching it on Kai, Gohan struggles against Dabura, to which Vegeta claims is because he slacked off in his training and didn't show his true power like he did against Cell. In other words, Gohan got weaker (I can't recall if he went SSJ2 against Dabura). It makes me think Dabura is weaker than Cell.
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Sep 8, 2017 01:01
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socialsecurity posted:This has gotten extra bad in Super, God Ki was shown to be this thing that if you didn't have it then you could not scratch a person with it or even sense them, then they get to these tourneys and they never really mention it. Yeah but then Vegeta said [Thats my Bulba]
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Sep 8, 2017 01:18
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seiferguy posted:Rewatching it on Kai, Gohan struggles against Dabura, to which Vegeta claims is because he slacked off in his training and didn't show his true power like he did against Cell. In other words, Gohan got weaker (I can't recall if he went SSJ2 against Dabura). It makes me think Dabura is weaker than Cell. Dabura was stated as holding back and toying with Gohan. Then he noticed Vegeta would make a great pawn to awaken Majin Buu and left to tell Babadi. Goku and Vegeta state that from first impression how he moved and fought that he was around Cells Level. Then Goku corrects himself stating that Dabura is likely stronger then that during his fight with Gohan. Vegeta was angry cause both and Goku know Gohan should be really strong but he had slacked off and was nowhere near as strong as he should be.
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Sep 8, 2017 01:29
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socialsecurity posted:This has gotten extra bad in Super, God Ki was shown to be this thing that if you didn't have it then you could not scratch a person with it or even sense them, then they get to these tourneys and they never really mention it. You can't scratch them with energy blasts, fists to the face work fine.
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Sep 8, 2017 02:02
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socialsecurity posted:This has gotten extra bad in Super, God Ki was shown to be this thing that if you didn't have it then you could not scratch a person with it or even sense them, then they get to these tourneys and they never really mention it. That's not true. Godly Ki is good, sure, but Freeza hit and surpassed that level without any godliness literally one movie later, showing that you can surpass the Gods without ever becoming something other than a normal ningen so long as you have a ridiculous amount of talent and some months of training. One arc later, Hit was also shown to be stronger than the God Ki-using Saiyans without any clear godliness in him, just 1000 years of experience and a pretty neat powerset. Trunks then hit Super Saiyan Blue's level through sheer, absolute, unstoppable rage, again without godly intervention (or well, with godly intervention, just entirely negative. Good job, Zamasu). God Ki is an undeniably useful feature but it isn't the end-all of things, and it hasn't been except in one movie (and even there, Goku only manages to do something after he loses Super Saiyan God, even if he keeps its "feeling"). It's always been about constant improvement through training and dedication, or just being Gohan/Freeza and being born with an insane amount of talent that takes the smallest amount of effort to unlock but they'll never take full advantage of it. Also I find the earlier argument funny due to the Spirit Bomb coming up, because nearly the same debate happens in-universe in Online's backstory. Seeing the Super Spirit Bomb that destroyed Buu makes Krillin and Tenshinhan reach two completely different conclusions. Krillin finds that a single person's power is not what matters, and that by working together, even a bunch of weaklings can surpass the strongest. Meanwhile, Tenshinhan reaches the conclusion that unleashing a ridiculous amount of Ki in one, decisive blow is the key to any victory, self-preservation be damned. This leads to the creations of the New Turtle and Crane Schools.
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Sep 8, 2017 05:15
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Blaze Dragon posted:Also I find the earlier argument funny due to the Spirit Bomb coming up, because nearly the same debate happens in-universe in Online's backstory. Seeing the Super Spirit Bomb that destroyed Buu makes Krillin and Tenshinhan reach two completely different conclusions. Krillin finds that a single person's power is not what matters, and that by working together, even a bunch of weaklings can surpass the strongest. Meanwhile, Tenshinhan reaches the conclusion that unleashing a ridiculous amount of Ki in one, decisive blow is the key to any victory, self-preservation be damned. This leads to the creations of the New Turtle and Crane Schools. These actually sound like cool and interesting takes on the Spirit Bomb. How do they handle the skills for these schools in-game? Kashuno posted:I am making a very real guess the next arc skips a few years and focuses on Uub The ToP has to end with Goku getting the Son Wukong treatment just to be extra sure this won't turn into another GT.
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Sep 8, 2017 06:32
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I'm still rooting for Toriyama's idea that Goku becomes the next turtle hermit Because gently caress the idea that Goku dies fighting Vegeta in space or living to be an immortal fight man That's stupid
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Sep 8, 2017 06:37
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I was always confused about Dabura's strength until someone pointed out he's essentially Demon Supreme Kai, and now it all makes sense.
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Sep 8, 2017 06:40
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Burkion posted:I'm still rooting for Toriyama's idea that Goku becomes the next turtle hermit Its cool actually
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Sep 8, 2017 06:41
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Momomo posted:I was always confused about Dabura's strength until someone pointed out he's essentially Demon Supreme Kai, and now it all makes sense. Jeez, that's really harsh on Dabura
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Sep 8, 2017 06:42
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If Goku becomes the Turtle Hermit what would Vegeta do then?
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Sep 8, 2017 06:45
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bobjr posted:If Goku becomes the Turtle Hermit what would Vegeta do then? Continue being a trophy-husband?
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Sep 8, 2017 06:46
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Krillin became the next Turtle Hermit in the DBO timeline. I like that idea more because I cannot believe Goku would hang out in one place training kids for long.
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Sep 8, 2017 06:47
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Andrast posted:Jeez, that's really harsh on Dabura not really, Shin's incompetent but he didn't get mind controlled.
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Sep 8, 2017 06:48
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bobjr posted:If Goku becomes the Turtle Hermit what would Vegeta do then? Vegeta likes training Saiyans especially (see:Cabba) so probably the same thing with more saiyans instead of humans
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Sep 8, 2017 08:44
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Here's a pretty good video with legit critism. https://youtu.be/jfHBrhMM5bk RBX fucked around with this message at 09:07 on Sep 8, 2017 |
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Sep 8, 2017 08:48
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RBX posted:Here's a pretty good video with legit critism. that videos broken
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Sep 8, 2017 08:58
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Fixed it.
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Sep 8, 2017 09:07
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It's from last year, much of it doesn't really apply past the first 2 arcs.
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Sep 8, 2017 09:25
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It's a shame that was made over a year ago, since the show has gone through pretty big changes since then, but still clearly has problems. Most of the clips used in that vid were up to the end of the Frieza arc, which I would almost call a different show in how different (awful) it was.
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Sep 8, 2017 09:31
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I didn't even notice, it showed up in my recommendations. He has a good video calling Caulifa a Mary Sue but the rest are just ehhh.
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Sep 8, 2017 09:44
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RBX posted:He has a good video calling Caulifa a Mary Sue Define good
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Sep 8, 2017 10:35
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RBX posted:Here's a pretty good video with legit critism. It's ugly and poo poo for 90% of its run-time because it's made on a shoestring meaning budget has to be allocated to highlight in the plot and the better key animators and directors can only do so much because they're only human. You don't need 12 minutes to explain that.
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Sep 8, 2017 10:49
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