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XboxPants
Jan 30, 2006

Steven doesn't want me watching him sleep anymore.

Burkion posted:

Gohan could still go SSJ2 if he had to/was angry enough, even in his late teens when he REALLY let himself go.

Any time after Gohan fought Cell it's not even a question who's stronger.

I couldn't remember if he could still reach 2 or not, I was thinking that he couldn't. That makes sense then.

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TheKingofSprings
Oct 9, 2012

Manatee Cannon posted:

gohan fought cell when he was 10-11 (if you count the time chamber or not) and I don't think goten's that old

Goten is a lot older now

It’s been 6.5 years since Buu, he’s actually almost 14

TheKingofSprings fucked around with this message at 07:25 on Feb 25, 2018

Burkion
May 10, 2012

by Fluffdaddy

XboxPants posted:

I couldn't remember if he could still reach 2 or not, I was thinking that he couldn't. That makes sense then.

Yeah he goes SSJ2 against Kibito and I THINK Dabura

(And apparently he goes SSJ2 super briefly against Broly in the movie but no way in gently caress is that canon)

Goten just never had to deal with the poo poo Gohan did.

If he had, maybe he'd be one of the most powerful beings in the multiverse. One day Goten, one day your time will come.

Kild
Apr 24, 2010

Burkion posted:

I'm pretty sure if Piccolo tried to fuse with either Goten or Trunks the fusion would implode sight unseen. You have to be SOME WHAT compatible with one another for the Fusion Dance to work. Never mind the practical reality that Piccolo is literally too big to fuse with either of the kids.
The guy can change his size at will. Theres nothing AFAIK that means they have to be compatible; just the ability to match power levels and able to do the dance.

Burkion
May 10, 2012

by Fluffdaddy

Kild posted:

The guy can change his size at will. Theres nothing AFAIK that means they have to be compatible; just the ability to match power levels and able to do the dance.

Sayians have more potential than he does.

Basically here's how it works out.

Piccolo is at least as strong as Cell Saga Android 17, who is in theory as strong as 18. He might be stronger by the time Buu rolls around since he never gave up training, who knows.

Goten and Trunks are explicitly not stronger than Android 18. She's pretty definitively stronger than they are, even fighting together, which makes sense.

The only level of SSJ they've achieved is the normal one.

Piccolo is nebulously stronger than that. Not as strong as a Fully Mastered SSJ or an Ultra SSJ or whatever, but he's definitely stronger than a normal SSJ.



BUT

Sayians are stupid broken genetic factories with exponential growth factors. The best option for the best fusion that they had at that time was the two of them, because even though they are weaker than Piccolo on their own, fused it won't matter.


Also even if Piccolo IS weaker than Goten and kid Trunks, he'd still be able to kick their rear end in a real fight. The two of them are not exactly the smartest fighters.

Sade
Aug 3, 2009

Can't touch this.
No really, you can't
Isn't Cell-era Gohan called Teen Gohan in official media? Where is 10 or 11 coming from? I always imagined him as, like, 14 or 15 by the Cell arc

Burkion
May 10, 2012

by Fluffdaddy

Sade posted:

Isn't Cell-era Gohan called Teen Gohan in official media? Where is 10 or 11 coming from? I always imagined him as, like, 14 or 15 by the Cell arc

He's called Teen because America tries really, REALLY hard to pretend that Gohan wasn't a baby getting his dick punched in all the goddamn time in early Z.


Also because he was jacked as gently caress.

10 or 11 comes from his actual age and the time line, which is one of the only things Toriyama has ever kept consistent with across the entire franchise time travel not included.


Gohan's life of misery goes as follows

Raditz- 4 years old
Sayians/Namek- 5 years old
Mecha Freeza- 7 years old
Androids!- 8
Cell- 9/10


Add subtract time chamber nonsense

Roughly he's 10 or 11 when he fights Cell

Sockser
Jun 28, 2007

This world only remembers the results!




11:



12/13:


Also 12/13:

PaletteSwappedNinja
Jun 3, 2008

One Nation, Under God.

Burkion posted:

And as Super showed, Piccolo is a smart enough fighter that even when he is going against way stronger fighters, he can still out smart them. Unless they're invisible.

Piccolo beat the invisible guy, he was knocked out by the tiny bug man who exploited his one weakness, his trademark poor hearing.

mycot
Oct 23, 2014

"It's okay. There are other Terminators! Just give us this one!"
Hell Gem

Sade posted:

Isn't Cell-era Gohan called Teen Gohan in official media? Where is 10 or 11 coming from? I always imagined him as, like, 14 or 15 by the Cell arc

Teen Gohan has always been a misnomer. I think it's because there's Adult Gohan but you can't call Cell Saga Gohan just Kid Gohan, because well.

Mechafunkzilla
Sep 11, 2006

If you want a vision of the future...
Being touched by Guru makes you grow up too fast.

Justin_Brett
Oct 23, 2012

GAMERDOME put down LOSER
If Piccolo hadn't been knocked out how could 17 look cool for the tenth time? Think.

esperterra
Mar 24, 2010

SHINee's back




Piccolo getting ringed out at that time is fine, but lol at the loving reasoning for it. This is the guy who eavesdropped on Trunks and Goku from like 100 yards off like it ain't no thang.

Burkion
May 10, 2012

by Fluffdaddy
My mind substituted the far less stupid reason for him to get rung out


Poor Piccolo

Mr.Acula
May 10, 2009

Billions and billions of fat clouds

Burkion posted:

He's called Teen because America tries really, REALLY hard to pretend that Gohan wasn't a baby getting his dick punched in all the goddamn time in early Z.


Also because he was jacked as gently caress.

10 or 11 comes from his actual age and the time line, which is one of the only things Toriyama has ever kept consistent with across the entire franchise time travel not included.


Gohan's life of misery goes as follows

Raditz- 4 years old
Sayians/Namek- 5 years old
Mecha Freeza- 7 years old
Androids!- 8
Cell- 9/10


Add subtract time chamber nonsense

Roughly he's 10 or 11 when he fights Cell

Pretty sure it was a year and a half for Goku to get back from Namek and then 3 years of training for the androids, and then 1 year in the time chamber.

Burkion
May 10, 2012

by Fluffdaddy

dr.acula posted:

Pretty sure it was a year and a half for Goku to get back from Namek and then 3 years of training for the androids, and then 1 year in the time chamber.

Basically yeah, 10-11.

Gohan is fighting Cell before Goku met Bulma, comparatively.

Mr.Acula
May 10, 2009

Billions and billions of fat clouds

Oh right and I forgot about this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ji1GLrZIQjQ&t=164s

amigolupus
Aug 25, 2017

Burkion posted:

If he had, maybe he'd be one of the most powerful beings in the multiverse. One day Goten, one day your time will come.

Maybe if the franchise stops focusing on the older characters like Goku, and to a worse extent Bardock, then maybe they could finally give the younger generation some actual development.

Zil posted:

Would their offspring be affected if they were both in SSJ form while the kid was conceived?

Bra was conceived by a God and delivered by an Angel. Bra is going to be Dragon Ball Jesus, and her uncle Beerus will train her to be the strongest.

esperterra
Mar 24, 2010

SHINee's back




I would love to live in a world where we get a series in which Bra is a dope-rear end fighter. Combining Bulma's brain and Vegeta's brawn would be top tier.

Momomo
Dec 26, 2009

Dont judge me, I design your manhole
So where are people getting the ages for Goten and Trunks? They've given us a couple of clues as to how much time has passed (mainly Pan and Bra's births) but have they given years? It seems strange that six years are supposed to have passed since Buu.

khwarezm
Oct 26, 2010

Deal with it.

Momomo posted:

So where are people getting the ages for Goten and Trunks? They've given us a couple of clues as to how much time has passed (mainly Pan and Bra's births) but have they given years? It seems strange that six years are supposed to have passed since Buu.

They haven't, it's incredibly (deliberately?) vague and I can't even figure out what tertiary source the wiki is basing it's claims off of.

This argument comes up constantly and I almost wish at some point they'd just say 'Look, it's only a couple of years after Buu, it's fine, everything is fine'.

Burkion
May 10, 2012

by Fluffdaddy

Momomo posted:

So where are people getting the ages for Goten and Trunks? They've given us a couple of clues as to how much time has passed (mainly Pan and Bra's births) but have they given years? It seems strange that six years are supposed to have passed since Buu.

Yeah we have actual dates.

Not sure from where exactly, I think it's reverse engineering from End of Z

drjuggalo
Jul 26, 2014
dragon ball super picks up right after kid buu dies and doesnt have that 10 year gap that the end of DBZ had

Mr.Acula
May 10, 2009

Billions and billions of fat clouds

Its because BoG and Super have different timelines I'm pretty sure but I cant look it up right now

Manatee Cannon
Aug 26, 2010



dr.acula posted:

Its because BoG and Super have different timelines I'm pretty sure but I cant look it up right now

yea that always trips me up. bog is less than a year after buu but super changes the timeline to something else

TheKingofSprings
Oct 9, 2012

Burkion posted:

Yeah we have actual dates.

Not sure from where exactly, I think it's reverse engineering from End of Z

End of Z is 784 and Pan is 4 then.

Buu is during 774.

Burkion
May 10, 2012

by Fluffdaddy

TheKingofSprings posted:

End of Z is 784 and Pan is 4 then.

Buu is during 774.

Pan is about 1 year old or near it by the time of the Tournament of Power


Really it is just Battle of Gods that kinda hosed up the timeline. Super put it back where it 'should' be, Re- Pan's age.

Kild
Apr 24, 2010

yeah BoG just hosed up the timeline because Videl shouldn't be pregnant at 17/18.

Also Adult Gohan's a misnomer like Teen Gohan too because he's suppose to be like 17 and in high school.

notaspy
Mar 22, 2009

4th March! Ftw is this poo poo? This has ruined my sunday morning with my daughter.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth

esperterra posted:

I would love to live in a world where we get a series in which Bra is a dope-rear end fighter. Combining Bulma's brain and Vegeta's brawn would be top tier.

Vegeta's brain and Bulma's brawn.

No Dignity
Oct 15, 2007

notaspy posted:

4th March! Ftw is this poo poo? This has ruined my sunday morning with my daughter.

Presumably the next two episodes are both going to be TV special quality

stev
Jan 22, 2013

Please be excited.



multijoe posted:

Presumably the next two episodes are both going to be TV special quality

Ha.

Calaveron
Aug 7, 2006
:negative:
It’s gonna be 22 minutes of Cleopatra doing the arm pose thing

No Dignity
Oct 15, 2007

This is what I mean in the thread having gotten really weirdly bitter.

It's the finale, every finale in Super to date has had good animation, they're debuting Goku's ultimate form, there's a break before each episode and it's the end of the series for the foreseeable future. All of that points to them ending the show on a high. They're not going to bring in the guys from the Universe 4 episode for Goku Blanco.

Squallege
Jan 7, 2006

No greater good, no just cause

Grimey Drawer
The last two episodes will be the sixth episode of Gunbuster in terms of animation

Crabtree
Oct 17, 2012

ARRRGH! Get that wallet out!
Everybody: Lowtax in a Pickle!
Pickle! Pickle! Pickle! Pickle!

Dinosaur Gum
Punches from God all the way down, color effects blocking what's happening sometimes, Jiren switching personalities yet again when he's gonna lose, Goku communicating entirety in AAAAHHHHHH and attacks.

Blaze Dragon
Aug 28, 2013
LOWTAX'S SPINE FUND

Oh hey, new Heroes opening!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i6L0reF5lks

Focus on the non-Xeno characters is a good change after the last few years have been non-stop Xeno action, Trunks' life keeps getting worse as it should, and weirdly enough, Cooler is here. I guess it's because he didn't get a chance to use a Dark Dragon Ball unlike the other popular movie villains. Even weirder, he may be a good guy, the manga has him rescue Trunks from jail.



We also have a name for Vegeta's new form: Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan Evolution.

Blaze Dragon fucked around with this message at 15:51 on Feb 25, 2018

ZepiaEltnamOberon
Oct 25, 2010

I Failed At Anime 2022
Something something live action movie.

ImpAtom
May 24, 2007

Blaze Dragon posted:

Oh hey, new Heroes opening!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i6L0reF5lks

Focus on the non-Xeno characters is a good change after the last few years have been non-stop Xeno action, Trunks' life keeps getting worse as it should, and weirdly enough, Cooler is here. I guess it's because he didn't get a chance to use a Dark Dragon Ball unlike the other popular movie villains. Even weirder, he may be a good guy, the manga has him rescue Trunks from jail.



We also have a name for Vegeta's new form: Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan Evolution.

"What is a god... TO A NON-BELIEVER?!"

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Burkion
May 10, 2012

by Fluffdaddy
Good guy Cooler?

What?

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