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mossyfisk posted:Honestly I'd just have Lews on-screen for when he's talking. It gives you more options for performance and lets you do the classic "cut to a bystander's perspective where he's shouting at nothing" trick. I really liked Holden and Miller, so it could work, maybe not all the time.
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Jan 14, 2020 02:54
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The Neal! posted:hrmmm so Mat, overtime, might have convinced the Seanchan to do away with enslaving women with A'dam ultimately freeing and unleashing Moghedien on the world. Assuming he survived the Seanchan campaign, since iirc the failure of that adventure and the death of Tuon is one of the conditions for the future Aviendha saw
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Jan 14, 2020 04:22
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That future is very much at question. Aviendha kinda broke it by forcing Rand to include the Aiel in the Dragon's Peace, which was something that was explicitly not in her vision.
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Jan 14, 2020 05:02
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VAGENDA OF MANOCIDE posted:Assuming he survived the Seanchan campaign, since iirc the failure of that adventure and the death of Tuon is one of the conditions for the future Aviendha saw Geez, I'd forgotten about that. Those Mat and Perrin books sure would have been swell.
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Jan 14, 2020 07:11
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rndmnmbr posted:That future is very much at question. Aviendha kinda broke it by forcing Rand to include the Aiel in the Dragon's Peace, which was something that was explicitly not in her vision. That particular future, sure. I'm saying that if it's a condition for that future then those conditions are currently a possibility--minus the Aiel not joining the Dragon's Peace thing. VAGENDA OF MANOCIDE fucked around with this message at 18:16 on Jan 14, 2020 |
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Jan 14, 2020 16:13
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i know i've seen some people say they dislike faile but i seem to enjoy all the segments she's involved in for whatever reason 
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Jan 16, 2020 03:56
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Johnny Joestar posted:i know i've seen some people say they dislike faile but i seem to enjoy all the segments she's involved in for whatever reason I actually like *her* scenes. And I like Perrin's scenes. It's the Berelain drama and the super long winter's heart stuff that gets me down.
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Jan 16, 2020 04:03
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i'll admit i haven't gotten back to winter's heart on my reread yet so i don't have the full experience of perrin standing in the snow fresh in my mind, so perhaps things degrade a bit!
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Jan 16, 2020 04:07
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Really I don't mind Faile, I just think she and Perrin make for a terrible couple. #TeamRolan #TeamPerrelain
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Jan 16, 2020 04:12
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VikingofRock posted:Really I don't mind Faile, I just think she and Perrin make for a terrible couple. #TeamRolan #TeamPerrelain Eh maybe that Seanchan instead of Berelain.
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Jan 16, 2020 04:13
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VikingofRock posted:Really I don't mind Faile, I just think she and Perrin make for a terrible couple. #TeamRolan #TeamPerrelain uh, #galadelain is a way healthier relationship my dude. A lot of Faile's storyline suffers because the Shaido storyline is dull and Perrin's sullenness when she's gone isn't interesting. But I thought they were pretty good when together. The scene where she gets him to cry gets me choked up.
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Jan 16, 2020 04:42
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I haven’t minded it but really Berelain actually wants Perrin and doesn’t try to be a shithead to him all the time and seems like a competent ruler.
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Jan 16, 2020 06:03
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#TeamElaytrim
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Jan 16, 2020 06:50
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Brolander posted:#TeamElaytrim Okay this I can 100% get behind; those two have way more chemistry together than any actual couple in the series.
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Jan 16, 2020 07:03
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Mat deserves much better than Elayne. Tuon is much better than Elayne. Also having remembered not liking Perrin/Faile, on this last time through I definitely realized it was just the whole Shaido storyline, not the characters, that made me tired of them. It just drags forever and Perrin is mopey for like, 3 books.
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Jan 16, 2020 07:17
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https://twitter.com/rafejudkins/status/1217520372725297152?s=19
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Jan 16, 2020 17:13
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Mmmm. AMOL: I never really thought about the similarity between Egwene's and whatever the Queen of Manetheren's name was deaths. Both avenging their Warder, both through overuse of the One Power, and both Warders gone to fight an impossible battle. I might have to look through the series for any other historical similarities.
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Jan 20, 2020 12:25
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Also I would like to congratulate Rand on the single biggest effort of will in the entire series. Not facing down TDO, not cleansing Saidin, but rather managing to resist Lanfear's charm when she's wearing nothing but a shirt and coming onto him strong enough to rouse the dead. Next to that, the rest would have been easy.
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Jan 20, 2020 12:33
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Comrade Blyatlov posted:Mmmm. AMOL: Main difference being that Egwene's warder was a massive idiot
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Jan 20, 2020 12:56
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You never know, Aemon's wife might have been yelling at him THIS IS A TERRIBLE IDEA DON'T DO IT
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Jan 20, 2020 12:57
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Just finished WH. The first half is sooooo slow, but it becomes a frantic caper for the whole second half. Forgot how good Mat and Cadsuanes parts are
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Jan 20, 2020 17:57
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One of these days I’ll just read the mat povs to see how it holds up by itself.
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Jan 20, 2020 19:19
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I'm doing my first reread since I was a teen/twenty-something keeping up with the books as they were coming out, but I fell off hard after Winter's Heart. So this is my opportunity to reread a series that meant a lot to me at the time, and finish the drat thing. That said, I just wrapped up RJs books and started Gathering Storm and at least based on the first few chapters and prologue, I can't say there's a stark difference in the writing really. Sanderson certainly breaks up paragraphs like a human being, and that's nice, but aside from that on the page I don't really notice a difference. Maybe it becomes more obvious later. Anyway, good god does this series benefit from being able to just cruise through it instead of waiting two years between books and forgetting 3/4 of the characters.
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Jan 21, 2020 04:54
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Mats writing felt super different to me. Like he had become pretty competent by the end of RJ books and then he becomes a buffoon (but good at war)
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Jan 21, 2020 05:37
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Sanderson's said that he had a hard time getting Mat's tone right, but I figure part of the shift is just that Mat's had a pretty significant character step right before Sanderson came on the scene. He's both personally out of step and being written by someone who's favorite character was Perrin. Seriously, Perrin? For the Light's sake, Perrin?
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Jan 21, 2020 05:49
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Vavrek posted:Seriously, Perrin? For the Light's sake, Perrin? Lan was my favorite in books 1 & 2 because he's a bad-rear end. After Perrin was Mat for a while, then Egwene from when she's captured by the White Tower up to the end.
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Jan 21, 2020 06:22
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Sandersons Perrin was way better than Jordans Perrin tbh
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Jan 21, 2020 07:16
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Nihilarian posted:Sandersons Perrin was way better than Jordans Perrin tbh If we're talking general averages maybe but book 4 Perrin is the best Perrin Perrin was my fave. I feel like Perrin and Faile have pretty much the only adult relationship in the whole book as well.
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Jan 21, 2020 23:13
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Not with that ridiculous jealousy of Faile's.
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Jan 22, 2020 00:04
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Soonmot posted:Not with that ridiculous jealousy of Faile's. Yeah I'll give you that but I don't know, they seem to be the only ones that have problems and deal with it together as partners/equals. Also to be fair to Faile, she was actually dead on about Berelain trying to crack on Perrin while Perrin spent the vast percentage of the time being like "what? No! That's crazy talk." which must have been infuriating as hell for her.
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Jan 22, 2020 00:12
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There's also the culture clash - he's from an area where disagreements seem to be settled with stoic silence, while she's from an area that expects family members to regularly be screaming at each other. Given the high percentage of their scenes that are from Perrin's viewpoint, it is clear that a lot of her jealousy is filtered through that barrier.
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Jan 22, 2020 00:15
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i feel like faile is one of the only few to respond in a relatively human way given the tendency for like 5-6 women to just pop up and start trying to throw themselves at a protagonist and said protagonist stupidly just shrugging and going 'I DUNNO' instead of saying directly that they have no interest in those people and that they're just being annoying i mean i know it would defuse certain situations instantly if it happened that way but good lord it happens enough to where you have to wonder why none of them catch on beyond just convenience for writing
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Jan 22, 2020 00:17
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Yeah but Perrin has said to her, multiple times, that he's not interested in Berelin, and Faile is all, "well he hasn't screamed at me or tried to hit me yet, so he must be lying".
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Jan 22, 2020 00:24
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Mat and Rand both turn down their share of women. Hell, Rand builds an entire game of it for the maidens, and does so even while doing his best to accommodate their frankly insane attachment to the idea of him. It’s just Perrin being written as a dullard who never lets any of his cleverness show up in his own thinking while being some kind of logistics savant that makes his interactions with women the worst.
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Jan 22, 2020 00:30
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Soonmot posted:Yeah but Perrin has said to her, multiple times, that he's not interested in Berelin, and Faile is all, "well he hasn't screamed at me or tried to spank me yet, so he must be lying".
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Jan 22, 2020 00:31
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Just make all the magic stuff like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gP13Vd4fIoY Then we good. Yes, musical numbers must be included.
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Jan 22, 2020 01:13
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Soonmot posted:"well he hasn't screamed at me or tried to hit me yet, so he must be lying". Yeah okay fair cop. That stuff is so loving stupid I forgot it existed.
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Jan 22, 2020 01:16
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Soonmot posted:Yeah but Perrin has said to her, multiple times, that he's not interested in Berelin, and Faile is all, "well he hasn't screamed at me or tried to hit me yet, so he must be lying". The Faile/Perrin thing is a casualty of the long, slow spiral of the books and Jordan's death. Just like the extent of Rand's madness only really becomes apparent when you start getting outside viewpoints who can comment on his long silences punctuated by bursts of insane non-sequitur caused by arguments with Lews Therin, Faile's behavior mostly only makes sense when viewed from a non-Aiel impartial courtly observer, which we basically never got before Jordan's death. Faile is a result of training in Saldean courtly behavior, where everyone hides their true intentions behind false masks and the only words worth trusting are the ones spoken in violent, unmistakable passion. Perrin keeps saying that he's uninterested in Berelain (true!) but he also says that she isn't trying to seduce him (false!) and he blindly keeps her close to him no matter how brazen she is in her pursuit of him, as if Berelain is a friend-zoned backup-girlfriend in case this whole "Faile" thing doesn't work out. To make an analogy; Perrin is Dermot Mulrooney, Faile is Cameron Diaz, and Berelain is the completely loving untrustworthy Julia Roberts. Julia is not your best friend, Dermot. She wants to gently caress you. Stop trying to make her your best man. So Faile, stung by the apparent contradiction between Perrin's words and deeds and feeling insecure, constantly pushes Perrin to the emotional breaking point, hoping to spark a reaction that she can use to divine his true intentions. But Perrin, being a good Two Rivers lad, thinks that you should never, ever get angry at a woman (because Nynaeve will hit you with a stick), so he hides his anger, which to Faile reads as intentional insincerity (which it technically is), so she pushes him even harder, until eventually he explodes. And Perrin's anger reveals his love, which makes Faile happy, which confuses the poo poo out of Perrin. And then the books get stuck in a holding pattern and we repeat the cycle half a dozen times.
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Jan 22, 2020 01:52
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Yeah that's one of the cases where Jordan's ability to make different cultures and mindsets fell down hard. Like it makes sense now that it was a culture clash of "never ever hurt a woman" and "only words said in violence can be trusted" and it was a comedy of errors between them, but it was so poorly executed (much like Winter's Heart in general)
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Jan 22, 2020 01:57
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It’s probably frustrating that Perrin can literally smell her emotions. He knows exactly how she’s feeling without her saying anything. In addition, he’s pretty stoic so Faile has no idea what Perrin is thinking. It’s pretty unbalanced until Perrin starts actually opening his mouth.
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Jan 22, 2020 01:59
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