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# ? May 29, 2020 03:54 |
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# ? Jun 3, 2024 23:25 |
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A spinoff featuring only characters from the middle column seems like it would be fun.
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# ? May 29, 2020 17:48 |
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Grammarchist posted:A spinoff featuring only characters from the middle column seems like it would be fun. Leah and Rosalie start out antagonizing each other, only to find they have a lot of shared trauma from abusive previous relationships and their own infertility. They bond and become a support system for each other, and eventually enter a romance even more star-crossed than Bella and Edward's. oh god what have i become
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# ? May 29, 2020 17:52 |
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Dienes posted:Leah and Rosalie start out antagonizing each other, only to find they have a lot of shared trauma from abusive previous relationships and their own infertility. They bond and become a support system for each other, and eventually enter a romance even more star-crossed than Bella and Edward's. A more exciting author than Stephanie Meyer.
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# ? May 29, 2020 18:00 |
quote:Funny how having a deadline made it harder to think about leaving, or having her leave. I was glad Seth’d brought that up, so I knew they were staying here. It would be intolerable, wondering if they were about to go, to take away one or two or three of those four days. My four days. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ccmgFo5c7Ug quote:Also funny how, even knowing that it was almost over, the hold she had on me only got harder to break. Almost like it was related to her expanding belly—as if by getting bigger, she was gaining gravitational force. If you know what's coming: yes, this is exactly the cause you think. quote:For a minute I tried to look at her from a distance, to separate myself from the pull. I knew it wasn’t my imagination that my need for her was stronger than ever. Why was that? Because she was dying? Or knowing that even if she didn’t, still—best case scenario—she’d be changing into something else that I wouldn’t know or understand? It's really hard to tell who Meyer wants us to sympathize with the most here. While Bella ultimately turns out to be right in the end, she looks like a delusional lunatic. quote:“Right,” I muttered. This scene is just so weird to envision. quote:“Thank you for coming,” Bella whispered. "Not sure why, but..." quote:“That sucks, you know.” I'm sure Stephenie will find a totally normal way for him to be part of her family! quote:“You’ve always been a part of my family,” she disagreed. These people are so hosed up and I honestly can't believe we're supposed to consider them loyal friends. quote:I looked back down at her face then, so close to mine. Her eyes were shut and she was frowning. “We got off track, Jake. Out of balance. You’re supposed to be part of my life—I can feel that, and so can you.” She paused for a second without opening her eyes—like she was waiting for me to deny it. When I didn’t say anything, she went on. “But not like this. We did something wrong. No. I did. I did something wrong, and we got off track.…” Power move: fall asleep in the middle of telling the guy crushing on you why you're not dating him. quote:“She’s exhausted,” Edward murmured. “It’s been a long day. A hard day. I think she would have gone to sleep earlier, but she was waiting for you.” quote:Occasionally, the mind-reading thing saved time. For example, maybe I wouldn’t have to make a big production out of the accusation about what was going on with Charlie. That mess. Edward would just hear exactly how furious— A terrible, poorly considered plan that makes things worse. quote:“She’s very sure she’s going to live,” Edward said. This reminds me of Handbook for Mortals where Zade's magickal near-death is covered up as an extremely obscure combination of rare diseases. quote:“Charlie’s not stupid. Even if she doesn’t kill him, he’s going to notice a difference.” So her plan is to give her dad a heart attack. quote:“Insane,” I repeated. And then turning her into a vampire works and he has to desperately try to reason with his wife as she tries to implement every crazy plan he agreed to. quote:“I’ll deal with whatever comes,” he whispered, and he turned his face down and away so that I couldn’t even read his reflection. “I won’t cause her pain now.” Yeah this book is gonna go places. quote:“Research?” I asked weakly. So...you have even more reason to terminate this pregnancy. quote:“What did their stories say about the… mothers?” Maybe tone down on the medicine man insults in front of the Native American. quote:The baby, the baby. Like that was all that mattered. Bella’s life was a minor detail to her—easy to blow off. This is like a crazy fanfic of the Twilight series. quote:Rosalie turned her head slowly, and her eyes were blazing. These are the worst people! I don't want to read about them anymore! quote:“C’mon, Jake. Leave Rose alo—” Bella broke off mid-sentence and sucked in a sharp breath. In the same second, Edward was leaning over the top of me, ripping the blanket out of the way. She seemed to convulse, her back arching off the sofa. If I was Carlisle, familiar with the effects immortal children have on their surrogate parents, I'd be very concerned that this baby is driving Bella and Rosalie insane. quote:She didn’t pick up on my mood. “You know, he reminds me of you, Jake,” she said—affectionate tone—still gasping. This is such a hosed up cast. quote:She took an easier breath and then relaxed back into the sofa, her body going limp. Yes, what of your wacky science? quote:“Well, taking your similarities into consideration—” ....what? quote:They got into it then, quickly taking the genetics conversation to a point where the only words I could understand were the the’s and the and’s. And my own name, of course. Alice joined in, commenting now and then in her chirpy bird voice. You may recall this is the exact same thing Bella has done multiple times. Meyer really can't come up with a truly unique voice. quote:Fact one, Bella’d said that the creature was protected by something as strong as vampire skin, something that was too impenetrable for ultrasounds, too tough for needles. Fact two, Rosalie’d said they had a plan to deliver the creature safely. Fact three, Edward’d said that—in myths—other monsters like this one would chew their way out of their own mothers.
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# ? May 29, 2020 18:10 |
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A Real Horse posted:A more exciting author than Stephanie Meyer. I'm not sure Stephanie Meyer is aware that gay people exist.
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# ? May 29, 2020 18:20 |
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I feel like Carlisle is about to start talking about how vampires and werewolves use the 90 percent of the brain that normal people don't. I can't follow his science as it is, so I hope it goes full 90's Discovery Channel wacky.
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# ? May 29, 2020 20:08 |
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She was friends with Jake for like 2 months while he was normal and funny and actually supportive. Then he turned into a complete rear end in a top hat and she mourned the loss of her friend. That made sense. I've also had toxic friends, and "breaking up" with them sucks. But that was like a year ago. At this point in the timeline, he's been an rear end in a top hat for much longer than he was a friend. I don't think they've had a single conversation in the last book and a half that didn't turn into a fight or an argument over his feelings for her. He hates her husband and inlaws and makes every single event in her life, including her wedding, about himself. Why the hell would she want him around?
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# ? May 29, 2020 23:56 |
hyperhazard posted:I don't think they've had a single conversation in the last book and a half that didn't turn into a fight or an argument over his feelings for her. I think you're absolutely right. Jacob starts out as the perfect boyfriend alternative, then turning into a werewolf causes his entire personality to just do a 180. He goes from the funny, smart, cheerful, kind dude that every woman wants to a brooding ball of repressed anger who repeatedly sexually assaults his crush and mocks her over it. Jacob is only her best friend because Meyer keeps insisting that he is, against all of his behavior. It's honestly one of the worst character assassinations she pulls, and she pulls them on drat near every character because she can't write organic conflict or complex morality. She takes one of the most kind and normal people in the series and turns him into someone who would be a villain in any other canon, all for the sake of adding drama and trying to force a love triangle that doesn't even exist until Bella goes "Well I enjoyed being raped, so maybe I'm in love with him."
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# ? May 30, 2020 01:02 |
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Rosalie posted:Giving birth in the middle of a disease-infested swamp with a medicine man smearing sloth spit across your face to drive out the evil spirits was never the safest method.
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# ? May 30, 2020 04:31 |
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Given Rosalie’s background a racist, ignorant screed against indigenous peoples is the most in-character thing she’s said in many, many chapters. I’m betting Meyer didn’t intend it that way.
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# ? May 30, 2020 13:53 |
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N1V3JW4HeBs Jasper was my first thought when I saw this and I hate that so much
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# ? May 31, 2020 09:59 |
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Cleolinda did some pretty entertaining readthroughs of the books that come from a perspective of enjoyment laced with criticism. Along with jokes, she (also) (thank you chitoryu12!) has some interesting commentary on the ideas and audience impact. This quote is from her first blog about the book, back before the others were released, where she muses on how Edward is a stand-in for how teenage girls see teenage boys:quote:The real question on a girl's mind is, "What, other than sex, is he thinking about? What, other than sex, do I have to offer someone I'm crazy about?" And if you're a teenage girl with low self-esteem, the answer you're going to come up with to that second question is going to be, "I don't have anything, because I'm not pretty or special or worthy, so if I don't want to immediately put out, I have nothing, and I have no chance." The obvious answer being "sex" actually makes it harder, because you've got that looming in front of you, and maybe a kind of despair--are you going to have to give in if you want a boy to like you? What if you aren't ready? What if you're scared? I had meant to post this back when we covered the "honeymoon" because some of what was said then touched on these ideas from a different angle. Of course, life got in the way, lol
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# ? Jun 1, 2020 13:40 |
Chapter 16: Too-Much-Information Alertquote:I took off early, long before sunrise was due. I’d gotten just a little bit of uneasy sleep leaning against the side of the sofa. Edward woke me when Bella’s face was flushed, and he took my spot to cool her back down. I stretched and decided I was rested enough to get some work done. That's a good way to describe how Stephenie Meyer got her ideas for this story! quote:Morning, Jacob, Leah greeted me. And I bet we'll see every goddamn second of it. quote:Let’s make the deep run, I told Leah. Seth, take the perimeter. "I really should have been the protagonist instead." quote:I gave her that one. I know. What this is foreshadowing has extremely little relevance to the plot and it's not a problem if you forget about it. quote:Leah didn’t push herself past me, though she could have now. I was paying more attention to each new scent than I was to the speed contest. She kept to my right side, running with me rather than racing against me. Oh, she's quoting her editor now? quote:Yeah. If Sam was hunting strays, we should have crossed his trail by now. Yes, that's the whole problem with everyone's characters! quote:You’re not exactly the same Leah I’ve always known and loved, either. Yes, is the girl who had her trauma and emotions trampled less annoying than the bully who eats all your food and then tries to decapitate you when you glare at him? quote:We ran in silence again then. It was probably time to turn around, but neither of us wanted to. It felt nice to run like this. We’d been staring at the same small circle of a trail for too long. It felt good to stretch our muscles and take the rugged terrain. We weren’t in a huge hurry, so I thought maybe we should hunt on the way back. Leah was pretty hungry. Can they not just...go to the store? Ask the Cullens for some cash to buy McDonalds in town? quote:She didn’t add anything for a few minutes; I started thinking about turning back. Great, now we're at the part where the put-upon girl starts saying that it was all her fault that everyone abused and ignored her and the protagonist is a true hero for showing her the barest hints of kindness. quote:Er, no problem. Actually, I mean that. I don’t mind having you here like I thought I would. "Author fiat. It's been like, 2 days." quote:She didn’t answer right away, and I followed the wordless direction of her thoughts. She was thinking about the future—about what I’d said to Jared the other morning. About how the time would be up soon, and then I’d go back to the forest. About how I’d promised that she and Seth would return to the pack when the Cullens were gone.… Let's not forget that Jacob has been a dick to her for most of this time. He's only reduced his outright threats to low-level snarking at her in every conversation. He hasn't displayed any real kindness to her except letting her leave Sam's pack and not directly overriding her will to force her onto his team. How hosed up was Leah's situation that this is the modicum of kindness that causes her to find happiness? quote:I want to stay, too, Seth thought quietly. I hadn’t realized he’d been paying much attention to us as he ran the perimeter. I like this pack. Do the wolves even have a choice, though? It's been established that their aging is basically frozen to keep them youthful guardians for years (which is also part of the justification for imprinting on a child). If Seth graduates high school, will he still be stuck as an unusually ripped and tall teenager for decades? quote:But— The best thing for Leah's well-being would be to abandon these rear end in a top hat jocks and never look back. quote:I turned back and started loping slowly toward the west. This is a bit much to deal with, Leah. Let me think about it, ’kay? Sure. Take your time. It took us longer to make the run back. I wasn’t trying for speed. I was just trying to concentrate enough that I wouldn’t plow headfirst into a tree. Seth was grumbling a little bit in the back of my head, but I was able to ignore him. He knew I was right. He wasn’t going to abandon his mom. He would go back to La Push and protect the tribe like he should. Maybe try not being a jackass to her 24/7, Jacob. That'll make it real easy to get along. quote:We ran into a herd of black-tailed deer just as the sun was coming up, brightening the clouds a little bit behind us. Leah sighed internally but didn’t hesitate. Her lunge was clean and efficient—graceful, even. She took down the largest one, the buck, before the startled animal fully understood the danger. I feel like, as human beings, we've invented many solutions to food that don't require giving into animal instinct and eating raw meat! quote:It was easy for me to do the same. And I was glad I hadn’t forgotten this. This would be my life again soon. Almost like the only thing she needed was for people to shut up about her emotions! quote:We ate together until we both were full. Mercifully avoiding another long dialogue scene. quote:You headed back to the bloodsuckers? Leah asked. quote:She thought about how to answer me. Wow, this is going to sound bad. But, honestly, it will be easier to deal with your pain than face mine. You're right! That does sound bad! quote:Fair enough. Remember, it's okay to brush off a character's legitimate pain as long as she calls herself bad for it! quote:I’m sorry about this, Jacob. I’m sorry you’re in pain. I’m sorry it’s getting worse and not better. Oh hey, nothing has actually changed! He'll still brutally maul you on an impulse! quote:Hold up! Let me explain! It is refreshing to see someone finally tell Jacob to shut the gently caress up and listen to people. quote:So what are you talking about? And there we have a one-two punch of "the implication that being able to have kids is the only thing making you a woman" and "something really important to the character and the lore that casually gets inserted in a paragraph when it becomes relevant." quote:You know why Sam thinks we imprint, she thought, calmer now. Somehow this makes imprinting even creepier, knowing that it's a coldly practical means of guaranteeing reproduction. quote:I waited for her to tell me where she was going with this. And again, the other wolves told her "Suck it up, we don't give a poo poo" and blamed her for feeling bad. The loving Volturi have better people skills. quote:We do not, I argued with her. That’s just Sam’s theory. Imprinting happens, but we don’t know why. Billy thinks it’s something else. Also, this means imprinting implicitly takes homosexuality out of the Wolf Pack altogether. quote:You really want to imprint, or be imprinted on, or whichever? I demanded. What’s wrong with going out and falling in love like a normal person, Leah? Imprinting is just another way of getting your choices taken away from you. I'm sure the book will do nothing to tell Jacob that imprinting is actually cool and good! quote:You don’t want to imprint? Before this line of thought continues, I want to bring it back to the problem I've brought up with the characters' actions and the author's intent not really matching reality. Rosalie wanting a baby because of losing her dream of having a family to vampirism is completely understandable. What is not understandable is that this reasonable desire would become so protective as to literally be a hissing cat trying to kill anyone who steps too close to Bella. That is far closer to Carlisle's education on immortal children causing a supernatural desire to violently protect them. What this conversation is doing feels more like Meyer realizing that, and trying to use a "women's intuition" scene to explain that Rosalie's terrifying behavior is actually completely normal and justified. quote:You would act like Rosalie? You would murder someone—because that’s what she’s doing, making sure no one interferes with Bella’s death—you would do that to have a baby? Since when are you a breeder? Oh God, he's an r/childfree poster. quote:I just want the options I don’t have, Jacob. Maybe, if there was nothing wrong with me, I would never give it a thought. "I won't stop calling her family 'leeches' and refusing to even eat their food, though. That would be too much." quote:A loud snarl ripped through my teeth. Somebody fucked around with this message at 18:04 on Jun 1, 2020 |
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# ? Jun 1, 2020 17:49 |
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There's...a lot to unpack in that chapter. Jake's absolutely right that imprinting is creepy as hell. Even if it helps you forget about your ex, it does so by wiping out any free will. Imagine how easy it would be to take advantage of someone who was forced to love you no matter what. "Do the dishes or I'll leave." "Buy me an Audi R8 or I'll leave." "Break off all contact with your family and friends or I'll leave." "Have sex now or I'll leave." That's some Ella Enchanted poo poo right there. Hell, even take it to extremes: "I know for a fact that you love me more than our children, so kill them or I'll leave."
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# ? Jun 1, 2020 19:47 |
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I know trans issues weren't really mainstream at the time, but for half a second I thought that's where Meyer was going with Leah feeling that her body was "wrong" and was horrified at how that would be handled.
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# ? Jun 1, 2020 20:12 |
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Wait, I just realized something. If imprinting works the way they have implied, why is Paul still acting like a violent lovely houseguest when he's at Billy's place? Presumably Jacob's sister would prefer he not be a dick to her family and isn't imprinting supposed to basically make you mold yourself into a perfect partner so that the other person can't help but fall in love with you? Or maybe Rachel just hates her family, I dunno.
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# ? Jun 1, 2020 21:48 |
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hyperhazard posted:There's...a lot to unpack in that chapter. Considering Sam nearly killed Emily, I'm thinking the imprinter will be fine. Imagine how easy it would be to take advantage of someone when you are super strong, forever youthful, and can turn into a monster. "I'll die if you leave me, if you try to leave me, I'll snap and you know what I could do."
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# ? Jun 1, 2020 21:50 |
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Is there a tally for all the times Leah get poo poo on? It feels bizarre for one character to endure so much grief in a story that isn't a kafkaesque comedy.
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# ? Jun 1, 2020 21:57 |
Lemony posted:Wait, I just realized something. If imprinting works the way they have implied, why is Paul still acting like a violent lovely houseguest when he's at Billy's place? Presumably Jacob's sister would prefer he not be a dick to her family and isn't imprinting supposed to basically make you mold yourself into a perfect partner so that the other person can't help but fall in love with you? Most likely it's specifically "perfect partner to your partner" and provides no obligations to be a decent person to anyone else without their demands to.
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# ? Jun 1, 2020 22:01 |
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Imprinting is such a bad concept to me because it's almost like an acknowledged, built in conceit of true love as we see in media all the time, but like it's been turned into an rpg mechanic. You now have the imprinted trait, you are obsessed with someone and will do anything for them. Why? Who knows. But then, obviously, it's too one-sided, so Meyer has the recipient of the affection inevitably fall in love too. That is more like the actual trope, where they are just falling in love with their imprintee(?) because the person has such overwhelming feelings for them or because it's fated (by the storyteller), rather than actually involving any genuine affection or even an attraction to their personality traits or their character. Even though everyone is inevitably super sexy and good looking, they don't even fall in love out of physical desire either. As usual, she doesn't effective follow through on the idea and it feels so strange to me that the person who doesn't have a paranormal compulsion to fall in love still, inevitably, falls in love with whoever imprinted on them. They just automatically become a couple, and both of them will forgive any fault in the other, struggle through any adversity for each other without actually having real reasons for both partners to have that kind of dedication to each other. True love is pretty old hat at this point, but Twilight manages to suck even the slightest bit of compelling interest out of it, somehow!
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# ? Jun 1, 2020 22:57 |
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Right, I'm just surprised she hasn't told Paul to stop being such a dink.
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# ? Jun 1, 2020 22:59 |
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Lemony posted:Right, I'm just surprised she hasn't told Paul to stop being such a dink. Maybe she thinks that’s cute.
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# ? Jun 1, 2020 23:02 |
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Maybe she's terrified any kind of criticism will pricing a violent outburst and he'll tear her father's leg off. But then of course he'll see how upset that makes her and he'll feel real bad and she won't bear to be able to leave him because it's not his fault he got angry. It's the werewolf thing and she was really kind of harsh expecting him to not eat everything in the fridge. So she'll be extra super careful in three future because she knows he really does care. After all he's imprinted, that's love.
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# ? Jun 2, 2020 00:06 |
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Up Circle posted:Imprinting is such a bad concept to me because it's almost like an acknowledged, built in conceit of true love as we see in media all the time, but like it's been turned into an rpg mechanic. You now have the imprinted trait, you are obsessed with someone and will do anything for them. Why? Who knows. The idea of True Love also runs into the huge problem of sexual orientation. Imprinting seems to just delete free will and ignore the whole concept of sexual orientation.
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# ? Jun 2, 2020 01:54 |
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Inspector Gesicht posted:Is there a tally for all the times Leah get poo poo on? It feels bizarre for one character to endure so much grief in a story that isn't a kafkaesque comedy. The blog “das sporking” had a count literally called “Let’s poo poo on Leah” and per their reading there are 108 instances in Breaking Dawn, with 98 in Jacob’s section. They also assessed that Leah is the only character with a genuine narrative arc, having to face her struggles and experience change as a result (regardless of her story’s quality).
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# ? Jun 2, 2020 04:24 |
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Dienes posted:Considering Sam nearly killed Emily, I'm thinking the imprinter will be fine. That's a good point, and very very depressing. Hell Jacob's halfway there -- he had to be restrained during the wedding to stop from hulking out and killing people. It's only a short jump to "Be with me or I'll hurt your husband and family."
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# ? Jun 2, 2020 05:03 |
Remember in the last two books how many times Jacob just barely restrained himself from turning into a giant wolf to kill Bella? Usually over a pretty innocuous comment or fact? Like they’d be having a serious conversation about what’s going on and he’d start transforming in a rage out of nowhere.
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# ? Jun 2, 2020 06:27 |
quote:I was only about a mile from where I’d left my clothes, so I phased back to human and walked. I didn’t think about our conversation. Not because there wasn’t anything to think about, but because I couldn’t stand it. I would not see it that way—but it was harder to keep from doing that when Leah had put the thoughts and emotions straight into my head. Remember how we were supposed to think Jacob was a cool dude who would never use his Alpha powers to suppress anyone's will and that's why Seth and Leah are so loyal and think he's so much better than Sam? Yeah that lasted 2 days. quote:It was real early when I got to the house. Bella was probably still asleep. I figured I’d poke my head in, see what was going on, give ’em the green light to go hunting, and then find a patch of grass soft enough to sleep on while human. I wasn’t phasing back until Leah was asleep. Stop summarizing my thread for me! quote:Alice was staring at my hands, watching them tremble. This cast is incredibly violent. Remember this was a series for young girls. quote:“I’ll take Emmett,” I offered. “You can help Edward with the ripping part.” I remember seeing people try to defend Bella as a character by saying that she's incredibly self-sacrificing and is basically willing to let herself die for others in every book. What I've learned is that she's exclusively self-sacrificing in the stupidest ways and every time she tries to kill herself is because of completely avoidable circumstances, usually from someone's impulses getting the better of them. It's a cast of hosed up people making bad choices and one person wildly flinging herself onto the fire every few months. quote:Carlisle came down slowly, the last one, his face creased with worry. It made him look old enough to be a doctor for once. The distances and times in these books never make any sense. Halfway from Forks to Seattle as the crow flies is almost 50 miles, but the previous half of the chapter makes it feel like they didn't even leave the immediate area. quote:“Thank you, Jacob. This is good timing. There’s much that we need.” His black eyes flickered to the cup that Bella was holding so tight. So she can kill him preemptively? quote:Carlisle sighed. I'm sure this passage will be incredibly entertaining and not at all annoying. quote:So I sauntered over to the armchair next to the one Rosalie had and settled in, sprawling out so that my head was tilted toward Bella and my left foot was near Rosalie’s face. I don't want to know it. quote:She looked pointedly at the TV and ignored me. This is so cringey. I can't handle it. quote:Rosalie still didn’t look at me. “I have killed a hundred times more often than you have, you disgusting beast. Don’t forget that.” Okay, I'll give her that one. quote:“Someday, Beauty Queen, you’re going to get tired of just threatening me. I’m really looking forward to that.” Yes! Please leave the story forever! quote:Before I could hope—or fear—that she’d finally gotten tired of me, she blinked, and her frown disappeared. She seemed totally shocked that I would come to that conclusion. “No! Of course not.” I'm just astounded by how much text in this book is useless. quote:And then Edward said, “Did you say something?” in a puzzled tone. Strange. Because no one had said anything, and because Edward’s hearing was as good as mine, and he should have known that. That one would cause him to transform. quote:“Say something else,” he whispered. That's the most Mormon expletive I've ever heard. quote:Edward’s hand moved to the top peak of her belly and gently rubbed the spot where it must have kicked her. "Nobody in this series is ever happy!" quote:Her breath caught, and it was impossible not to see the fanatical gleam in her eyes. The adoration and the devotion. Big, fat tears overflowed her eyes and ran silently down her face and over her smiling lips. "No, seriously, what kind of loving name is that?" quote:She blushed again. “I sort of named him. I didn’t think you would want… well, you know.” He just realized what the "J" stands for. quote:“What?” quote:“Do you have a backup plan?” Rosalie asked then, leaning over the back of the sofa with the same wondering, gloating look on her face that was on Bella’s. “What if he’s a she?” That's the stupidest loving name I've ever heard! quote:“No, I like it,” Rosalie assured her. Their heads were close together, gold and mahogany. “It’s beautiful. And one of a kind, so that fits.” This unbelievably awful name comes from a Mormon tradition of combining the names of the child's grandparents to name them. Meyer, for her part, said that "whether they become a stripper or a lawyer in large part has to do with the name you give them." quote:“I still think he’s an Edward.” At this point, the foreshadowing of immortal children supernaturally making everyone love them so they can kill with impunity is so blatant that it would be extremely bad writing for it to not be the case here. quote:And I was all alone with my hatred and the pain that was so bad it was like being tortured. Like being dragged slowly across a bed of razor blades. Pain so bad you’d take death with a smile just to get away from it.
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# ? Jun 2, 2020 14:58 |
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Forget it Jake, it’s vampire town.
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# ? Jun 2, 2020 16:57 |
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IT'S HAPPY.
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# ? Jun 2, 2020 17:21 |
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What's starting to offend me most is how boring Meyers' use of imprinting and whatnot is. It's just used to arbitrarily pair up characters without needing to write any sort of relationship or even chemistry between them. Just bam, these two are in love, beginning and end of story.
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# ? Jun 2, 2020 21:38 |
Cythereal posted:What's starting to offend me most is how boring Meyers' use of imprinting and whatnot is. It's just used to arbitrarily pair up characters without needing to write any sort of relationship or even chemistry between them. Just bam, these two are in love, beginning and end of story. For that matter, the only imprinting that's even mattered in the long run so far has been Quil and Claire because of what it's trying to set up and justify. Sam and Emily has been horrifying in how much the abuse overtones get brushed off, but Emily has been a virtual non-entity in the story. Kim (Jared's imprintee) only appeared briefly at the bonfire in Eclipse and Rachel (Paul's imprintee) hasn't even appeared at all.
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# ? Jun 2, 2020 21:46 |
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chitoryu12 posted:That's the stupidest loving name I've ever heard! You need to find a clip of this scene in the movie, because it's worth watching. She says the name and none of the actors can keep a straight face. (Also, Jake's response is literally "uhhhhh...")
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# ? Jun 2, 2020 22:07 |
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Cythereal posted:What's starting to offend me most is how boring Meyers' use of imprinting and whatnot is. It's just used to arbitrarily pair up characters without needing to write any sort of relationship or even chemistry between them. Just bam, these two are in love, beginning and end of story. This isn't exactly to bash Mormonism, it's got a range of extreme to casual believers like any religion and Mormons can be progressive as well as conservative, but the specific race and gender relations in Twilight make a lot of sense if you consider Meyer's cultural background and the fact that it's basically wish fulfillment for her. Like historically Mormonism is very white-dominated but the doctrine when it comes to Native Americans is specifically super racist. These aren't problems that are exclusive to Mormonism by any means, but there's specific quirks.
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# ? Jun 2, 2020 23:25 |
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That said my favorite Mormon Quirk in Twilight is how everyone dresses like a Mormon, despite explicitly not being Mormon.
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# ? Jun 2, 2020 23:33 |
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Why do all the Native Americans have very Biblical names? Jacob, Seth, Leah, Rachel.
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# ? Jun 2, 2020 23:33 |
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HopperUK posted:Why do all the Native Americans have very Biblical names? Jacob, Seth, Leah, Rachel. Mormonism has some hosed up teachings on the history of Native Americans.
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# ? Jun 2, 2020 23:40 |
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HopperUK posted:Why do all the Native Americans have very Biblical names? Jacob, Seth, Leah, Rachel. She named a lot of side characters after people she knows irl. Which is why I'm still convinced that it was real-life Leah that leaked her pages.
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# ? Jun 3, 2020 01:18 |
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# ? Jun 3, 2024 23:25 |
Okay, so Mormons and racism. Part of the Mormon mythology is that there were three ancient tribes who traveled from Israel after the Babylonian conquest of Jerusalem around 600 BC and settled America thousands of years ago: * The Jaredites, descended from Jared (a sixth-generation descendant of Adam and Eve and the father of Enoch in the Book of Genesis). Mormon scholars place them in Mesoamerica, possibly as the Olmecs. * The Mulekites, descended from Mulek (supposedly the only surviving son of Zedekiah, the last King of Judah) and established their capital in the unknown location of Zarahemla (unknown because it didn't exist). * The Nephites, descended from Nephi (who I'm pretty sure is a complete invention for the book) who settled in Central America. When Nephi believed his brothers, Laman and Lemuel, planned on killing him, he and his followers fled into the wilderness. Laman's followers remained as the Lamanites. Most importantly, Nephi is the one who engraved their history first on brass plates. The Lamanites and Nephites had a fierce war, in which the Lamanites turned away from God and became decadent. While a visit from Jesus temporarily created peace and united the tribes, a breakaway group of Lamanites 84 years later revolted and exterminated the Nephites. For their wickedness and corruption, they were punished with "a skin of blackness" as a mark of their evil and to ensure the Nephites would not associate or breed with them. You can see where this is going. Joseph Smith, who "found" the golden plates buried under a nearby hill telling the true history of America after being visited by the angel Moroni, was a supporter of slavery and claimed that the Book of Mormon provided justification for the enslavement of Africans. While he would eventually soften and become anti-slavery, Brigham Young (his successor and the founder of Salt Lake City) enacted a total ban on black men becoming Mormon priests. The Mormons believe the Lamanites to be the ancestors of Native Americans, Polynesians, and other dark-skinned peoples. Some passages have been interpreted as allowing the skin of the Lamanites to finally lighten once they accept God truly, which associates Mormonism with whiteness. During the establishment of Salt Lake City, Young directed his followers to brutally suppress local natives and take resources from them to support the city, using the justification that they were "rejecting Christ's message." So while Mormons do not believe Native Americans to be so wicked or sinful as to be impossible to rehabilitate, there's over 150 years of religious racism infecting Mormonism. There have been many attempts by modern Mormon scholars to reframe their relationship with race, but it hasn't exactly been perfect. This ends up tying firmly into the colonialism narrative that Meyer accidentally infects Breaking Dawn with, and is likely the root cause of it appearing despite her seeming to be totally clueless about it. The Cullens are the metaphor for a perfect Mormon family, while the Quileute are the Lamanites who must be rehabilitated to truly gain redemption. Only the Quileute who side with the Cullens are portrayed as truly good and redeemed; those who don't aren't necessarily bad, but they're also not truly worthy. Jacob's path in the final book is slowly learning to accept the
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# ? Jun 3, 2020 05:06 |