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I think you're fine, it's just a goofy book fight. No need to fundamental attribution error yourself (I'm linking this just because I love talking about it) e: new page shameful snipe and look, it's another central principle of psych that doesn't seem to replicate 
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Sep 30, 2020 13:40
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"Fundamental attribution error" is a great name for it when it involves you erroneously thinking that someone is an rear end.
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Sep 30, 2020 13:45
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quantumfoam posted:-Chelsea Quinn Yarbro's series about a 2000+ year old vampire named Ragoscvy Saint Germaine sounds interesting strictly for the various historic eras the stories take place in.. I've read a couple of the Saint-Germain books and they're okay. Very much vampire-as-superhero.
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Sep 30, 2020 14:30
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I'm trying to find a book I found out about here, and I've skimmed through the thread and I couldn't find it again. It was this future dystopia where there were all sorts of enhanced fabrics, and the protagonist was a tailor. Is that ringing any bells? Can someone remind me of the title?
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Sep 30, 2020 14:36
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General Battuta posted:e: new page shameful snipe and look, it's another central principle of psych that doesn't seem to replicate Someone should write an SF book set in a universe where all of the psych studies of the last 50 years are legit and all of the effects they claim are huge and meaningful.
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Sep 30, 2020 14:52
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Foundation?
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Sep 30, 2020 14:58
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Ani posted:Does the Fundamental Attribution Error not replicate? This would be the universe where all those SciFi stories about "infinite monkeys in a room with the goal of typing out Shakespeare's work" and the inevitable murder, murder-suicide, and mass monkeycides take place too. Posted the first readthrough summary of SFL Vol 12a at the off-site blog. Being able to reference Andy Griffith as a SF actor AND make a Robotech/protoculture THE STUFF reference were the highlights of writing it. Acknowledging any Stainless Steel Rat movie adaption would be terrible was just being honest though. On a smugness scale of 1 - 10 with Abraham Lincoln being 1(least) and Robert Downey Jr being 10(most), James Bolivar DiGriz is a 25. e: GladRagKraken posted:I'm trying to find a book I found out about here, and I've skimmed through the thread and I couldn't find it again. It was this future dystopia where there were all sorts of enhanced fabrics, and the protagonist was a tailor. Is that ringing any bells? Can someone remind me of the title? Are you thinking of Garak and Deep Space Nine? quantumfoam fucked around with this message at 15:46 on Sep 30, 2020 |
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Sep 30, 2020 15:15
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GladRagKraken posted:I'm trying to find a book I found out about here, and I've skimmed through the thread and I couldn't find it again. It was this future dystopia where there were all sorts of enhanced fabrics, and the protagonist was a tailor. Is that ringing any bells? Can someone remind me of the title? I have no idea if this matches, since I've not read it, but I've got The Carpetmakers on my list. Someone rec'd it and that seems at least fabric related, so maybe that's it.
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Sep 30, 2020 15:59
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GladRagKraken posted:I'm trying to find a book I found out about here, and I've skimmed through the thread and I couldn't find it again. It was this future dystopia where there were all sorts of enhanced fabrics, and the protagonist was a tailor. Is that ringing any bells? Can someone remind me of the title? The Garments of Caean Barrington J. Bayley
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Sep 30, 2020 16:04
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Ninurta posted:Tor released a sequel to this last month, How to Rule an Empire and Get Away with It. I haven't picked it up yet as it's unfortunately a full-sized novel price of $9.99 for a 400 page novella. It's getting good reviews so I will probably pick it up once I've thinned out my queue or when I have a few more digital credits to throw at it. I've read it. It's pretty good. It's basically more of the same as it's predecessor so don't expect anything too new but I'm a sucker for fantasy con-job stories so it works for me.
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Sep 30, 2020 16:07
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I'm reading KJ Parker's short story collection "Academic Exercises" and it's really good. And some stories have magic! What? He doesn't have magic in his novels. In particular two of the stories I've read concentrate on members of the Studium (natural philosophers with telepathic powers who everyone thinks of as wizards) going and sorting out supernatural problems. I would love a full book of this. I wrote one with a similar premise but Parker's prose is, well, professional, so I hope in the future he writes something full length with these guys. Maybe when he gets tired of sieges and swords.
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Sep 30, 2020 16:30
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Ccs posted:I'm reading KJ Parker's short story collection "Academic Exercises" and it's really good. And some stories have magic! What? He doesn't have magic in his novels. anilEhilated fucked around with this message at 16:50 on Sep 30, 2020 |
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Sep 30, 2020 16:45
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Ani posted:Does the Fundamental Attribution Error not replicate? I've sometimes thought about the question of when new scientific developments can "ruin" existing works of fiction. My view is that for most SF, it doesn't; some stories about canals on Mars and jungles on Venus remain readable, and the ones that now seem awful are awful for reasons other than the canals and jungles. But what happens when the changes in scientific knowledge affect the characters rather than than the setting? In particular, what about characterization based on now-outdated ideas about psychology and genetics? This is an issue outside of SF, or at least outside of what's normally thought of as SF. The most obvious example that comes to mind is Zola's Rougon-Macquart novels. Are they "ruined" now?
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Sep 30, 2020 17:03
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GladRagKraken posted:I'm trying to find a book I found out about here, and I've skimmed through the thread and I couldn't find it again. It was this future dystopia where there were all sorts of enhanced fabrics, and the protagonist was a tailor. Is that ringing any bells? Can someone remind me of the title? Is this the one where there were two books in the series and in one of them the rich/powerful/media star protagonist decides to kill himself and asks his tailor to making an incendiary suit?
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Sep 30, 2020 20:38
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pseudorandom name posted:Is this the one where there were two books in the series and in one of them the rich/powerful/media star protagonist decides to kill himself and asks his tailor to making an incendiary suit? No, nobody's hit it yet. It had a free sample of the first two or so chapters where the protagonist manages to steal a thread from the outfit of some upperclass person, and his boss finds out and ruthlessly exploits that talent to expand his buisiness.
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Sep 30, 2020 21:12
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Ninurta posted:I apologize for being an rear end. I long to think that I am someone who is a visionary, however I end up staring at my rear end more often than not. I'm glad your back and I'm sorry things suck right now and I hope they will be better. I do want to thank you for the '400 page novella' thing because it tickles me every single time I see it and there's not a lot of joy in small things lately so thanks.
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Sep 30, 2020 21:18
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Ninurta posted:I apologize for being an rear end. I long to think that I am someone who is a visionary, however I end up staring at my rear end more often than not. U good, fam I asked people to post some links to free ebook resources and suchlike for you, and there were some good responses, so scroll back through the thread and check those out if you haven't.
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Sep 30, 2020 21:28
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GladRagKraken posted:No, nobody's hit it yet. It had a free sample of the first two or so chapters where the protagonist manages to steal a thread from the outfit of some upperclass person, and his boss finds out and ruthlessly exploits that talent to expand his buisiness. OK, well, if anybody knows the books I'm thinking of, please let me know. Early 2000s, I think. Early enough that social media wasn't really a thing yet so the weird future pop culture star was more in line with rock star than Instagram influencer. Both had one word titles, I think. Possibly a color.
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Sep 30, 2020 21:31
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:U good, fam And from that resource I downloaded and read the Castle of Otranto, then read half of it this morning! It was fascinating, more like reading a historical curio than a proper story. The author's style for it all is intensely overwrought in a hypnotic way, but halfway through I got irritated with it as yet another twist came to the tale and I skimmed it to see how it all wrapped up. Which is all to say, hey thanks, if not for the links to the Standard Ebooks place I wouldn't have picked it up and had a wild reading experience today. I now know where gothic novels come from, and what tropes have been ripped from the original, and fortunately as far as I can tell, none of them have stolen the "random giant stone helmet appears above a dude and crushes him to death" thing.
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Sep 30, 2020 21:32
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If you liked Castle of Otranto, Jane Austen's Northanger Abbey is hilarious. It was her first book and is basically just an extended parody of Gothic tropes.
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Sep 30, 2020 21:42
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StrixNebulosa posted:And from that resource I downloaded and read the Castle of Otranto, then read half of it this morning! It was fascinating, more like reading a historical curio than a proper story. The author's style for it all is intensely overwrought in a hypnotic way, but halfway through I got irritated with it as yet another twist came to the tale and I skimmed it to see how it all wrapped up. Once you're done with Otranto, you should read The Beetle with me. I know nothing other than it's horror, and that it came out the same year as Dracula and drastically outsold it that year. I assume it's probably not amazing since it's so completely fallen into obscurity, but I figure it'll be an interesting curiosity in a similar way.
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Sep 30, 2020 21:57
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Ninurta posted:I apologize for being an rear end. I long to think that I am someone who is a visionary, however I end up staring at my rear end more often than not. And I'm sorry if I made you feel bad or feel like I was making fun of you for your tough situation. I'm on unemployment because of COVID myself and I know it's a miserable position to be in, and it kind of casts a pall over all kinds of interactions.
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Sep 30, 2020 22:00
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:If you liked Castle of Otranto, Jane Austen's Northanger Abbey is hilarious. It was her first book and is basically just an extended parody of Gothic tropes. Hmmm. After pouncing off of Pride and Prejudice I don't know if I want to try more by her. Like, I respect her but I don't enjoy reading her stuff. I'll poke my library. MockingQuantum posted:Once you're done with Otranto, you should read The Beetle with me. I know nothing other than it's horror, and that it came out the same year as Dracula and drastically outsold it that year. I assume it's probably not amazing since it's so completely fallen into obscurity, but I figure it'll be an interesting curiosity in a similar way. Put this in calibre and soon it'll be on my kindle, but I'm not going to get to it for a while as I want to try some other horror first before I return to reading older books. Thank you for the rec though, I missed it on my scan through that place!
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Sep 30, 2020 22:07
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Also it's weird to me that Andre Norton's stuff is in the public domain, I somehow thought she was more recent than that?
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Sep 30, 2020 22:07
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StrixNebulosa posted:Also it's weird to me that Andre Norton's stuff is in the public domain, I somehow thought she was more recent than that? Just from a quick google while I'm at work, her estate is trying to revert the copyrights for those titles back into her portfolio. She wrote from 1934 to her death in 2005. I used to see her books in stores and at the library often but I don't think I've read any. My mother has some of her Witch World books.
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Sep 30, 2020 22:12
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The Hydrogen Sonata (Culture #9) by Iain M Banks - $2.99 https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0081BU42O/ Childhood's End by Arthur C Clarke - $1.99 https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07XG6MG3Y/ Rendezvous with Rama by Arthur C Clarke - $1.99 https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07XD75HGV/
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Sep 30, 2020 22:24
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pradmer posted:The Hydrogen Sonata (Culture #9) by Iain M Banks - $2.99 I'm hoping after a few more years I'll have all the Culture novels from these sales. I'm up to 3 or 4. I read most from the library and have a few paperbacks but I liked them well enough to get to again someday. Thanks again for posting these.
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Sep 30, 2020 22:43
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Ani posted:Does the Fundamental Attribution Error not replicate? It seems like people overgeneralized and oversimplified a lot, and the FAE as described in textbooks is not true. It is sometime the case that people accurately infer how much of people's behavior is due to who they are vs. the situation, and sometimes they are inaccurate in either direction. But when each of these happens is complicated - e.g. you're more likely to make the FAE when what someone is described as extremely unusual, or when you are making a negative inferences about them. It isn't my area of research though so I'm not sure what the most up to date findings are. An SF book set in this universe would be crazy. I've actually thought about this when I idly wish that one of my experiments had found a significant effect -- this seems like it would be nice at first, but then I realize that would require some fundamental changes to human cognition with completely unknown ramifications. I feel like there are two main groups of ways in which a world where all claimed psych findings are true would be odd/interesting: One set would be the sort of wild findings psychologists make which no one really believes, but which would obviously change the world if they were true. E.g. - ESP would exist, but only if the thing you were trying to detect made you horny enough. People with very specific fetishes would suddenly become extremely valuable as psychics. - How bright your room was would determine how honest you were, so test centers and courtrooms would be blanketed with stadium lights. - Parole decisions, whether you get a loan, etc. would be mostly determined by the judge's blood sugar level -- there'd be huge fights to get your case heard right after lunch, or sneak some carb-loaded gel into their coffee - Adopted kids would get killed all the time, since genetic connection is a main reason parents are nice to their children - Women's menstrual cycles would determine the clothes they wore and the romantic partners they pursued But the second set would be the findings which a lot of people assume are true right now and do result in the world as we know it, but which actually probably aren't currently true. It's hard to imagine how the world would be different if, for example, the fundamental attribution error actually was universally true, since we often mistakenly assume that's just the world we already live in. Other examples: - The stanford prison experiment is so poorly run you really can't conclude anything from it - The marshmallow test, if it predicted anything, is a very, very, very minor predictor of future succes - Ego depletion (i.e. the idea that willpower is a resource you can "use up") is probably not a thing - Faking a smile probably does not actually then make you happy - 10,000 hours = mastery wasn't even claimed by the original researchers e: I might be being somewhat unfair to some of this psychology research, but that's my take on the replicability of these findings at least
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Sep 30, 2020 23:37
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tildes posted:- ESP would exist, but only if the thing you were trying to detect made you horny enough. People with very specific fetishes would suddenly become extremely valuable as psychics.
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Sep 30, 2020 23:54
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Silver2195 posted:But what happens when the changes in scientific knowledge affect the characters rather than than the setting? In particular, what about characterization based on now-outdated ideas about psychology and genetics? I'm not familiar with the specific example you use, but I don't understand where you're going here. I don't really see how you can have a wholly ruined character unless that character is already unrecognizable as a human being, because even the most flawed psychology notions are based on (at least nominal) attempts to explain the observed behavior of people.
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Sep 30, 2020 23:54
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Remember how in Turnabout Intruder, the main baddy ends up going insane and hysterical because her FEMININE WOMAN BRAIN couldn't handle the strain of starship command? I'm guessing it's that kind of thing.
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Sep 30, 2020 23:59
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Missed two KJ Parker books. The Hammer by KJ Parker - $1.99 https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0047Y0FDM/ The Company by KJ Parker - $1.99 https://www.amazon.com/dp/B002B9MHQ8/
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Oct 1, 2020 00:39
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If we're talking about public domain books, what are people's general SFF reccs for those? I think The War of the Worlds, 1898, is probably the oldest book I've read that I really genuinely enjoyed (as opposed to appreciated or admired, like Moby Dick for example). We've probably all seen some adaptation of it or another by now, but if you haven't read the original, it really holds up. In fact I think the year I read it, it was my best book of the year, even though I knew all the fundamental story beats. Wells just paints an absolutely engrossing portrait of a catastrophe visited upon a deeply "normal" corner of the world. One of the things that really sticks in my mind over the years is the atmosphere of a hot summer and long days, twilight at 10pm, with the aliens landing on the common and a horrible sense of foreboding, of the calm before the storm. pradmer posted:Childhood's End by Arthur C Clarke - $1.99 IMO this is Clarke's best work
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Oct 1, 2020 01:11
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freebooter posted:If we're talking about public domain books, what are people's general SFF reccs for those? I was digging around in pre-Tolkien fantasy for a while, and this is what I read in that vein that I recommend: Alfred Lord Dunsany - "The Charwoman's Shadow" and "The King of Elfland's Daughter" George MacDonald - "The Princess and the Goblin" (I meant to read more of his stuff but never got around to it) William Morris - "The Well at World's End" And ER Eddison's "The Worm Ouraboros" is still on my shelf and I will read it some day.
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Oct 1, 2020 01:53
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freebooter posted:If we're talking about public domain books, what are people's general SFF reccs for those? War of the Worlds is one of my favourite books. I probably read it once a year or so. It's fantastic. Though I did also enjoy Moby Dick, so.
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Oct 1, 2020 01:53
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Moby dick loving owns and is funny as hell and no one who reads 200 page info dumps about the kinds of sleeves worn in Ebou Dar should ever complain about the chapters about whaling.
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Oct 1, 2020 02:17
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freebooter posted:IMO this is Clarke's best work That's Neutron Tide.
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Oct 1, 2020 02:37
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Gnoman posted:I'm not familiar with the specific example you use, but I don't understand where you're going here. I don't really see how you can have a wholly ruined character unless that character is already unrecognizable as a human being, because even the most flawed psychology notions are based on (at least nominal) attempts to explain the observed behavior of people. The Rougon-Macquart novels aren't just concerned with how people act, but why, i.e., the hereditary basis of human psychology and how it interacts with environmental factors. I say "hereditary" rather than "genetic" because this is a pre-Mendelian understanding of heredity. Zola understood inheritance of psychological traits in terms of Proper Lucas's prepotency theory. See the explanation here, and check out the pie chart family tree! Naturally we don't have a very good understanding of the questions Zola was trying to address even today (studies linking a particular gene to a psychological trait tend to be overhyped), but we can at least be sure that it doesn't work like that, and perhaps more importantly, it's hard to imagine a modern novelist having the self-confidence to tackle the subject in fiction so directly and at such length. Silver2195 fucked around with this message at 03:17 on Oct 1, 2020 |
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Oct 1, 2020 03:13
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freebooter posted:If we're talking about public domain books, what are people's general SFF reccs for those? Forgot this bit. You've got pretty much all of HG Wells. Also William Hope Hodgson. If you're up for it, Edgar Rice Burroughs Barsoom stuff is largely public domain. Jekyll and Hyde. Heck all of Stevenson. Phantom of the Opera is not un-fantastical. While not strictly SFF, there's a lot of really entertaining adventure stuff. Robin Hood by Pyle, Three Musketeers, Scarlet Pimpernel, Zorro. Sabatini. Generally tales of derring-do and heroism and sword fighting without necessarily fantastical elements. If you want adventure with mystical elements out of darkest Africa, there's always H Rider Haggard, and I think that description is it's own caveat.
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Oct 1, 2020 03:56
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Lemniscate Blue posted:Alfred Lord Dunsany "Idyll Days on the Yann"?
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