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since a lot of people only check bookmarks, you should know that our admin, lowtax, has been credibly accused of abusing his partner. https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3928980 please do what you believe to be ethical.
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Jun 24, 2020 11:09
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Okay.
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Jun 25, 2020 06:57
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And now that this forum isn't gripped by sectarian violence or on the verge of being killed without warning, I think it's time to get this ball rolling again. Watch this space!
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Nov 15, 2020 13:49
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Looking forward to it!
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Nov 15, 2020 19:42
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I for one am super-psyched to read and talk about imaginary space politics!
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Nov 15, 2020 23:39
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Same, I have missed this thread.
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Nov 16, 2020 06:30
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I begged Milkfred for him to bring it back and I'm glad he wanted to bring it back. I may not be a fan of Expanse, but I appreciate this well-balanced and well-done Let's Read of it very much.
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Nov 16, 2020 10:41
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I had intended to re-open it once everything had settled, but I also have a tendency to get distracted. But it's a lot of fun to be getting this ball rolling again because these books are fun to talk about. That, and over the past few months, I've read a lot of bad books and it's nice to be back with a series that has its issues but never becomes something you trudge through. Chapter Four: Bobbie So, we're back with Bobbie. This is an interesting chapter because there's not too much to say about it, which Omi agrees with it. It's this fairly decent little chapter that does what it sets out to do. It's not good, it's not bad, just one of those stepping stone chapters to something more interesting. Probably my biggest issue with it is how it opens. The chapter kicks off with three short paragraphs and breaks that are clearly supposed to evoke the incoherence of time passing, Bobbie passing in and out of consciousness, but don't quite get there because they're fairly precise and descriptive in their language. Observe: Caliban's War, Chapter Four posted:A voice, male and young, in her suit’s internal speakers said, “Gotcha, Gunny. We gotcha. Gonna be okay. Gonna be all right. Just hang in there.” He hadn’t quite finished saying there when she blacked out again. Omi has some similar thoughts: "The opening paragraph isn’t bad, but honestly I would’ve started with the second paragraph where Bobbie wakes up in the hospital. We don’t really need to see her get rescued by some faceless marines when it’s implied." We're both of the mind that the chapter could've started with the paragraph where she's abruptly woken up by the brass. That way, you'd go from the battlefield to a hospital and the reader could share Bobbie's disorientation. It's a minor thing, but I really like books that try things like that. But Omi and I both like the little beat of Bobbie's first concern being for her suit, and then her dead friends. It's a very human thing to think, I feel. So, Bobbie wakes up in a hospital. Turns out she's on a powerful amount of focus drugs and amphetamines. Again, doesn't really come through the prose. She's promptly put under interrogation by one Captain Thorsson, a member of Mars' naval intelligence branch, and part-time lich. Caliban's War, Chapter Four posted:The owner of the nice voice turned out to be a very tall, thin man in a naval intelligence uniform. His face was narrow and tight, the skull beneath it pressing to get out. He gave her a frightening smile that didn’t extend past a slight upturn at the corners of his mouth. Bobbie tells him about the monster and what happened, just as we saw it - monster came out of the outpost, killed the UN dudes, then came after us. Thorsson turns off his digital recorder and, of course, thinks Bobbie has gone crazy. There's no proof! As far as Thorsson's concerned, an exemplary marine as gone out of her mind. There's no proof and no way to get any because the orbital mirror hit the site of impact and annihilated everything. Bobbie herself was thrown a quarter of a kilometer. But Bobbie still has her suit, and she'd have video footage! But Thorsson comments that they've already examined the suit's video feed and it's all static. But the little bit about Bobbie's suit being old is brought up and she recommends they use an old video compression to check the data. While they're waiting for someone to bring the suit up, we get a Big Beefy Bobbie moment. Caliban's War, Chapter Four posted:With her size, her physical presence up close usually either frightened men or turned them on. Either way it made them uncomfortable. She leaned toward Thorsson a bit and was rewarded when he pushed his chair back an equal amount. Milkfred E. Moore posted:Now, I think we get some mention of Bobbie's size and build in every single book she appears. This is one of the more mild ones, because I think later ones stress that while she's a tank of a woman, she's also curvy and hot. I feel like she's flat out called a 'beach bunny' in one of the later books, or maybe later in this book. Another break and Bobbie wakes up again. A Doctor is chewing Thorsson out for filling Bobbie full of speed and interrogating her. But they got the data from the suit and now Thorsson thinks they've managed to avoid a shooting war with Earth. Bobbie passes out again (For those of you keeping track, that means we are at five 'Bobbie passes out' moments and page breaks. Is this a problem? I'm not sure.) So, Bobbie wakes up again and the Doctor and Thorsson introduce Bobbie to a Captain Martens, a navy chaplain. Bobbie's pissed because she marked her faith as 'none' but Martens comments that he's here as her grief counsellor, nothing more. Bobbie shrugs him off. Martens says they should deal with her trauma before they get to Earth- Wait, Bobbie says. Why am I going to Earth? And that's it. As mentioned, it's not a bad chapter but there's also not much to say about it. It does what it set out to do. Perhaps my personal note on is that it feels like it does too much. Bobbie is rescued, Bobbie goes to hospital, Bobbie is interrogated, Bobbie is not believed by Thorsson, Bobbie realizes her suit has proof, Bobbie thinks her suit is useless, Bobbie realizes how to get the info from the suit, Bobbie is believed by Thorsson, Bobbie is going somewhere, Bobbie is going to Earth. It would not surprise me if this chapter was originally split in two, and some aspect of the cyclical POV chapter system led to it needing to be condensed into one. Omi: "I’m surprised by how little I have to say about this chapter. It’s very serviceable and doesn’t have any problems besides the creepy Big, Meaty Bobbie thing that we’re never going to run out of ammo for." TV Adaptation Bobbie's interrogation is handled a bit differently. She wakes up on the ship and is interrogated by Thorsson. Bobbie blames the UN. But as the interrogation goes on, she begins to wonder why they'd only attack with 'a third of their full garrison.' Mention is also made of a drone flying over the zone before the attack. Piece by piece, Bobbie begins to recollect what happened - that the marines were shooting at someone behind them. Eventually, mention is made that Mars wants Bobbie's people to take the fall for firing first and that she will go to an emergency summit on Earth and give testimony to that effect - and that she will not mention any mysterious man who wasn't wearing a vac suit.  Cle Bennett as Commander Thorsson/Thorsen  Peter Outerbridge as Captain Martens Milkfred E. Moore fucked around with this message at 08:27 on Nov 17, 2020 |
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Nov 17, 2020 08:10
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Chapter Five: Avasarala We swap to the fourth, and final, member of Caliban's War viewpoint characters. Caliban's War, Chapter Five posted:Chrisjen Avasarala, assistant to the undersecretary of executive administration, sat near the end of the table. Her sari was orange, the only splash of color in the otherwise military blue-and-gray of the meeting. The seven others with seats at the table were the heads of their respective branches of the United Nations military forces, all of them men. She knew their names, their career paths and psychological profiles, pay rates and political alliances and who they were sleeping with. Against the back wall, personal assistants and staff pages stood in uncomfortable stillness, like the shy teenagers at a dance. Avasarala snuck a pistachio out of her purse, cracked the shell discreetly, and popped the salted nut into her mouth. That's sort of what the chapter is, in a nutshell. Avasarala sitting there and watching and listening to these various military types talking about the situation across the Solar system. Not bad, not great. Avasarala wants to know what was up with the initial attacker. Nettleford thinks it is a new Martian technology. Mikel Agee, of the diplomatic corps, thinks it was the protomoloecule. Nettleford agrees but says it's different. Admiral Souther thinks Mars has weaponized the protomolecule. Nguyen thinks they should get ready to strike. Avasarala says they should meet with Mars, and thinks they should meet on Earth. She heads out and meets with her assistant, Soren. She gives him a bunch of orders and then she vents about how everyone in the room was a man. She wants Soren to spy on Nguyen. Caliban's War, Chapter Five posted:"They’re all loving men," she said. I don't think Omi's wrong here, and I think Avasarala's foul language and general demeanour is why this chapter holds attention. For example, from a later exchange: Caliban's War, Chapter Five posted:"Please, can we not refer to the secretary-general as 'the bobble-head'?" That's not to say she's not an entertaining character, though. But I know a few people who think her swearing is a little bit much and borders on making her seem like a parody. A minor point I have on the 'they're all men' bit is that in the 24th Century would we really still see such a male dominance of high-level spaces? It's irrelevant because the Expanse is obviously making a point about present-day things (see my later comments about Errinwright, too) but my brain did go 'hmm.' Like, if Nguyen was a lady, would it really change anything? Probably not, because a bureaucracy like the UN basically self-propagates. HIRE (CLAP) MORE (CLAP) FEMALE (CLAP) ADMIRALS, etc. etc. Anyway, we get a reminder of Venus, the political situation and history of Earth and Mars, and the discovery of Phoebe being an alien weapon. Then Avasarala speaks with Errinwright, her boss. Turns out Earth has seven minutes of high-def video of the monster slaughtering Earth marines. They suspect it's a Martian weapon. However, they also know that Venus had a big ol' spike in activity at the same time the shooting started on Ganymede, so, it could be something worse. Caliban's War, Chapter Five posted:"Saber rattling we’ve done before," she said. "We’ve survived it. It’s a known quantity. I have a binder with nine hundred pages of analysis and contingency plans for conflict with Mars, including fourteen different scenarios about what we do if they develop an unexpected new technology. The binder for what we do if something comes up from Venus? It’s three pages long, and it begins Step One: Find God." Anyway, Avasarala says she'll keep the secretary-general from kicking off a war, and anyone who leaks the video will be found guilty of treason and sent to the Lunar Penal Colony. She sends Soren to get some intel on people who testified at the Eros incident hearings. Then she calls her husband, tells him she won't be coming home tonight, and gets back to work. There's a little bit throughout about how, regardless of paradigm shifts such as the existence of alien life and secret moon weapons, the seasons keep going and the world keeps turning and humans keep being humans, and so on, which is basically The Expanse's core theme: humans will be humans. But is that true? Overall, it's not a bad chapter but I wouldn't say it's great either. It gives us a look into how Earth functions. But, as usual, I think it's pretty clear why they introduced Avasarala in the first season of the TV adaptation, and why they dosed up the intrigue in the TV take on the Ganymede incident. Admittedly, this isn't my first time reading it, but the one-two of 'Mars didn't do it but has footage' feels like it's weakened by 'Earth didn't do it, and they have footage.' Especially when it seems like there's little tension. Sure, Nguyen is agitating for war, but Avasarala looks like she has a handle on it, y'know? And the reader presumably remembers the prologue, which means it's not Venus itself. It makes me think of some of the earlier chapters of Leviathan Wakes. Like how Holden and pals go off to visit the Scopuli, but there's no real drama to it. Omi and I both think it might've been nice had the initial meeting focused a bit more on Avasarala's mindset and headspace, and less on what we call character-as-camera, where she's merely the viewpoint to the discussion. Like, it would've been maybe more interesting to be in Nguyen's head because at least he might have a goal. Avasarala is just kind of there and bored and every so often she clears her throat or eats a pistachio to remind us she's a character. Not bad, but perhaps not the strongest introduction to one of the fan favorite characters. TV Adaptation From memory, this whole plotline basically unfolds differently. This is also probably one of the few times where the adaptation does very different things with the characters. Nguyen and Avasarala are spot on. In fact, when I first read Caliban's War, Shohreh Aghdashloo was exactly how I heard and pictured Avasarala.  Shohreh Aghdashloo as Chrisjen Avasarala  Byron Mann as Augusto Nguyen But Errinwright? Well... Caliban's War, Chapter Five posted:Avasarala turned to the dead screen on her wall as it came to life. Sadavir Errinwright was darker skinned than she was, his face round and soft. It would have been in place anywhere in the Punjab, but his voice affected the cool, analytic amusement of Britain.  Shawn Doyle as Sadavir Errinwright But I think Doyle portrays him excellently, regardless. Perhaps the point can be made that making Errinwright a white dude helps the series out with it's 'modern day' allegories, similar to the 24th Century halls of power being male-dominated. And all we get about Souther at this point is that he has a "high voice."  Martin Roach as Michael Souther Which is not how I'd describe Martin Roach's voice. Avasarala's assistant, Soren, does not appear. Oh, and then there was this interesting thing.  Brian George as Arjun  Michael Benyaer also as Arjun (yes, really!) Yes, they are supposed to be playing the same character. No, I don't know why they went with Benyaer who both looks and plays Arjun drastically differently to the extent I'd argue that he or the director didn't 'get' the character. When it comes to the TV series, I generally think the casting is spot on, with Brian George being up there, but Benyaer is absolutely when they missed the mark in a big way and it's quite unfortunate. Like, just look at him! Milkfred E. Moore fucked around with this message at 11:22 on Nov 19, 2020 |
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Nov 19, 2020 11:17
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One big missed opportunity with this chapter was to more explicitly acknowledge something that the book gradually builds into the cracks (spoilered because I can't remember where in CW this becomes explicit): Avasarala is pretty much the de-facto head of state, using a dinky cabinet position to hide from time-wasting nonsense while she puppeteers a shitload of plots all over the government. I believe it'll become a point later on when Nguyen still thinks she's a stubborn holdout while literally everyone else on the committee knows that he's poking the bear, and I think this chapter would've been a better time to set that up. Show the (comparatively) younger, more inexperienced top brass try to push his weight around, express surprise when the tired old lady pushes back, and be caught off-guard when, after the meeting, a mentor figure corners him and frantically whispers "What the gently caress are you doing?? Do you want to get us all fired or worse?"
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Nov 19, 2020 19:27
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Chapter Six: Holden One thing I like about the Expanse's multiple-perspective narrative is how it elegantly skips over dead time, especially in a setting where travel time is an ongoing concern. Last time we saw Holden, Fred was telling him that something was up on Ganymede. Now, Holden is arriving at Ganymede. It would've been nice to see Fred's perspective on it all, but not really necessary. So, Holden wakes up from some dreams about Eros and the protomolecule's half-human horrors. He's not aboard the Rocinante but a ship called the Wandering Somnambulist. Naomi calls him via intercom and lets him know that, one, they're arriving at Ganymede and, two, the UN and Mars are working together to board every ship that approaches to land. Caliban's War, Chapter Six posted:“Well,” Holden said. “Earth wants me for stealing a couple thousand of their nuclear missiles and handing them over to the OPA. Mars just wants me for stealing one of their ships. I assume those carry different penalties.” Caliban's War, Chapter Six posted:Holden opened the locker under the bunk and pulled out a badly fitting green jumpsuit with Somnambulist stenciled on the back and the name Philips on the front pocket. ... Given his reputation in the solar system, it was thought best that Holden not have a job on the ship that would require him to speak to anyone in authority. Omi noticed it, too: "...so the Somnambulist doesn’t have clothes that fit either? This is kinda weirding me out - poorly-fit clothing is super distracting and obnoxious, especially on long trips with nothing to do, so I would’ve assumed they would fix that situation ASAP." I like the bit about Holden growing a terrible beard as a disguise, and the bit about how Amos grew one that looked good on him. So, Holden goes up to the Somnambulist's excuse for an ops deck. We get a bit of background on how the ship had been running Ganymede-to-Ceres for a long time and how the familiarity should prevent people from looking twice. Unfortunately, they have. There's a nice exchange between Holden and Naomi, and then they're off to meet the boarding party. The three of them wait in the airlock. Naomi's playing the part of 'Captain Estancia.' Holden's third-in-command of a group of three. Amos is the chief engineer. It's a fun little thing that Amos is still basically who he is. That 'can't or refuses to be disguised' character is a fun trope. The UN boarding team comes through. Six marines in combat gear and a lieutenant who is bored with his tasking. He might be bored, but Holden begins to get tense because he's also perceptive and smart. But Naomi plays it cool. Holden... Caliban's War, Chapter Six posted:Holden shot a look to Amos. Is he flirting with her? I think he’s flirting with her. Amos’ scowl could have meant anything. Caliban's War, Chapter Six posted:Amos elbowed Holden to get his attention, then said, "How you boys doing today?" The Marines step to Amos, and he steps up to them. Caliban's War, Chapter Six posted:With his nose so close to the marine’s armored faceplate that his breath fogged the glass, Amos said, “So be straight with me, Joe. The outside of those suits, that’s anatomically correct, ain’t it?” Caliban's War, Chapter Six posted:Holden grabbed Amos by the sleeve. "What. The. gently caress," he said through gritted teeth, "was that all about?" Caliban's War, Chapter Six posted:"Cap, you’re a good guy, but you’d be a lovely smuggler." So, the Somnambulist gets held from landing for a few more hours. A bunch of food ships are taking off. Holden wonders why he has to bring food to the colony if there's so much of it leaving. If you guessed 'corporate assholes' you've got it. Every day that food sits there is a day corporations are losing money. Holden and Naomi fume about it. Meanwhile, Amos eats an apple from the relief supplies and wonders why it surprises them. Sometimes I wonder how many people come to a book like this with Holden's perspective. Like, what, corporations would do such a thing? And how many people read Amos' response and go, yeah, DUH, Holden! Holden's still fuming by the time they land. We get a bunch of information about Ganymede and how it looks and the ruins and debris, etc. etc. That usual kind of Corey exposition that's somehow invisible despite the amount of words it takes up. I do criticize their love for it, but I've never really found it a chore to read until Book 8, where it felt like some of the exposition was really just being thrown in to pad the word count. Anyway! Caliban's War, Chapter Six posted:And the orbiting mirrors were marvels of engineering that helped make it possible. Slamming one into the other, and leaving both lying in ruins, struck Holden as being as stupidly shortsighted as making GBS threads in your water supply to deny your enemy a drink. Caliban's War, Chapter Six posted:Holden had lost all patience with human stupidity. So of course, it came out to meet him. They land and a customs officer - Mister Vedas - comes out ot meet them. But Holden figures out that they are not on the level, and we see a side of Holden we've not really seen before. Caliban's War, Chapter Six posted:“Captain, I’ll take care of this.” Caliban's War, Chapter Six posted:“You enjoyed that,” Naomi said. Her expression was odd and evaluating, her voice in the no-man’s-land between accusing and not. All in all, I like this chapter. I think it's the best one yet. Stuff happens, the characters are fun, etc. Omi did raise an interesting point, though, that I'll amend to the end as a thing to ponder: Omi: "I’m kind of surprised that Holden and his crew can still go undercover - they’re the name and face behind the missile thefts and Phoebe’s destruction, and directly connected to Fred, right? I would’ve assumed Fred’s HQ would’ve had Earth and Martian assets whose entire job was to write reports on who is coming and going." I think, later, Caliban's War even has mention made of something like this in an Avasarala chapter. We'll see if my memory is right! TV Adaptation Strangely enough, the Wandering Somnambulist is renamed the Weeping Somnambulist. It plays out very differently. The Weeping Somnambulist is a relief ship piloted by Mr and Mrs Suputayaporn enroute to Ganymede and gets abruptly boarded and searched by Martian marines, who say they'll need to seize the ship. Keep an eye on that surname because it'll show up again. Anyway, surprise, the marines are Holden and Amos! The crew of the Roci travel with Mr and Mrs Suputayaporn to Ganymede. There's no boarding party. When the Somnabulist lands, there's a 'security patrol' that boards them and are obviously not on the level. What's fun about these crooked dudes is that they're Star Helix guys. In the end, Holden and Amos rush in and blast the bad cops but one of the crew of the Somnambulist is killed in the gunfight. It's a pretty standard plot. 'Oh no, we forced these nice people into our crazy scheme and they paid the price!' but it works. It's one of the changes that I'm not sure whether it's better or worse, just different as a consequence of going from novel to TV. I like both interpretations. I don't think it's a consequence of not being dramatic if they were to adapt this chapter more closely than they did. It's very easy for me to envision this chapter on screen as-is, so to speak, but the whole storyline is basically a different beast at this point. But perhaps the change stems from addressing a thought like that Omi raised. Milkfred E. Moore fucked around with this message at 08:17 on Nov 23, 2020 |
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Nov 23, 2020 08:13
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My guess is that the TV show cut the boarding sequence because they thought it wouldn't play well on film- both it and the terrible disguise are fun bits that primarily work because we see them from inside Holden's head with his thoughts, and I'm betting it wouldn't work nearly as well if we were watching actors pretend to be dudes pretending to be other dudes, who were super-nervous and/or wearing a terrible glue-on beard.
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Nov 23, 2020 12:43
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Chapter Seven: Prax Elsewhere on Ganymede, and after the usual Corey opening paragraphs that consist of some manner of introspection or backstory for whoever we're jumping back to, Prax is still looking for Mei. He's not having much luck, even after a solid week of searching. Everyone else is trying to get away. Caliban's War, Chapter Seven posted:The fares for passage were bankrupting people who’d worked for years in some of the highest-paying material science positions outside Earth. The poorer people were left sneaking out in freight drones or tiny yachts or even space suits strapped onto modified frames and fired off toward Europa in hopes of rescue. Caliban's War, Chapter Seven posted:He was looking for a child, so he didn’t have to go through the vast majority of the dead, but the ones he did see haunted him. Twice he’d found a corpse sufficiently mutilated that it might have been Mei, but the first had a stork-bite birthmark at the back of her neck and the other’s toenails were the wrong shape. I'm condensing a fair bit of stuff here. On one hand, the argument can be made that maybe we don't need to get so much detail in this stuff Prax has been doing in the past as opposed to what he's doing now. On the other, I think it's a credit to the Corey team that I don't bounce off these long paragraphs that are, in all honesty, fairly unnecessary. But overall, that's kind of the theme of this chapter. Prax is going around looking for Mei. He goes to visit the home of Basia Merton. Basia's son, Katoa, is also missing. But Basia and his family are abandoning their own search and getting on relief ships from Luna. I think it might've been nice to get some hint of Basia or Katoa before this point. Just namedrop him in Mei's chapter or something. The discussion gets... Well, it doesn't go well. Caliban's War, Chapter Seven posted:Prax put down the glass of milk. The chambers around them seemed to go quiet, but he knew that was an illusion. A strange pressure bloomed in his throat, down into his chest. His face felt waxy. He had the sudden physical memory of his wife announcing that she’d filed for divorce. Betrayed. He felt betrayed. Caliban's War, Chapter Seven posted:“You can’t go,” Prax said. “You have to stay and look for him.” Outside, later, Prax reflects about the danger of botanical collapse. Similar to what I noted before, Omi and I think it's a strength of these books that such pontifications often feel interesting without triggering the 'infodump' alarm. A cascade, a bunch of small problems that metastasize into something deadly. Mei's immune system issue is similar, a tiny issue in one allele that produces a bad protein and ultimately leads to all the bacteria in her body trying to kill her. Prax goes home and cries. He figures he'll join Basia and go to Luna, leave Mei behind. But, as he goes on for his routine of wandering Ganymede to find some sign of Mei, he still has hope. Ultimately, though, there's just not much to say about the chapter. I'd honestly blocked it out of my memory and thought Prax's next chapter happened now. I suppose we get a bit more insight into how desperate Prax is becoming, but I'm not sure it needed to be a whole chapter, and I feel like you could fill it all in with how these storylines converge where Holden ends up with Prax. Like, Prax could just look shabby and say he's been looking for his daughter for weeks. Especially when, in a few chapters time, I'm pretty sure Holden mentally assesses him like 'Wow, this dude looks really bad, and he said he was looking for his daughter for ages.' I don't think it's that surprising that this was cut from the TV adaptation. During our discussion, Omi noted that: "Prax's amateur detective stuff reminds me of Miller - a lot of Prax’s stuff does, weirdly enough." This is something that I was planning on bringing up in Chapter Eight, but there's no harm in mentioning it now. In Leviathan Wakes, Abraham wrote Miller and Franck wrote Holden. Have you been able to figure out who wrote who in Caliban's War? Turns out, Franck wrote Holden and Bobbie. Abraham wrote Avasarala and Prax. I wasn't able to determine who wrote Mei, but I'm leaning towards Abraham just with how it has similar 'space noir' bits to Miller's 'voice.' I don't think it's much of a surprise based on what we've seen so far, but it's still neat to know.
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Nov 26, 2020 07:53
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Milkfred E. Moore posted:Ultimately, though, there's just not much to say about the chapter. I'd honestly blocked it out of my memory and thought Prax's next chapter happened now. No joke, I read this writeup shortly after writing my comments for Prax's next chapter, and thought you were talking about the thing I'd just read. I hadn't thought about it, but yeah- those two could really easily combine.
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Nov 26, 2020 20:31
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Chapter Eight: Bobbie At the end of Chapter Seven's recap, I talked briefly about which half of the Corey team wrote each chapter in Caliban's War. But it was this chapter that made me want to investigate that topic because, two books in, I think I've figured out one of Franck's tells. I'll be interested to see if people think I'm on the right path or not. It's the very first paragraph. Caliban's War, Chapter Eight posted:The Harman Dae-Jung was a Donnager-class dreadnought, half a kilometer in length, and a quarter million tons dry weight. Her interior docking bay was large enough to hold four frigate-class escort ships and a variety of lighter shuttles and repair craft. Currently, it held only two ships: the large and almost opulent shuttle that had ferried the Martian ambassadors and state officials up for the flight to Earth, and the smaller and more functional Navy shuttle Bobbie had ridden up from Ganymede. As a completely nitpicky aside, I feel like every Martian ship of the line we see throughout the series is a Donnager-class vessel. But it's somewhat funny in books seven and eight where such ships are thirty-years old antiques and therefore take on a different meaning. Omi: "We’ve touched on this a bit before, but The Expanse really, really likes its ship porn - there’s always lots of elaborate, drawn-out exposition on ships and fleets. In this case I think it’s a serviceable enough way to set time and place, but it’s also a bit clunky and noticeable over time." The Dae-Jung is heading to Earth. Bobbie is jogging. The naval crew finds the constant one-gee acceleration uncomfortable, but Bobbie does not because the marines train for combat at one-gee. To fight on Earth, you see. That's always stuck in my mind as one of the more memorable parts of the Expanse's worldbuilding, especially where they then go with it. Caliban's War, Chapter Eight posted:The Dae-Jung’s captain was being pressured by the diplomats to get them to Earth as quickly as possible, so the ship was running at a near-constant one g acceleration. I also like the bit about how weak and decadent Earthers are leading into an aborted PTSD episode about Snoopy and his marines. Omi: "I like Bobbie’s PTSD stuff- it’s a little cliché, but it works well enough and it informs her arc without feeling overdone (yet)." Caliban's War, Chapter Eight posted:“Anything you can do I can do better,” she sang to herself in a breathless falsetto as she ran. “I can do anything better than you.” But Bobbie is surprised by a yeoman and she trips. She injures her knee and wrist but is otherwise okay. The yeoman touches her on the injured knee, which strikes me as very odd for a crewman to do both to a woman and a superior (I may not know how ranks work.) But she's been ordered to go to a conference room and, so, off she goes. Caliban's War, Chapter Eight posted:A marine in full battle dress and armed with an assault rifle opened the door for her and gave her a smile as she went by. It was a nice smile, full of even white teeth, below almond-shaped eyes so dark they were almost black. ANYWAY. Bobbie goes to the conference room. Captain Thorrson is there, as are two civilians whom Bobbie mentally dubs Redhead and Chubby. They want to figure out what happened with the attack and get Bobbie's perspective on things. They call the proto-monster the Anomaly. Caliban's War, Chapter Eight posted:The Anomaly they called it now. You could hear them capitalize the word when they said it. Anomaly, like something that just happens. A strange random event. It was because everyone was still afraid to call it what it really was. The Weapon. Caliban's War, Chapter Eight posted:Thorsson patted her hand paternally Chubby, Redhead and Thorsson think that the proto-monster was delivered to the UN outpost, whereupon it got loose and ran for it when they realized they couldn't contain it. Bobbie laughs and says there's no way that the 'second most dangerous things in the system' - that is, UN marines - would cut and run. She cites that the UN outpost usually held a full platoon of Marines (20-50 soldiers, thanks Google) but there were only six. She thinks the UN guys were coming to the Mars base for backup. After all, if it was some secret UN project, then why would they bring the evidence right to Mars? But after that, she's dismissed. Later, Bobbie's working on cleaning the Gatling gun in her suit. As an aside - Gatling with a capital g? I suppose it was a specific kind of gun, but would it still be a capital-g Gatling gun built-in to the suit of a future Martian marine?  Anyway, Martens comes by. They talk a bit, about how Thorrson is a naval spook and isn't a grunt like she is. So, Martens wonders, how messed up is Bobbie that even Thorsson notices it? I wondered about this line for a minute or so. Omi thinks it works really well. I feel like a naval spook would be able to notice things like that. But I suppose it doesn't matter, Martens is just using it as a way to open the dialogue with Bobbie. Caliban's War, Chapter Eight posted:The end of Bobbie’s nose itched, and she scratched it without thinking. The sudden smell of gun oil let her know that she’d just rubbed lubricant all over her face. Martens glanced at it but didn’t stop talking. She tried to drown him out by putting the gun together as noisily as possible. Now, that's interesting. That's Prax and Bobbie who've both had chapters where their account has these unreliable moments where they were shouting but didn't realize it. Martens also sys that Bobbie just keeps cleaning her gun, over and over again. She's never fired it, she just keeps disassembling and reassembling it. He says she has PTSD and, until she's processed it, she's not going to handle it. It's the kind of standard-fare PTSD tough guy tropey talk. 'You shouldn't feel ashamed, you're trained to be tough and awesome and to help your friends, but your training and friends couldn't prepare you for what happened.' It's not bad, but it feels like something you'd see in many, many stories. Omi: "I’m not sure if I like Martens, because the whole “Affable guy who won’t leave you alone for your own good” archetype fundamentally annoys me, but I like this line. Remember how I said that the initial PTSD stuff wasn’t overdone? This whole conversation kinda is. It feels like every tough guy/combat fatigue scene ever made, to the point that you can predict nearly the entire scene line-for-line, act-for-act. I’m also not a fan of the whole “I’m gonna get over the thing that traumatized me by killing it” thing." Caliban's War, Chapter Eight posted:“No, Captain, talking to you is not what’s going to get me better.” Again, not a bad chapter. What I said about Avasarala's chapter is basically what I think about this one. I don't even mind that the chapter is basically reiterating what we already know, because Bobbie's a fun character. It's probably what makes the chapter a nice one to read. She's got all these little moments that make her fun to read about. It might be a cliche plotline for Bobbie, but the capabilities of the protomonster do create a 'Well, how will she do it?' hook. And, of course, the wider idea of just how she'll hook into the main narrative.
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Nov 30, 2020 12:01
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Milkfred E. Moore posted:Anyway, Martens comes by. They talk a bit, about how Thorrson is a naval spook and isn't a grunt like she is. So, Martens wonders, how messed up is Bobbie that even Thorsson notices it? Hmm that's a good point... when I read it, I think I was picturing Thorrson as basically a glorified office worker: less silenced pistols and poisoned martinis, and more dude who reads tons of reports and goes "Whoops, Earth's wheat prices dropped by 0.2% this quarter, that must mean the unidentified base they built on the far side of the moon is an orbital farm." So when Martens talks about Thorrson recognizing Bobbie's symptoms, I thought he was basically going "Yo- nobody knows what being in combat arms is like unless they've been there- we've all got scars, and we recognize those scars in others. How screwed up do you have to be for someone without those experiences to recognize your trauma?"
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Dec 1, 2020 00:45
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Omi no Kami posted:Hmm that's a good point... when I read it, I think I was picturing Thorrson as basically a glorified office worker: less silenced pistols and poisoned martinis, and more dude who reads tons of reports and goes "Whoops, Earth's wheat prices dropped by 0.2% this quarter, that must mean the unidentified base they built on the far side of the moon is an orbital farm." It's possible I may be tainted by the TV show's depiction of Thorsson, where him and Martens have a slightly different role. From memory, I think it's implied that the pair of them were aware of the monster before Bobbie's interrogation and were making sure she could recall it. I'd say your perspective is closer to the text, but my brain is just maybe making connections based on genre knowledge. Thorsson is introduced as this skull-faced figure (tall and thin, further enhancing that skeletal aspect) who orders Bobbie pumped full of amphetamines so he can question her immediately, which leads my brain down the path of 'canny silenced pistols operator' and not so much 'cubicle commando.' Of course, now I'm wondering if we're supposed to draw any kind of link between Thorsson's 'paternal' pat on the hand and Bobbie's feelings about her father.
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Dec 1, 2020 03:22
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Chapter Nine: AvasaralaCaliban's War, Chapter Nine posted:The report was more than three pages long, but Soren had managed to find someone with the balls to admit it when he didn’t know everything. The chapter opens with a big ol' expository block about what's going down on Venus. Caliban's War, Chapter Nine posted:A network of filaments had nearly encased the planet in a pattern of fifty-kilometer-wide hexagons, and apart from the fact that they seemed to carry superheated water and electrical currents, no one knew what they were. The gravity of the planet had increased by 3 percent. Paired whirlwinds of benzene and complex hydrocarbons were sweeping the impact craters like synchronized swimmers where the remains of Eros Station had smashed into the planetary surface. Caliban's War, Chapter Nine posted:“Well, that’s worth poo poo,” she said. (Omi and compose our notes a few updates in advance, so, this was written before I decided to hunt down who wrote what. But it builds on some of the thoughts I had in the previous chapter, and immediately prior within this one, that each author has some little habits.) Avasarala stares out the window for a moment. Mention is made of 'real wood' being particularly extravagant, and that rain has a particular smell. I wonder whether Avasarala is referring to nominal petrichor or if Earth is in such a state that rain smells like something else. Unfortunately, the text doesn't let us know. Soren and Avasarala catch up on recent events. Soren doesn't think Venus sent anything to Ganymede, but Avasarala cautions that they have no idea of Venus' capabilities. Mars is on the way and Nguyen is playing escort. She has a meeting with Jules-Pierre Mao, and she's not read the briefing Soren had sent. Mention is made of Avasarala having nightmares of Arjun, her husband, dying as a consequence of her son dying in a skiing accident. She covers her failure to read the briefing with the classic 'tell me what you think is important' move. So, y'know, Soren gives us the rundown. Ol' Jules-Pierre Mao (henceforth referred to as JP Mao) is the corporate controlling interest in Mao-Kwikowski Mercantile. Before Eros, they were one of the major supplies to Protogen. Everything that happened on Eros, happened with their equipment, their warehouses, and their ships. Only reason why JP isn't locked away or dead (Avasarala isn't precise on this part) is because there was no evidence that Mao-Kwik had any idea what Protogen was up to. When everything came out that Protogen was doing mad science with a dash of crimes against humanity, Mao handed over evidence to implicate two major figures. Avasarala thinks he was cutting a deal, but Soren thinks it may have been personal vengeance for what happened to Julie (which Soren fills us in on - big alien brain on Eros.) Avasarala meets with JP. He's a handsome dude and rich and charismatic. Avasarala and Mao spar for a bit. She wants him to give up anything about the protomolecule he hasn't already given up--off the record, no recorders. JP says he's given up everything he knows, but Avasarala isn't so sure. After all, why did they use his daughter, of all people? JP says it's just bad luck. Avasarala wonders if he's head from Julie since Eros crashed into Venus. JP pantomimes some rage. When Avasarala mentions Ganymede, the shock seems genuine, so, what's he hiding, but Mao counters again that he's already given up everything he knows. JP leaves. Avasarala wonders if he'll go to Errinwright. Caliban's War, Chapter Nine posted:Avasarala reached for her hand terminal and opened a connection to Soren. Soren comes in, drops off the report and the tea. It's out of Ganymede and, correct me if I'm wrong, it's our... Well, I won't spoil it. Caliban's War, Chapter Nine posted:The man in the picture had the stocky bones of an Earther, unkempt dark hair, and a peculiar brand of boyish good looks. Avasarala frowned at the image as she sipped her tea. Caliban's War, Chapter Nine posted:"Otherwise stay out of their way and try not to get noticed. Holden’s an idiot, but he’s not stupid. If he realizes he’s being watched, he’ll start broadcasting pictures of all our Ganymede sources or something. Do not underestimate his capacity to gently caress things up." Omi: "I usually like Avasarala chapters, but I didn’t enjoy this one - it felt like a bit of a disorganized ramble used to tie a shitzillion loose threads back into the main plot. Serviceable and utilitarian, but a lot of it felt rudderless and I feel whole blocks of dialogue and exposition could’ve gone away." Have to say, my thoughts are pretty similar. The dynamic between Avasarala and Soren is fun, and meeting JP Mao in the flesh is somewhat intriguing (even if he fits the Expanse Villain Model) but feels telegraphed too clearly, and tying in Holden there at the end and the hook of the UN being aware of him on Ganymede is good... But it still feels a touch too disconnected. Bobbie saw the monster on Ganymede, Prax is on Ganymede and looking for his daughter (who is involved with the monster), and Holden is there trying to figure out what's going on. But Chrisjen Avasarala is just kind of... on Earth, reminding us of things that happened in the last novel. TV Adaptation Caliban's War, Chapter Nine posted:Avasarala’s eyes flickered over him, taking in the details: well-tailored silk suit that straddled the line between beige and gray, receding hairline unmodified by medical therapies, startling blue eyes that he had probably been born with. He wore his age like a statement that fighting the ravages of time and mortality was beneath his notice. Twenty years earlier, he’d just have been devastatingly handsome. Now he was that and dignified too, and her first, animal impulse was that she wanted to like him.  Francois Chau as Jules-Pierre Mao Perfect casting, I think.
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Dec 2, 2020 11:02
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Chapter Ten: PraxCaliban's War, Chapter Ten posted:“Pas kirrup es I’m to this,” the boy sitting on the cot said. “Pinche salad, sa-sa? Ten thousand, once was.” Sometimes the simple act of reading it means I have to spend a few seconds figuring out what is being said. Like when an author writes out a heavy accent phonetically. I assume that the boy is asking for payment to do something, and that payment is just a salad - when, previously, it would've been ten thousand space monies. Turns out I'm correct, but I think there were moments in later novels where I'd just kind of shrug at what was being said. That's basically where we find Prax. Bartering with a hacker to find some info on Mei. Turns out Ganymede is starting to have severe shortages of food. Basically everyone is starving and, in a particularly dark mention, someone's left their starving baby with this young hacker as "collateral."  Omi: "Is this the first time we’ve heard about the food shortages on post-protomolecule Ganymede? I always thought that it was kinda under-emphasized: Prax is bordering on starvation by the time he meets Holden, but the text never seems to fully resonate with that level of desperation and privation." Technically, no. After all, Holden's there with relief food supplies. But at the same time, I think this is the first Prax chapter where it is mentioned as being a severe problem. A skim of Prax's previous chapter indicates that, yes, he's been eating ornamental plants, but that reads more like listless depression on his part than an issue with the food supply. I'd say this is bolstered by Prax checking on a "sweet shop" and "bars" which you assume are still functioning in some capacity. Prax sums himself up as "technically starving" which must be distinct from "actually" starving, and Basia gives him milk and doesn't mention the lack of food as being a reason why they're leaving Ganymede. So, yeah, maybe under-emphasized is right. Anyway, Prax talks with the hacker, specifying that he's looking for footage prior to the mirror coming down. We read about a bunch of security footage being played in reverse, and it's kind of entertaining, but probably not necessary. Caliban's War, Chapter Ten posted:The second corpse sat up and then stood, clutching her belly. A man stepped into the frame, a gun in his hand, healing her by sucking the bullet from her guts. They argued, grew calm, parted peaceably. Prax knew he was seeing it all in reverse, but his sleep-and calorie-starved brain kept trying to make the images into a narrative. A group of soldiers crawled backward out of the ruined door, like a breech birth, then huddled, backed away in a rush. A flash of light, and the door had made itself whole, thermite charges clinging to it like fruit until a soldier in a Martian uniform rushed forward to collect them safely. Caliban's War, Chapter Ten posted:“Can you follow them?” he asked. “See where they went?” He goes to one of them and mentions that all of Strickland's patients - all sixteen - are missing. But the security man doesn't care, even if Prax points out that Strickland took them all before the attack happened. A woman comes in to report a murder, and it's pretty entertaining the little bit of comedy where the security man starts talking to her but Prax thinks he's talking to him. Caliban's War, Chapter Ten posted:“Three men broke into my apartment,” the woman said. “They... My brother was with me and he tried to stop them.” It's Holden. Caliban's War, Chapter Ten posted:Prax took out his hand terminal, looked at his list. Sixteen names, sixteen children gone. And at the bottom of the page, in simple block characters: Get help. The jump from "poo poo’s hosed, what should I do" to "Who you gonna call? James Holden!" is abrupt and a little jarring. It doesn’t really work for me, and feels like a very obvious lever to get two unrelated pieces into the same puzzle." My thoughts aren't dissimilar. Like I said in Chapter Seven, in my memory this was Prax's previous chapter. As it is, I think you could combine Chapter Seven and Chapter Ten and get something that'd be more effective. Like, just off the top of my head, you get Ganymede starving, oh no -> no one helps Prax -> Prax goes to Basia -> Basia says he and his family are leaving -> Prax freaks out, they fight -> Prax leaves and realizes he's out of time, energy, and help -> Prax sees Jim Holden. Like, I'm not sure at all what you'd lose. And this comes back to my overall critique of these novels, that it feels like if you cut them in, say, half, you could create something that's a little bit more engaging by just condensing some events. On the other hand, they're wildly successful as they are, so, what do I know. It's similar to my thought (which I think I mentioned during one of LW's later chapters) at how these books would look if Holden wasn't a perspective character. If he was just this dude who showed up in these situations and we only saw him through the eyes and thoughts of others. Not a bad chapter, but not a great one. Like Omi says, I do like the science-y stuff we get in Prax chapters, about cascades and hydroponics and so on. And Prax is, overall, a pretty fun character. He's just this hopeless nerd in a terrible situation. He has his flaws but he just really wants to find his little girl. TV Adaptation Prax meets Holden under very different circumstances in the TV series. Prax is on Tycho Station, having survived an ordeal on a refugee ship where Belter radicals spaced everyone else. Much like this chapter, he tries to find someone to do something about the massacre, but he doesn't even know what the name of the ship was. Meanwhile, Holden and Naomi already know that the protomolecule is active on Ganymede. They figure out Protogen is connected to Doctor Strickland. Then, they notice that Prax is on Tycho and linked to Strickland. They interrogate him and Prax, of course, has no idea what they're talking about because Strickland is just Mei's paediatrician. Naomi finds the footage of him taking Mei away and, so, Prax goes with them to Ganymede. Milkfred E. Moore fucked around with this message at 10:38 on Dec 4, 2020 |
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Dec 4, 2020 07:57
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Chapter Eleven: Holden Back to Holden, who is getting a dressing down from Santichai Supitayaporn. He and his wife, Melissa, are eighty-year-old missionaries from the Church of Humanity Ascendant. Which seems like the sort of secular, humanistic religion you find in a lot of sci-fi. For example, Babylon 5's Foundationism. Santichai is seemingly annoyed that Holden was late, I suppose, due to the altercation with the customs officials (and, I'd assume, the hold up in just landing.) Santichai is also annoyed that the OPA promised 22,000 kilos of protein and supplements but delivered less than 12,000. The scene has real 'customer service dude dealing with bad policies' energy, but it's also not that interesting. As Omi puts it: "Santichai being ticked off and poking Holden feels too much like a caricature. Also like the therapy scene with Bobbie, it's kinda cliche - you can guess how this scene will go on an almost line-for-line basis." When Santichai has found someone else to criticize, Holden flees over to Naomi and Melissa. Holden asks Melissa if she knows about anything that happened. Caliban's War, Chapter Eleven posted:“Yes,” Holden said, cutting in again. “I understand that. But why? Not one shot during the entire year that Earth and Mars have jointly held this moon. We had a war before the whole Eros thing, and they didn’t bring it here. Then all at once everyone everywhere is shooting? What kicked that off?” Omi: "Holden being convinced that something rotten is afoot in Ganymede feels very much like an RPG hook. He's definitely a bit of a crusader when injustice or malfeasance is thrust under his nose, but I never got the sense that he was looking for rights to wrong - he just can't stand to let problems that he sees go unaddressed. It feels like the more Holden-esque move here would be to go 'Welp, we delivered our poo poo just like Fred wanted, let's gtfo.'" This relates to a discussion Omi and I had, which is really an extension of some of the thoughts mentioned in Chapter Six. At the time, I had said that seeing Fred's perspective on things was not necessary, under the assumption that Holden and co. would obviously be on Ganymede to find out what's going on. But as Omi pointed out - why send the dude who everyone would recognize to poke around a disaster zone covertly? Especially under the cover of a humanitarian mission? For some reason, I'm reminded of the recent history where, in Africa, it turns out - from memory - the CIA was doing covert poo poo under the guise of a medical program. Turns out, if that gets out, it does a lot of damage! Basically, why are they on Ganymede? There's enough that you can reasonably infer that they're there to snoop around, but there's two questions: One, do they suspect protomolecule involvement at this time? After all, Avasarala is entertaining the idea. Or, two, is it just to find out why Mars and Earth suddenly started a big shootout over the Solar system breadbasket? Three, if Holden's here to do a humanitarian mission, why are they trying to avoid attention? None of this is major but, now that I think about it, maybe it would've been nice to get a 'briefing chat' from Holden (or just a few paragraphs remembering) to get us a concrete idea. Caliban's War, Chapter Eleven posted:The station looked worse on the ground than from space. The vital, oxygen-producing plants that lined the corridor walls were turning an unhealthy shade of yellow. Many corridors didn’t have lights, and the automatic pressure doors had been hand cranked and then wedged open; if one area of the station suddenly lost pressure, many adjoining sections would as well. The few people they ran into either avoided their eyes or stared at them with open hostility. Holden found himself wishing he were wearing his gun openly, rather than in a concealed holster at the small of his back. So, because the story didn't tell us much about Fred's interest in Ganymede, we find out now that he gave Holden a list of names. But before Holden can explain anything further, there's a big ol' explosion and, so, they run towards it. Caliban's War, Chapter Eleven posted:“’Bout fookin’ time,” he yelled in an accent Holden couldn’t place. He held his extra club out to Holden when Naomi didn’t take it. Caliban's War, Chapter Eleven posted:“Fookin’ bastahds flingin’ the victuals up, and the prols jus gotta shove, wut? Well, fook that, ya mudder-humpin’ spunk guzzlas!” Omi: "There's something about a big Scottish guy yelling "Bout fookin' time" that comes off as almost obnoxiously cliche, to the point that I wish they'd written his dialogue normally and just noted that his accent was so thick Holden struggled to parse it. 'Mudder-humpin' spunk guzzlas' is fun, though." Turns out, there's another warehouse space that's in teh middle of a riot. Caliban's War, Chapter Eleven posted:When Holden arrived, the crowd was still cowed by the security officers’ Tasers and shock prods, but from the rising tension and anger in the air, he could tell that wouldn’t last long. The corporate security is guarding Caliban's War, Chapter Eleven posted:“Are you about to do something really stupid?” she asked. Omi: "Okay, now that Holden's been led to the crowd full of starving people, I'm thinking the entire riot and Scottish Man bits could've been skipped. Just go from Holden arguing over how many thousand kilos of food he had to meeting a contact who lives in the slums and is all like "Yo, you wanna see the real hunger games? Throw a steak into this crowd." It'd be more startling and in-your-face awful, and it would skip the jarring tone shifts." Holden gets up on the loading dock and introduces himself as "Walter Philips" who is the personal representative of Colonel Frederick Johnson (not bad for a crewman first-class, hey!) Holden tries to pass a Persuasion Check to get people to give the food up, but fails and a big goon from Mao-Kwik tells him to gently caress off, and Holden... Caliban's War, Chapter Eleven posted:Well, he’d tried. Holden smiled at the man and began to reach for the holster at the small of his back. He wished that Amos were here, but he hadn’t seen him since they had gotten off the ship. Before he reached the pistol, his hand was enveloped by long slender fingers and squeezed tightly. So, Naomi dials up Amos and bluffs that they have an OPA gunship standing by that'll disable the food freighter and steal the cargo and scuttle it if it leaves. The Mao-Kwik goon, of course, falls for it even though I'm not sure I buy it, and the goons and rent-a-cops and whoever else leave. Omi: "So I've got a complaint about how the standoff at the supply ship is resolved, but I'm not quite sure what it is. The issue isn't entitlement, and given the diverse nature of Holden's crew it's not really a great white savior thing, but there's something about a small group of charismatic, well-fed outsiders showing up and handily solving a situation that the desperate locals were perfectly capable of resolving on their own that rubs me the wrong way." I'm not sure I'd say 'perfectly capable of resolving' (I suppose getting shot to pieces is a resolution) but it's a touch too neat, I suppose. "Give them some food." "No, gently caress you." "Give them some food or we'll conduct interplanetary piracy under the flag of the Space IRA." "Dang, they got us, the representatives of one of the most powerful megacorps in the system." I get it that's something like that is the whole point of a bluff, but there are Earther ships in orbit, right? Couldn't the Mao-Kwik freighter just start broadcasting "HEY UN FORCES, THE OPA JUST TOLD US THEY PLAN ON ATTACKING THIS VESSEL AND STEALING OUR CARGO, REQUEST ESCORT?" Just a thought. Holden say it's cool what Naomi did, and here we get one of the more interesting parts of Caliban's War - that Naomi accuses Holden of "acting like that rear end in a top hat Detective Miller." Caliban's War, Chapter Eleven posted:“I wasn’t acting like Miller,” he said, the accusation stinging, because it was true. Then Prax shows up! Caliban's War, Chapter Eleven posted:He gave them another small nod and said, “You are James Holden? Captain James Holden? From the OPA?” Caliban's War, Chapter Eleven posted:“You have to help me,” Prax said. Holden could see that the man had been through a rough couple of months. His clothes hung off him like a starving man’s, and his face was covered with yellowing bruises from a fairly recent beating. So, Holden asks him what's the problem, and the chapter ends. It's an okay one. The dynamic between Holden and Naomi is fun enough, and the bit with the Supitayaporns wasn't much of an issue on my first read. But it doesn't really tell us anything we don't already know and, really, just kind of complicates what we thought we knew - such as what Holden is supposed to be doing on Ganymede, what Fred wants him to do, and so on. But the overall idea that Holden's arc is going to be that he's imitating Miller because the old, surly Detective rubbed off on him is interesting enough. Especially if it's going to complicate his relationship with the sensible, intelligent Naomi. Omi: "It feels like 90% of this chapter was filler to bridge Holden from landing on the moon to meeting Prax. The only thing it accomplished was worldbuilding, and we've already seen a lot of Ganymede from the Prax chapters."
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Dec 7, 2020 12:05
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Oh, and something that bothered me about Holden's assessment of Prax. I'm pretty sure no one notices (or cares), but a wizard inflicted upon me a curse to care about pedantic details, so...Caliban's War, Chapter Eleven posted:“You have to help me,” Prax said. Holden could see that the man had been through a rough couple of months. His clothes hung off him like a starving man’s, and his face was covered with yellowing bruises from a fairly recent beating. Here's a better simile right off the top of my head, and would even be an entertaining call back to Chapter Six. "His clothes hung off him worse than Holden's crewman disguise did."
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Dec 8, 2020 05:42
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Chapter Twelve: Avasarala It's Sunday morning back on Earth and Avasarala is having a conversation with her husband, Arjun. Caliban's War, Chapter Twelve posted:A small house is a deeper kind of luxury,” her husband said. “To live in a space entirely our own, to remember the simple pleasures of baking bread and washing our own dishes. This is what your friends in high places forget. It makes them less human.” Omi: "I like Avasarala's husband, but I think his opening line is a bit on-the-nose and author tract-y." Meanwhile, Avasarala's grandchildren - Kiki and Suri - are playing outside. Suri bursts in to show Avasarala an earthworm. She goes out to get the full story and enjoy some grandmother time, but is quickly interrupted by politics. Omi: "I think seeing Avasarala play the happy grandmother is a nice touch, but everything before she gets the call from Gloria feels a bit rudderless." Turns out, Nguyen is sending ships to Ganymede - and doing it quietly, outside official channels. Avasarala has no idea why. After a bit more grandmother time, she goes off to have a shower. Afterwards, she basically lectures Arjun about it. Caliban's War, Chapter Twelve posted:“He thinks they did it,” she said. Avasarala goes off to figure out what Nguyen's up to. He's sending ten ships of a fairly wide gamut, ranging from ancient transports to light warships named by people who Avasarala has heard about. Avasarala thinks Nguyen is going to gently caress everything up by throwing more warships into the warzone, so, she begins to dismantle his little flotilla. Crews get given new orders, ships sent elsewhere, and so on. In the end, there are only three that she can't reassign - but they're so old and underpowered that the Martians won't take it as a provocation. At some point, she calls Errinwright who wonders what Nguyen will do in response but Avasarala basically says he won't risk kicking up a fuss. They talk about Venus, and it's a lot of techy-talk that is basically 'hmm, it's doing something ' which functionally means we're basically where we were with the report she read last chapter. There's an interesting mention of millennial cults doubling since Eros, though, and the stress of what it feels like having a god slumbering on Venus. Avasarala is much more concerned about Venus and Ganymede than Errinwright is. She watches the footage of the Protomonster killing marines.Soren comes in. Turns out, Nguyen has sent a note of protest to Errinwright, but not the head of the UN. So, he's upset, but Avasarala surmises it as merely pouting and she's not in any danger. But the Martians have arrived and, with a weary sigh, Avasarala goes off to stop a war. And that's really it. It's enjoyable enough even if just because of how well-realized Avasarala's relationship with her husband and grandchildren is, but the intrigue with Nguyen isn't really engaging. Rotating viewpoints is tough. I think this was the wrong place for an Avasarala chapter. Holden's just met Prax, that's sort of what I'm interested in seeing. Avasarala's stuff provides a bunch of background on the space politics, which is fine, but I'd say she's the character I have the least interest in at this point. All in all, maybe this would've been a better place for a Prax chapter. That's not to say an Avasarala chapter is a bad idea at this point - we're presumably skipping over Prax telling Holden his whole deal - but it doesn't feel like we're neatly slipping between two stories. There's the Prax and Holden story, which is tying together, but Avasarala and Bobbie feel like they haven't come together as yet and the political intrigue is a bit too neat. Nguyen comes up with something, Avasarala puts him in his place. It's like she's killing time until the story outline nudges her and Bobbie together at the peace talks. But Mars wants to avert a war and so does Avasarala, sooo... I also note that we don't hear anything about that request to talk to Fred Johnson on the sly. I assume that'll be coming up later. While I can generally recall how the Prax and Holden chapters go, the Avasarala and Bobbie ones are much more of a mystery to me, for better or worse. But basically, so far, Avasarala's chapters are not something I'd reread the novel for.
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Dec 9, 2020 12:13
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I think if I had free reign to edit CW I would've probably cut the Holden viewpoints entirely and run alternating Prax/Bobbie chapters with an Avasarala chapter starting and ending each act and framing the high-level politics that drive the boots on the ground stuff. I think that Prax, in particular, suffers because of the size of the cast- Holden and his crew are fun, and Prax is fun, but together the two often feel redundant and vaguely clunky.
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Dec 9, 2020 13:30
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replace every character with prax and let the clone army go off on a 600 page space botany adventure imo
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Dec 9, 2020 21:01
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Omi no Kami posted:I think if I had free reign to edit CW I would've probably cut the Holden viewpoints entirely and run alternating Prax/Bobbie chapters with an Avasarala chapter starting and ending each act and framing the high-level politics that drive the boots on the ground stuff. I think that Prax, in particular, suffers because of the size of the cast- Holden and his crew are fun, and Prax is fun, but together the two often feel redundant and vaguely clunky. I feel like both Holden and Prax are trying to occupy the 'space' of audience identification character, which I think hurts Holden as a character. He's at his best when he's this self-righteous weirdo who tilts at windmills and gets into arguments and is borderline incomprehensible (a later scene between Holden and Fred is one of my favorites in the whole series, and really like how Tiamat's Wrath does not have him as a perspective character.) I feel like you could tell the same story with just Bobbie and Prax. Both of them on Ganymede, both of them end up swept into some crazy events, but Prax ends up going around with space truckers while Bobbie walks the halls of power. T-man posted:replace every character with prax and let the clone army go off on a 600 page space botany adventure imo You could call them the Praxidike Men.
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Dec 9, 2020 23:34
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Chapter Thirteen: HoldenCaliban's War, Chapter Thirteen posted:Amos, who’d finally turned up a few hours after the food riot carrying a case of beer and saying he’d done some “recon,” was now carrying a small case of canned food. The label claimed it was “chicken food products.” Holden hoped that the hacker Prax was leading them to would see the offering as at least being in the spirit of his requested payment. So, they're off to see Prax's hacker. There's something the Corey boys like to do which is basically describing the past. For example, they're on the way to see the hacker - but there's a paragraph about how they took Prax on to the ship, made him shower and eat, stuff like that. It then leads into a few paragraphs of how Holden is sad because... Caliban's War, Chapter Thirteen posted:When Holden had been dying and trapped in the hell of Eros Station, he had discovered that he needed to see Naomi one last time. Or barring that, to see that she was safe. It was why he hadn’t died there. That and having Miller at his side with a second gun. And that connection, even now that he and Naomi were lovers, was a pale shadow compared to the thing driving Prax. It left Holden feeling like he’d lost something important without realizing it. So, after Prax 'had showered' Holden 'had gone up' to see Naomi and hugged her and so on. Of the hug, Holden reflects: Caliban's War, Chapter Thirteen posted:It might be a pale shadow, but it was what he had right now, and it was pretty drat good. So, Prax leads them to the hacker. Amos isn't sure if they can find their way back to the ship because, as Holden points out, Ganymede is a bit of a maze of identical corridors. Which honestly feels like a description of all the various space installations in the Expanse. There's mention made that Amos's "constant glower" keeps scary people away from them, and a reminder that Holden doesn't actually know anything about his life prior to meeting him on the Canterbury. They meet the hacker. Prax will trade the chicken for the rest of the footage, which was actually what was mentioned in Chapter Ten. Naomi, who is watching from the ship, says she could've done it for them. The hacker tries to shake them down for more and more chicken, and Amos steps up “That guy,” Amos said, pointing at Prax with his left hand while continuing to toss the chicken with his right, “got his baby girl snatched. He just wants to know where she is. He’s willing to pay the agreed-upon price for that information.” Then, Amos beats the poo poo out of the guy. Just hammers him with the can over and over until Holden grabs him and reminds him that he can't help them if Amos beats his brains out. Something about the hacker being a jerk over the life of a little girl really sets Amos off. I like how this sort of grows into some of the stuff we learn about Amos. Anyway, with the hacker beaten and terrified, they go through the footage. Doctor Strickland and someone pretending to be Mei's mom came to get her. Prax mentions Mei's genetic disorder, etc. They get Strickland's tail to an old, abandoned part of Ganymede's infrastructure. When they give the hacker his payment, Amos tips all the cans all over the floor. Holden and Naomi figure that Strickland or his buddies took all the other kids, too. I feel like we got all of this from Prax's chapters, or could be inferred from them. Caliban's War, Chapter Thirteen posted:“Why would he want those kids?” Naomi asked. The crew (minus Alex) groups up and discusses things. Not kidnapping, not ransom. Someone's kicked off a firefight to hide that they grabbed sixteen kids. Amos thinks it was Protogen - if they weren't toast. Whoever they are, Naomi says, they have significant resources to hack into the systems of a school for the richest and brightest on Ganymede. Holden wonders what'll be waiting for them where Strickland went. Amos thinks corporate goons, Naomi guesses nothing, and Prax puts his money on Mei. The group splits up to be get a plan to be prepared for anything, and that's that for the chapter. Omi wonders: "I'm still not really feeling the crew's decision to go all in on this random dude's child kidnapping crisis. It's unambiguously the right thing to do, but it doesn't feel like something they'd involve themselves in given everything else that's going on." I feel like it's the problem with not getting a concrete idea of why Holden is on Ganymede. Was he there just to drop off food and get out? Was he there to poke around and find out what's up? Is he shirking duties from Fred by helping some random dude find his baby girl? Again, not a huge problem - because as Omi said, it's basically a RPG hook for Holden to find and follow and as a reader you know Holden is going to help Prax out so cut to the chase - but it's a little bit annoying. I really do feel like Holden and co. are supposed to be there on this covert fact-finding mission (hence the disguises, beards, fake identities, etc) because otherwise why not just send Holden with the food without all the subterfuge? Make it a big win for the OPA, y'know? Just a few lines from Holden being like 'Fred sent us here to find out what's going on, and this is related to it, I know it' could help establish some conflict and tie back to Holden picking up Miller's worst habits. As it is, it suffers a little bit from that RPG Adventure Syndrome where everyone involved knows this is how the adventure goes, so, no one really questions the setup. But I also don't think there's a character in the crew who would, say, be the 'let's not find the little girl' figure, either. Anyway, the TV adaptation smoothed it over. And, speaking of... TV Adaptation The chicken beatdown is in the series and is pretty much as-is. The big differences are that Naomi is present and Prax is the one to stop Amos, not Holden, which I think works a little better and starts off a nice little friendship between him and Amos. The scene in question used to be on Youtube but appears to have been taken down. One thing I appreciate is how it cuts Amos' dialogue from the scene because, like, we don't need him shouting angrily that he's beating up the guy because he's holding her hostage for chicken - him furiously laying into him with the can says that loud and clear. Milkfred E. Moore fucked around with this message at 01:30 on Dec 15, 2020 |
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Dec 15, 2020 01:22
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It really is bugging me how Holden's Ganymede mission is operating from this Schrodinger's space. It feels like no matter how I assemble the pieces, I just end up with questions. At first, I did say that I didn't think it was necessary to see Fred's briefing, and I know it didn't bother me on my first read through, but going through it again, it just feels strange that we don't get directly told why Holden is on Ganymede, and nor does he seem to act like he's there for any reason other than to stumble upon Prax. Which, speaking of... Chapter Fourteen: Prax We're on the Somnambulist and Prax is just woofing down food. Canned chicken, spicy chutney, crackers and beer. Omi points out that it's not the brightest idea because it'd probably make him vomit and, funnily enough, he promptly does. Caliban's War, Chapter Fourteen posted:After he finished vomiting, the woman who seemed to take care of all the small practical matters on the ship... Naomi gives Prax some food that's more suited to his starved status, a thin protein broth. We get a little bit about the state of the ship. Unsurprisingly, it's dingy and old and in disrepair. Prax notes especially that the lighting would kill any plant living under it which is a nice touch. Prax watches Amos assemble and clean his hand cannon and does this kind of OCD thing with his hands. Caliban's War, Chapter Fourteen posted:Prax found his hands moving toward the disassembled pieces, willing them to come together. To be already cleaned and polished and remade. Amos pretended not to notice in a way that meant he was very much aware. Caliban's War, Chapter Fourteen posted:“Getting ready’s the lovely part,” Amos said, as if agreeing to something. “You want to get right out into it right the gently caress now. Get it over with.” Caliban's War, Chapter Fourteen posted:“How many gunfights have you been in?” Amos asked. His voice was low and wide and gentle. “Because I’ve been in … poo poo. This’ll be eleven for me. Maybe twelve, if you count the one time when the guy got up again as a different fight. Point is, if you want your little girl safe, you don’t want her in a tunnel with a guy firing a gun who doesn’t know what he’s doing.” Anyway, Amos basically quizzes Prax, and it's a nice moment. Caliban's War, Chapter Fourteen posted:“This ready to fire?” Amos asked. Omi: I like how Amos does his big tough gun trivia quiz, Prax aces it, and he still has to go "Uh... yeah, that's right. But even without an excuse we're not giving you a gun and letting you come with." Holden and Naomi show up. They're bickering. Holden wants to go in guns blazing, but Naomi is on the side of that being a bad idea. Caliban's War, Chapter Fourteen posted:“This guy who grabs a gun first and talks later …” Naomi said. “You didn’t used to be him. You aren’t him.” Omi: "I like watching Prax watch Naomi watch Holden and get pissed. This is a good place to establish that there are problems in Naomi town, because goodness knows Holden himself is oblivious enough." Some numbers are going up and Holden thinks they're wrong. Turns out it's the death rate, and Holden is confused because, well, the fighting was only a day and it was ages ago - so why are more people dying? Prax says it's the cascade. Caliban's War, Chapter Fourteen posted:“It’s the basic obstacle of artificial ecosystems. In a normal evolutionary environment, there’s enough diversity to cushion the system when something catastrophic happens. That’s nature. Catastrophic things happen all the time. But nothing we can build has the depth. One thing goes wrong, and there’s only a few compensatory pathways that can step in. They get overstressed. Fall out of balance. When the next one fails, there are even fewer paths, and then they’re more stressed. It’s a simple complex system. That’s the technical name for it. Because it’s simple, it’s prone to cascades, and because it’s complex, you can’t predict what’s going to fail. Or how. It’s computationally impossible.” Holden argues that Ganymede is the most important bread basket in the system and that no one would let it collapse. Prax says that it already has - the environmental and social structures are busted. He has to go find Mei before everything truly collapses. He thinks that even if Strickland thinks he's safe, he might not understand what's going on and how bad it'll get, or maybe he'll just run out of air. Once again, Prax raises his voice without realizing it. Prax insists that he has to be the one to find Mei, dead or alive. Amos agrees by handing him a pistol. Holden doesn't seem to think that's a good idea, but Amos agrees he has to go. Caliban's War, Chapter Fourteen posted:“We might want to talk about that decision-making process, Amos,” Naomi said, shaping the words carefully. Then six Martians in body armor show up. Seven, Amos corrects Holden. Caliban's War, Chapter Fourteen posted:“Six is still more than three,” Naomi said in their ears. “You want me to send backup?” Omi: "Amos is fun!" Prax goes for his gun. Amos grabs him by the hand. Holden and the Martian talk. Seems like the Martian, who figures them for offworlders, wants to take them back to the dock and steal their ship. Holden basically goes, hey, sure, but I'll do you one better - I'll give you passage on our ship if you help us figure out what's going on here. Caliban's War, Chapter Fourteen posted:“You’re loving with me,” the Martian said. So, the Martian's name is Wendell. He works for Pinkwater Security, which is a heck of a portmanteau (Pinkerton/Blackwater), and were first mentioned back in Leviathan Wakes. Holden says he'll get them off Ganymede if they help them out. So, the security goons go 'sure' and form up around Holden's people. It all feels a bit neat and tidy, like an excuse to give Holden redshirt bodies for the inevitable shootout. Omi: "I don't buy that Holden is good enough at talking to turn a shakedown into mercenaries working for them - that seems more like an Amos or Naomi job." Then they go to the mystery door and Naomi opens it. Dun dun! It's a pretty good chapter, all in all. Prax and Amos have a fun dynamic and Prax's headspace is a weird, interesting place to spend time in. The weakest part is the bit with the Pinkerton mercenaries, really. It strikes me as a little odd to have Holden talking the guys down when Naomi's making a big deal about how he's basically Miller and too eager to shoot people and, indeed, almost pulled a gun on the Mao-Kwik guy a few chapters ago. I wonder if it's related to how they write the chapters. The Holden chapters are written by a different writer to the Prax chapters, and while they claim to pass them back and forth and edit for continuity, I wonder if it's just a case of Abraham and Franck not quite having the same perspective on where Holden's story is going and what it means by him being influenced by Miller. I think this is something Omi and I have pegged to talk about in the next Holden chapter, too. (Here's another thing some people might not have noted. In the last Holden chapter, they said they had taken Prax back to the ship and had him eat and shower while they waited for Amos to get the chicken. But now he's eating again, and vomiting, like it's the first time he's eaten in ages?) But it's similar to Holden's idealistic (if not naïve) bit about how they wouldn't let Ganymede fail, when he's watched corporate freighters take off with food and so on. I feel like it could've been interesting to have Holden be a bit of a cynic about the situation, and maybe Prax is like 'Wait, wasn't this dude some kind of freedom of information hero of the people?' and so on. But this all comes back to my lingering issue with the Ganymede chapters, which is Holden's motivation, and - as mentioned - I think it's better to give it a good, thorough discussion in his next chapter. Still, ultimately, it's all fairly minor stuff - the story works - and I'd say this chapter was one of my favorites of the CW reread so far. TV Adaptation Wendell and co. do not show up in the TV series.
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Dec 16, 2020 10:05
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Chapter Fifteen: Bobbie And back to Bobbie, who is three hours into the first big meeting between Mars and Earth. Bobbie's not enjoying it. Avasarala and Errinwright are in attendance, and Bobbie tries to figure out who the person in charge is. Bobbie is very bored, down to pouring herself a glass of water simple because it'd give her something to do. Thorsson is also there. Bobbie's worried that he might start hitting on her. She's also concerned that no one is taling about the 'goddamned monster.' Thorsson basically says they'll get around to it, there's protocol, and so on. It's a little weird. As a reader, I know there's a monster, every party involved in this meeting knows there's a monster... Admittedly, I've never sat in on a national security meeting between two major political powers, but... Bobbie decides 'to hell with that' and raises her hand like a "fifth-grade student in a room of adults." It's a weird moment for precision - why did Bobbie single out fifth-grade? Is there something very different about being in grade four or six and asking a question? Caliban's War, Chapter Fifteen posted:“I, for one,” Grandma said, smiling a mild apology at the room, “would like to hear what Sergeant Draper has to say.” Caliban's War, Chapter Fifteen posted:“This is your fault,” he said to Martens, then spun to face Bobbie. “And you, Sergeant, have just proven that it was a monumental mistake to bring you along. Any benefit that might have been gained from having the only eyewitness has now been squandered by your … your idiotic tirade.” Bobbie ends up going outside for some air. We learn that the UN governs "thirty billion citizens" and "hundreds of millions of colonists." Mars, on the other hand, has a population of "four billion." We get a bunch of information on Mars. Mars sees Earth as corrupt and decadent, a population that survives on welfare with a decaying infrastructure. Meanwhile, Mars has no unemployment and is engaged, as a society, in the terraformation of the planet. It's a work that'll take decades, if not centuries, to complete but it gives Martians something to look toward. Meanwhile, Earthers only look towards their next welfare check - according to Mars, anyway. The Martian terraforming project is one of the more interesting parts of the Expanse's worldbuilding, I think. While Earth/Mars/Outer Planets is a pretty standard sci-fi trope, The Expanse realizes it in an interesting way with Mars' dream of the great terraforming work and how it unites them as a society, and then how that plays out over history. It's pretty close to Dune's treatment of the Fremen and how their way of life changes and adapts (or fails to.) Anyway, Bobbie's time on Earth makes her start thinking that maybe the Martian propaganda isn't entirely accurate. Then she steps outside of a building and has a panic attack, because she's outside without a suit! That'd be a death sentence on Mars. It's a fun little scene. Bobbie thinks Chuck, a UN Marine who helps her out, is hot. He gives her some advice to help her with, basically, agoraphobia. Bobbie's reaction to Earth reminds me of a friend who had grown up in Singapore and, when they came to the Australian outback, couldn't handle the fact that they could see the horizon in every direction and actually flew into a panic. Likewise, the scene that follows when Bobbie heads out into the streets of... Y'know, I don't think it's mentioned where on Earth they are... Wherever, Earth... Caliban's War, Chapter Fifteen posted:Bobbie had gone to a couple of games at Armstrong Stadium on Mars, to watch the Red Devils play. The stadium had seats for twenty thousand fans. Because the Devils were usually at the bottom of the standings, it generally held less than half that. That relatively modest number was the greatest number of humans Bobbie had ever seen in one place at one time. There were billions of people on Mars, but there weren’t a lot of open spaces for them to gather. Standing at an intersection, looking down two streets that seemed to stretch into infinity, Bobbie was sure she saw more than the average attendance of a Red Devils game just walking on the sidewalks. We get a bit more worldbuilding on Earth. This is a Franck chapter, after all, and he likes his RPG notes. tl;dr - Earth is overpopulated, and is a world of 'the engaged and apathetic.' Bobbie gets tea from a vendor and some introduction to Earther life. Caliban's War, Chapter Fifteen posted:When the tea arrived, she said, “Hey, do you mind if I ask you something?” Bobbie wondered if Mars would become like this after the terraforming. If Martians didn’t have to fight every day to make enough resources to survive, would they turn into this? A culture where you could actually choose if you wanted to contribute? The work hours and collective intelligence of fifteen billion humans just tossed away as acceptable losses for the system. It made Bobbie sad to think of. All that effort to get to a point where they could live like this. Sending their kids to work at a coffee shop to see if they were up to contributing. Letting them live the rest of their lives on basic if they weren’t. But Bobbie has a more interesting observation, and one I mentioned briefly a few chapters back. If it came to a ground war on Earth, then Mars would lose. Not only are there way more Earthers than Martians, but the few hours of training the Martian marines do at one full gee is nothing compared to the fact that every single Earther has lived their whole lives in one gee. Caliban's War, Chapter Fifteen posted:But one thing was for sure: All that running and exercising the Martian Marines did at one full gravity was bullshit. There was no way Mars could ever beat Earth on the ground. You could drop every Martian soldier, fully armed, into just one Earth city and the citizens would overwhelm them using rocks and sticks. Caliban's War, Chapter Fifteen posted:Thorsson and his bullshit didn’t matter. The pissing contest with Earth didn’t matter. Making Mars into another Earth didn’t matter, not if this was where it was headed. All that mattered was finding out who’d put that thing on Ganymede. She tossed off the last of her tea and thought, I’ll need a ride. You can probably tell that I liked this chapter a little bit more than the previous ones. I'm not sure why, exactly, because nothing much really happens and it's very worldbuilding heavy. I think it's really just on the contrast between Mars and Earth and Bobbie as a character. Getting a true believer's perspective on Mars contrasted with a street-view analysis of Earth is pretty neat. However, there are some issues with it, and I'll let Omi detail them. Omi: "This was the first chapter where I really felt the same narrative whiplash we often saw in book one. Bobbie and Prax's stories are much more obviously connected than Holden and Miller's, but the end of 14 left me ready to see the action thing, and now I'm having to recalibrate and remember what Bobbie was up to last time we saw her." (It's been six chapters since we last saw Bobbie. That's the single largest gap between a character's chapters so far.) Omi: "This chapter was weird - I liked Bobbie running around hanging out with locals, but it felt like a completely different chapter than the board room PTSD stuff. The latter honestly feels like it got taped onto an otherwise fun chapter just because it was a story beat they needed to hit ASAP. I think I wish they'd introduced the two characters differently." (The political stuff brings to mind Mass Effect's Council (  Reapers ). That and surely a hundred other sci-fi stories where the strong action hero is being held up by bureaucrats whose red tape will kill us all! It's weird because Earth knows it wasn't Mars, Mars knows it wasn't Earth, neither of them want a war... so the tension has to come from Thorsson insisting that things have to be done slowly. And it's just kinda... )Omi: "Bobbie deciding to get her rear end to Ganymede is kinda weird - I know, PTSD and all, but seriously, what the heck-she's on a different planet, in a different situation, after a whole career as a cool military lady. In my mind she's maybe the least likely among the entire cast to go off half-cocked in pursuit of her goals." TV Adaptation Suffice to say, the TV adaptation of this sequence is very different, but I think it'll be easier to discuss that once we're done with Caliban's War instead of going piece by piece.
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Dec 18, 2020 11:35
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Sorry! I was on a real writing tear yesterday and I completely forgot to do a write-up. Chapter Sixteen: Holden Caliban's War, Chapter Sixteen posted:Beyond the door lay a long hallway that looked, to Holden, exactly the same as every other hallway on Ganymede: ice walls with moisture-resistant and insulated structural plates and inset conduit, rubberized walking surface, full-spectrum LEDs to mimic sunlight slanting down from the blue skies of Earth. They could have been anywhere. Omi: "Oh look, it's yet another identical hallway! Now that this particular tic has been pointed out, it's really hard not to notice." Holden calls his ad hoc army - book's words, not mine - to a briefing. tl;dr: they have a map but no other intel, so, could be a death trap. They'll leave a lookout at each intersection to make sure no one shoots them in a back. If the lookouts are needed, then Holden will call them in. Amos takes point, Wendell takes rearguard. Omi: "The Holden situation seems to have evolved from 'feed some peasants' to 'conduct an organized paramilitary raid on an unknown compound' really quickly." After leaving a lookout, Amos and Holden check out a door. The way it's written confused me for a moment. Caliban's War, Chapter Sixteen posted:When Amos hit one, Holden took a deep breath, and he burst through the door as Amos yanked it open a split second later. There's nothing behind the door but "another ten meters of corridor." Then we hit a paragraph that's somewhat intriguing. Caliban's War, Chapter Sixteen posted:Amos began advancing to the intersection and the next hatch, his gun aimed down the hallway. Holden followed him, his rifle tracking right as he kept it aimed at the side passage, the reflex to cover every possible ingress point to their position having become automatic over the last year. So, what is Holden talking about? Since when has he been a cop? Omi and I both think that his past year has had him being an OPA pirate hunter. This is what the first Holden chapter pretty much directly stated, after all. And Holden himself is a naval officer with a top-of-the-line combat frigate. You'd assume the work he'd be doing for Fred would be ones that'd allow him to make use of his unique resource. As Omi puts it: "...wait, what? When was Holden a cop? I vaguely remember him taking on independent pirate-hunting jobs for the OPA, did I forget an entire character beat or something? If you're a boots on the ground beat cop or detective who regularly walks around and interviews people sure, you'd probably learn or be taught to do that... but how the gently caress did he learn to do that sitting on a ship shooting pirates? Because I thought he basically spent the last year doing pickup missions for Fred that were implied to largely be token efforts to keep him out of the public eye." Which comes back to my thought of: why send Holden to Ganymede? Especially without his fancy ship? It's a reasonable assumption that Fred has sent Holden to poke around covertly (if we disregard that Fred doesn't seem to think anyone will recognize Holden, which they do, immediately) and figure out why everyone started shooting but Holden hasn't seemed to act at all like he's on a priority mission from one of the most powerful men in the system at all, a man who holds his leash and pays for his ship and crew. He's delivered some food (seemingly a cover) and then walked around until he just so happened to run into Prax. Omi and I wondered if there's not a better setup for getting Holden on Ganymede so he can go chase Prax's missing daughter. Some of the ideas we floated include:
As they walk the halls, Holden reflects: Caliban's War, Chapter Sixteen posted:Naomi had said this wasn’t him. He’d left the Navy without seeing live combat outside pirate hunting from the comfort of a warship’s operations deck. He’d worked for years on the Canterbury, hauling ice from Saturn to the Belt without ever having to worry about something more violent than drunken ice buckers fighting out their boredom. He’d been the peacemaker, the one who always found the way to keep things cool. When tempers flared, he’d keep it calm or keep it funny or just sit for a shift and listen to someone rave and rant whatever it was out of their system. Then, there's some more introspection where Holden specifically states that, okay, he's killed people. But he specifies in such a way that makes it clear that it's only been shooting down other ships, and only of the 'worst kind of carrion eaters', and that this is what Naomi means by 'this isn't you' and I'm not really sure how this fits into the idea that Holden is acting like that bad cop Miller. (Not even mentioning how excited Naomi was to be hunting space pirates in the first chapter...) Caliban's War, Chapter Sixteen posted:If they tracked down the secret base where Mei had been taken, there was a good chance they’d have to fight to get her back. Holden found himself hoping it would bother him, if for no other reason than to prove that it still could. And, again, we won't even interrogate what a space pirate is and whether Holden's actually capable of assessing them as bad people like he thinks he is. Say, Holden, how many people do you think who got off Ganymede might be resorting to space piracy to survive? If Holden draws those two dots together, he hasn't yet. Omi: "The middle of a tense raid is a bad place to put huge chunks of meandering introspection and exposition." They leave another lookout at another intersection, and then move into - quote - not "another featureless gray corridor" but some kind of lab. Holden sends Wendell to find a network access point for Naomi. Meanwhile, Prax finds a dead child. Katoa, who belongs to his friend Basia. Prax freaks out. Not just because he knows Katoa, but because now he's not sure that Strickland will keep Mei safe. They keep moving. Amos isn't sure if bringing Prax was a good idea. Suddenly, a complication! The next room is warmer than the one they're in. So, it's got climate. Someone's heating it, which means someone is in there! Caliban's War, Chapter Sixteen posted:“It looks like we’ve come to the inhabited portion of this base. Amos and I go in first. You three”—Holden pointed at the three Pinkwater people who weren’t Wendell—“follow and cover our flanks. Wendell, you cover our asses and make sure we can get back out in a hurry if things go bad. Prax—” Caliban's War, Chapter Sixteen posted:Just before he got to the hatch, he heard Prax say, “Nobody move,” in a loud but quavering voice. Holden, Amos and their Pinkwater goons back up Prax. Holden tells Wendell to disarm them. Caliban's War, Chapter Sixteen posted:“No,” the woman repeated, taking another bite of her pizza. Around a mouthful of food, she said, “There are only seven of you. There are twelve of us just in this room alone. And there are a lot more behind us that will come running at the first gunshot. So, no, you don’t get to disarm us.” Omi: "It's weird to me how Holden makes a bunch of references to feeling like he's a cop while also being totally cool with murdering a dozen pizza-wielding randos with his machine gun." Which I suppose comes back to that point of like, what is Holden meaning when he says he was a cop, and how much of this is really him 'learning from' Miller? Anyway, catching himself, Holden decides that they should talk. And it seems like the scientist lady is going to talk, too, because - as Holden thinks - everyone is rational here. And then Prax cocks his gun, and the science people go for their guns. Holden thinks: poo poo. For all the tangents I've gone on this chapter, it's another good one. Amos has some fun moments, Prax's whole 'run into the room and make demands' bit is entertaining and a great source of tension. I can take or leave the mercs (and the TV series made the right choice in ditching them.) I don't even mind the exposition, if only because 'use introspection to cover travel time' is a nice sleight-of-hand. There's still a bit too much 'walking down corridors' to it but, y'know, the plot is moving and it ends on a good cliffhanger that leads into what's probably one of the better perspective shifts in the whole novel.
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Dec 22, 2020 11:39
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I really liked the end of this chapter, with Prax loving everything up because he's got no idea what he's doing in this kind of situation. Both funny and a good source of tension.
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Dec 22, 2020 21:25
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I also like how Amos was like "We proooobably shouldn't take Prax, because he'll totally run ahead and gently caress everything up," then they took Prax, and he immediately ran ahead and hosed everything up.
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Dec 23, 2020 05:58
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GodFish posted:I really liked the end of this chapter, with Prax loving everything up because he's got no idea what he's doing in this kind of situation. Both funny and a good source of tension. Oh, yeah, it's a really good note to end on - and I really like how it leads into this chapter... Chapter Seventeen: Prax Caliban's War, Chapter Seventeen posted:In the cinema and games that formed the basis of Prax’s understanding of how people of violence interacted, the cocking of a gun was less a threat than a kind of punctuation mark. A security agent questioning someone might begin with threats and slaps, but when he cocked his gun, that meant it was time to take him seriously. It wasn’t something Prax had considered any more carefully than which urinal to use when he wasn’t the only one in the men’s room or how to step on and off a transport tube. It was the untaught etiquette of received wisdom. You yelled, you threatened, you cocked your gun, and then people talked. Caliban's War, Chapter Seventeen posted:Holden’s voice seemed to come from far away. But I don't think that's what happened. I assume that we're supposed to take it at face value, that Prax's gun didn't go off but her people drew (like we saw in Holden's chapter) and Holden's people opened fire before they did, and cut them down in about a second. It's one of those little weird things - I thought last chapter ended on a gunshot, too. Omi: "Prax begins the chapter by pondering that violence in real life isn't like games and movies. This actually felt a bit jarring to me, since Prax didn't strike me as the kind of guy who would play games or watch movies." I'm tempted to agree. It feels more like a description that the nerdy 21st Century reader reader understands more than Prax understands. Prax doesn't strike me so much as a nerd but, like, a botanical savant. I'd guess that Prax's idea of relaxing is that he just reads up on cool plants or something. Prax asks what happened. Holden says he started a gunfight. Omi: "This is where I would've started the chapter - it's a bit jarring to jump past the violence, but that's basically what Prax's introspective moment does anyway." Which is true. I think I've mentioned before that I do like it when books try to match the reader's perception with the characters. The Expanse does this really well with one particular moment in Nemesis Games. If you want Prax to just miss the gunfight, then have the reader miss it, too. Instead, it feels like our attention is drawn to the fact that Prax missed it, y'know? Amos leads the way out of the room and it's... Caliban's War, Chapter Seventeen posted:On the other side of the door, the nature of the rooms changed. They were still clearly in the old tunnels of Ganymede. The walls still had their webwork of mineralized frost, the lighting was still old-fashioned LED housings, and the gray walls showed where ice had melted and refrozen during some climate system glitch years or decades before. But walking through that doorway was walking from the land of the dead into something living. The air was warmer, and it smelled of bodies and fresh soil and the subtle, sharp scent of phenol disinfectant. The wide hall they entered could have been the common room in any of a dozen labs where Prax had worked. Three metal office doors were closed along the far wall and a rolling metal freight gateway hung open ahead of them. Omi: "It's not bad, but boy do these writers like describing tunnels." A brief gunfight breaks out when Holden and Amos find a prize behind Door #3 (the prize is armed people.) They gun them down. There's a brief bit where Naomi feeds them a floor plan and everyone is like, wait, why are the goons defending on the lower ground. Turns out there's more than seven dudes in there, and they either don't know what they're doing or it's something they can't seperate themselves from. Caliban's War, Chapter Seventeen posted:A metal canister the size of a fist rolled through the gateway, clanking. Amos picked the grenade up casually and tossed it back through the doorway. The detonation lit the room, the report louder than anything Prax had ever heard before. The ringing in his ears redoubled. Caliban's War, Chapter Seventeen posted:“Well now,” Amos said, “that’s loving queer.” Omi: "I think I remember Amos saying this before, and commenting on it before, but given how sex-positive his upbringing was and how sensitive he is towards all kinds of lgbt+ folks, I still find it hard to picture him saying this." Anyway, the room is a lab. People have been ripped apart and blood has sprayed across the ceiling. Some huge bits of lab equipment have been tossed around like toys. Wendell wonders if that was Amos' grenades, but Holden says it probably wasn't. I feel like Wendell would probably know grenades couldn't do that but, hey. They go deeper into the mystery lab, and Prax gets increasingly frantic about Mei possibly being hurt or something bad happening to her. They find an airlock and, just on the other side, a ship is launching. Prax freaks out and beats on the airlock door with his fists, blacks out for a moment, and comes to with Amos carrying him over his shoulder. Suddenly, gunfire - another Pinkwater merc eats it. Like all action in these novels, it's okay - but, in this chapter, it's also basically filler to pad out the word count and create the illusion of things happening. Caliban's War, Chapter Seventeen posted:The woman nodded, but Prax saw something pass over her. Everyone here was losing someone. His tragedy was just one among dozens. Hundreds. Thousands. By the time the cascade had run all the way out, maybe millions. When death grew that large, it stopped meaning anything. He leaned against the nitrogen bath, his head in his hands. He’d been so close. So close… Holden advises that they need to take stock of what's happening. Caliban's War, Chapter Seventeen posted:“We have to drop back ten and punt,” Holden said. “We came here looking for a missing kid. Now we’ve got a covert scientific station halfway to being packed up and shipped out. And a secret landing pad. And whatever third player was fighting with these people while we were.” Wendell says Mei's probably dead. Holden basically agrees. Prax disagrees - after all, Katoa was in this lab, and there's no sign of Mei's body. Meanwhile, Amos is poking through the wreckage and calls for Holden to come and look at something. Caliban's War, Chapter Seventeen posted:Prax pushed away from the nitrogen bath and joined them. There, clinging to the walls of glass that still stood, was a network of fine black filament. Prax couldn’t tell if it was an artificial polymer or a natural substance. Some kind of web. It had a fascinating structure, though. He reached out to touch it and Holden grabbed his wrist, pulling him back so hard it hurt. Caliban's War, Chapter Seventeen posted:When Holden spoke, his words were measured and calm, which only made the panic behind them more terrifying. Kind of a weird chapter, all in all. The opening is pretty strong and the ending is, too. But the middle is just kind of padded out with gunfights, redshirts dying, and descriptions of corridors and lab equipment. Omi had an interesting thought on the ending that I think might've been more interesting, and gone back to Prax's character 'flaw' of 'touch everything' in an interesting way. Omi: "The end of this chapter feels like more of a Holden POV than a Prax POV: we're watching the Roci crew get freaked out by alien goo, not watching Prax watch Holden freak out. I think the moment might've landed harder if Prax was the one who found it, and just kinda held up the cube and went "I don't know what this is."
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Dec 30, 2020 07:12
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prax has always struck me as a dad goon, he probably is a mod on Space Reddit's r/beleterhydro and posts goony pages on how to use extra CO2 in your grows safely or something. also, i'm gonna say in defense of that latest space corridor quote, I really do feel like it would be noticably diffrent to be in occupied space, especially for a belter like prax who would know quite well what semi-functional bare crawlspace is supposed to smell like. like going into an old industrial hallway that's not used very often.
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Jan 1, 2021 03:44
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T-man posted:prax has always struck me as a dad goon, he probably is a mod on Space Reddit's r/beleterhydro and posts goony pages on how to use extra CO2 in your grows safely or something. That's true, and I do like how Prax picks up on the smell of soil in particular. What I've been wondering of late is how these books are constructed. As far as I know, the Corey boys write each perspective separately and pass them back to each other for editing and continuity. What I'm curious about is how much structure they have, how much narrative spine they've put together before writing. Sometimes, it feels like the stories have basically been written in a disconnected void, and then the chapters are kind of slotted in a vaguely chronological order instead of being drafted knowing that the story is telling one story that goes ABABAB, etc. So, it sometimes feels like it creates a few uneven patches, whether that's timelines being out of sync, long stretches between perspectives, or just both Holden and Prax's chapters specifying that, yes, they're in a section of the creepy old tunnels that are inhabited now. Chapter Eighteen: Avasarala We're back with Avasarala. After an expository paragraph about Errinwright's history, they talk about what's happening with Mars (pretty much nothing) and Venus (something, but no one knows what.) So, all in all, no change. Errinwright asks Avasarala what she needs to 'resolve' the Venus situation, especially since the Martian talks have stalled out. He'll even let her retire, if she can figure out what's happening with Venus. I'll borrow some of Omi's thoughts. Omi: "I'm really having trouble staying interested in Avasarala. Her chapters aren't bad, but high-level worldbuilding and exposition isn't where I want to be right now. Holden and Prax's stuff is so effortlessly urgent and engaging that I want to be back in the tunnels watching them freak out about bio-slime. "It also feels like the books have waited too long before getting into what's up with Venus- I was really, really interested at the end of book one, but now that we're maybe 30% through CW it feels like a distant concern." Now, I think it's safe to say that the situation on Venus is supposed to feel distant, but this comes back to what I was rambling about at the start of this post. You've got the Ganymede story, which Holden and Prax and to a lesser extent Bobbie tie into, and then you've got the Avasarala story... which is pretty much just worldbuilding and a window into the halls of UN power. I don't think there's something wrong with switching from a 'holy poo poo' moment to something more mundane, but the intrigue with the Martians remains fairly opaque. Like, the talks have stalled? How, why? Anyway, Avasarala starts wondering if someone - perhaps Nguyen - is pulling strings to get her off the Martian negotiation. She goes down to the Dasihari Lounge, a bar, and runs into Bobbie. A bit more worldbuilding and set description, and a bit more brooding from Avasarala about whoever asked her to get taken off the negotiation. Omi: "Avasarala's meetings feel very performative, which is weird - her grumpy, hardass granny act is an affectation, but I feel that it extends to her thoughts - there should be more hard, almost jarring distinction between the foul-mouthed rear end in a top hat she presents herself as, and the calm, focused puppetmaster she supposedly is." Caliban's War, Chapter Eighteen posted:She sat down next to Draper. The big woman looked over at her. There was a light of recognition in her eyes that boded well. She might not know who Avasarala was, but she’d guessed what she was. Smart, then. Perceptive. And loving hell, the woman was enormous. Not fat either, just... big. So, with the threads finally crossing, Bobbie mentions that she's getting shipped home. Avasarala says that Bobbie's done everything she needed to do - specifically, convinced her that the monster wasn't Martian-made. Avasarala tells her that it wasn't UN-made, either. Bobbie talks about how no one cares about the monster, they just care that it won't upset the balance of power. But Avasarala does and, hey, she's just been told to handle the Venus situation. Close enough. Avasarala says she'll hire Bobbie as her liaison with the Martian military. Bobbie's offers to think about it, and Avasarala has the neat line that she can think about it, sure, providing once she's done thinking she comes and works for her. After that, she heads back to her apartment, thinks about how she misses her husband and how Bobbie is her connection to Mars, but she'll need more. A man named Ameer calls her, and he's an analyst with news from Ganymede. Holden's met up with a local scientist named Prax who, unsurprisingly, has no known connections to the OPA or any political group. Omi: "Avasarala's chapters have a habit of going on for just a bit too long. I was ready to be done after her meeting with Bobbie, so switching over to news about Holden and Prax feels like we're accelerating from a dead stop again." Ameer continues with that Holden, Meng, and Burton have armed up, linked up with a bunch of Pinkwater goons, and they seem to have figured this out in the space of about forty minutes. Whoever is on-site mentioned that Holden and his group have gone through the mystery door, and Avasarala has a funny moment where she's like what door, where is it, how big is it? Omi: "...how the hell did the overburdened security forces on Ganymede figure out that Holden hired a team of obscure hobo mercenaries and raided a secret lair in 41 minutes? These are the same people who've spent weeks failing to notice dozens of missing children." Then, this: Caliban's War, Chapter Eighteen posted:So the OPA had something on Ganymede. Maybe something they’d put there, maybe something they’d found. Either way, this mysterious door made things a degree more interesting. While Ameer read through and digested the new update, Avasarala scratched the back of her hand and reevaluated her position. She’d thought Holden was there as an observer. Forward intelligence. That might be wrong. If he’d gone to meet with this Praxidike Meng, this utterly under-the-radar botanist, the OPA might already know quite a bit about Bobbie Draper’s monster. Add the fact that Holden’s boss had the only known sample of the protomolecule, and a narrative about the Ganymede collapse began to take shape. Anyway, Ameer says that there's also been a firefight between Holden and someone else. Avasarala is like, what the gently caress, I thought those tunnels were supposed to be unused, and it seems like the UN intelligence is really bad at their jobs because Ameer keeps saying that whoever's on the ground basically didn't include any details on anything. Avasarala notes that whatever she says will be an hour and a half behind. So, she gives the order for bring in Holden, Burton, and everyone else. All of them. Now. Avasarala decides to spend the next hour and a half researching Praxidike Meng and why he matters, and that's where we end, with the stories about to converge. It's another one of the weaker chapters, really. I don't really have much to say about it beyond what I've said. The talks between Mars and Earth were always this weird pantomime that carried on a little bit too long. Bobbie and Avasarala getting on the same page was overdue, and having it happen in a bar was a bit drab (compare, for example, to the TV series.) Avasarala wanting Holden and his pals brought in is a good hook into the next chapter but I wonder how differently it would've played out had Avasarala given the order the moment she saw through the beard. It's all a little too convenient, I think. Imagine if the UN forces had kicked in the door just as Holden found the protomolecule, y'know? Wouldn't that add a little wrinkle! Maybe the UN is in on it - but then you get the Avasarala chapter that adds a bit of context, and so on.
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Jan 4, 2021 04:12
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Oh hey, stupid thought that just occurred to me reading your writeup: this is a little hollywood, but what if instead of whatever the gently caress her new job was, Bobbie was hired explicitly to extract Prax and/or Holden? Like, Avasarala goes "poo poo's hosed and I don't wanna get stuck with the bill- Bobbie, how would you like to get paid to fly to Ganymede with some muscle and kidnap a dude off the books?" Then Bobbie can arrive, realize it's about the protomolecule, team up with Holden, and all three governments can start calling their respective Holden-adjacent operatives and going "What the gently caress is going on over there??"
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Jan 4, 2021 16:09
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It'd be interesting, but I don't think it'd be workable without changing up the timeline and such. For example, while I don't know how long it takes to go from Earth to Ganymede, I assume it's at least a week or so. But in a scenario where the situation felt more desperate for all parties involved instead of 'I guess the talks are deadlocked, oh well ' something like that could be fun. Maybe Errinwright is like 'Who cares about Venus? Mars has a hundred battleships leering in our direction' while Avasarala sees that the talks are just sabre-rattling or something. I think that's kind of my issue with Avasarala's stuff. While Holden and Prax have their plots that I find pretty enjoyable to read about again, even if I think they can be rough at times, Avasarala (and Bobbie, really) doesn't have the same energy. Maybe it's deliberate, to have two characters who are running around and getting into gunfights and shouting at people and two others who are doing the Mars-Earth Worldbuilding Tour, it just means I end up going 'Yeah, some of this is neat - but what's happening on Ganymede?' The talks feel like the Corey boys needed a way to get Avasarala and Bobbie in the same locale, but also didn't want the talks to distract from the adventure. Hence why it's a bit strange that Earth and Mars are basically on the same page - and then the talks immediately deadlock because of the 'balance of power' and Avasarala gets pushed off them while Bobbie is just about sent home. Milkfred E. Moore fucked around with this message at 23:17 on Jan 4, 2021 |
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Jan 4, 2021 23:15
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Bobby's still a Martian Marine, on contract, subject to military discipline, all that good stuff. She can't just go off on an adventure to the outer solar system because the assistant to the assistant to the vice president of a foreign power asked her to, both legally and in her own head. She's starting to have the crisis of faith but she's not in "yeah gently caress it I'm a free agent now" territory, she just went outside to get a cup of coffee.
Crazycryodude fucked around with this message at 23:58 on Jan 4, 2021 |
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Jan 4, 2021 23:49
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Hmm, this is a lot less feasible than even my original flawed idea, but I'm wondering if there would've been some way to put the UN stuff on Ganymede instead of Earth. It would require removing Avasarala and a lot of the military brass, since senior leadership wouldn't get anywhere near that mess, but I could see Bobbie being part of, say, a multi-planetary crisis response task force that was sent to figure out what the heck is going on. Either way I think the core point we're all hammering at is inertia: it simply takes too long to get the not-Holden pieces into position, and that's something that I think could've been resolved with some story wrangling early in the writing process.
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Jan 5, 2021 01:24
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Chapter Nineteen: Holden We pick up right where Prax's last chapter ended off. Like, exact same line of dialogue. It was italicised completely in Prax's chapter, but only the 'right now' is in Holden's perspective. It doesn't strike me as being really representative of anything. Caliban's War, Chapter Nineteen posted:All around Holden, the black filaments spread, a dark spider’s web with him at the center. He was on Eros again. He was seeing thousands of bodies turning into something else. He thought he’d made it off, but Eros just kept coming. He and Miller had gotten out, but it got Miller anyway. Now it was back for him. I mean, this very chapter compares the icy walls in that way later on. Holden freaks out for a little bit but everyone else is fairly calm. We do get some reminders from Holden of the kind of crazy poo poo he saw on Eros, which is nice, but it's described as "running too quickly to make sense, like a video played at high speed" which must be one of the weakest similes I can remember reading of late. Holden shouts at Naomi to bring the Roci in. Holden stresses to Wendell that they have to bail out right now. Amos interrupts Holden's freak-out by pointing out that it's not like Eros: no radiation, no zombies, etc. Holden figures Amos is right, apologises to Naomi, gives Wendell the key for the Somnambulist, and they leave the base. Holden basically spends the time freaking out how it may, in fact, be worse than Eros. Caliban's War, Chapter Nineteen posted:Eight rems burning off Jupiter onto the surface of Ganymede. Even with the magnetosphere, eight rems a day. How quickly would the protomolecule grow here, with Jupiter endlessly supplying the energy? Eros had become something frighteningly powerful once the protomolecule had taken hold. Something that could accelerate at incredible speeds without inertia. Something that could, if the reports were right, change the very atmosphere and chemical composition of Venus. And that was with just over a million human hosts and a thousand trillion tons of rocky mass to work with at the beginning. Holden tells Naomi that, if anything happens to them, not to go back to Tycho. He wonders about how he's been helping Fred enact this mad science plan, and how he'd missed out on doing so much - like taking Naomi to meet his parents and have a child. Holden sums himself up as Fred's "leg breaker." Caliban's War, Chapter Nineteen posted:Holden had spent a year playing enforcer to Fred’s politician. He’d hunted ships and killed them for Fred’s grand OPA government experiment. He’d changed the man he’d been into the man he was now, because some part of him believed in Fred’s dream of the liberated and self-governed outer planets. It feels a little strange, because as far as we know, Holden's just been blowing up pirates. And even then, in the first chapter, he manages to do it without killing anyone. And while we've seen Holden being a bit of a dick so far, a bit on edge, has any of it been that unreasonable? Perhaps the most obvious one is when he just about pulled a gun on the Mao-Kwik merc and Naomi told him off, but everything else? I do think now that we should've seen the briefing scene between Fred and Holden, if only to give Holden more dots to join during his conspiracy bender. So, Holden mentally swears vengeance on Fred. He wonders why the people of Ganymede haven't been infected yet if the protomolecule was loose. When they reach the Somnambulist, they get jumped by five Earthers in armor with no markings. The shootout does not go well for Holden. The Pinkwaters promptly surrender when more Earthers show up, Amos gets shot in the back of the head, and Holden and the Pinkwaters are promptly black-bagged. Dun dun! I don't think there's much to say about this chapter. It's good, it builds on what we know in a way that feels reasonable, and the core beats are all fine, even if I think it's too long for what it is. I like the immediate tie-back to Avasarala's orders to bring him in even if a part of me is wondering about the time sequencing. Omi and I were basically echoing each other's thoughts.
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Jan 6, 2021 12:11
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Chapter Twenty: Bobbie It really is curious how some of these chapters throw in a few paragraphs before hitting the point where the chapter begins. For example, I feel like this one you could cut until where Bobbie steps into Thorsson's office. But I'm getting ahead of myself: we're joining Bobbie as she has returned to the suite of offices shared by the Martian delegation. In true Expanse fashion, it's a lot of description. It's not really necessary at all. Turns out, the offices are ridiculously extravagant, not just for Earth, but for Mars especially. But this is all stuff we learned about the UN offices in Avasarala's chapters, because I remember commenting on the real wood stuff. I think I've mentioned before, but I'm going to reiterate it if so, that I can only assume that the Coreys begin their chapters like this to ease the audience into each perspective switch. It happens enough now that it has to be deliberate, although it seems to be way more of an Abraham thing than a Franck thing. Anyway, Bobbie's paying a visit to Thorsson. He says he's overreacted and is willing to accept the blame for her outburst. Caliban's War, Chapter Twenty posted:“Ah,” Bobbie said. There was a framed photograph on the wall behind Thorsson of a city with a tall metal structure in the foreground. It looked like an archaic rocket gantry. The caption read PARIS. Thorsson says that Bobbie won't be sent home. Bobbie asks why she's here. Bobbie thinks that she wants to get sent back to Mars to get sent to Ganymede, which is somewhat interesting. Bobbie tries to press to get sent home anyway, but Thorsson basically tells her she's here to follow orders - what he says goes. Then Martens shows up. It feels a little typical at this point, like we have to have both Thorsson and Martens in a Bobbie chapter. Bobbie tells him she's leaving. Martens hopes they part friends and that it won't ruin their career. Then, Bobbie goes and takes the Avasarala job. Caliban's War, Chapter Twenty posted:There was something liberating and terrifying about the first day on a new job. In any new assignment, Bobbie had always had the unsettling feeling that she was in over her head, that she wouldn’t know how to do any of the things they would ask her to do, that she would dress wrong or say the wrong thing, or that everyone would hate her. But no matter how strong that feeling was, it was overshadowed by the sense that with a new job came the chance to totally recreate herself in whatever image she chose, that—at least for a little while—her options were infinite. Omi: "How would Bobbie know this? Isn't this only the second job she's ever had? (I assumed she joined the marines right out of school.)" As far as I know, that's correct. I won't say I'm an expert on Bobbie's history but, as far as I'm aware, she came from a military family and joined the military because such service is compulsory on Mars and has been doing it for the whole of her life. So, it feels a little strange for Bobbie's concern to be so... civilian. Sure, that's how I've felt during my first day on a new job, but I've also never been a badass Martian marine. I've never served, so, I may be entirely wrong, but I operate under the assumption that you get trained to do the things you're asked to do, you're given the clothes to wear, you're trained what to say and when to say it, and so on. I can understand that such an anxiety is a normal thing for people to think, but I feel like it'd be more interesting if it better illustrated the difference between Bobbie the marine (who knows that for most of her life everything has been drilled into her) and the realization that she was walking into a civilian job where she wouldn't have that comfort. Anyway, now Bobbie is in Avasarala's office. It's not as nice as the Martian office. Bobbie imagines Avasarala like a child's doll and it's a little weird. Omi felt it made it feel like a weird sketch comedy, wondering if it was a sign of Bobbie's anxieties, or if Avasarala really looks like that. Avasarala and Soren have a bit of back and forth for a bit. It's entertaining enough, but... Caliban's War, Chapter Twenty posted:“Yes, ma’am,” Soren said. “But I was wondering whether you should alert the security service about your decision to clear the sergeant. They do like to be in the loop on that kind of thing.” Omi: "I know this is supposed to be friendly banter, but the way Avasarala interacts with Soren is hosed up - dude deserves better." And when Soren talks about it to Bobbie: Caliban's War, Chapter Twenty posted:“Don’t worry about it. The thing is, my whole job is making her”—he jerked his head toward the closed door—“calm and happy. With her, everything’s top priority. And so nothing is, you know? I’ll do it when it needs doing. Until then, the bitch can bark a little if it makes her feel happy.” And, like, I know where the story goes with Soren and Avasarala - but I still don't think it was a good usage by the Coreys. I've mentioned how I didn't really like Amos' usage of 'queer' but that's more because I don't think it fits the setting or character. This is a different issue. I'd be curious to see what other people think! Similar to what Omi said before, I get the impression that Soren and Avasarala have friendly banter. That line isn't really that. And, again, I know where they go with Soren, but I still don't think it works. If they want to make us dislike Soren, or even just have a shade of it for what comes later, having him throw slurs around is a really cheap and nasty way of doing it. Later that night, Bobbie gets woken up by surprise music. Soren's called her at 0400 so Avasarala can expect her at 0700. After a bit of 'what has my life become' musing, she goes to Avasarala's office and Errinwright is there having an 'intense conversation' with her. Avasarala asks Bobbie to loving liaise and call her people. Why? Because Ganymede's gone hot again, and Earth and Mars are now at war. Dun dun! Omi and I both really like how this ties everything to Holden and really gets the four characters into the same story, it just might've been nicer had it happened before Chapter 20 of 54.
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Jan 8, 2021 09:36
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