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I would be very, very surprised to see any tertiary characters like Hurin make anything more than a token appearance. If we were getting old school 20+ episode seasons, maybe, but if they're cramming 2 books into 10-13 episodes we'll be lucky to see many characters beyond our heroes at all. I'm pretty interested to see what a streamlined tv plot of the books is going to look like, but it's probably not going to cover anything beyond the high points. I'm cool with that, but I'm already bracing for the backlash that is going to burst out. The fact that people actually got mad about Thom playing a guitar instead of a harp does not bode well for how fans are going to handle the adaptation process.
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Dec 31, 2020 14:12
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Would surprise me if Julin makes it in. I skipped books 7-10 in my listening tour of the books but in 1-6 and KoD so far Julin doesn’t do anything interesting other than be backup for better characters. They could just have Mat go into the Stone alone and Thom do everything with Nynaeve and Elayne. Hurin at least has the interesting sniffing talent to distinguish him.
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Dec 31, 2020 15:41
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Honestly if there's one "unfilmable" aspect of this series it's the sheer number of characters. Look at any prestige TV show's credits and you see like two pages of named roles. WoT would have to cast like ten times that many just to keep the concurrent story threads going, or else cut major subplots altogether.
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Dec 31, 2020 16:01
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Even Jordan couldn’t handle all the characters he made and it was hard to remember all the bit players. A tv show has no chance in hell.
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Dec 31, 2020 16:20
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If for no other reason that, in a book, adding a character is free. In a TV show you have to pay someone, a lot
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Dec 31, 2020 16:28
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A character like Hurin who does a lot in one book and then disappears forever (ignoring the very end) is basically fine - shows can have characters who have a lot to do for a season then disappear or die off. The problem is characters like Juilin who don't do much but are just around for 10+ books. And Juilin is actually not that minor a character compared to lots of others, like the 10,000 Aes Sedai we're somehow supposed to all keep track of.
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Dec 31, 2020 16:47
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i'll have you know, i have very fond memories of all 4 paragraphs that aes sedai #3709 is involved in
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Dec 31, 2020 16:59
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Johnny Joestar posted:i'll have you know, i have very fond memories of all 4 paragraphs that aes sedai #3709 is involved in I bought the WoT Companion, and my favorite references are to characters that never even get a name.
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Dec 31, 2020 17:05
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Ani posted:A character like Hurin who does a lot in one book and then disappears forever (ignoring the very end) is basically fine - shows can have characters who have a lot to do for a season then disappear or die off. The problem is characters like Juilin who don't do much but are just around for 10+ books. And Juilin is actually not that minor a character compared to lots of others, like the 10,000 Aes Sedai we're somehow supposed to all keep track of. Ultimately, for someone like Juilin you probably need to either write him out after his big betrayal/redemption arc in The Dragon Reborn or you need to increase his role somehow. That's what they seem to be doing with Logain....increasing his role in the first season, at least.
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Dec 31, 2020 17:24
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jng2058 posted:Ultimately, for someone like Juilin you probably need to either write him out after his big betrayal/redemption arc in The Dragon Reborn or you need to increase his role somehow. That's what they seem to be doing with Logain....increasing his role in the first season, at least.
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Dec 31, 2020 18:22
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jng2058 posted:Ultimately, for someone like Juilin you probably need to either write him out after his big betrayal/redemption arc in The Dragon Reborn or you need to increase his role somehow. That's what they seem to be doing with Logain....increasing his role in the first season, at least. His arc is that he gets mind controlled and then decides to help mat because he feels bad approximately 10 pages later. Agree that the wise woman works perfectly well (or just have the BA wait in their room at some inn). I think RJ just liked writing about his conical hat.
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Dec 31, 2020 18:29
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buffalo all day posted:His arc is that he gets mind controlled and then decides to help mat because he feels bad approximately 10 pages later. Agree that the wise woman works perfectly well (or just have the BA wait in their room at some inn). What was Nynaeve's opinion on that? She never said.
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Dec 31, 2020 19:01
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Juilin is too important to cut. You need him at a minimum from his appearance in TDR to the girls arriving in Salidar. Hurin on the other hand is a character I feel you could quite easily cut without it being much of a loss.
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Dec 31, 2020 19:07
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The Lord Bude posted:Juilin is too important to cut. You need him at a minimum from his appearance in TDR to the girls arriving in Salidar. Hurin on the other hand is a character I feel you could quite easily cut without it being much of a loss. I agree here. Juilin wasn't a major character, but if they keep the supergirls searching in Ebou Dar, he's a big part of that with him and Thom going out every day and getting progressively more beaten up. He's fun, Hurin wouldn't fit in the gathering information part of that book, and just dumping him altogether just doesn't sit right with me. They could easily keep him for the parts where he's searching with Thom, and then have him head off after that. They'd still be able to get a decent actor, as he'd be in a chunk of the season but wouldn't have to keep him forever. Hell, get the guy with the fez from the first Wonder Woman movie. He's not a huge name actor, but he's pretty good and fits the description of Juilin. Hurin is the guy they have to bring back 8 books later for a 30 second conversation with Rand, and you know that'll get cut because they won't be able to keep the actor. I think they do need him at the beginning though, to show that there's some weird poo poo out there that's happening and he's an interesting character.
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Dec 31, 2020 19:17
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The Lord Bude posted:Juilin is too important to cut. You need him at a minimum from his appearance in TDR to the girls arriving in Salidar. Hurin on the other hand is a character I feel you could quite easily cut without it being much of a loss.
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Dec 31, 2020 19:19
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There are a million other opportunities for Rand to be disgruntled about becoming a lord and leading.
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Dec 31, 2020 19:21
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The Lord Bude posted:Juilin is too important to cut. You need him at a minimum from his appearance in TDR to the girls arriving in Salidar. Hurin on the other hand is a character I feel you could quite easily cut without it being much of a loss. Hurin and Juilin are both more prevalent than the thread is giving credit for at the moment.
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Dec 31, 2020 19:22
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Given that whole thing with Juilin and Amathera that happens in the later books, you could just have the two of them get together at the end of The Shadow Rising instead and leave the series together at that point. 
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Dec 31, 2020 19:23
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jng2058 posted:Ultimately, for someone like Juilin you probably need to either write him out after his big betrayal/redemption arc in The Dragon Reborn or you need to increase his role somehow. That's what they seem to be doing with Logain....increasing his role in the first season, at least. I’m excited for an increased presence for Logain. He could fill a role close to Asmodean, trying to teach Rand without being able to see what’s happening or use his powers. He could fill a half antagonistic role as well, the “is he actually a good guy?” thing. And he could be a great foil to Moiraine, especially with his feelings about the Tower.
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Dec 31, 2020 22:31
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Losing Hurin and his sniffing would be a great loss. Strange oowers nobody can explain are a great part of the series.
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Dec 31, 2020 22:40
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Gnoman posted:Losing Hurin and his sniffing would be a great loss. Strange oowers nobody can explain are a great part of the series. It does help normalize Min a bit, as well as the people who can see ta'varen. There's someone out there who has this odd power the Aes Sedai don't understand, but it's definitely not the Power.
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Jan 1, 2021 07:23
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There’s also a super old magic treant guarding a saidar well. We see that kind of being once and it’s never brought up again. I wonder if they throw that into the TV show.
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Jan 1, 2021 08:12
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seaborgium posted:It does help normalize Min a bit, as well as the people who can see ta'varen. There's someone out there who has this odd power the Aes Sedai don't understand, but it's definitely not the Power. Hell, it helps normalize Perrin for the same reasons.
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Jan 1, 2021 08:25
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Invalid Validation posted:There’s also a super old magic treant guarding a saidar well. We see that kind of being once and it’s never brought up again. I wonder if they throw that into the TV show. You see them in book #4, during the flashback in the crystal pillars. They were a creation of the Age of Legends and, like most things from the AoL, have disappeared since its passing.
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Jan 1, 2021 08:30
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I remember reading these books as a teenager and getting mindblown around book five but I don't remember a drat thing anymore, except all the casting choices for the show look exactly how I pictured most of the characters I remember, even though they're mostly anodyne "actor" photos. Going to start with EotW and get back on this motherfuckin train, see you in like 4 billion years when I have some ready baked hot takes.
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Jan 2, 2021 03:18
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perc2 posted:I remember reading these books as a teenager and getting mindblown around book five but I don't remember a drat thing anymore, except all the casting choices for the show look exactly how I pictured most of the characters I remember, even though they're mostly anodyne "actor" photos. Going to start with EotW and get back on this motherfuckin train, see you in like 4 billion years when I have some ready baked hot takes. Live read for us, goon! Doesn't have to be much, just some thoughts after each book. We love poo poo like that around here!
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Jan 2, 2021 03:37
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as someone who read through 9-10 of the books as a kid and came back later over the course of last year to reread the whole series and catch up on the ones i'd never read, it was definitely worth it. there's some warts here and there, but nothing really all that bad considering that pretty much any expansive sci-fi/fantasy series is due to have some. sanderson did a good job finishing up given the task in front of him.
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Jan 2, 2021 05:13
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I only had Book 5 for the longest time when I was 11. I read that thing like 3 times before going onto Lord of Chaos. I really really loved it, but man oh man did my imagination fill in the spaces. Like I thiught Rand fought God in Heaven in the earlier books lol
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Jan 3, 2021 22:22
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Looking at an article from 2016: In the "Game of Thrones" TV series there are 553 listed cast members. That number includes uncredited roles, like "pit fight #1," but doesn't factor in extras. 2,103 mentioned characters in the books 52 "Main Characters" in the show I think if we get a similar level of depth of adaption to what they did with GoT there will be room for the Juilins and Hurins to stay. If the show actually makes it to the later seasons/books I'm confident that means the show turned out to be a hit and actors for characters like Hurin will be begging to come back for a 30 second bit part after not appearing for 6 seasons.
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Jan 5, 2021 21:33
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Late-series spoilers: I reread the Prologue, and there's an interesting parallel. Lews Therin flees from the accusing eyes of his kin, and much much later, Rand flees from his father's eyes.
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Jan 8, 2021 08:25
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Hmmm... Egwene al'Vere is an obvious allusion to Guinevere. Is there an equivalent to Nynaeve al'Meara?
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Jan 9, 2021 12:34
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Comrade Blyatlov posted:Hmmm... Egwene al'Vere is an obvious allusion to Guinevere. Is there an equivalent to Nynaeve al'Meara? Looking at women in Arthurian legend, the only one I could think of was Nimue, the Lady of the Lake, but that didn't seem close enough. However it turned out there actually are a lot of variant names given including Ninianne/Viviane, which seemed closer. Long story short: wikipedia posted:The form Nimue, in which the letter e can be written as ë or é, has been popularized by Thomas Malory's Le Morte d'Arthur and itself has several variations: in William Caxton's edition, her name appears as Nymue, Nyneue and Nynyue, but it had been rather Nynyve (predominantly) and Nenyve in Malory's original Winchester Manuscript. And one of Lan's several titles is Lord of the Lakes, so there you go, seems to fit. Also if you go through the very, very lengthy List_of_Arthurian_characters, you'll find like
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Jan 9, 2021 13:20
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"Mara and the three foolish kings" - Mary Magdalena and the three wise men?
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Jan 10, 2021 21:53
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"Abruptly the flow of words and the juggling alike stopped. Thom simply snatched the balls from the air and stopped talking. Unnoticed by Rand, Moiraine had joined the listeners. Lan was at her shoulder, though he had to look twice to see the man. For a moment Thom looked at Moiraine sideways, his face and body still except for making the balls disappear into his capacious coat sleeves. Then he bowed to her, holding his cloak wide. “Your pardon, but you are surely not from this district?”" Yeah.... he knows full well who she is, and he knows that she knows who he is. I don't think Thom is ever caught flat-footed like that again. Lol she keeps calling him Master Bard. She knows.
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Jan 10, 2021 22:00
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Taringail was Moiraine's half-brother. Thom's already on uneasy terms with Aes Sedai in general, having Moiraine herself show up in the sticks?quote:I don't think Thom is ever caught flat-footed like that again. Pretty sure you're correct!
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Jan 11, 2021 00:03
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No...no, there's definitely at least one time later on when he nearly misses a ball juggling or a line of a poem. I forget the details though. Feel like it was in TGH when Rand shows up or something.
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Jan 11, 2021 00:29
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silvergoose posted:No...no, there's definitely at least one time later on when he nearly misses a ball juggling or a line of a poem. I forget the details though. Feel like it was in TGH when Rand shows up or something. Nope, he'd already finished the tale he was telling, and his entire reaction there was widened eyes and a nod. When Mat meets up with him in TDR he's in the middle of telling a story and "almost" stops. Still not quite the same level as him seeing Moiraine. VAGENDA OF MANOCIDE fucked around with this message at 01:20 on Jan 11, 2021 |
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Jan 11, 2021 01:08
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VAGENDA OF MANOCIDE posted:Nope, he'd already finished the tale he was telling, and his entire reaction there was widened eyes and a nod. Hmmmm. Yeah those were the ones I was thinking of I guess. He good.
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Jan 11, 2021 02:37
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I'm going on the record as saying that Thom, in fact, fucks.
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Jan 11, 2021 02:42
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silvergoose posted:Hmmmm. Also in TDR he's depressed and drinking a lot I think, I'm pretty sure that's his lowest point which is why he's even in Tar Valon.
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Jan 11, 2021 09:13
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