Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Post
  • Reply
DurianGray
Dec 23, 2010

King of Fruits

adaz posted:

I finally finished reading the Daevabad trilogy over vacation. For those who are interested in Arabic fantasy, Djinn's and a pretty decent story I'd recommend it! The only real trying part was a uh, very long love triangle between the 3 main characters and the end book had a whole lot of REDEMPTION ARK in it. It was still a pretty good yarn though.

It also made me hungry as the author (S. A Chakraborty ) is a fine cook herself based on her twitter and there's a lot of food smells and imagery in the book and all I wanted to do was bury my head in mediterrean/Egyptian cooking after reading it.

Besides the love triangle, how would you say the pacing is in the other two books? I read the first one and for me at least it fell into good-but-not-great territory, and I've been putting off on the second because the first book felt reeeaallly slow to me (I actually already have the third book because I got it for like $2 just knowing the trilogy was popular, but I'd need to acquire the second one myself as my library doesn't have it).

(Also, if you like stories with Djinn you should check out some of the Dead Djinn Universe stuff by P. Djčlí Clark if you haven't already.)

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

PeterWeller
Apr 21, 2003

I told you that story so I could tell you this one.

Nomnom Cookie posted:

I wanna see your reading list because with the kind of books i usually read, a space tree teleporting around to deliver a virus that kills the immortality-granting parasites distributed by the catholic church and created by AI to steal our bodily fluids/cpu cycles is pretty weird. If you ask me to describe Rise of Endymion in one word I'll say "weird". Three words and I'll say "weird and boring", so I dunno about recommending it, but still. Weird.

The sequels are still weird, sure, but I don't get the same sense of wonder from them. All those ingredients you mention are in Hyperion but not so spelled out. For example, the Cruciform Parasite was a lot more interesting and wondrous to me when it was some strange phenomenon or organism and not just another device made by the evil AI.

grassy gnoll
Aug 27, 2006

The pawsting business is tough work.

General Battuta posted:

Sixteen Ways to Imagine You Are Siri Keeton

How to Pretend You Are Conscious and Get Away With It.

Alternatively, Sixteen Ways to Imagine You Are Siri Keeton Sixteen Ways to Imagine You Are Siri Keeton.

anilEhilated
Feb 17, 2014

But I say fuck the rain.

Grimey Drawer

DurianGray posted:

(Also, if you like stories with Djinn you should check out some of the Dead Djinn Universe stuff by P. Djčlí Clark if you haven't already.)
Any particular recommendations? Never heard of this author and the premises sound pretty interesting.

DurianGray
Dec 23, 2010

King of Fruits

anilEhilated posted:

Any particular recommendations? Never heard of this author and the premises sound pretty interesting.

In that particular series, I've only read The Haunting of Tram Car 015 so far (novella length, and from what I gather a little bit of a standalone) but it was a lot of fun, and I've been meaning to pick up more in the series based on just that entry point.

I've also read some of Clark's other short stories and nonfiction and he's very good in general, I'd say. He also wrote the horror novel Ring Shout that has been getting some really good press since it came out last year (and I've been meaning to read that, too).

Ben Nevis
Jan 20, 2011

DurianGray posted:

In that particular series, I've only read The Haunting of Tram Car 015 so far (novella length, and from what I gather a little bit of a standalone) but it was a lot of fun, and I've been meaning to pick up more in the series based on just that entry point.

I've also read some of Clark's other short stories and nonfiction and he's very good in general, I'd say. He also wrote the horror novel Ring Shout that has been getting some really good press since it came out last year (and I've been meaning to read that, too).

Ring Shout was good.

New Djinn one is Master of Djinn, though I've not read it yet.

Also, the nominal first is a short available online at https://www.tor.com/2016/05/18/a-dead-djinn-in-cairo/

Ben Nevis fucked around with this message at 20:50 on Jul 14, 2021

Bayham Badger
Jan 19, 2007

Secretly force socialism, communism and imperialism types of government onto the people of the United States of America.

pradmer posted:


Middlegame by Seanan McGuire - $2.99
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07HF2ZK75/


The City in the Middle of the Night by Charlie Jane Anders - $2.99
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07FJZDJ8Y/

These in particular caught my eye when I saw them on sale - anyone have opinions either way towards them?

Stuporstar
May 5, 2008

Where do fists come from?

DurianGray posted:

In that particular series, I've only read The Haunting of Tram Car 015 so far (novella length, and from what I gather a little bit of a standalone) but it was a lot of fun, and I've been meaning to pick up more in the series based on just that entry point.

I've also read some of Clark's other short stories and nonfiction and he's very good in general, I'd say. He also wrote the horror novel Ring Shout that has been getting some really good press since it came out last year (and I've been meaning to read that, too).

Ring Shout is seriously great if you’re after a novel where KKK members turn into literal monsters and are put down like the rabid dogs they are.

I’ve read all Clark’s Djinn series as well, including the new novel. I suggest reading the short A Dead Djinn in Cairo before the novel Master of Djinn, since it introduces the protagonist Fatma and establishes a lot of concepts in the novel. I think the short story is still available to read for free on Tor.com.

Also he started using more colloquial Egyptian in Master of Djinn and I enjoyed seeing him using a bunch of Egyptian Arabic words I’ve learned as well :allears: The novel is great.

E. or as Ben linked

Ben Nevis posted:

Ring Shout was good.

New Djinn one is Master of Djinn, though I've not read it yet.

Also, the nominal first is a short available online at https://www.tor.com/2016/05/18/a-dead-djinn-in-cairo/

DurianGray posted:

Besides the love triangle, how would you say the pacing is in the other two books? I read the first one and for me at least it fell into good-but-not-great territory, and I've been putting off on the second because the first book felt reeeaallly slow to me (I actually already have the third book because I got it for like $2 just knowing the trilogy was popular, but I'd need to acquire the second one myself as my library doesn't have it).

(Also, if you like stories with Djinn you should check out some of the Dead Djinn Universe stuff by P. Djčlí Clark if you haven't already.)

I’d say the pacing remains the same throughout, but politics becomes more prominent in the second book while the romance is almost snuffed out and left to smoulder like an untended coal in the fireplace. As someone who enjoyed the romance, I was a little disappointed by the end of the trilogy in that respect, but everything else was interesting and cool enough to make up for it.

Also I just started reading The Hidden Palace, which is Helene Wecker’s recently released sequel to The Golemn and the Djinni, and it looks promising so far. Definitely slow-paced slice of life kinda thing from multiple povs and less a ripping adventure than Master of Djinn, but I’m good with either.

adaz
Mar 7, 2009

DurianGray posted:

Besides the love triangle, how would you say the pacing is in the other two books? I read the first one and for me at least it fell into good-but-not-great territory, and I've been putting off on the second because the first book felt reeeaallly slow to me (I actually already have the third book because I got it for like $2 just knowing the trilogy was popular, but I'd need to acquire the second one myself as my library doesn't have it).

(Also, if you like stories with Djinn you should check out some of the Dead Djinn Universe stuff by P. Djčlí Clark if you haven't already.)

Pacing was better, the 2nd book dragged for the first half then picked up without issues, the last book honestly had TOO much crammed into it but was way better.

Tbh it was your standard trilogy that could've used a few hundred page cut.

Stuporstar
May 5, 2008

Where do fists come from?

adaz posted:

Pacing was better, the 2nd book dragged for the first half then picked up without issues, the last book honestly had TOO much crammed into it but was way better.

Tbh it was your standard trilogy that could've used a few hundred page cut.

I thought everything with Sobek was super cool in the 3rd book

fritz
Jul 26, 2003

Stuporstar posted:

Ring Shout is seriously great if you’re after a novel where KKK members turn into literal monsters and are put down like the rabid dogs they are.

Bad analogy, rabid dogs should be put down compassionately and humanely.

buffalo all day
Mar 13, 2019

fritz posted:

Bad analogy, rabid dogs should be put down compassionately and humanely.

cardinale
Jul 11, 2016

Stuporstar posted:

I thought everything with Sobek was super cool in the 3rd book

Yeah that guy was rad!

DurianGray
Dec 23, 2010

King of Fruits
Oh cool, thanks all! That definitely makes me feel more motivated to pick up the second book.

And more motivated to read more stuff by Clark.

I was down to just 50~ books in my to-read pile, so it was getting low :getin:

I wish I was kidding but 50 books will only last me until about December at the rate I've been reading...

Ccs
Feb 25, 2011


The book equivalent of this is reading KJ Parker novels

https://mobile.twitter.com/ryxcommar/status/1415482443470082049

quantumfoam
Dec 25, 2003

Still doing the SFL Archives readthrough, it's extreeeeeeemely slow going.
Essays are being dropped on reviewing tv-show episodes, which is painful. Seemingly every 2nd kindle page I hit that's not tv-episode reviews has been something I have to bookmark. Collecting the names of the many long forgotten books and tv-series is tricky effort vs payoff; for example who the hell remembers that a tv show called PROFILER once existed on american network tv? Or that people deeply deeply cared about the minutiae of Harry Turtledove's cut-n-paste <WHAT IF> scenario stories.

wizzardstaff
Apr 6, 2018

Zorch! Splat! Pow!

quantumfoam posted:

for example who the hell remembers that a tv show called PROFILER once existed on american network tv?

I do! She had a psychic ability to read criminals' minds and some sort of relationship with a serial killer named Jack. Also they did a crossover episode with The Pretender which was big news.

quantumfoam
Dec 25, 2003

wizzardstaff posted:

I do! She had a psychic ability to read criminals' minds and some sort of relationship with a serial killer named Jack. Also they did a crossover episode with The Pretender which was big news.

Thanks. People like you are why I started making those mega-lists at the beginning of every SFL Archives readthrough update a while ago. Some things get mentioned repeatedly in long-lasting threads, others are one-off requests for discussion. Here's the listing of almost every (I skip over anything posted about by the Leeper idiots) tv-show/movie/radioshow or book mentioned in SFL Archives Vol 21b.

Movies, television shows referenced: INDEPENDENCE DAY, RED DWARF (tv-series), POLTERGEIST THE LEGACY (tv-series), SLIDERS (tv-series), NEVERWHERE (tv-series), OUTER LIMITS (tv-series), PHENOMENON, THE NUTTY PROFESSOR 1996, OSIRIS CHRONICLES, BARB WIRE, MULTIPLICITY, THE FRIGHTENERS, ERASER, THE VISITORS, THE FIFTH ELEMENT, HUNCHBACK OF NOTRE DAME 1996, DARK SKIES (tv-series), WARPED IN SPACE, SWAMP THING (tv-series), XENA WARRIOR PRINCESS, FOREVER KNIGHT (tv-series), HOMEBOYS FROM OUTER SPACE (tv-series), THE ARRIVAL, ESCAPE FROM L.A., ISLAND OF DR MOREAU 1996, THE PRINCESS BRIDE, THE REAL ADVENTURES OF JONNY QUEST (tv-series), BONE CHILLERS (tv-series), MR STITCH, SPACE JAM 1, LOST IN SPACE 1998, THE CAPE 1996 (tv-series), BOGUS, THE CROW 2, THE PRETENDER (tv-series), STAR TREK DEEP SPACE NINE (tv-series), BABYLON FIVE (tv-series), STAR TREK VOYAGER (tv-series), STAR TREK 30TH ANNIVERSARY SPECIAL, STAR TREK FIRST CONTACT, HIGHLANDER THE TV SERIES, THEM, EARLY EDITION (tv-series), PUMPKIN HEAD 2, MILLENNIUM (tv-series), X-FILES (tv-series), ADVENTURES OF SINBAD (tv-series), ALIEN NATION: THE ENEMY WITHIN, STARGATE SG-1 (tv-series), JOHNNY SOKKO AND HIS FLYING ROBOT (tv-series), CONTACT, STANLEY KUBRICKS A.I., ODYSSEY (tv-series), ASTEROID, MARS ATTACKS.



SF&F stories referenced: THE DRAGON AND THE UNICORN, TEHANU, WIND FROM A FOREIGN SKY, BLUE MARS, THE FIRE DUKE, MAGE HEART, OTHER DAYS OTHER EYES, SHAPECHANGERS WIFE, RESURRECTION MAN, RELUCTANT VOYAGERS, INFINITE JEST, BUTTERFLY KID, WAR OF THE WORLDS: GLOBAL DISPATCHES, TAMULI, THRESHOLD, GOSPEL OF CORAX, WAY STATION, ARTIFACT, WILD SEED, THE LONG HUNT, DUTCHMAN, ANVIL OF STARS, BRIGHTNESS REEF, FOREIGNER, THE WATERBORN, DRUM WARNING, HIGHER SPACE, RINGWORLD THRONE, AUTOMATED ALICE, RINGSTONES, LURE OF THE BASILISK, SHADE AND SHADOW, ENCOUNTER WITH TIBER, TREKS NOT TAKEN, SQUARES OF THE CITY, THE FORTUNATE FALL, FORTRESS IN THE EYE OF TIME, WHEN GRAVITY FAILS, THE DUBIOUS HILLS, CELESTIAL MATTERS, LIONS OF AL-RASSAN, WIZARD OF THE PIGEONS, MURDER IN THE SOLID STATE, CADRE LUCIFER, THE TEN TON SNAKES, PASSAGE TO DAWN, ZOD WALLOP, HOLY FIRE, CLOUDS END, RAPTOR RED, ONE FOR THE MORNING GLORY, STARTIDE RISING, THE KILLING GAME, THE SUN THE MOON AND THE STARS, PSALMS OF HEROD, GUARDIANS KEY, BOOK OF ENCHANTMENT, THE KILLING STAR, GOOD OMENS, THE TWO GEORGES, STONE AND FLUTE, HEADCRASH, DEAD GIRLS, ARMED MEMORY, SLOW RIVER, DAGGERSPELL, VIRTUAL DEATH, HAPPY POLICEMAN, THE BASTARD PRINCESS VOLUME 2, CAMELOT 30K, THE PRINCESS BRIDE, WINTER TALE, HUMPTY DUMPTY: AN OVAL, REIGNING CATS AND DOGS, DANCING VAC, EARTHFASTS, BIMBOS OF THE DEATH SUN, SILVERLOCK, THE INTEGRAL TREES, TERMINAL EXPERIMENT, CONVERGENCE, ARCHANGEL, 1945, PATTERN FOR CONQUEST, ETERNAL LIGHT, A BREACH IN THE WATERSHED, ISLAND IN THE SEA OF TIME, DRAKON, BLUE SHIFTING, IN CONQUEST BORN, FALLING ANGEL, STARPLEX, CHRONICLES OF HAWKLAN, THE UNKNOWN SOLDIER, TEN THOUSAND LIGHT YEARS FROM HOME, SHANGRI-LA: RETURN TO THE WORLD OF LOST HORIZON, THE RETURN, ONE MINDS EYE, LIVE FROM GOLGOTHA, THE WEIRD COLONIAL BOY, SHADOWS OF ECSTASY, GORGON CHILD, LEGACY, BEST OF JAMES BLISH, WITCHLIGHT, THE MAN IN THE HIGH CASTLE, DISTRESS, GLORY SEASON, WALKING THE LABYRINTH, IDORU, WAITING FOR THE GALACTIC BUS, DEATHSTALKER, THE TRUTH MACHINE, THE REALITY DISFUNCTION, QUIET POOLS, BESERKER, RAPTURE, THE WHENABOUTS OF BURR, THE FUTUROLOGICAL CONGRESS, A FIRE UPON THE DEEP, FREE LIVE FREE, FISHERMANS HOPE, GOLDEN WITCHBREED, TRAVELLING WITH THE DEAD, BLADERUNNER 2: THE END OF HUMAN, FAIRYLAND, SPARROW, NIGHT LAMP, GRUNTS, STRANGER IN A STRANGE LAND, THE BAKERS BOY, THE LONG RUN, EMERALD EYES, THE LAST DANCER, GORMENGHAST, ECOTOPIA, CITY OF DIAMOND, TIMEMASTER, COYOTE BLUE, LOVE AND SLEEP, CHAIN OF ATTACK, GOJIRO, A WALK IN THE SUN, BLAMELESS IN ABADDON, HOGFATHER, CALLAHANS LEGACY, ALONGSIDE NIGHT, GANYMEDE CLUB, RISE OF ENDYMION, DIAMOND AGE, MAN WHO FOLDED HIMSELF, IMMORTAL ENGINES, VOYAGE, AGAINST A DARK BACKGROUND, INFINITYS SHORE, LAW OF BECOMING, NANOTECH CHRONICLES, THE BIG U, SNOW CRASH, PARIS IN THE TWENTIETH CENTURY, OTHERLAND, DEATH GATE, FEERSUM ENDJINN, SPOOKER, FACETS, MATHEMAGICS, QUICKER THAN THE EYE, THE HASHISH MAN, KEEPER OF THE KING, THE LAW OF LOVE, A GAME OF THRONES, A GAME OF UNIVERSE, ZOTHIQUE, EMPIRE OF THE PETAL THRONE, DEVILS TOWER, WORLDWAR: STRIKING THE BALANCE, MADOUC, EMPIRE OF THE ATOM, THE MOTION OF LIGHT AND WATER, CRYSTAL EXPRESS, GALACTIC GOURMET.

Phobeste
Apr 9, 2006

never, like, count out Touchdown Tom, man
You know, no matter what your mla manual says if you capitalize every single word in a list it makes it impossible to read

quantumfoam
Dec 25, 2003

Phobeste posted:

You know, no matter what your mla manual says if you capitalize every single word in a list it makes it impossible to read

I have no idea what the hell a mla manual is and refuse to look it up. The SFL Archives readthrough project I've been doing is a zero budget thing done in my free time.

Here is why everything in the lists is in all caps:
-this is a zero budget done on my free time project
-all the existing SFL Archives Volume readthrough bookmarks are stored on the 2 ebook readers I've used to do the readthrough (one device broke and holds bookmarks for SFL Archives Volume 01 - Volume 9, the other one has the other 20 SFL Archives Volume bookmarks)
-those ebook reader bookmarks don't sync to how things are displayed on tablets or normal computer screens so searching manually in the raw text files is very time-intensive for a project done in my free time
-directly cutting and pasting title names from the sfl archives raw text files is tricky and easy to mess up always fucks up, even ignoring the highlighting methods some SFL people always used that need to be edited out
-The format of the sfl archives is raw ansi text, and some SFL people used weird underscores or dashes or other annoying highlighting methods to indicate bolding or italics when listing tv shows/movies/books/etc.
-roughly 28% of the tv show/movie and book names in the SFL Archives are highlighted using those annoying methods
-Everything in those lists I make for the SFL Archives readthrough recaps are typed in manually to a external document as I review bookmarks on the ebook reader devices, and write in commentary on the really noteworthy bizarre/weird things discovered.
-Doing proper Caps/lower case for everything in those lists was making my wrists hurt/giving carpal tunnel twinges around the SFL Archives Vol 7 recap point so I switched to all CAPS MODE listing around that point.

If that explanation doesn't make you satisfied, feel free to correct everything in those lists into proper Caps/lowercase format and send it to me in PM's, and I will update everything on the off-site readthrough blog accordingly; otherwise gently caress off.

quantumfoam
Dec 25, 2003

On a friendlier note: Robert Anson Heinlein's The Puppetmasters relied on nudity for everyone as the solution to the alien invasion takeovers. So I guess Puppetmasters exists in a world without freezing cold weather or the need for protective gear in any format or in any setting. Hello cooking grease. Hello leaded gas fumes and DDT. Hello pricker bushes. Hello Beta radiation, etc.

packetmantis
Feb 26, 2013
:chloe:

Why are you even doing this "project"?

SSJ_naruto_2003
Oct 12, 2012



I assume because it's interesting

AARD VARKMAN
May 17, 1993
i find it pretty interesting and i appreciate you doing it, even if i sometimes scroll by most of the posts

Ripley
Jan 21, 2007

quantumfoam posted:


If that explanation doesn't make you satisfied, feel free to correct everything in those lists into proper Caps/lowercase format and send it to me in PM's

If it would be a helpful tool for you, MS Word has a function to convert cases automatically, or a more accessible option would be https://titlecase.com/

Ccs
Feb 25, 2011


I finished KJ Parker’s Fencer trilogy. Geez. My initial impression of what this series would be drastically changed as I made my way through the books. In the first I assumed everything would happen in the big fancy city that was established. Nope! Second book takes us to some island nations for a war between two banks, our protagonist is training a kid he picked up, his brother is a weird bastard but has also made the best of a bad situation, and at least the the mercantile nation literally called The Island seems cool and keeps out of large conflicts.

The third book introduces an empire previously unheard of (some foreshadowing of them might have been nice, they seem to be the largest political entity in the world) and our protagonist is working for them for want of anything better to do. The first book had its fill of exploring swords, the second bows, and now we get to thoroughly explore sapping warfare and especially armour. So so much about armour and the process of proofing it so that it makes the grade. Our protagonist gets his own highest quality set of armour and ends up on a mission that parallels the first book, only with the sides reversed. And then everything goes downhill. He wins, sort of, but not well enough, so is going to be shipped off for either a promotion or a court martial. We never find out which is true because his brother rescues him and brings them both to a tiny piece of land out in the ocean where they’re meant to be farmers together until they die. The idea being both of them are too dangerous to be out in the civilized world and need to return to their roots. Also every main character on The Island is strung up for treason for not joining the Empire quick enough, though our protagonists former clerk sees the writing on the wall and escapes before the soldiers come for her. So 90% of the main characters are dead, our protagonist is miserable, his brother is pleased with himself for making the best of a bad situation, and the trilogy is over.

This series was published well before The First Law came out, but it is far far more grim. It’s the type of grim that doesn’t even console you with the fact that at least there’s one guy that seems to be in control of everything. No one had any control. They’re just struggling along and can die at any moment and the world remains utterly indifferent.

There are cunning metaphors employed in terms of the swords, bows, and armour though. If there’s any theme to these books aside from “life can really suck” it’s that life also parallels these weapons. We fight for what we get (swords) while straining against internal tensions (bows) and external pressures (the proofing of armour). But even someone like our protagonist, who seems to have mastered all 3 weapons and therefore metaphorically understands those aspects of life, has not really grown as a person. It’s as if life is a giant hammer that can crush the military hardware that is a stand in for humanity’s physical struggles and psychological defences.

Ccs fucked around with this message at 15:23 on Jul 17, 2021

PawParole
Nov 16, 2019

Ccs posted:

I finished KJ Parker’s Fencer trilogy. Geez. My initial impression of what this series would be drastically changed as I made my way through the books. In the first I assumed everything would happen in the big fancy city that was established. Nope! Second book takes us to some island nations for a war between two banks, our protagonist is training a kid he picked up, his brother is a weird bastard but has also made the best of a bad situation, and at least the the mercantile nation literally called The Island seems cool and keeps out of large conflicts.

The third book introduces an empire previously unheard of (some foreshadowing of them might have been nice, they seem to be the largest political entity in the world) and our protagonist is working for them for want of anything better to do. The first book had its fill of exploring swords, the second bows, and now we get to thoroughly explore sapping warfare and especially armour. So so much about armour and the process of proofing it so that it makes the grade. Our protagonist gets his own highest quality set of armour and ends up on a mission that parallels the first book, only with the sides reversed. And then everything goes downhill. He wins, sort of, but not well enough, so is going to be shipped off for either a promotion or a court martial. We never find out which is true because his brother rescues him and brings them both to a tiny piece of land out in the ocean where they’re meant to be farmers together until they die. The idea being both of them are too dangerous to be out in the civilized world and need to return to their roots. Also every main character on The Island is strung up for treason for not joining the Empire quick enough, though our protagonists former clerk sees the writing on the wall and escapes before the soldiers come for her. So 90% of the main characters are dead, our protagonist is miserable, his brother is pleased with himself for making the best of a bad situation, and the trilogy is over.

This series was published well before The First Law came out, but it is far far more grim. It’s the type of grim that doesn’t even console you with the fact that at least there’s one guy that seems to be in control of everything. No one had any control. They’re just struggling along and can die at any moment and the world remains utterly indifferent.

There are cunning metaphors employed in terms of the swords, bows, and armour though. If there’s any theme to these books aside from “life can really suck” it’s that life also parallels these weapons. We fight for what we get (swords) while straining against internal tensions (bows) and external pressures (the proofing of armour). But even someone like our protagonist, who seems to have mastered all 3 weapons and therefore metaphorically understands those aspects of life, has not really grown as a person. It’s as if life is a giant hammer that can crush the military hardware that is a stand in for humanity’s physical struggles and psychological defences.

yeah it was super-f'ed up, the brother isn't innocent though, he pimped out his sister to a rapist and killed his father when he fled That's why his brother wants revenge on him and does what he does in the end.

also the empire island and the bank island are different. people might get them mixed up from your summary

Ccs
Feb 25, 2011


Oh yeah Gorgas is in no way innocent. He has such a twisted justification for why he’s happy that Bardas hates him. Gorgas feels like Bardas blaming him for ruining his routine farm life helps Bardas to psychologically absolve himself of all the killing he’s had to do in his career, because he never would have left the Mesoge if it wasn’t for Gorgas’ actions.

Gorgas’ whole attempt to right his past wrong and bring the family back together is just... a twisted mess that creates pretty much all the problems in the series.

Despite the grimness of Fencer I’m about to launch into yet another Parker book, Savages. Like Fencer, this also has a major conflict between a giant empire and a nomadic tribe. Parker certainly knows what he likes. This one has much more positive reviews on Goodreads and won some awards so I’ll be curious to contrast it to Fencer to see how much Parker’s tackling of similar material has improved in the 15 years since he published The Proof House.

Ccs fucked around with this message at 20:03 on Jul 17, 2021

pradmer
Mar 31, 2009

Follow me for more books on special!
Seed to Harvest: The Complete Patternist Series by Octavia E Butler - $4.99
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B008HALOVO/

ulmont
Sep 15, 2010

IF I EVER MISS VOTING IN AN ELECTION (EVEN AMERICAN IDOL) ,OR HAVE UNPAID PARKING TICKETS, PLEASE TAKE AWAY MY FRANCHISE

quantumfoam posted:

Or that people deeply deeply cared about the minutiae of Harry Turtledove's cut-n-paste <WHAT IF> scenario stories.

I loved those in the 90s, but I remember very little about them now for obvious reasons.

Marshal Radisic
Oct 9, 2012


quantumfoam posted:

Or that people deeply deeply cared about the minutiae of Harry Turtledove's cut-n-paste <WHAT IF> scenario stories.
I used to hang out on an alternate history forum in the mid-2000s, and Turtledove and S.M. Stirling were just about the only authors anyone ever talked about in the media subforum. From what I remember, it feels the whole appeal of Turtledove's stories was in sifting out the minutiae, arguing about it, and using it as the base for one's own creative projects. The novels were overlong, often repetitive, and generally not that good, but for fans they were always more appealing as a minutiae delivery system rather than as narratives in their own right.

Occasionally Turtledove could hit on an interesting concept. That "Timeline 191" sequence takes the stock alternate history of the Confederacy winning the ACW and just lets the consequences play out over the next eighty years as North and South fight again and again and both are drawn into the European alliance systems that cause the world wars. The execution isn't great and too often falls back on blatantly copying actual history (I suspect part of the reason Turtledove ended the sequence after that world's version of WW2 was because the political situation would be so radically different that there's no way you could copy the events of the Cold War and have anyone believe them), but the premise is sound.

quantumfoam
Dec 25, 2003

ulmont posted:

I loved those in the 90s, but I remember very little about them now for obvious reasons.

Marshal Radisic posted:

I used to hang out on an alternate history forum in the mid-2000s, and Turtledove and S.M. Stirling were just about the only authors anyone ever talked about in the media subforum. From what I remember, it feels the whole appeal of Turtledove's stories was in sifting out the minutiae, arguing about it, and using it as the base for one's own creative projects. The novels were overlong, often repetitive, and generally not that good, but for fans they were always more appealing as a minutiae delivery system rather than as narratives in their own right.

Occasionally Turtledove could hit on an interesting concept. That "Timeline 191" sequence takes the stock alternate history of the Confederacy winning the ACW and just lets the consequences play out over the next eighty years as North and South fight again and again and both are drawn into the European alliance systems that cause the world wars. The execution isn't great and too often falls back on blatantly copying actual history (I suspect part of the reason Turtledove ended the sequence after that world's version of WW2 was because the political situation would be so radically different that there's no way you could copy the events of the Cold War and have anyone believe them), but the premise is sound.

Thank you SFL Archives readthrough; as per Turtledove himself back in 1994.

===
History Roundtable 16.3.259, GEnie network, Mon Apr 18, 1994
H.TURTLEDOVE [Harry]

I may have been trained as a historian, but (what I tell you three times is
true) I AM A FICTION WRITER!
I AM A FICTION WRITER!
I AM A FICTION WRITER!
Stories are for entertainment first, or they fail. I have no obligation,
and no intention, of being consistent in historical viewpoint from one
story or set of stories to the next, especially if looking at things is
style B rather than style A lets me do something new and I hope more
interesting.
===

e: All the replies about stuff I doubted anyone cared about is heartening; I will try to post more about that stuff in my offsite blog updates.

Right now Sam Raimi's 1997 tv-series SPY GAME premiered and I broke readthrough kayfabe a 10th time to verify SPY GAME the tv series wasn't a extended practical joke. Doing SPY GAME sort of explains how Raimi managed to pry the Spiderman movie franchise away from James Cameron's hands.

quantumfoam fucked around with this message at 05:46 on Jul 18, 2021

Urcher
Jun 16, 2006


quantumfoam posted:

e: All the replies about stuff I doubted anyone cared about is heartening; I will try to post more about that stuff in my offsite blog updates.

Keep it up. The SF archives stuff is fascinating, particularly now that you are up to years that I remember. I just rarely comment because I don't have much to add.

Groke
Jul 27, 2007
New Adventures In Mom Strength
Same. I was a regular on Usenet for most of the 90s and poo poo is hitting me in the nostalgias now.

Ccs
Feb 25, 2011


Ok started reading Savages by KJ Parker and noticed pretty quickly that this isn’t actually a tale of an empire vs nomadic tribe. That was a big part of Fencer, but since then every book he’s written that involves nomadic horse archer plainspeople casts them as mercenaries hired by one empire or another instead of being the enemy in and of themselves. Maybe he figured it was a bad look to have the nomads be, if not the bad guys, the other major “enemy” force? Or he reconsidered that it would make more economic sense for the skilled archers from the nomads to hire themselves out instead of trying to conquer anything because as nomads they’re not really into conquering.

In Fencer Parker also covered the whole “Empire wants to chase off the nomadic tribes to annex their land” but it seems like that’s not a subject he’s returning to here. So the “Savages” of the title is really just meant to refer to war in general and what it does to people, but happens to also feature a mercenary force that the regular imperial soldier would consider “savages”.

DurianGray
Dec 23, 2010

King of Fruits
Just finished A Psalm for the Wild-Built (first in the new Monk and Robot series by Becky Chambers) and it's good. (I will also admit I got a bit misty like I have with most of her books.) Really interested to see where she'll go with this series since it's very meditative and has a much narrower focus (in terms of character POV and focus) than her other stuff had.

Beefeater1980
Sep 12, 2008

My God, it's full of Horatios!






Whoever it was recommended Chalion, thank you. It was exactly what was needed.

E: my immediate mental image for Cazaril like 5 pages in is Jim Caviezel at the start of Person of Interest.

Beefeater1980 fucked around with this message at 08:35 on Jul 19, 2021

FewtureMD
Dec 19, 2010

I am very powerful, of course.

DurianGray posted:

Just finished A Psalm for the Wild-Built (first in the new Monk and Robot series by Becky Chambers) and it's good. (I will also admit I got a bit misty like I have with most of her books.) Really interested to see where she'll go with this series since it's very meditative and has a much narrower focus (in terms of character POV and focus) than her other stuff had.

I just met Mosscap, and I'm already in love with them. They're just so eager and curious! :allears:

pradmer
Mar 31, 2009

Follow me for more books on special!
Raising Steam (Discworld #40) by Terry Pratchett - $1.99
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00FIN0TGY/

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

FPyat
Jan 17, 2020

Marshal Radisic posted:

I used to hang out on an alternate history forum in the mid-2000s, and Turtledove and S.M. Stirling were just about the only authors anyone ever talked about in the media subforum. From what I remember, it feels the whole appeal of Turtledove's stories was in sifting out the minutiae, arguing about it, and using it as the base for one's own creative projects. The novels were overlong, often repetitive, and generally not that good, but for fans they were always more appealing as a minutiae delivery system rather than as narratives in their own right.

Occasionally Turtledove could hit on an interesting concept. That "Timeline 191" sequence takes the stock alternate history of the Confederacy winning the ACW and just lets the consequences play out over the next eighty years as North and South fight again and again and both are drawn into the European alliance systems that cause the world wars. The execution isn't great and too often falls back on blatantly copying actual history (I suspect part of the reason Turtledove ended the sequence after that world's version of WW2 was because the political situation would be so radically different that there's no way you could copy the events of the Cold War and have anyone believe them), but the premise is sound.

Stirling was later banned from alternatehistory.com for saying (I recall) that he would kill all Muslim males if given the option to do so.

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply