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KOGAHAZAN!! posted:lmao that we all immediately knew what the scene was and where to find it. (It's specifically where Rand extinguishes the fires by pulling the heat into the stone of the fireplace, I think, and Egwene recalls that this is a good way to set yourself on fire, if you try it with saidar). Oh man I forgot about that one.
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Nov 19, 2021 23:00
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KOGAHAZAN!! posted:lmao that we all immediately knew what the scene was and where to find it. (It's specifically where Rand extinguishes the fires by pulling the heat into the stone of the fireplace, I think, and Egwene recalls that this is a good way to set yourself on fire, if you try it with saidar). Yeah, she says that Elayne tried it with a candle or a lamp or something and blistered her arm up to her elbow.
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Nov 19, 2021 23:15
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Really, I fully expected it to be absolutely awful so I'd have been happy with any improvement on that. As it is, I feel like they understand the books and what makes them good, even if some of the changes/translation to screen aren't perfect, they're trying their best. I don't know if it's a good TV show if you haven't read the books but as an imagining of the Wheel of Time it was great to see on screen. It could have been so much worse!
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Nov 19, 2021 23:23
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My partner, who hasn't read and never will read the books, said last night that her apprehensions about the series were wrong so far and that she's excited to watch more. Hopefully that applies to most new show-watchers.
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Nov 19, 2021 23:27
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I wonder if all major channeling will be depicted with some associated body movements, or if we’re going to get some “oh poo poo” moments when the forsaken show up and do everything current Aes Sedai can do without lifting a finger.
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Nov 19, 2021 23:29
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Arrinien posted:Just want to say Nynaeve is by far my favourite character and show Nynaeve loving owns and the show is great. Nynaeve is such a badass in the show so far, I love it
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Nov 19, 2021 23:31
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Democratic Pirate posted:I wonder if all major channeling will be depicted with some associated body movements, or if we’re going to get some “oh poo poo” moments when the forsaken show up and do everything current Aes Sedai can do without lifting a finger. I remember a video of Logain using Saidin and he was just like sitting there, I think? e: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-T6pgVSXBpc
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Nov 19, 2021 23:32
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How are u posted:My partner, who hasn't read and never will read the books, said last night that her apprehensions about the series were wrong so far and that she's excited to watch more. Hopefully that applies to most new show-watchers. yeah i genuinely feel like a lot of us need to realize that the vast majority of the poo poo we bicker about literally does not register or matter to someone watching the show who has never read the books. we're the biased ones. in whatever way we are, it's true for all of us. stuff being moved or missing does not matter to them. what they know is what's presented to them. they have no further context. with that in mind i think the show has put forward a pretty compelling experience so far and i think it has enough of a budget to get people hooked, and i can't wait to see what the show emphasizes for the couple of big haymakers it'll inevitably throw the way of the audience to get them to react
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Nov 19, 2021 23:38
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Johnny Joestar posted:yeah i genuinely feel like a lot of us need to realize that the vast majority of the poo poo we bicker about literally does not register or matter to someone watching the show who has never read the books. we're the biased ones. in whatever way we are, it's true for all of us. stuff being moved or missing does not matter to them. what they know is what's presented to them. they have no further context. My friends I was watching this with were mad at me when I said "Eh, they may even ditch Elayne and her brothers. They don't really impact the overall plot that much. Only in how they relate to main characters." So yea, if you see me bickering at some point i'm doing it entirely for fun.
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Nov 19, 2021 23:52
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Democratic Pirate posted:I wonder if all major channeling will be depicted with some associated body movements, or if we’re going to get some “oh poo poo” moments when the forsaken show up and do everything current Aes Sedai can do without lifting a finger. The Aiel clowned on Aes Sedai for using such big gestures, I don't know if doing literally nothing would translate well to TV but small finger/hand motions to tie in with the use of handtalk might work as a contrast to the overexaggerated Aes Sedai
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Nov 19, 2021 23:58
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minema posted:The Aiel clowned on Aes Sedai for using such big gestures, I don't know if doing literally nothing would translate well to TV but small finger/hand motions to tie in with the use of handtalk might work as a contrast to the overexaggerated Aes Sedai Doing nothing and channeling worked for the Logain preview I thought.
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Nov 20, 2021 00:01
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Barreft posted:Doing nothing and channeling worked for the Logain preview I thought. True, but we see in the books how the rigidity of Aes Sedai training has advantages...you learn the fundamentals very well and it's a quick road to maximizing your potential...but it has disadvantages too. In particular Tower trained Aes Sedai tend to learn a Weave a specific way and can't vary from that method. So if in the show's turning of the Wheel that Aes Sedai training involves very specific body, arm, and hand movements for each weave, then the Aes Sedai are pretty much stuck with that methodology. Meanwhile Logain who is, by definition, self-taught, may never have realized that gestures and motion can be helpful in directing Weaves and as such doesn't use them, essentially just willing the Weaves into exisitence.
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Nov 20, 2021 00:14
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Barreft posted:Doing nothing and channeling worked for the Logain preview I thought. Logain wasn't trained by Aes Sedai. There's a bit in the books about how someone can tell not only what weave they were preparing, but who taught them that weave based on the hand movements.
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Nov 20, 2021 00:15
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I assumed Barreft meant it worked in terms of how it looked visually rather than if it would work in-world, and it's definitely true. I hope they do go non gesture based for Wise Ones, I like the contrast.
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Nov 20, 2021 00:22
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jng2058 posted:In particular Tower trained Aes Sedai tend to learn a Weave a specific way and can't vary from that method. That's not an Aes Sedai thing, it's a channeling thing. In fact the most prominent example of it is that Aviendha has a really hard time learning to Travel properly because she learned it "wrong" when running away from Rand.
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Nov 20, 2021 00:27
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minema posted:I assumed Barreft meant it worked in terms of how it looked visually rather than if it would work in-world, and it's definitely true. I hope they do go non gesture based for Wise Ones, I like the contrast. Yeah this
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Nov 20, 2021 00:39
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I don't love that that in a pretty diverse cast, the darkest skin person is a major bad guy. Maybe not the right thread to talk about colorism in casting, though.
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Nov 20, 2021 00:42
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Jaxyon posted:I don't love that that in a pretty diverse cast, the darkest skin person is a major bad guy. Semirhage?
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Nov 20, 2021 00:45
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He's talking about Fain.
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Nov 20, 2021 00:46
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How are u posted:He's talking about Fain. Yeah I was joking but then I just remembered Fain. Great casting. That dude is gonna be so drat creepy
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Nov 20, 2021 00:48
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Barreft posted:Semirhage? Fain, in the show casting. It's not great in the book either but at least Tuon is there as well to balance it out Also Loial but that could arguably a "dark skin folks as non-human" trope.
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Nov 20, 2021 00:48
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The very first dark friend you see on screen is as pale as gently caress and blond.
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Nov 20, 2021 00:51
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CainFortea posted:The very first dark friend you see on screen is as pale as gently caress and blond. Like I said, probably not the thread to talk about this, carry on.
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Nov 20, 2021 00:59
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Jaxyon posted:Fain, in the show casting. I do get your point, but I think in this case the actor is so loving good for the role,    Like I can't wait to see this guy terrify and kill a fade in season 2 but yeah lets move on. Barreft fucked around with this message at 01:03 on Nov 20, 2021 |
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Nov 20, 2021 01:00
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Jaxyon posted:Like I said, probably not the thread to talk about this, carry on. I mean, you're the one who brought it up in the first place lol.
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Nov 20, 2021 01:02
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CainFortea posted:The very first dark friend you see on screen is as pale as gently caress and blond. They could retcon that to not being Liandrin at any point if they can't get her back for what seems like it going to be the first third of season 2.
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Nov 20, 2021 01:02
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Jaxyon posted:Like I said, probably not the thread to talk about this, carry on. It's a fair criticism, I've seen it brought up elsewhere. I checked the cast list and it looks like Ihvon's actor is darker-skinned but we'll probably not see much of him :/
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Nov 20, 2021 01:03
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minema posted:I assumed Barreft meant it worked in terms of how it looked visually rather than if it would work in-world, and it's definitely true. I hope they do go non gesture based for Wise Ones, I like the contrast. I’m also thinking it’d be a neat, semi-subtle indicator for Rand. Early on, having been around Moiraine and Aes Sedai, he learns some standard fireball!, lightning bolt! moves complete with associated hand motions. Once he hits a breaking point in a fight, “Lews Therin” takes over and Rand suddenly goes stock still while 1 fireball turns into 25, lightning floods the stone of tear, etc.
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Nov 20, 2021 01:06
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part of me is fine with them not spending way too much time on early book stuff because honestly i really just want to see certain scenes get put into motion and i can't wait to see how they get pulled off
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Nov 20, 2021 01:08
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How are u posted:I mean, you're the one who brought it up in the first place lol. I feel it needs to be said, but also I don't have time(right this moment) to explain the issues with colorism in casting to people who don't understand where I'm coming from. If you want to jump in and help, feel free. Jaxyon fucked around with this message at 01:17 on Nov 20, 2021 |
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Nov 20, 2021 01:09
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Democratic Pirate posted:I’m also thinking it’d be a neat, semi-subtle indicator for Rand. Early on, having been around Moiraine and Aes Sedai, he learns some standard fireball!, lightning bolt! moves complete with associated hand motions. Once he hits a breaking point in a fight, “Lews Therin” takes over and Rand suddenly goes stock still while 1 fireball turns into 25, lightning floods the stone of tear, etc. I specifically need to see this Nynaeve (Zoe) and Moghedien just glaring at each other while throwing around insane amounts of the power.
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Nov 20, 2021 01:10
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Barreft posted:I specifically need to see this Nynaeve (Zoe) and Moghedien just glaring at each other while throwing around insane amounts of the power.
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Nov 20, 2021 01:25
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Sab669 posted:
There's a TVIV thread? I can't find it :c
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Nov 20, 2021 01:28
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Solefald posted:There's a TVIV thread? I can't find it :c https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3974396
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Nov 20, 2021 01:29
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Rarity posted:She was called Mili Skane and you will put respect on her name Lady Shiane you loving philistine.
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Nov 20, 2021 01:46
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adhuin posted:As the predator or as Arnold? she plays both watching all 3 again, mainly to see nyn roar again and there is one cut in particular where moiraine says one of YOU and it shoves rand in your face lol. I'll update when i find it
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Nov 20, 2021 02:02
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We'll know it's Rand in Ep 7, from IMDB The Dark Along the Ways Moiraine and her charges are diverted from their path by an unexpected encounter. This diversion reveals many things - Moiraine's true goal, Lan's past, the fractures that have grown in the group, and the identity of the Dragon Reborn.
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Nov 20, 2021 02:06
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Alright, I've watched all three episodes now. Are we doing spoilers for the show in here? I guess I might as well spoiler it. Episode 1 is... bad? At best, it's rough. It's dramatically overstuffed, having to do far too much work to introduce far too many characters, with the result that all of them are underserved. You get just the briefest outline of who these people are before they're whisked off to adventure. World-building, too gets short shrift. Now, I am a "only that which is needed, when it is needed" sort of guy when it comes to world-building in general, but it's so stripped down and plot-focused here that it ends up feeling nakedly mechanical. The Manetheren story is a particularly acute example- ripped out of its context and kicked to the second episode, it falls into a weird little nothing scene that doesn't really flow from or into anything around it, and comes only shortly before Lan vomits up the other half of the tale in Aridhol. Here is a lore-fact, it says, which you need to know now, so that in seven seconds this other lore-fact will be slightly less meaningless to you than it would otherwise have been. Jordan's writing and Pike's delivery are both great but the both of them together can only take it so far. I think probably the most damning result of this compression of story beats is how little emotion there is in the Emond's Fielders' leavetaking. We don't get to linger with Perrin over his wife's body, Rand doesn't get to say even three words to Tam after his healing- nobody gets to say goodbye to anyone, in fact- and Moiraine drops her spiel about the Dragon and needing to get out of dodge right in the middle of the street. The show can't even afford the time to show Moiraine and Lan getting on their horses- we cut directly from them walking off to them mounted and riding out of town. There is no space given to any of the characters to discuss or unpack what any of this means to them or how they feel about it, and I think the character beats in the following episodes suffer for it. The realities of production being what they are, this may have been the best adaptation of the material they could have made. As an episode of television in its own right? Not great. Performances ranged across the spectrum. All the main cast were good with Pike being of course the standout. Some of the bit parts gave dreadful line reads, but, well, they're bit parts. I particularly liked the Rand/Egwene and Rand/Tam scenes- Stradowski ain't half bad. (And so pretty, my God. The women in this show cannot compete.) Perrin's wife is- like, so, injecting her into the story was already a bizarre choice. Injecting her into the story and having her be a mostly silent role with no development is next-level baffling. I am baffled. Did they not want to pay the actress to speak? Man if there's a 90 minute cut of this episode out there where Perrin's wife is an actual character then I'm going to be pissed. I'm actually going to take back what I said before, though, about Perrin's uxoricide undermining his arc- because it's not actually clear to me here that it was the influence of the wolf on him that "makes him" do it. You can argue that, with the wolf noises overlaid on it, but he doesn't appear to be in any sort of berserk state or whatever. He is freaking out, high on adrenaline, sees something in the corner of his eye and- oh no. Costuming- I have seen a lot of people talk about the costumes and, yeah, I definitely noticed the costumes. They kept raising themselves to my attention. Are they bad? I'm uncertain. Are they setting appropriate? I'm also uncertain, and I'm uncertain if it would be a failing even if they were. Rand does look very comfy in his sweaters, and Moiraine's ridiculous shoulder pads have endeared themselves to me. The Aes Sedai's colour coding may be a little too full-on, but we knew that already. And, later, I did actually like the Whitecloak outfits. They communicate, with commendable efficiency, what absolutely ridiculous dorks these idiots are. They're very clearly obsessed with appearance above all else, with their silly little white robes (a nightmare to keep clean- in a forest, Christ I wouldn't want to be these guys' camp follower), silly little armguards (completely useless as armour but coloured by rank and sporting a very fetching sunburst), and their silly little haircuts and moustaches (which make them look like some kind of hybrid of Nazis and hipster baristas). Absurd nonsense people, love to hate 'em. High points: the Trollocs. Holy poo poo, the Trollocs. I am absolutely terrified of Trollocs. They made the things so drat imposing I flatly did not believe the show when it decided to tell me that Perrin or Nynaeve or the rest could take one out. And the landscape shots, also a high point. Even the ones that are obvious composites. I saw someone in the TVIV thread talking about bad CGI in the Shadar Logoth scenes and- to be honest? gently caress off. It's not bad just because you can tell it's fake. Verisimilitude is not the sole virtue of the medium. Those shots are gorgeous. They're all gorgeous. Overall, I liked the first episode, but I don't know if I, personally, would have found it particularly compelling television if I was not already invested in the source material. The second episode is better. Still a bit too tight, still a few too many characters to cover, but it's a much more linear plot and I think that allows it to pace itself better. I initially mistook Valda for Bornhald in the cold open and was very confused- this can't be Bornhald, I said: Bornhald can't sound like that! And duly it did in fact turn out not to be him. Big sigh of relief when actual!Bornhald turned up and immediately nailed the role. Now I have to talk the excision of Baerlon from the story. I knew this was coming, and if you'd asked me ahead of time whether I'd prefer to cut Baerlon or Shadar Logoth I would probably have agreed that Baerlon is the less vital of the two. But!! after having actually watched that play out? I think I'd rather have cut Shadar Logoth for Baerlon. Especially with the characters so lightly sketched coming out of the first episode, the loss of those additional character building scenes really hurts here. We reach the end of this episode, two entire hours into the show, with only the barest fingernail grip on who any of these people are. Lan I think is particularly hurt by this. Fortunately, splitting the party up allows the third episode to do much more focused character work, and it produces the strongest episode yet. Rand and Mat especially get a lot of polish here- which reminds me. Rand's little hissy fit in E2 was considerably worse than I had been expecting based on the spoilers. It is incredibly hard not to read him as a petulant dick in that scene. The decision to cut the scenes with feverish Tam and that lack of emotional freight in the end of E1 really do not leave us much room to sympathise with him, and the fact that he seems to be completely on his own out of the four kids does not help. If his rebellion had been a joint effort between him and Mat I think it would have worked a lot better, especially since- hey!- in this episode their positions seem to have reversed. Now Mat is the one fighting to go back and Rand the one taking a pragmatic approach to Moiraine. Dagger influence? gently caress up in the writers' room? Who knows! Actually, I could definitely see the hissy fit being a Mat thing that got reassigned because they wanted to make Mat seem less awful. So, grades. A C for E1 and Bs for 2 and 3. I am generally positive on the show, I think it needs to find a stride somewhere, I have some confidence that they might stick some sort of a landing. Jaxyon posted:I don't love that that in a pretty diverse cast, the darkest skin person is a major bad guy. Yeah that was something that struck me. Not just Fain, Valda too. It's, uh, a choice.
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Nov 20, 2021 02:36
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I was primed to dismiss this as I wasn't impressed by the trailers but I actually found it pretty good! All the characters were likeable and the romances/friendships between pairs like Moiraine/Lan, Lan/Nynaeve, Rand/Egweane are believable (Watching this after e1 of Cowboy Bebop might have also been another factor...)
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Nov 20, 2021 02:44
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Episode 1 ruled I'm not even mad that perrin was married or killed his wife. Great way to establish his character of being afraid to hurt someone without a monologue. Lan and Moiraine were established badasses. Egwene and Nynaeve ruled. Rand existed lol. Mat was cool. Established his being a hero all the time. I don't like that they did Abel Cauthon dirty though. I'm a fan of the relationship of Rand and Egwene. It makes later more interesting. I liked establishing Matt's gambling on screen. The establishing shots rocked. Nynaeve hating Moiraine already is perfect. Nynaeve is perfect casting. Egwene is also great. Very brave with Nynaeve against an 8 foot tall nightmare beast. Loved watching nynaeve and egwene try to save old me. I hated not having Cenn complaining about woman circle business and the last of shirt smoothing and braid tugging though. After egwene and rand started making out I turned to my wife and said "I hope we don't get random nudity" and 0.1 second later we see Moiraine naked in the tub and Lan's sweet rear end. 8/10 so far imo. Got through the boring rear end first dozen chapters safely.
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Nov 20, 2021 03:18
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