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D34THROW
Jan 29, 2012

RETAIL RETAIL LISTEN TO ME BITCH ABOUT RETAIL
:rant:
I have a 2010 latitude. If I lock it while its on the vpn I can't get back on because it is literally too old and the trust relationship doesnt exist.

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my cat is norris
Mar 11, 2010

#onecallcat

Bob Morales posted:

The actual customer service guy at Dell is the one that told us it would take a while. Meanwhile our business development manager is using an old engineering laptop where the battery dies the second you unplug it. They won't come on-site to fix his old one, either.

It was a coffee-related incident.

We normally had a stock of 'spare laptops', however:

We've made a few hires recently and the new laptops we ordered haven't came in yet
Some laptops that we have as spares have bad USB-C ports so they don't work with external displays
Someone commandeered 4-5 of the spares for a makeshift training room
All the old spares (4 years or older) finally got thrown out

do you work on my team because this is all frustratingly familiar

sfwarlock
Aug 11, 2007

RFC2324 posted:

Why the gently caress did he think Dell was shipping you a bunch of empty boxes?

He thought we'd already been there and removed the contents. So he was disposing of the empty boxen for us.

sixth and maimed
Mar 20, 2012

Fun Shoe

Thanks Ants posted:

Have them upgrade you to on-site service and they will send a tech with a fan. It's more cost effective than your round trip time into the office during work hours. ProSupport is something like £60 a year above a normal warranty, I've never understood not buying it.

We no longer buy laptops with warranty ... Since we haven't needed it yet, it'll be cheaper to just buy a new laptop. Downtime for the user? No worries, we'll keep some in stock. Which gets turned down every time we ask. This is a multinational, BTW.

:shepicide:

Thanks Ants
May 21, 2004

#essereFerrari


Yeah I can see how not bothering with a warranty makes sense if you have a large enough fleet, but the key is that you have to actually do the logistics bit yourself

Bob Morales
Aug 18, 2006


Just wear the fucking mask, Bob

I don't care how many people I probably infected with COVID-19 while refusing to wear a mask, my comfort is far more important than the health and safety of everyone around me!

I argued that we could buy 1/3rd more AP's instead of buying Ciscos warranty and come out ahead

This would even cover ones that got covered in bird poo poo, soaked from leaking pipes, covered in grease, hit by lightning...

GreenNight
Feb 19, 2006
Turning the light on the darkest places, you and I know we got to face this now. We got to face this now.

We do that with some networking gear. Have extras instead of paying for the high end warranty. Pay for software updates only.

Especially with the supply chain issues.

Bob Morales
Aug 18, 2006


Just wear the fucking mask, Bob

I don't care how many people I probably infected with COVID-19 while refusing to wear a mask, my comfort is far more important than the health and safety of everyone around me!

GreenNight posted:

We do that with some networking gear. Have extras instead of paying for the high end warranty. Pay for software updates only.

Especially with the supply chain issues.

Exactly. I just RMA'd a 9120 that's not even a month old, it took like 3-4 months to get the AP's this summer so I wonder how long a single replacement will take.

Bob Morales
Aug 18, 2006


Just wear the fucking mask, Bob

I don't care how many people I probably infected with COVID-19 while refusing to wear a mask, my comfort is far more important than the health and safety of everyone around me!

Also our "spare" 2960 is only a 24 port

GreenNight
Feb 19, 2006
Turning the light on the darkest places, you and I know we got to face this now. We got to face this now.

We have a huge stack of older Cisco switches we could use in a pinch but 1 sole Meraki switch as our "good" spare. Although Meraki told us to have a warehouse fill of equipment solely set aside as warranty replacements.

I do know that's true for HP, for I can't get poo poo but they fix my laptops pretty quick.

Thanks Ants
May 21, 2004

#essereFerrari


I did an Aruba switch RMA a couple of weeks ago and they got it to me the next day despite lead times for new orders going into 2022. They definitely have separate stock for maintenance, imagine the shitstorm if they couldn't fulfil people's RMAs.

Bob Morales
Aug 18, 2006


Just wear the fucking mask, Bob

I don't care how many people I probably infected with COVID-19 while refusing to wear a mask, my comfort is far more important than the health and safety of everyone around me!

I haven't done an Aruba in the 8-9 months or so but they were always very quick

Thanks Ants
May 21, 2004

#essereFerrari


A place I used to work at was about 10km from the DHL hub where HPE store all their RMA inventory, I think we had a "next day" replacement in 9 hours at one point.

Renegret
May 26, 2007

THANK YOU FOR CALLING HELP DOG, INC.

YOUR POSITION IN THE QUEUE IS *pbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbt*


Cat Army Sworn Enemy
Yeah we've had 0 RMA problems across multiple vendors.

But we also pay them a gazillion dollars so they loving better figure it out.

Knormal
Nov 11, 2001

Prior to our current batch of laptop the heads of our division at our place always insisted our people needed rugged laptops because they were out of the office a lot and surely standard laptops couldn't handle the abuse of being set on a carseat from time to time. I always argued that for less than the cost of a single rugged laptop could buy every user three more-powerful standard laptops and just swap them out if they broke them. Finally their requests for ruggeds got slapped down by the big heads and told we have to use the same standard-issue laptops as everyone else. We're going on about a year now and so far not a single one of the non-rugged laptops has been broken, and this is with teleworking and people carrying the laptops around with them increasing exponentially with the pandemic.

GreenNight
Feb 19, 2006
Turning the light on the darkest places, you and I know we got to face this now. We got to face this now.

Yeah, I pick all the laptops, order them, and set them up. I pay for the 5 year warranty uplift along with ADP for each of them. Yes, probably cheaper to have a bunch of spares but it bugs the poo poo out of me pitching a good laptop due to a cracked screen that costs $700 to replace.

Data Graham
Dec 28, 2009

📈📊🍪😋



Can't think of a good thread to ask this in so you guys are elected.

We all have the crazy right-wing uncle Thanksgiving story, but mine cornered me and tried to ask me about Elon Musk's Starlink system and how it's going to make all current cell phone and computer technology obsolete when he releases his new phone in January, "just you wait and see". I have literally not heard a single word about it and so I just made noncommittal grunting noises and let him exit the conversation looking like and thinking that he knew more than the family computer nerd.

It seems to be a real thing according to wikipedia, and whatever crackpot sources he gets his information from at least seem to have things like numbers of satellites correct. What's the general consensus among actual industry people though? Is it just another stupid Musk snake-oil thing? Does anyone think it's worth paying attention to?

Thanks Ants
May 21, 2004

#essereFerrari


It makes sense to create a satellite phone if you're building an LEO satellite network, but they will be competing with people like Inmarsat and not Verizon.

duz
Jul 11, 2005

Come on Ilhan, lets go bag us a shitpost


With Musk's track record, you can assume it'll never happen and most likely be right.

Arquinsiel
Jun 1, 2006

"There is no such thing as society. There are individual men and women, and there are families. And no government can do anything except through people, and people must look to themselves first."

God Bless Margaret Thatcher
God Bless England
RIP My Iron Lady
I've been told by one goon that the internet it provides is pretty good, so maybe they'll launch some VOIP phone service over it too?

TheParadigm
Dec 10, 2009

Data Graham posted:

Can't think of a good thread to ask this in so you guys are elected.

We all have the crazy right-wing uncle Thanksgiving story, but mine cornered me and tried to ask me about Elon Musk's Starlink system and how it's going to make all current cell phone and computer technology obsolete when he releases his new phone in January, "just you wait and see". I have literally not heard a single word about it and so I just made noncommittal grunting noises and let him exit the conversation looking like and thinking that he knew more than the family computer nerd.

It seems to be a real thing according to wikipedia, and whatever crackpot sources he gets his information from at least seem to have things like numbers of satellites correct. What's the general consensus among actual industry people though? Is it just another stupid Musk snake-oil thing? Does anyone think it's worth paying attention to?

You might be interested in the AST stock/business pitch. Caught this the other day : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JCBPTRvz1bM

Give Spacemobile/AST a googling.

Short pitch seems to be basically cheap wireless gap-coverage satellite/data plan.

orange juche
Mar 14, 2012



Thanks Ants posted:

It makes sense to create a satellite phone if you're building an LEO satellite network, but they will be competing with people like Inmarsat and not Verizon.

I don't know if they'll be competing with Inmarsat and their go anywhere satphones, they're planning on offering VoIP via Starlink to replace a land line phone for remote users.

quote:

While the Starlink beta only includes broadband, SpaceX said it will eventually sell VoIP service that includes "(a) voice-grade access to the public switched telephone network ('PSTN') or its functional equivalent; (b) minutes of use for local service provided at no additional charge to end users; (c) access to emergency services; and (d) toll limitation services to qualifying low-income consumers."

Voice service will be sold "on a standalone basis at rates that are reasonably comparable to urban rates," SpaceX said. The plan isn't finalized, but SpaceX said it is exploring the use of "a white-label managed service provider (MSP) voice platform."

"In this baseline plan, Starlink Services would provide telephone services connecting consumers to its MSP's platform using its network capacity, which is available to consumers through their customer premises equipment," the filing said. "Consumers will have the option of using a third-party, conventional phone connected to a Session Initiation Protocol standards-compliant analog terminal adaptor or a native-IP phone selected from a list of certified models."

So they'll get a MSP to administer their VoIP network and provide VoIP services for Starlink customers.

I don't know how this will work actually since it's a hell of a lot easier to get two copper wires to carry an analog phone signal out to a remote house than it is to send data over them at a decent rate, so I'd imagine most people would keep their existing house phones, or use their cell phones to do wifi hotspot calling from their home wifi network if they're on Starlink vs buying a bespoke VoIP service from them. Just not sure who their imagined customer is, exactly.

Xarn
Jun 26, 2015
Bazingas

Weedle
May 31, 2006




Xarn posted:

Bazingas

Bazingular Wireless

mllaneza
Apr 28, 2007

Veteran, Bermuda Triangle Expeditionary Force, 1993-1952




GreenNight posted:

We have production laptops that are from 2012. Still work fine, but we're trying to replace them. HP Elitebook 9470m to be exact.

With an SSD and 8GB RAM that isn't a terrible laptop. Your people don't have that, do they ?

GreenNight
Feb 19, 2006
Turning the light on the darkest places, you and I know we got to face this now. We got to face this now.

All of them were upgraded to an SSD and 16 gigs of RAM.

divabot
Jun 17, 2015

A polite little mouse!
yep. Limiting factor these days is RAM, as web pages turn from HTML/CSS into virtual machines running a megabyte of JavaScript. 4GB on a Chromebook, 8GB min/16GB preferable on a laptop. Mine is 32GB.

wolrah
May 8, 2006
what?

Data Graham posted:

Can't think of a good thread to ask this in so you guys are elected.

We all have the crazy right-wing uncle Thanksgiving story, but mine cornered me and tried to ask me about Elon Musk's Starlink system and how it's going to make all current cell phone and computer technology obsolete when he releases his new phone in January, "just you wait and see". I have literally not heard a single word about it and so I just made noncommittal grunting noises and let him exit the conversation looking like and thinking that he knew more than the family computer nerd.

It seems to be a real thing according to wikipedia, and whatever crackpot sources he gets his information from at least seem to have things like numbers of satellites correct. What's the general consensus among actual industry people though? Is it just another stupid Musk snake-oil thing? Does anyone think it's worth paying attention to?
Starlink is real and they are currently the best internet option for a lot of rural homes or businesses that would have otherwise been stuck on GEO satellite solutions.

Nothing about the current system is even close to portable though, the dish is the size of a large pizza and can draw up to 100 watts. Both of those things need to shrink by orders of magnitude for handheld use. On top of that, the network itself is currently not even allowing roaming within the area covered from a single base station, to move between "cells" you have to let support know, and the hardware to support roaming on a global scale only exists in the most recent batch of satellites. Said hardware has also yet to be proven to actually work.

Beyond all that, when it's running well it performs about the same as a good LTE connection.

Don't get me wrong, even as-is it's huge for rural users who had no real choices, but anyone who thinks it's going to disrupt incumbent service providers in areas they actually care about is insane. Especially if they think a portable implementation is months away when you can't even put it on a boat yet.


orange juche posted:

I don't know how this will work actually since it's a hell of a lot easier to get two copper wires to carry an analog phone signal out to a remote house than it is to send data over them at a decent rate, so I'd imagine most people would keep their existing house phones, or use their cell phones to do wifi hotspot calling from their home wifi network if they're on Starlink vs buying a bespoke VoIP service from them. Just not sure who their imagined customer is, exactly.
Rural businesses that need more advanced phones than some bare lines and a key system but can't justify the cost of getting a leased line.

Working for a MSP that's heavy on hosted VoIP at the edge of rural areas I am hoping Starlink succeeds so I have a viable backup connection for sites with unreliable cable and/or a possible alternative for sites in the middle of nowhere currently riding the ragged edge of DSL.

Sickening
Jul 16, 2007

Black summer was the best summer.

wolrah posted:

Starlink is real and they are currently the best internet option for a lot of rural homes or businesses that would have otherwise been stuck on GEO satellite solutions.

Nothing about the current system is even close to portable though, the dish is the size of a large pizza and can draw up to 100 watts. Both of those things need to shrink by orders of magnitude for handheld use. On top of that, the network itself is currently not even allowing roaming within the area covered from a single base station, to move between "cells" you have to let support know, and the hardware to support roaming on a global scale only exists in the most recent batch of satellites. Said hardware has also yet to be proven to actually work.

Beyond all that, when it's running well it performs about the same as a good LTE connection.

Don't get me wrong, even as-is it's huge for rural users who had no real choices, but anyone who thinks it's going to disrupt incumbent service providers in areas they actually care about is insane. Especially if they think a portable implementation is months away when you can't even put it on a boat yet.

Rural businesses that need more advanced phones than some bare lines and a key system but can't justify the cost of getting a leased line.

Working for a MSP that's heavy on hosted VoIP at the edge of rural areas I am hoping Starlink succeeds so I have a viable backup connection for sites with unreliable cable and/or a possible alternative for sites in the middle of nowhere currently riding the ragged edge of DSL.

Starlink seems like its just the current state of satellite internet, just at a large availability scale.

CitizenKain
May 27, 2001

That was Gary Cooper, asshole.

Nap Ghost

Sickening posted:

Starlink seems like its just the current state of satellite internet, just at a large availability scale.

I had 2 coworkers who got it, and it was a dramatic improvement in terms of quality over LTE one had, and CenturyLink dsl. Its a bit iffy for realtime stuff, especially if you are in a area with a lot of tree cover and can't see the horizon. But he went from barely having internet, to being able to work remote with a sdwan box.
Its not perfect, it dropped his calls a lot, but at least it works. Now how well it will scale is a mystery though.

Thanks Ants
May 21, 2004

#essereFerrari


From the limited amount of information I can pick up about the state of LTE in the US, the thing that makes it unsuitable for a home internet connection is more the costs and the data caps, whereas an unlimited data SIM can be had for £30 a month here. Up until a couple of years ago when that option became available we had the same problem, and were having to buy 4G routers with multiple SIM slots to use for backups, and juggling them as the quotas got used up.

The Iron Rose
May 12, 2012

:minnie: Cat Army :minnie:
More competition is rarely a bad thing. The reflexive hatred of goons for all things Elon Musk, while generally warranted, occasionally overreaches.

Arquinsiel
Jun 1, 2006

"There is no such thing as society. There are individual men and women, and there are families. And no government can do anything except through people, and people must look to themselves first."

God Bless Margaret Thatcher
God Bless England
RIP My Iron Lady
Starlink has other issues which might make it be a bit lovely as a whole package deal, but the service seems to do the job. It's just that it's a Musk project with Musk ego behind it and there have already been quite a few toes stepped on.

Sickening
Jul 16, 2007

Black summer was the best summer.

CitizenKain posted:

I had 2 coworkers who got it, and it was a dramatic improvement in terms of quality over LTE one had, and CenturyLink dsl. Its a bit iffy for realtime stuff, especially if you are in a area with a lot of tree cover and can't see the horizon. But he went from barely having internet, to being able to work remote with a sdwan box.
Its not perfect, it dropped his calls a lot, but at least it works. Now how well it will scale is a mystery though.

I have no doubt that its better than LTE and dsl depending on the place and the service. Satellite internet is not new and all the satellite tv providers have a version of it for over a decade now.

Mierdaan
Sep 14, 2004

Pillbug

Sickening posted:

I have no doubt that its better than LTE and dsl depending on the place and the service. Satellite internet is not new and all the satellite tv providers have a version of it for over a decade now.

The killer for satellite internet has always been the latency - isn't Starlink's big gimmick the comparably much-lower orbital height of their satellites?

Hughmoris
Apr 21, 2007
Let's go to the abyss!

Mierdaan posted:

The killer for satellite internet has always been the latency - isn't Starlink's big gimmick the comparably much-lower orbital height of their satellites?

Everything that I've read about Starlink shows it blowing away any competition at the moment. The old guard of satellites seems to be dirt slow in both speeds and latency. You are correct in that their satellites are at a lower orbit, allowing for lower latency.

The starlink subreddit is full of people comparing their outgoing service to Starlink.

*I don't care for Elon and I don't have Starlink but the service seems to provide a huge QOL increase for people in the sticks.

Mustache Ride
Sep 11, 2001



HughesNet/Viasat can only laughably be called internet in this day and age. Not enough bandwidth to stream anything, ping time in the 200-500ms on average. And if the wind slightly nudges the dish or a storm rolls through you've lost everything.

In the world of residential satellite internet, they are a poor alternative to Starlink. They only operate residential terminals in the US and Brazil for one thing, and they depend on SpaceX to launch their satellites. Elon may be a loving troll, but he's actually delivering a worldwide satellite constellation that can actually be called high speed internet to customers without any other option in remote places in the world. And no I don't mean the greater Seattle area.

Once this thing moves out of "beta" or whatever I expect mobile terminals and the lasers will help it become an alternative to LTE and possibly a better alternative to lovely ISP monopolies in cities maybe.

BaseballPCHiker
Jan 16, 2006

Mierdaan posted:

The killer for satellite internet has always been the latency - isn't Starlink's big gimmick the comparably much-lower orbital height of their satellites?

Thats my understanding of it. Much lower orbit, lower latency as a result.

For rural folks without other options its a huge improvement over traditional satellite internet.

Data Graham
Dec 28, 2009

📈📊🍪😋



This is all good to know, thanks. It's funny to think it could actually be exactly what my parents (who do live in the sticks and who were on 28.8 until just a few years ago, and still don't have cable) need.

Not at all the pervasive game-changer of all technology that the crazy uncle apparently read that it is though.

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wargames
Mar 16, 2008

official yospos cat censor

Mierdaan posted:

The killer for satellite internet has always been the latency - isn't Starlink's big gimmick the comparably much-lower orbital height of their satellites?

marine/mobile sat stuff is obscene

http://www.globalmarinenet.com/satellite-internet-at-sea-hardware-airtime-and-pricing/

Hardware cost: Around $6,000 for a Sailor 150, around $11,000 for a Sailor 250, and around $16,000 for a Sailor 500.
Airtime cost: While prepaid options are available, be sure to read the fine print. We recommend a postpaid plan. These start at $106 a month (includes 5 MB of data).
Estimated low-usage cost: Around $100 a month will cover you for email, downloading weather GRIB files, and doing emergency web-browsing.
Estimated high-usage cost: FleetBroadband postpaid options for high usage jump from 200 MB per month to 2 GB (with nothing in-between). 200 MB per month will cost you around $1,000 and 2 GB per month will cost you around $2,000.
Coverage: Excellent coverage up to 70 degrees latitude. For worldwide coverage, consider adding an Iridium Pilot as backup.

https://www.satphonestore.com/airtime/iridium-go-airtime-rates.html

wargames fucked around with this message at 16:02 on Nov 30, 2021

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