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Only thing I really wish was that Logains entrance in ep4 was the opener of ep1. I've gotten everyone I know hooked by linking a YouTube of ep2 theme opener, Logain opener, and then this: https://youtube.com/watch?v=OidIk-8P3po https://youtu.be/b4-tObGOpDQ https://youtu.be/zSOmKtBdV2w https://youtu.be/iZXpGXdnUvE I've learned midnight is not a time to try and post YouTube's correctly Barreft fucked around with this message at 06:15 on Dec 14, 2021 |
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Dec 14, 2021 06:02
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I really think WH gets a bad rap because it's sandwiched between PoD and Cost, but the ending is just so good and I like the Far Madding plotline 
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Dec 14, 2021 07:36
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CainFortea posted:What do we know of the forsaken. We know that the age of legend was actually sort of science fiction. We know the actor we want for him should be able to chew scenery like it's a bag of gummy bears. So what I'm saying is Jeffrey Combs Jared motherfucking Harris, also he dies by hanging himself
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Dec 14, 2021 07:57
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Data Graham posted:I could never figure out why Callandor is rendered in italics p much everything that comes from the old tongue is italicized angreal, saidin, saidar, cadin'sor, da'covale, grolm the only things that aren't are proper names of people and places
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Dec 14, 2021 08:05
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The Glumslinger posted:I really think WH gets a bad rap because it's sandwiched between PoD and Cost, but the ending is just so good and I like the Far Madding plotline Agreed!
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Dec 14, 2021 08:12
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The Glumslinger posted:I really think WH gets a bad rap because it's sandwiched between PoD and Cost, but the ending is just so good and I like the Far Madding plotline I just got past Far Madding on my reread and I have no clue what that bit was even supposed to accomplish - force Rand into another case of being trapped? The stedding nature of the city made it possible i guess, but it's such a weird speedbump in between his decision to cleanse the source and actually doing it. Combined with the pointless ashaman attack that caused it and the wet fart of Fain showing up ineffectually. The character interactions/extra backstory with Cadsuane, Lan, Verin and Nynaeve are good though.
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Dec 14, 2021 08:12
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ngl the worst thing about the show is that Moiraine is like the tallest woman in the tower MY IMMERSION
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Dec 14, 2021 08:38
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cailleask posted:ngl the worst thing about the show is that Moiraine is like the tallest woman in the tower Making Aram charismatic totally ruined the series for me. Show runners are frauds. I did notice though that Valda mentioned hand movements as being a crutch for channeling and Moraine seems to have some over the top gestures when she channels. Aristocratic theater? Or would she be screwed if she was immobilized? Siuan didn't seem to use any gestures when activating the Oath Rod, although maybe it's different with physical contact?
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Dec 14, 2021 08:49
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I love Show Aram, his journey is going to be so tragic 
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Dec 14, 2021 08:56
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yeah, aram in the books just sucks, so far his show version is way better
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Dec 14, 2021 08:57
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Dingleberry2 posted:Making Aram charismatic totally ruined the series for me. Show runners are frauds. it's morraine, so i'm gonna say it's a fakeout so people THINK she's a scrub that still has to wave her hands around like a dork when she's basically professor x. or because it's a visual medium with actors, so you probably want to show them doing stuff actually, on that note, did anyone see the tv show 'magicians'? they based their hand gestures on 'tutting' and initially i thought it was cringey, i grew to like it as a metaphor for the skill you need in weaving a spell. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RjN_pWTh5Z4 crepeface fucked around with this message at 09:11 on Dec 14, 2021 |
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Dec 14, 2021 08:58
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Killer robot posted:In particular, a lot of non book readers seem to love many things book readers are upset about. They like Stepin's story including Lan's funeral performance. They like (to hate) Valda and the Whitecloaks as presented. They like Mat despite his being an actual thief to start, in part because his apparently rough and poor home life and care for his sisters make it sympathetic. They enjoy the mystery of Perrin's wolf thing happening, without having met a guy that lives with wolves and explains "Oh you're like me, this is your future." They feel intensely for him having accidentally killed a loved one. The first view of a big city and powerful people being the White Tower rather than Caemlyn has them intensely interested in what's going on with the Aes Sedai's internal politics. What's been omitted doesn't really seem to leave them confused about the world or the character stories, apart from the very deliberate choice of making the identity of the Dragon Reborn more mysterious. They seem to have pretty accurate views of who the main characters are at this point of the story, and seem to be on the right track in guessing how the world and channeling work. This is rather disingenuous, because it's positing that non-book readers wouldn't have liked character beats that stuck closer to the book just as much. Like, the plucky rogue is an eminently popular archetype in media, and they don't remotely need a broken home in their backstory to make them so. And yes, the Stepin stuff is designed to pluck at emotional heartstrings, so of course a bunch of people with no knowledge of the material like it - but it's also a huge waste of time when there are still major issues with character presentation for actual important ones rather than someone that's basically never going to come up again. Like, just as an example, giving more emphasis to Thom helping the boys before apparently dying, and then Rand picking up and learning his flute as something of a memorial - you've now both added more facets to an actual important one, along with still keeping an emotional moment if you want. Hell, this actually might have worked somewhat going forward rather than as a one-off, as Rand absolutely keeps the flute around for a while as an emotional touchstone for what could have been compared to everything related to being the Dragon Reborn. Mat's had a fair bit of character so far, but Perrin's had very little other than being mopey - and yes, his character in the books is rather dull at this point too, but it's something they could have improved on in a way other than the fridging - and Rand, despite having the second most lines in the entire series so far, is still incredibly bland and almost entirely generic nice guy (or apparently vaguely abusive boyfriend, according to some people). He absolutely should have had something before the Dragon Reborn revelation - whether that be swordfighting or an instrument or something, but it really feels that in trying to deflect attention from him they've basically made his character as bland as they possibly could. Which is absolutely going to cause complaints from at least some people who don't appreciate just how horrible this "hero" role is when it's revealed. Disgruntled Bovine posted:Wait is Rand supposed to be an Arthur equivalent? I thought that was Artur Hawkwing. When is Artur Hawkwing every really compared to King Arthur, other than their names being similar? Could very easily be forgetting something, but very little in what I recall of Hawkwing's life and accomplishments have much to do with any Arthurian legend I can think of. Alexander the Great definitely seems the better reference for him. Meanwhile, even aside from the Sword in the Stone, Rand's also got the three women in his life to parallel certain depictions of Arthur including the iconic ending of Le Morte d'Arthur. Like, ultimately it's just references either way, as it's not like Rand's journey in general has much relation to Arthurian legend, but I just don't recall ANY real references to that in regards to Hawkwing.
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Dec 14, 2021 09:10
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Lord Koth posted:it really feels that in trying to deflect attention from him they've basically made his character as bland as they possibly could. Rand is bland as hell in the first book
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Dec 14, 2021 09:15
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Lord Koth posted:This is rather disingenuous, because it's positing that non-book readers wouldn't have liked character beats that stuck closer to the book just as much. Like, the plucky rogue is an eminently popular archetype in media, and they don't remotely need a broken home in their backstory to make them so. And yes, the Stepin stuff is designed to pluck at emotional heartstrings, so of course a bunch of people with no knowledge of the material like it - but it's also a huge waste of time when there are still major issues with character presentation for actual important ones rather than someone that's basically never going to come up again. Like, just as an example, giving more emphasis to Thom helping the boys before apparently dying, and then Rand picking up and learning his flute as something of a memorial - you've now both added more facets to an actual important one, along with still keeping an emotional moment if you want. Hell, this actually might have worked somewhat going forward rather than as a one-off, as Rand absolutely keeps the flute around for a while as an emotional touchstone for what could have been compared to everything related to being the Dragon Reborn. the important thing is to move character A to location B for plot C to occur in the most economical storytelling possible. anything outside of this is bad!!! though, i do agree that the core 5 were pretty bland and unlikeable (except for mat), but i thought they got better (except for perrin who will probably suck for the entire show). rand is already set up to be the noble one who's kind of a golden boy. some lines about having a heron blade or his archery or something would've been good tho. maybe it'll come up when they're travelling in the ways.
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Dec 14, 2021 09:21
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Lord Koth posted:This is rather disingenuous, because it's positing that non-book readers wouldn't have liked character beats that stuck closer to the book just as much. Like, the plucky rogue is an eminently popular archetype in media, and they don't remotely need a broken home in their backstory to make them so. And yes, the Stepin stuff is designed to pluck at emotional heartstrings, so of course a bunch of people with no knowledge of the material like it - but it's also a huge waste of time when there are still major issues with character presentation for actual important ones rather than someone that's basically never going to come up again. Like, just as an example, giving more emphasis to Thom helping the boys before apparently dying, and then Rand picking up and learning his flute as something of a memorial - you've now both added more facets to an actual important one, along with still keeping an emotional moment if you want. Hell, this actually might have worked somewhat going forward rather than as a one-off, as Rand absolutely keeps the flute around for a while as an emotional touchstone for what could have been compared to everything related to being the Dragon Reborn. But in the context of a show, if you're trying to attract viewers with no story knowledge, you have to make them think that even "important" characters can die. So Perrin's wife can die. So can seemingly important Green sister and her warder. I've seen many non-book reader reviewers who speculated that Nynaeve would bond Stepin eventually. So him dying gave them world building and drama. If you put all the focus on the Emonds Field people then eventually every side character is a Red Shirt and people will stop caring about people in danger because of plot armor. That's something that GoT definitely did right, as far as making danger real for every character up through season 6 or so anyways. That's not to say the show can't do better. I know it gets a lot of grief here for again not being exactly like the books, but I think the Witcher is an incredible adaptation. You can tell they really cared about the lore and the characters. In episode 1 Geralt takes Renfris badge. In episode 3 it's revealed as one of his prize possessions. By episode 6 he's had it worked into his sword hilt. Great continuity, and a great example of show, don't tell. Little things like that can go a long way and I wouldn't say there's been a bunch of evidence of that in WoT, so far, at least.
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Dec 14, 2021 09:31
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Yeah, the Red Shirt thing is a good point. I was going to mention something about focusing too hard on a central cast can lead to everyone else feeling like NPCs.
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Dec 14, 2021 09:44
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crepeface posted:actually, on that note, did anyone see the tv show 'magicians'? they based their hand gestures on 'tutting' and initially i thought it was cringey, i grew to like it as a metaphor for the skill you need in weaving a spell. Yup, that's always more or less what I had in mind for WoT magic as well. When I first read the books as a kid I also read a bunch of d&d novels that had magic involve really specific hand gestures like that and it bled over.
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Dec 14, 2021 09:45
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Rarity posted:Rand is bland as hell in the first book All three of the boys are. I’m doing a reread and am in the middle of TDR. Rand isn’t really interesting until he meets the Amrilyn acting like a border lord. It’s the first time you see the personality he shows for most of the rest of the books. Mat is boring until he’s healed in the tower and starts being lucky. Perrin gets interesting oddly enough around the time Faile shows up. Not because of her but that’s about when he quits running from the wolf thing and eavesdropping on Forsaken in T’A’R.
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Dec 14, 2021 09:58
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Dingleberry2 posted:But in the context of a show, if you're trying to attract viewers with no story knowledge, you have to make them think that even "important" characters can die. So Perrin's wife can die. So can seemingly important Green sister and her warder. I've seen many non-book reader reviewers who speculated that Nynaeve would bond Stepin eventually. So him dying gave them world building and drama. If you put all the focus on the Emonds Field people then eventually every side character is a Red Shirt and people will stop caring about people in danger because of plot armor. That's something that GoT definitely did right, as far as making danger real for every character up through season 6 or so anyways. ...No you don't, for one because WoT DOESN'T kill even secondary characters very often, and for two those characters are terrible examples. Because Kerene absolutely had all the hallmarks of a one episode character, with blatant red flags all throughout that episode, so her surviving would have been the real surprise. And there are plenty of TV shows where someone important is eventually killed and they didn't feel some need to establish this at the beginning - you're getting warped by GoT. We also already know Ingtar is cast, and is likely going to be a decently prominent role for multiple episodes before dying during wherever in the season they put the end of TGH, it's not like "major secondary character you thought was important can't die" won't come up anyways. As for "Nynaeve bonding Stepin," just lol. Even ignoring book knowledge, the framing of the storyline there wasn't remotely right for that kind of result. Lord Koth fucked around with this message at 10:07 on Dec 14, 2021 |
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Dec 14, 2021 10:04
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The Lord Bude posted:Sure but the ultimate Asmodean would be John Barrowman. Can chew scenery to pieces and is also an incredible singer. Considering Barrowman got MeTooed, he'd make a better Balthamel.
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Dec 14, 2021 10:21
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Moiraine does Dance Battle Magic because she is D R A M A, obviously.
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Dec 14, 2021 11:04
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Lord Koth posted:This is rather disingenuous, because it's positing that non-book readers wouldn't have liked character beats that stuck closer to the book just as much. Like, the plucky rogue is an eminently popular archetype in media, and they don't remotely need a broken home in their backstory to make them so. And yes, the Stepin stuff is designed to pluck at emotional heartstrings, so of course a bunch of people with no knowledge of the material like it - but it's also a huge waste of time when there are still major issues with character presentation for actual important ones rather than someone that's basically never going to come up again. Like, just as an example, giving more emphasis to Thom helping the boys before apparently dying, and then Rand picking up and learning his flute as something of a memorial - you've now both added more facets to an actual important one, along with still keeping an emotional moment if you want. Hell, this actually might have worked somewhat going forward rather than as a one-off, as Rand absolutely keeps the flute around for a while as an emotional touchstone for what could have been compared to everything related to being the Dragon Reborn. Sure, you could have made a more direct and literal adaptation that the audience would have liked more. Most just would have fallen into the categories of "Things the audience likes just as much but take twice as long to tell," "Things the audience likes as much but cost more to film", and "things it's actually hard to make the audience like as much because the books did them through lengthy internal monologue of POV characters instead of any sort of actual events." I grant that Rand's TV dullness is pretty book-accurate (seriously how far do you get in before he does more moping and being a gawking bumpkin), but it seems to me that non-readers I've heard from find Perrin plenty appealing. I grant, I would have liked to see more Thom. If they got the two-hour pilot or extra episodes they wanted I wonder if he would have been in the Two Rivers, or if introducing him later was an early decision. Though I guess one thing the TV take isn't lacking compared to the book is adults in the limelight.
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Dec 14, 2021 11:59
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CainFortea posted:My bad. I had just grabbed your line about it to reference everyone else talking about it. Ah well. No worries, friend.  The Lord Bude posted:I wonder if it was meant to suggest that it was maybe once part of a larger structure. That would make sense! Jedit posted:Considering Barrowman got MeTooed, he'd make a better Balthamel. Is Barrowman any good even? I only ever saw him on Doctor Who, where he... failed to impress.
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Dec 14, 2021 12:24
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goethe.cx posted:p much everything that comes from the old tongue is italicized Proper names of things don't count as proper names? Are there any other examples?
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Dec 14, 2021 12:43
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As for the King Arthur business and the Sword in the "Stone", lol yeah. Though I suppose I was kind of irritated at it being teased as "the sword that cannot be touched" and Thom introducing it by saying it might not even be a sword at all, so I was completely expecting it to be a metaphorical sword of some kind, but then it turns out to be ... a sword. Prominently featured being touched on the cover and everything. The real question is, is "Merlin" Thom Merrilin, or the Amyrlin?
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Dec 14, 2021 12:49
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Data Graham posted:As for the King Arthur business and the Sword in the "Stone", lol yeah. Though I suppose I was kind of irritated at it being teased as "the sword that cannot be touched" and Thom introducing it by saying it might not even be a sword at all, so I was completely expecting it to be a metaphorical sword of some kind, but then it turns out to be ... a sword. Prominently featured being touched on the cover and everything. yes
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Dec 14, 2021 12:59
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Data Graham posted:As for the King Arthur business and the Sword in the "Stone", lol yeah. Though I suppose I was kind of irritated at it being teased as "the sword that cannot be touched" and Thom introducing it by saying it might not even be a sword at all, so I was completely expecting it to be a metaphorical sword of some kind, but then it turns out to be ... a sword. Prominently featured being touched on the cover and everything. Callandor is not being touched on the cover of TDR.
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Dec 14, 2021 13:03
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You have to touch it with the one power, not with your hands, to use it effectively.
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Dec 14, 2021 13:13
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Nitrousoxide posted:You have to touch it with the one power, not with your hands, to use it effectively. Touching it without your hands expands the taint though
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Dec 14, 2021 13:26
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Data Graham posted:As for the King Arthur business and the Sword in the "Stone", lol yeah. Though I suppose I was kind of irritated at it being teased as "the sword that cannot be touched" and Thom introducing it by saying it might not even be a sword at all, so I was completely expecting it to be a metaphorical sword of some kind, but then it turns out to be ... a sword. Callandor isn't a sword, though. It's a sa'angreal that looks like a sword. And it genuinely can't be touched unless you can breach the wards around it.
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Dec 14, 2021 13:26
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Jedit posted:Considering Barrowman got MeTooed, he'd make a better Balthamel. wait what? aww poo poo I didn't know about that.
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Dec 14, 2021 13:34
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Ceci n'est pas une epee
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Dec 14, 2021 13:35
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ONE YEAR LATER posted:Ceci n'est pas une epee epee is stored in the stone
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Dec 14, 2021 13:39
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And here I’ve been hoping I’d get the chance to see his epee for years and apparently he just shows anyone and everyone? Why are there no pics of this on the internet?
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Dec 14, 2021 13:44
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Osmosisch posted:Touching it without your hands expands the taint though 
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Dec 14, 2021 14:45
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No Great Serpent ring, 3/10.
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Dec 14, 2021 14:47
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(Donkey Kong font) ExPaNd TaInT
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Dec 14, 2021 14:51
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Working on The Great Hunt and I’d forgotten how incredibly OBVIOUS “Selene” is bad business. I think they’re going to have to tone that down to make the trio look less like gibbering idiots for the show.
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Dec 14, 2021 14:59
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Definitely, she seems like she wants to eat them the whole time.
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Dec 14, 2021 15:02
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Nitrousoxide posted:Working on The Great Hunt and I’d forgotten how incredibly OBVIOUS “Selene” is bad business. I think they’re going to have to tone that down to make the trio look less like gibbering idiots for the show. it would be extremely funny if it played out like in the books and everyone is just incredibly horny and deferential to her while she says things that make it incredibly clear she's evil was she doing her low level compulsion thing there? i forget
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Dec 14, 2021 15:03
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