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jng2058 posted:I like a lot of that plotline....Elaida's attempt to undermine Alviarin actually doing some good when she's too oblique and Seaine gets the wrong idea and goes hunting the Black Ajah instead is pretty cool. And their initial success in outing Talene and starting to slowly unravel the Black Ajah network is nicely done. And hell, their "borrowing" of the Oath Rod prevents Verin from trying to use it to remove the Black Oaths and leads to her death. The other reason that plotline exists is to introduce you to a group of known good Aes Sedai within the Tower though, so that their surrender can be seen from inside.
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Dec 20, 2021 00:57
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CainFortea posted:The show prophecies are probably not going to be the same. And just because they're written down doesn't mean that translations errors can not occur. Exactly. For all we know, the show prophecies have something like "And the Dragon shall face the Heart of the Dark at the Eye and will save or destroy the world, and all who come between the Dragon and the Dark shall die". Bam, prophecy that Rand must go to the Eye, face Ishamael, and make a choice that either saves the world (fights Ishamael/destroys the Trolloc armies) or destroys the world by giving in to Ishy's temptations. The fact that Heart of the Dark != Dark One is missed. Gully Foyle fucked around with this message at 01:04 on Dec 20, 2021 |
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Dec 20, 2021 01:02
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i'm assuming the reveal of 'surprise! it was just a forsaken and not the actual dark one you've been seeing in your dreams and that you just fought, rand! get hosed!' is going to be part of the hook for season 2
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Dec 20, 2021 01:04
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I love one of the most obscure, silliest little scenes in book 2 where Moiraine is grilling Vandene for info on the prophecies, and asks about Toman Head being linked to the dragon. Vandene says "This is a bone between Adeleas and I. She thinks because it's M'avron, it refers to the watchers over the waves, but of course they use Avron, not M'avron." or something like that It's so unnecessarily focused on how prophecies can be known, translated, and still have inaccuracies or disagreements. Hell, look at the Torah and just how many Talmudic scholars wrote just how much poo poo about it silvergoose fucked around with this message at 01:28 on Dec 20, 2021 |
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Dec 20, 2021 01:06
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There hasn't been a lot of dreams about him in the TV show. Just a few scenes in the first 2-3 episodes and nothing since. And he never spoke. I'd not be surprised if most tv only folks have forgotten about him now. They've really not done much to establish him as an antagonist.
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Dec 20, 2021 01:08
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CainFortea posted:The show prophecies are probably not going to be the same. And just because they're written down doesn't mean that translations errors can not occur. Sure, I get this. But there's a number of extremely distinctive ones they're probably not cutting, even if not explicitly mentioned. For instance, given they're already making references to the Seachan I don't really see them cutting "Five ride forth, and four return, Above the Watchers over the Waves shall he proclaim himself..." because that's the climax of the hunt for the Horn as well as Ingtar's death, and both of those are powerful (and extremely important, in the case of the former) moments. Technically they could move the proclaiming himself sequence to the Eye, cutting out one of Ishamael's "deaths," but then Rand being at Falme is somewhat superfluous. This is an unclear until it happens prophecy though, so I can certainly see it happening but not being mentioned as one. Ultimately though, It's mainly Callandor and its importance to the Dragon Reborn which is the big sticking point, because that's both an extremely clear and concise prophecy (even if no one knew who the People of the Dragon were), as well as so many absolutely critical plot threads converging at Tear. Either it's extremely important to the Dragon - in which case why isn't Moraine concerned at all about it - or it's not, in which case why are Rand and the Aiel even going there?
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Dec 20, 2021 01:21
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Lord Koth posted:Sure, I get this. But there's a number of extremely distinctive ones they're probably not cutting, even if not explicitly mentioned. For instance, given they're already making references to the Seachan I don't really see them cutting "Five ride forth, and four return, Above the Watchers over the Waves shall he proclaim himself..." because that's the climax of the hunt for the Horn as well as Ingtar's death, and both of those are powerful (and extremely important, in the case of the former) moments. Technically they could move the proclaiming himself sequence to the Eye, cutting out one of Ishamael's "deaths," but then Rand being at Falme is somewhat superfluous. This is an unclear until it happens prophecy though, so I can certainly see it happening but not being mentioned as one. One, I wouldn't specifically count on Falme occuring like the books - there's so much to cut down we have no idea how things are going to happen. Personally, I think Rand will only have one fight against Ishy (after the Eye) happening in Tear with Callandor. Two, the prophecies could specifically be structured in an if/then structure. So there's a prophecy that the Dragon must face the Dark One or whoever at the Eye. If he doesn't die there, then Callandor. If he gets Callandor, then he can do the prophecies related to the Aiel. We know from the books that the Dark One's victory would likely render prophecies/visions/Foretellings void. So Rand must do something at the Eye first to prevent victory of the shadow - only then do further prophecies become valid.
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Dec 20, 2021 01:36
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I read the rescue arc as a different arc
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Dec 20, 2021 01:40
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how come perrins two ashaman bros don't TP back to the black tower and get more ashaman? seems like resolving the giant shaido problem could have used more than two ashaman, one of whom I think was only a dedicated.
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Dec 20, 2021 01:47
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Sure, three fights against Ishamael was always a bit excessive, and if you're cutting one then Falme is absolutely the one to cut. It's just that if it's not there then the Dragon being present is a bit superfluous, as you can't have him turning back the invasion (because that undercuts the Heroes of the Horn riding forth) and other than that he's only really got the fight against Turak. And I don't see the fight with Turak being cut because it's kind of a major character moment for Rand as well as directly leading into Ingtar's repentance and sacrifice. They might change the circumstances where those happen, but they still kind of have to be around Falme. Plus him being heavily injured at the end is what sets up the Lanfear reveal to Min, and it feels like they might want to keep that scene. Because "Lews Therin was and is mine, girl. Tend him well for me until I come for him." (possibly with some slight changes) is just such a establishing introduction to her, as well as bringing in the personal dangers of being around Rand (he's got a psycho ex from a previous life) rather than just the general dangers. edit: You absolutely can just have him there doing nothing, it just feels odd narratively. Kind of like if Superman wandered into Gotham in the middle of a Joker plot, got into a fight with Calendar Man, and then just sat on the sidelines as the rest of the JL showed up and resolved the situation. Lord Koth fucked around with this message at 02:03 on Dec 20, 2021 |
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Dec 20, 2021 01:49
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Ghislaine of YOSPOS posted:how come perrins two ashaman bros don't TP back to the black tower and get more ashaman? seems like resolving the giant shaido problem could have used more than two ashaman, one of whom I think was only a dedicated. I think they were poisoned or sick or something
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Dec 20, 2021 01:51
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Barreft posted:I think they were poisoned or sick or something They were doing a bunch of gateways and it was a major plot point that they were tired. Seems like they should have just gone to the BT and grabbed a couple guys off the bench
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Dec 20, 2021 01:56
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Considering the way the Black Tower became a viper's nest more or less from moment one I don't know if I'd want reinforcements from them.
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Dec 20, 2021 01:57
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Well I finally got to the confrontation between Egwene and Elaida in The Gathering Storm. Pretty bad rear end moment for Egwene. Hoping though that the tower being divided ends this book and we see Egwene as the Amyrliin. Not sure where the story can go with Egwene being put in a cell.
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Dec 20, 2021 02:01
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Hollismason posted:Not sure where the story can go with Egwene being put in a cell. When it comes, come back here and let us know you read it.
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Dec 20, 2021 02:04
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Ghislaine of YOSPOS posted:They were doing a bunch of gateways and it was a major plot point that they were tired. Seems like they should have just gone to the BT and grabbed a couple guys off the bench I think one explicitly said it'd be sketch since they were labeled traitors.
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Dec 20, 2021 02:08
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I'm about half way through Gathering Storms , its pretty good. I haven't really noticed that big of a change in the writing. I thought there would be more of a difference but there really isn't. Maybe less description? I dunno I'm enjoying it.
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Dec 20, 2021 02:44
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Hollismason posted:I'm about half way through Gathering Storms , its pretty good. I haven't really noticed that big of a change in the writing. I thought there would be more of a difference but there really isn't. Maybe less description? I dunno I'm enjoying it. Don't even stress over it until you finish the books. Otherwise you'll be picking up things and getting annoyed
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Dec 20, 2021 02:48
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It seems to be a much more direct style of writing than Jordan's which I like. I dunno I don't really notice that big of a difference really.Barreft posted:Don't even stress over it until you finish the books. Otherwise you'll be picking up things and getting annoyed edit:  I think Rand has lost his mind or finally been broken because he just killed Semirhage and the other Black Ajah then banished Cadsuane from him. This feels like it's really loving bad lol.
Hollismason fucked around with this message at 03:15 on Dec 20, 2021 |
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Dec 20, 2021 02:52
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"Direct" is definitely the way to describe Sanderson's writing compared to Jordan's. There are merits to both, I personally didn't mind a more fast-paced storyline
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Dec 20, 2021 03:33
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Hollismason posted:It seems to be a much more direct style of writing than Jordan's which I like. I dunno I don't really notice that big of a difference really. lmao oh man, keep going. you'll probably finish all 3 in a few days
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Dec 20, 2021 03:37
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Just got to the part where Mat encounters the village that seems to be under some sort of curse to go bugfuck crazy at night then be forced back to their homes every morning. That was loving weird but also good. I like all the weird poo poo from the bubbles of evil or whatever that show up in the books especially stuff like rooms rearranging themselves etc.. it makes it feel like it really is the end of times.
Hollismason fucked around with this message at 04:03 on Dec 20, 2021 |
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Dec 20, 2021 03:59
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Hollismason posted:Just got to the part where Mat encounters the village that seems to be under some sort of curse to go bugfuck crazy at night then be forced back to their homes every morning. That was loving weird but also good. I like all the weird poo poo from the bubbles of evil or whatever that show up in the books especially stuff like rooms rearranging themselves etc.. it makes it feel like it really is the end of times. The Patterns falling apart and the dark one is getting through a lot easier now
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Dec 20, 2021 04:20
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It's interesting how quickly people forget that Jordan goes out of his way to have a character in Eye explain at length that the prophecies are unreliable and hard to parse, specifically singling out Callandor and the fall of the Stone as a "who the gently caress knows what, exactly, it means or how it will happen?" piece of it. Reading the book as I watch the series and read the thread really drives home how many of the complaints about the show are actually specifically addressed in the book or drawn from the book with few changes.
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Dec 20, 2021 04:38
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Hollismason posted:
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Dec 20, 2021 07:26
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Rands not crazy, Nynaeve saw the light in his brain.
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Dec 20, 2021 07:54
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ONE YEAR LATER posted:Fully kitted out Aiel can run as fast as a horse, they are literally superhuman due to 2500 years living in a wasteland and preparing to be used as weapons. They are the People of the Dragon. They rule. They're superior fighters no doubt. 160 000 Shaido couldn't take Cairihien in the 7? Days before Rand caught up. Mat fights 5000 shaido with 3000 men mostly by using solid tactics like a defensive pike wall and charging their flanks with cavalry. They're very very good but theyre still just superior light infantry. It's still fantasy grounded in reality. My biggest pet peeve is that trollocs are disregarded the way they do. 800 pounds 10ft tall humanoids running at you will break almost anything just with their weight.
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Dec 20, 2021 12:07
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aiel/trollocs are as incredible or as mediocre as jordan needs them to be to set up his next plot beat or awesome moment
crepeface fucked around with this message at 13:16 on Dec 20, 2021 |
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Dec 20, 2021 13:08
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Ok, I think this is the best of those submitted. Last call for any other suggestions. What I'll probably do is post an announcement a little before 7 pm eastern on Thursday and give people till Saturday morning to request a gang tag, anyone who requests in that window and I can add it to their profile without screwing something up, I'll add it in. Gang tags will be clickable and link to this thread.
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Dec 20, 2021 13:18
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:Ok, I think this is the best of those submitted. Last call for any other suggestions. I liked the "kneel" version against the seven colours.
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Dec 20, 2021 13:29
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Umbra Dubium posted:I liked the "kneel" version against the seven colours. that one was good but it's a show line not a book line.
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Dec 20, 2021 13:32
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Braid tugging is a silly hallmark of the entire series, on your knees is an amazing but very narrow one line from the show, I agree with the choice.
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Dec 20, 2021 13:45
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Braid tuggers is for the best since it accurately represents the books and the show and will always be a thing and not just confined to one episode.
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Dec 20, 2021 14:12
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I still can't believe "you will marry the Daughter of the Nine Moons" was one of the prophecies, like it was setting that up to be some super oblique metaphor along the lines of "half the light of the world" whose meaning would gradually and intricately be revealed many books later, and then it turned out to be literally her title. Might as well have just said "you will marry Tuon, the Empress of Seanchan"  what this could mean
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Dec 20, 2021 15:24
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I think the second season will condense the books even more. Book 2 + 3 merged in one single entity. Then on third season they will slow down (hopefully).
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Dec 20, 2021 15:44
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Data Graham posted:I still can't believe "you will marry the Daughter of the Nine Moons" was one of the prophecies, like it was setting that up to be some super oblique metaphor along the lines of "half the light of the world" whose meaning would gradually and intricately be revealed many books later, and then it turned out to be literally her title. It wasn't supposed to be a mystery to the readers.
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Dec 20, 2021 15:48
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According to these media sites and whatever metrics they use, the show is still kickin rear end  Mediaplay News posted:Amazon Prime Video’s “The Wheel of Time” remained No. 1 on Parrot Analytics’ digital originals U.S. chart the week ended Dec. 17, its third week in the top spot. Based on a series of fantasy novels, the show had 43.4 times the demand of an average series during the week after a 4.57% gain in demand expressions, the proprietary metric Parrot uses to gauge a show’s popularity. “The Wheel of Time” was No. 5 on the list of overall TV shows. https://www.mediaplaynews.com/wheel-of-time-tops-parrots-digital-originals-charts-for-third-week/
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Dec 20, 2021 15:58
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silvergoose posted:It wasn't supposed to be a mystery to the readers. In fact it wasn't supposed to be a mystery to Mat either! He kept thinking "like a sword above my head, waiting to strike" for books and books. It was meant to be a known thing, not an inscrutable prophecy. It's not like "you must go to rhuidean or you will die" is mysterious! It's very plain!
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Dec 20, 2021 16:02
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Yeah he spends several books asking everyone he meets if they know who the Daughter of the nine moons is.
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Dec 20, 2021 16:07
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withak posted:Yeah he spends several books asking everyone he meets if they know who the Daughter of the nine moons is. I think he’s asking about it in a tavern and a Seanchan spy is like “who the gently caress is that and why the gently caress does he know that title I gotta get out of here”
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Dec 20, 2021 16:26
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