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Lily Catts posted:Not limited in the sense that monster heels are, but I think Toru Yano would be higher up the card if he didn't play a comedy gimmick. Dude has the best body slam in NJPW and was a legit amateur wrestler. I think Taguchi is real good too (he had great feuds with Devitt and KUSHIDA) but his current goofy self puts his ceiling at IWGP Jr. Tag champion. One thing I always praise about Yano is that he is believable winning or losing against anyone. This conversation has me wondering how a main event run would work for Yano. I don't think any promotion would risk it, but I'm curious how it would look. Would a 60-minute Yano match just suck rear end or would he find hilarious ways to work his act into the longer match format? I'm imagining a 'second wind' where he just yells AAAAAAAAAAAAA at the top of his lungs and rapid fire distracts the ref while low-blowing his opponent. Big move exchanges where the other guy is hitting him with murder moves and he's countering with flash pins. He's a good wrestler in addition to his goofiness and cheating, makes me wonder what a World Champ Yano would look like  I guess it goes against the entire purpose of Yano matches (short, funny, and a welcome relief for his opponents).Same curiosity about other meme-ish wrestlers too. Obviously I know OC can kick into high gear, but I have the mental image of the competitors staggering to their feet, barely conscious but unwilling to quit, and OC puts his hands back in his pockets.
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Apr 6, 2022 15:14
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Yano recently had a 35 minute match and it was loving dire e: checking cagematch it was apparently only 28 minutes, but felt twice that
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Apr 6, 2022 15:42
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Are you talking about the Chase Owens match? I think that would have been a great match if it went 10-15 but they didn't have enough to go 28. I'm so glad the "every match on the card goes 20" era of NJPW is over
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Apr 6, 2022 15:57
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I'd rather see Yano wrestle himself for 28 minutes than to ever have to see Chase Owens again
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Apr 6, 2022 16:13
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GEORGE W BUSHI posted:Are you talking about the Chase Owens match? I think that would have been a great match if it went 10-15 but they didn't have enough to go 28. Yeah, every sequence seemed to drag on and on, it became such a chore to watch. I vaguely remember them having a strap match early last year that went half the time and I enjoyed it quite a bit more
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Apr 6, 2022 16:14
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The recent Cody Rhodes and Jeff Hardy re-debuts had me thinking, who are some wrestlers who kept their exact same presentation between national promotions, right down to the theme music? The music would be the most limiting factor here, so I guess it favors guys who used classical/orchestral themes that were easier to license... so Ric Flair and Randy Savage are the examples that stick out to me (although I assume they used different recordings between WWF/WCW). Did Jerry Lawler use Also Sprach Zarathustra in Memphis? And of course, CM Punk may be the most notable modern example.
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Apr 6, 2022 16:24
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Minidust posted:The recent Cody Rhodes and Jeff Hardy re-debuts had me thinking, who are some wrestlers who kept their exact same presentation between national promotions, right down to the theme music? The music would be the most limiting factor here, so I guess it favors guys who used classical/orchestral themes that were easier to license... so Ric Flair and Randy Savage are the examples that stick out to me (although I assume they used different recordings between WWF/WCW). Did Jerry Lawler use Also Sprach Zarathustra in Memphis? And of course, CM Punk may be the most notable modern example. Keiji Mutoh uses his NJPW theme in NOAH. Christian uses his TNA theme in AEW and I'd count TNA as national when he was there.
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Apr 6, 2022 16:39
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GEORGE W BUSHI posted:Keiji Mutoh uses his NJPW theme in NOAH. Christian uses his TNA theme in AEW and I'd count TNA as national when he was there. His AEW theme is actually an identical cover of his TNA theme done by Mikey Rukus.
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Apr 6, 2022 16:42
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Goldberg kept the same theme right?
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Apr 6, 2022 16:42
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Defenestrategy posted:Goldberg kept the same theme right? WWE changed his gear and theme when he debuted in 2003.
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Apr 6, 2022 16:43
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Minidust posted:The recent Cody Rhodes and Jeff Hardy re-debuts had me thinking, who are some wrestlers who kept their exact same presentation between national promotions, right down to the theme music? The music would be the most limiting factor here, so I guess it favors guys who used classical/orchestral themes that were easier to license... so Ric Flair and Randy Savage are the examples that stick out to me (although I assume they used different recordings between WWF/WCW). Did Jerry Lawler use Also Sprach Zarathustra in Memphis? And of course, CM Punk may be the most notable modern example. Even Flair had a knock-off theme in his original 90s WWF run.
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Apr 6, 2022 17:09
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Minidust posted:The recent Cody Rhodes and Jeff Hardy re-debuts had me thinking, who are some wrestlers who kept their exact same presentation between national promotions, right down to the theme music? The music would be the most limiting factor here, so I guess it favors guys who used classical/orchestral themes that were easier to license... so Ric Flair and Randy Savage are the examples that stick out to me (although I assume they used different recordings between WWF/WCW). Did Jerry Lawler use Also Sprach Zarathustra in Memphis? And of course, CM Punk may be the most notable modern example. Maybe not quite the same thing, but Minoru Suzuki takes Kaze Ni Nare and its accompanying video everywhere he goes.
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Apr 6, 2022 22:25
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Scott Steiner was always Scott Steiner once he was fully Scott Steiner
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Apr 6, 2022 22:46
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Trying posted:Scott Steiner was always Scott Steiner once he was fully Scott Steiner He is the initial singularity of rasslin. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Initial_singularity
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Apr 6, 2022 22:47
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Trying posted:Scott Steiner was always Scott Steiner once he was fully Scott Steiner He did get a different theme in WWE, though it did start with a similar siren sound effect to his last WCW theme. Booker T. and the others who were in the first wave of the Invasion, Ric Flair right after the Invasion, and the nWo a while later all kept their WCW music in WWE, but that's kind of a special case. I believe all other WCW guys who showed up later came with new themes.
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Apr 6, 2022 22:55
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So, um...it seems like the issue is now "We brought Roman back and finally turned him heel, he was much better at it, and that was good in 2020, but now we've had him reign as champion and overexposed him so much that we're right back to thinking he totally sucks", correct? Be careful what you wish for, along with "Vince finds a way (to gently caress it up.)"?
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Apr 7, 2022 02:39
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Cornwind Evil posted:So, um...it seems like the issue is now "We brought Roman back and finally turned him heel, he was much better at it, and that was good in 2020, but now we've had him reign as champion and overexposed him so much that we're right back to thinking he totally sucks", correct? Be careful what you wish for, along with "Vince finds a way (to gently caress it up.)"? It's kind of similar to the Britt Baker run where every match feels the same and nobody gets over, and WWE doesn't even have enough guys anymore to make the match feel fresh. I'm a Roman guy, but he's not good enough to make every match in a long run feel special, and eventually he ends up going over guys the fan base is really behind (Finn, Big E) and you're just gonna lose favor. Now there doesn't seem to be an end in sight, everyone expects this to go to WM39 vs The Rock.
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Apr 7, 2022 02:47
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they also don't have the decency to just put Roman over clean, either; the botched handcuff spot against....Owens? & the top rope giving way under Demon Finn, just to name two comical "Roman can't lose but he also can't just win..." finishes.
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Apr 7, 2022 05:41
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In theory, having an amazing unbeatable champion is cool, and there were probably points you could argue Roman Reigns was a better champion than whoever AEW had at the time. But the fact that I almost bet [whatever maximum the betting agency would allow] on Roman to win despite not watching WWE because you do not need to watch WWE to know how Roman Reigns matches are going to go, well, that is really not so good. I bet Cody really believes he is going to be allowed to beat Roman, hahahaha (I say this, then Paul Heyman turns on Roman to join Cody and starts wearing polka dots en route to Cody squashing Reigns in a coal miner's glove match) But yeah I love thinking about Vince absolutely planning on the Rock beating Roman at Wrestlemania next year and then the Rock does not agree to do it and so Roman just keeps the belt against, hmm, Bron Breakker, only to lose it at Wrestlemania 40 to Goldberg
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Apr 7, 2022 05:56
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Lily Catts posted:Not limited in the sense that monster heels are, but I think Toru Yano would be higher up the card if he didn't play a comedy gimmick. Dude has the best body slam in NJPW and was a legit amateur wrestler. I think Taguchi is real good too (he had great feuds with Devitt and KUSHIDA) but his current goofy self puts his ceiling at IWGP Jr. Tag champion. Look for his run in NOAH in 2013, when KENTA had his big GHC Heavyweight Championship reign, prior to his departure to go do a whole lot of nothing in the WWE. Yano was built as a challenger at this point, and it's probably the closest Yano'll probably ever get to the top of the card. To be quite frank, their match was probably the weakest of KENTA's run as champion. I remember it was the one I enjoyed the least at that point.
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Apr 7, 2022 05:57
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Yano had some serious matches with Tanahashi too that were just there. I think Yano knows he can't really go at that high level so he's just gone all in on comedy and character work which probably is a good move since it means he'll always have a spot in the mid card just by being different
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Apr 7, 2022 06:05
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The Rock isn't coming back for a match of any kind unless he's squashing his opponent in one move. The last time he did a full match he got hurt and had to delay filming of one of his movies by several months (Hercules, IIRC), and he's a way bigger star with way more projects on his table now than he was back then. There's also the fact that he just doesn't care anymore about the WWE. He's so far beyond them it's not even funny. They dedicated an entire month and an entire PPV to him and all he could do in return was send them a movie prop. Hell, even Impact managed to get a cell phone video from him. Impact! It just seems like he's completely done with the WWE, as he should be, and no amount of begging from Vince is going to change that.
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Apr 7, 2022 06:21
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I think it'd be hilarious is The Rock finally did come back for the match against Roman that Vince so desperately wants, but it turns out the only hole in The Rock's schedule means it has to happen on an ep of Smackdown on a week where they're bumped to FS1
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Apr 7, 2022 14:06
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The whole "this is all leading to the Rock" idea from the Fed is crazy because.....there's no way you actually have Rock win, right?oldskool posted:they also don't have the decency to just put Roman over clean, either; the botched handcuff spot against....Owens? & the top rope giving way under Demon Finn, just to name two comical "Roman can't lose but he also can't just win..." finishes. Also passed out Goldberg when the ref ignored Bill on the ropes. Did beat Big E with ease, clean as a sheet. Imagine that
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Apr 7, 2022 15:15
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Rock wins. Loses/vacates the title the next night. Bing bong so simple.
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Apr 7, 2022 15:27
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Rock wins, trades the belt for his gold egg and rides off into the sunset.
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Apr 7, 2022 15:31
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Davros1 posted:I think it'd be hilarious is The Rock finally did come back for the match against Roman that Vince so desperately wants, but it turns out the only hole in The Rock's schedule means it has to happen on an ep of Smackdown on a week where they're bumped to FS1 Dwayne losing in the ratings to Allie would very funny
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Apr 7, 2022 15:57
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Minidust posted:The recent Cody Rhodes and Jeff Hardy re-debuts had me thinking, who are some wrestlers who kept their exact same presentation between national promotions, right down to the theme music? The music would be the most limiting factor here, so I guess it favors guys who used classical/orchestral themes that were easier to license... so Ric Flair and Randy Savage are the examples that stick out to me (although I assume they used different recordings between WWF/WCW). Did Jerry Lawler use Also Sprach Zarathustra in Memphis? And of course, CM Punk may be the most notable modern example. Before I ever saw old nitros on the Network I had already Mandela’d myself into believing jericho had Break The Walls Down as his theme in wcw.
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Apr 7, 2022 16:04
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D.N. Nation posted:The whole "this is all leading to the Rock" idea from the Fed is crazy because.....there's no way you actually have Rock win, right?
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Apr 7, 2022 18:58
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The Rock should show up on AEW as The Paper Then as he's cutting a promo The Scissors comes out and beats him
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Apr 8, 2022 02:12
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sticklefifer posted:The Rock should show up on AEW as The Paper Why would Rock be wrestling The Acclaimed? 
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Apr 8, 2022 02:14
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sticklefifer posted:The Rock should show up on AEW as The Paper I thought Arn moved on to firearms.
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Apr 8, 2022 02:53
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sticklefifer posted:The Rock should show up on AEW as The Paper it'd definitely be a statement for Max Caster to finally get a big win against a debuting talent, and one as famous as Dwayne Johnson!
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Apr 8, 2022 02:54
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sticklefifer posted:The Rock should show up on AEW as The Paper Hopefully Sid doesn't forget them.
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Apr 8, 2022 03:21
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Rusty Shackelford posted:Hopefully Sid doesn't forget them. They said, HOPEFULLY SID DOESN'T FORGET THEM!!!!
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Apr 8, 2022 11:01
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Sting stands in the rafters, brandishing a squeegee.
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Apr 8, 2022 12:11
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Minidust posted:The recent Cody Rhodes and Jeff Hardy re-debuts had me thinking, who are some wrestlers who kept their exact same presentation between national promotions, right down to the theme music? The music would be the most limiting factor here, so I guess it favors guys who used classical/orchestral themes that were easier to license... so Ric Flair and Randy Savage are the examples that stick out to me (although I assume they used different recordings between WWF/WCW). Did Jerry Lawler use Also Sprach Zarathustra in Memphis? And of course, CM Punk may be the most notable modern example. Savage's WCW theme was an awful bastardization of "Pomp & Circumstance" which is bizarre because it's a public domain composition.
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Apr 8, 2022 12:38
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sticklefifer posted:The Rock should show up on AEW as The Paper Why isn't The Scissors doing the cutting, have you ever worked in wrestling before??
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Apr 8, 2022 13:24
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Pope Corky the IX posted:Savage's WCW theme was an awful bastardization of "Pomp & Circumstance" which is bizarre because it's a public domain composition. It is weird that with all of Turner's resources they couldn't find a good orchestral version of the song but then WCW everybody.
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Apr 8, 2022 15:02
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But they didn't need to find anything else, the version WWF used is the same one that's used in high school graduations and in movies and television, it's absolutely free.
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Apr 8, 2022 15:59
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