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Bulldog, Austin and Owen are the big singles matches. For Owen and Austin, it's probably worth watching the whole series as there's fun long term storytelling that you might miss out on if you just watch the classic matches. HBK is worth watching just for historical context, but again, it would help to watch the leadup too. The Canadian Stampede IYH match is worth watching just to experience the crowd. The Benoit Nitro match is weird. It was a great match, but an Owen tribute match vs. Benoit might be a little off-putting for people.
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Jun 27, 2022 16:25
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The Owen cage match, for me at least, isn't very good when you watch it on it's own. But if you take into account the 12 months of build, Owen's turn at the Rumble and their WrestleMania match, then it's easy to see why it's so lauded. Come to think of it, all of Bret's matches work better when you treat them as part of a series. The Bulldog match from 95 is really good because Davey has beaten Bret before when he was a nicer dude. Now Bulldog has developed a real vicious nasty attitude and this match is for the more important belt. Cornette, managing Bulldog really convinced me that Bret didn't stand a chance again, just like in Wembley.
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Jun 27, 2022 16:46
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pseudodragon posted:Bulldog, Austin and Owen are the big singles matches. For Owen and Austin, it's probably worth watching the whole series as there's fun long term storytelling that you might miss out on if you just watch the classic matches. Did Austin ever beat Bret? To me the perfect guy for Austin to beat for his world title would have been Bret but that obviously didn't happen
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Jun 27, 2022 16:53
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he did in the 1997 royal rumble
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Jun 27, 2022 16:54
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Nope. Lost the first match by having the million dollar dream reversed into a pin, lost the 2nd rather famously by stoppage
El Gallinero Gros fucked around with this message at 17:13 on Jun 27, 2022 |
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Jun 27, 2022 16:54
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Shard posted:Did Austin ever beat Bret? To me the perfect guy for Austin to beat for his world title would have been Bret but that obviously didn't happen Yeah, there's a non-Montreal world where Austin destroying the sanctimonious prick Bret at WM 98 would have been huge.
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Jun 27, 2022 17:08
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Austin would constantly get the better of the Harts on TV and earned the greatest victory he could have over Bret by turning the fans against him. But Bret was always superior to Austin in the ring. The supposed match between them at WrestleMania 14 would undoubtedly been a classic, with Austin finally going over.
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Jun 27, 2022 18:43
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in an ideal world, Bret/Austin for the belt would've main evented that Mania and Bret would've been the Fed's top heel for the next year oh well. Great match anyway
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Jun 27, 2022 18:52
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It's actually a great what if - Does Austin hit the same level of popularity if they go Hart/Austin at that mania or was it the Vince feud that took him to Hogan levels of drawing power
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Jun 27, 2022 19:56
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It was certainly the Vince feud.
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Jun 27, 2022 20:14
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Where does Bret fit in if Austin begins feuding with Vince? Would WWF have been able to afford Tyson if they're still paying for Bret's massive contract?
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Jun 27, 2022 21:31
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Kosmo Gallion posted:Where does Bret fit in if Austin begins feuding with Vince? Would WWF have been able to afford Tyson if they're still paying for Bret's massive contract? Bret could be Vince's corporate champion. And Bret had agreed to restructure, I think?
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Jun 27, 2022 21:33
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Yeah I’m pretty sure Bret offered to work something out and Vince told him no, just go get paid. Edit: no, now I’m second guessing myself and maybe it was Vince who wanted to restructure and Bret said no, so Vince told him to go ask WCW for an offer. History Comes Inside! fucked around with this message at 21:38 on Jun 27, 2022 |
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Jun 27, 2022 21:35
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edogawa rando posted:I recall a ref got fired from the WWE because someone (my brain insists it was Miz) failed to kick out. Wasn't this that brief period where Vince ordered the refs to count as if it was a shoot? And then the ref does that, and Vince fired him for following instructions.
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Jun 27, 2022 21:41
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I thought Vince only became an on screen character because of the Screwjob. No Bret leaving, no Mr. McMahon. Austin would still be a star but it's kinda like that Vince/Hogan feud about "who made who." Would Stone Cold have been the biggest thing ever without an equally great heel?
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Jun 27, 2022 21:52
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The origins of Mr McMahon were already in the work before SS97. Stuff like Bret walking over to commentary and slapping Vince's headset and stuff had already happened a decent amount. someone who knows their history better would probably be able to provide more detail but I'm pretty sure Vince had also done something of a test run of Mr McMahon somewhere else? Memphis or somewhere, I wanna say. I could be completely making this up but I swear I'm not
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Jun 27, 2022 22:04
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Visual Basic Bitch posted:The origins of Mr McMahon were already in the work before SS97. Stuff like Bret walking over to commentary and slapping Vince's headset and stuff had already happened a decent amount. No, you're right, he did do a thing in Memphis. I've seen clips of it on YT.
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Jun 27, 2022 22:06
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NikkolasKing posted:No, you're right, he did do a thing in Memphis. I've seen clips of it on YT. McMemphis. It's basically a dry run, and it ruled.
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Jun 27, 2022 22:10
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the first stunner to vince was september 97
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Jun 27, 2022 22:33
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There was also that bit in 97 where Austin knocked Vince off the apron "accidentally" and McMahon looked horrified .
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Jun 27, 2022 22:49
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Visual Basic Bitch posted:The origins of Mr McMahon were already in the work before SS97. Stuff like Bret walking over to commentary and slapping Vince's headset and stuff had already happened a decent amount. Vince thought he would come out of Montreal a babyface, he did not plan to become a heel character at the time.
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Jun 27, 2022 23:06
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Davros1 posted:Wasn't this that brief period where Vince ordered the refs to count as if it was a shoot? And then the ref does that, and Vince fired him for following instructions. It was a Mark Henry/Matt Hardy? feud that was derailed by an injury. Upon whoever's return, there was a tag team match as the blowoff. Someone (not Henry) forgot to kick out and since refs were under orders to "shoot" count, the ref kept going. He looked like a deer in headlights while holding the winner's arm up, then was promptly fired for screwing up the match.
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Jun 27, 2022 23:11
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Davros1 posted:Wasn't this that brief period where Vince ordered the refs to count as if it was a shoot? And then the ref does that, and Vince fired him for following instructions. I believe that was the case. So a ref did exactly as directed and got fired for it by the person who told him to do it.
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Jun 27, 2022 23:36
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What's the origin in puro of yelling out someone's name before you hit them? I feel like I've been seeing it a LOT more frequently in recent years than in previous decades.
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Jun 28, 2022 03:55
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Who is this Claudio guy ppl in AEW are gushing about and why is he a "technical" wrestler when all he did was big power moves?
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Jun 28, 2022 04:20
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the european uppercut is considered technical due to late 90s and early 2000s video game categorization.
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Jun 28, 2022 04:21
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He did a sharpshooter!
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Jun 28, 2022 04:31
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I think power wrestlers who actually have good matches are automatically categorized as technical wrestlers
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Jun 28, 2022 06:18
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hell that's a good point. if somebody is a power wrestler but not a brawler then they probably do a lot of technical strikes and suplexes and throws so then they will be called Technicalman 5000
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Jun 28, 2022 06:28
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MassRafTer posted:Vince thought he would come out of Montreal a babyface, he did not plan to become a heel character at the time. Good god that's such a Vince way of thinking.
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Jun 28, 2022 07:35
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Mekchu posted:Who is this Claudio guy ppl in AEW are gushing about and why is he a "technical" wrestler when all he did was big power moves? He used to do a lot more technical stuff before being doomed to being stuck in WWE for a decade, iirc.
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Jun 28, 2022 08:18
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it's also out of keyfabe but claudio is quite possibly the best base in wrestling, so he can help his opponents perform some absolutely wild poo poo on him
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Jun 28, 2022 08:31
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PublicOpinion posted:He did a sharpshooter! He countered into it too.
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Jun 28, 2022 12:51
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Mekchu posted:Who is this Claudio guy ppl in AEW are gushing about and why is he a "technical" wrestler when all he did was big power moves? Claudio Castagnoli was a huge deal in the indies in the 2000's due to his size, amazing strength, charisma, and insane versatility as a worker. In a time when WWE didn't want any tiny indie wrestlers, Claudio was seen as a can't-miss prospect. WWE hired him and after a good run in NXT, he went to the main roster. There, as Antonio Cesaro (later just Cesaro because Vince is weird), he had such gimmicks as "angry rugby player," "yodeler," and "foreign guy who loves the potential of America, but hates Americans." WrestleMania 30 was his big breakout moment where he turned face and won the first Andre the Giant Memorial Battle Royal by straight-up picking up Big Show and bodyslamming him out of the ring. He was immediately given Paul Heyman as a mouthpiece, which not only made him a heel again, but was also for the sake of advertising the existence of part-timer Brock Lesnar ("MY CLIENT BROCK LESNAR ENDED THE UNDERTAKER'S STREAK! Also, here's Cesaro."). Cesaro became an afterthought and a bit of a jobber to the point that when Steve Austin had Vince as a guest on his live podcast, he grilled him over absolutely loving up Cesaro's push. Vince shrugged and stated that Cesaro 1) is Swiss and 2) couldn't grab the brass ring. Whatever that means. Cesaro remained a staple in the midcard until feuding with Sheamus. They were having a Best of Seven series where the winner would get a title shot. They ended up being 3-3 and their last match ended on a draw, so they became a tag team instead, calling themselves The Bar. They were a solid team and big part of the tag division, but it's WWE and WWE doesn't care about tag teams. Afterwards, Cesaro would occasionally get the hints of a big push in order to trick him into re-signing with the company, including a big singles win against Seth Rollins at WrestleMania 37. Then he'd fall back down the card. His contract was up yet again and while Kevin Owens, Sami Zayn, and AJ Styles were getting huge money to stick around, Cesaro just had the regular offer. He left and while there were reports that he was going to go back to WWE, Bryan Danielson's injury leading into Forbidden Door gave Tony Khan reason enough to open his wallet.
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Jun 28, 2022 15:44
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Gavok posted:Claudio Castagnoli was a huge deal in the indies in the 2000's due to his size, amazing strength, charisma, and insane versatility as a worker. In a time when WWE didn't want any tiny indie wrestlers, Claudio was seen as a can't-miss prospect. WWE hired him and after a good run in NXT, he went to the main roster. There, as Antonio Cesaro (later just Cesaro because Vince is weird), he had such gimmicks as "angry rugby player," "yodeler," and "foreign guy who loves the potential of America, but hates Americans." This is a really good summary and I would like to add the following short video about Claudio's feud with Eddie Kingston in Chikara. For anyone who was wondering why, at the end of Forbidden Door, Eddie was screaming "gently caress YOU" at Claudio, this video explains it. They have unfinished business and I'm really looking forward to seeing where AEW takes it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_SX21cxOtag
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Jun 28, 2022 18:02
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During the "angry foreigner who loves the idea of America" they made sure to note that he immigrated the "right" way.
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Jun 28, 2022 18:33
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Gavok posted:
claudio had been quietly signed since june 2
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Jun 28, 2022 18:51
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This came up in another discord I'm in and maybe we already came to the correct conclusion but I figure I'll ask here too to see if anyone has any insight that I may have missed. Is there a particular reason that women (and joshi in particular) throw full arm strikes to the chest rather than forearms to the neck that men do? My guess was that because of the relative lack of definition in their forearms/necks it's more dangerous for joshi to do because there's a higher chance of bone hitting bone or bone hitting flesh, so it's easier to do full arm strikes to the chest which gives a good 'thud' sound but has less of a chance of breaking anything as long as you aim below the collar.
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Jun 28, 2022 19:30
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Endless Mike posted:During the "angry foreigner who loves the idea of America" they made sure to note that he immigrated the "right" way. Well zeb coulter as a heel said that when Claudio was partnered with Hager, yes.
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Jun 28, 2022 19:34
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0konner posted:Well zeb coulter as a heel said that when Claudio was partnered with Hager, yes. Yes, I should have clarified that his manager said that, not Claudio himself.
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Jun 28, 2022 20:26
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