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Oxyclean posted:That wouldn't make it Meadows sending the message - it's from someone saying they heard from Meadows about the deposition. Perhaps re-read the message. "He wants me to let you know" is the most important phrase here. Hopefully we hear more about the witness tampering during later hearings.
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Jul 1, 2022 07:25
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TheSpartacus posted:Perhaps re-read the message. "He wants me to let you know" is the most important phrase here. I could text a witness that same sentence and put 'thespartacus' in there and it doesn't make it evidence that you're trying to witness tamper. It just makes it evidence that someone is trying to witness tamper and blame it on you. Anyways the people involved are stupid enough that it's entirely possible that someone actually tried to witness tamper one degree from mark meadows from their home wifi network or something.
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Jul 1, 2022 08:20
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Oxyclean posted:That wouldn't make it Meadows sending the message - it's from someone saying they heard from Meadows about the deposition. Wtf? No. Just because he said, 'so and so told me to tell you' doesn't mean he isn't doing the tampering. Someone else may also be doing tampering but it doesn't matter if so and so actually said it, the person conveying the message is the one making the threat and the is doing tampering.
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Jul 1, 2022 13:51
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Murgos posted:Wtf? No. Just because he said, 'so and so told me to tell you' doesn't mean he isn't doing the tampering. It wasn't Meadows delivering the message. We still don't know who that was. the person delivering the message indicated the Meadows was aware they were being deposed. Whoever delivered the message for sure did some tampering. Unclear if Meadows directly did or not.
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Jul 1, 2022 14:09
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Herstory Begins Now posted:I could text a witness that same sentence and put 'thespartacus' in there and it doesn't make it evidence that you're trying to witness tamper. It just makes it evidence that someone is trying to witness tamper and blame it on you. It gives a pretty strong reason to look into it however. They need to subpoena the texters phone records and depose the texter under oath immediately. I fully expect to see phone records showing that Meadows called someone then immediately the guy texted the witness to intimidate them.
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Jul 1, 2022 14:10
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I'm assuming they have because it was likely Hutchinson that gave them a heads up https://twitter.com/hugolowell/status/1542681156155580416
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Jul 1, 2022 14:15
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Heck Yes! Loam! posted:I'm assuming they have because it was likely Hutchinson that gave them a heads up Probably also why they rushed her to take the stand, because if she had to go through that intense pressure for a few weeks or months she might have folded.
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Jul 1, 2022 14:21
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Murgos posted:Wtf? No. Just because he said, 'so and so told me to tell you' doesn't mean he isn't doing the tampering. I think that's what I'm saying? It's not hard evidence Meadows is tampering - whoever the message is from -is.-
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Jul 1, 2022 14:31
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Oxyclean posted:I think that's what I'm saying? It's not hard evidence Meadows is tampering - whoever the message is from -is.- Yeah, start taking down the easy targets to break down these creep's support system. Whoever sent the message goes to jail and fast. Then others will be far less willing to cooperate with these assholes when Meadows says "hey go intimidate this witness for me". Seems pretty easy - scare people away from helping the monsters and eventually they have to get their hands dirty themselves, or stop witness tampering.
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Jul 1, 2022 15:14
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Meadows knew Hutchinson was deposed, and he then told Mr. E. Texter. Texter then reached out to try and intimidate Hutchinson. Whether Texter did so of their own accord or at Meadows' (implicit or explicit) direction is an open question. I wouldn't say that Texter acting on their own is the most likely scenario, but it's certainly possible.
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Jul 1, 2022 15:37
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Tampering is a fun word to say. Tamper tamper tamper tampering
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Jul 1, 2022 16:13
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Tamper bay buccaneers
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Jul 1, 2022 16:18
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Hey, Mister Tampering Man, make a call for me 
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Jul 1, 2022 16:29
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mdemone posted:Tampering is a fun word to say. Tamper Tantrum
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Jul 1, 2022 16:48
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Oxyclean posted:I think that's what I'm saying? It's not hard evidence Meadows is tampering - whoever the message is from -is.- Sorry, minsunderstood.
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Jul 1, 2022 16:59
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Jethro posted:Meadows knew Hutchinson was deposed, and he then told Mr. E. Texter. Texter then reached out to try and intimidate Hutchinson. Whether Texter did so of their own accord or at Meadows' (implicit or explicit) direction is an open question. I wouldn't say that Texter acting on their own is the most likely scenario, but it's certainly possible. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ian_Kershaw#%22Working_Towards_the_F%C3%BChrer%22_concept It's explicitly implicit.
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Jul 1, 2022 17:00
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Murgos posted:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ian_Kershaw#%22Working_Towards_the_F%C3%BChrer%22_concept and here i am thinking that Texter was the proper name of someone, and i've been googling that for the past x minutes trying to find out what office they held.
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Jul 1, 2022 17:03
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Pissed Ape Sexist posted:Hey, Mister Tampering Man, make a call for me 
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Jul 1, 2022 17:12
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Tinker, Tamper, Donnie, Spy
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Jul 1, 2022 17:16
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Hey, Mister Tamper Man, tamper me banana
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Jul 1, 2022 17:23
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Tamper? I just met 'er!
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Jul 1, 2022 17:26
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Shiver me Tampers
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Jul 1, 2022 17:48
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TAMPER! *click*
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Jul 1, 2022 18:05
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Blow me where the tampers is
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Jul 1, 2022 18:10
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Please Universe, let it be ginnie thomas sending text threats.
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Jul 1, 2022 18:19
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Jul 1, 2022 18:20
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Murgos posted:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ian_Kershaw#%22Working_Towards_the_F%C3%BChrer%22_concept Cimber posted:and here i am thinking that Texter was the proper name of someone, and i've been googling that for the past x minutes trying to find out what office they held. Sorry for my dad joke level pseudonym
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Jul 1, 2022 18:29
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Jethro posted:I mean, that's most likely the way things went, but I can still see a scenario where Meadows was legitimately not worried about Hutchinson's testimony because he really thought she would put loyalty to Trump and Meadows above all, while the texter wasn't so sure and reached out on his own. Heck, I can even see a scenario where Meadows was right, until the text message drove her to say "perjure myself for these assholes? gently caress that." Doesn't that scenario not matter in the midst of RICO? In either case Meadows should be liable for being part of the corrupt organization within which the witness tampering occured.
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Jul 1, 2022 18:35
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Bel Shazar posted:Doesn't that scenario not matter in the midst of RICO? In either case Meadows should be liable for being part of the corrupt organization within which the witness tampering occured. That seems hard to prove without some kind of paper trail connection between him and the texter. Based on how these things have gone, they could just throw the texter to the wolves and say "I barely know that person and I never spoke with them about the witness". Then what? Trying to stop witness tampering by drawing a connection all the way to the top before taking action is a total waste of time and resources. If you can get one arrested idiot to flip and squeal, it's much faster and easier.
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Jul 1, 2022 19:15
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Judge Schnoopy posted:That seems hard to prove without some kind of paper trail connection between him and the texter. Based on how these things have gone, they could just throw the texter to the wolves and say "I barely know that person and I never spoke with them about the witness". Then what? Given that Mark Meadows has apparently never been seen without a drat phone in his hand and texts like some people breathe, I have a feeling 'paper trail' is going to be an antiquated term in his case. Also all that should be logged by the phone company unless I'm mistaken.
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Jul 1, 2022 19:17
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Oracle posted:Given that Mark Meadows has apparently never been seen without a drat phone in his hand and texts like some people breathe, I have a feeling 'paper trail' is going to be an antiquated term in his case. Also all that should be logged by the phone company unless I'm mistaken. Yeah but I highly doubt he's sending messages like "hey go intimidate this lady so she doesn't testify". He's either doing it on a call, in person, or sending vague messages like "it would be a bummer if Hutchinson testified, huh?" And leaving the texter up to their own devices. These people act like morons but they're not dumb enough to spell out their crimes.
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Jul 1, 2022 19:27
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Bel Shazar posted:Doesn't that scenario not matter in the midst of RICO? In either case Meadows should be liable for being part of the corrupt organization within which the witness tampering occured. Nobody involved in any of this is getting charged under RICO
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Jul 1, 2022 19:34
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Judge Schnoopy posted:These people act like morons but they're not dumb enough to spell out their crimes. NARRATOR: They absolutely were.
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Jul 1, 2022 20:10
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Judge Schnoopy posted:Yeah but I highly doubt he's sending messages like "hey go intimidate this lady so she doesn't testify". He's either doing it on a call, in person, or sending vague messages like "it would be a bummer if Hutchinson testified, huh?" And leaving the texter up to their own devices. These people act like morons but they're not dumb enough to spell out their crimes. they hired multiple documentary crews to document their crimes
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Jul 1, 2022 20:13
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Oracle posted:Given that Mark Meadows has apparently never been seen without a drat phone in his hand and texts like some people breathe, I have a feeling 'paper trail' is going to be an antiquated term in his case. Also all that should be logged by the phone company unless I'm mistaken. Yeah the phone company if the government asks will happily give up texts and other metadata. The hardest part usually from a prosecutor's point of view is putting a person to the phone and intent. But as you point out, if Meadows is a serial texter and has cooperation of his aides that might be significantly easier.
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Jul 1, 2022 20:15
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I don't expect anyone who makes more than six figures to be charged, unfortunately. Least of all Donald Trump and I'll  that he'll never EVER see the inside of a prison cell, let alone catch a charge from the DoJ. Giuliani too.
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Jul 1, 2022 20:23
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Fuschia tude posted:Nobody involved in any of this is getting charged under RICO I understand that we have a dysfunctional state incapable of justice, but they're still a corrupt organization and that's how RICO works, yes? Judge Schnoopy posted:That seems hard to prove without some kind of paper trail connection between him and the texter. Based on how these things have gone, they could just throw the texter to the wolves and say "I barely know that person and I never spoke with them about the witness". Then what? See I think I I'm misunderstanding RICO. I thought the whole point was you didn't HAVE to draw a direct line all the way to the top. Everyone in the organization is guilty of all of its crimes.
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Jul 1, 2022 20:31
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Bel Shazar posted:I understand that we have a dysfunctional state incapable of justice, but they're still a corrupt organization and that's how RICO works, yes? You still gotta show *something*, it's just way less than the typical burden of proof for conspiracy
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Jul 1, 2022 20:35
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mdemone posted:You still gotta show *something*, it's just way less than the typical burden of proof for conspiracy Thought it was 1) All part of the same corrupt organization 2) Crime occurred related to the general activities of the organization 3) errbody in the organization is guilty So you just had to show The thing happened It was related to the purposes of the organization The people being charged were part of that organization
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Jul 1, 2022 20:37
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Bel Shazar posted:Thought it was Yeah the second one there is the only real sticking point. But they could certainly give it a try.
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Jul 1, 2022 20:38
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