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https://twitter.com/Marri/status/1538896871208411136?s=20&t=PI1HdM0rB2NIlb_uqKDq3Q
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Jun 20, 2022 22:51
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:https://twitter.com/Marri/status/1538896871208411136?s=20&t=PI1HdM0rB2NIlb_uqKDq3Q wouldn't all the triangular sails before the foremast be jibs?
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Jun 20, 2022 23:03
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ChubbyChecker posted:wouldn't all the triangular sails before the foremast be jibs? Yeah, it's an odd image. I believe that all jibs are a type of staysail, the term being used as you said to denote the stays that are before the foremast. Saying that, I've also heard that to differentiate between the multitude of sails before the foremast, the outer sails would be referred to as jibs, and the inner sails as stays.
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Jun 20, 2022 23:18
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"Stun sails" for when you just need to incapacitate the enemy.
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Jun 20, 2022 23:25
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ChubbyChecker posted:wouldn't all the triangular sails before the foremast be jibs? I think in this era it's typical to refer to the innermost two as the fore staysail (on the forestay) and foretopmast staysail (on the foretopmast stay).
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Jun 20, 2022 23:27
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I love studding sails, or stun'sl's. For when the ship needs to go full fabulous.
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Jun 20, 2022 23:28
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I'm nearly done with Reverse of the Medal. It's convinced me that I need to read a good biography of Thomas Cochrane because it looks like the upcoming books in the series are going to take a dramatically different course. Can anyone recommend a good biography of him?
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Jun 21, 2022 13:21
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MeatwadIsGod posted:I'm nearly done with Reverse of the Medal. It's convinced me that I need to read a good biography of Thomas Cochrane because it looks like the upcoming books in the series are going to take a dramatically different course. Can anyone recommend a good biography of him? I remember enjoying this one when I read it long ago https://www.amazon.com/Cochrane-Master-Commander-David-Cordingly-ebook/dp/B00422LERA
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Jun 21, 2022 14:25
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MeatwadIsGod posted:I'm nearly done with Reverse of the Medal. It's convinced me that I need to read a good biography of Thomas Cochrane because it looks like the upcoming books in the series are going to take a dramatically different course. Can anyone recommend a good biography of him? His autobiography is not bad, if you skim the stock exchange bits. He was still very touchy about that when he wrote his book.
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Jun 21, 2022 16:05
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Thanks guys. I'll check those out. In other news, I made everlasting syllabub using the Tasting History recipe because there's been a heat wave here lately, and that stuff is fantastic. Put a couple spoonfuls in a bowl of fresh fruit and it's S-tier.
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Jun 23, 2022 03:08
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Doesn't necessarily have to be a Patrick O'Brian novel but are there any good books in the series or eslwehre that go into the relationship between a ship's crew and their marine detachment? Would the marines be segregated from the crewmen along the same lines as the officers?
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Jul 11, 2022 19:24
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Arc Hammer posted:Doesn't necessarily have to be a Patrick O'Brian novel but are there any good books in the series or eslwehre that go into the relationship between a ship's crew and their marine detachment? Would the marines be segregated from the crewmen along the same lines as the officers? E: One of the books (or several) definitely has a scene where the marines are drawn up on deck in a show of force against a potentially mutinous crew, and I think there are suspicions about how loyal the marines will be if it means firing on the crew, but I can’t remember which book it is. Kaiser Schnitzel fucked around with this message at 00:08 on Jul 12, 2022 |
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Jul 12, 2022 00:06
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The Leopard
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Jul 12, 2022 01:21
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On my first read-through (across many years, I like to ration them) and just finished 19, The Hundred Days. Without spoiling too much for what remains, can anyone illuminate me on: Wtf is with the left-field, quickly dismissed deaths of Diana and Bonden? O'Brian is not, on the whole, an author I consider to embrace the nihilistic nature of the universe even if the nature of war lends itself to that (unlike eg Larry McMurtry). I can't think of a previous situation in which a critical character has been so randomly killed; Bonden's death is treated as though he was some random nice fella who'd just been introduced that book, and while more shrift is given to Diana, we really don't delve into Stephen's grief much - we honestly see far more of it during their on again/off again relationship and his consistent heartbreak across books 2 through 15 or so. Did O'Brian lose his wife at the time, or something like that? Was he getting bored of the series? I honestly don't know what to make of it.
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Jul 18, 2022 11:02
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freebooter posted:On my first read-through (across many years, I like to ration them) and just finished 19, The Hundred Days. Without spoiling too much for what remains, can anyone illuminate me on: IIRC that's exactly what happened. And yes, it's a very weird thing, not just that it happens but how little anyone seems to care.
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Jul 18, 2022 12:48
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freebooter posted:
Yeah
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Jul 18, 2022 16:48
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The Diana thing was handled very weirdly in general. We heard about it through ships gossip, and then Stephen seems to be cured by his grief from throwing himself into his work. I guess this makes sense if Maturin is a stand in for O’Brian, since I suspect he used this book as his own way with processing his wife’s passing. Still, I wish more was said about a character that had so much influence over previous storylines. He also writes Martin off quickly as well, which I felt was odd at my first read through since he was a fairly important character during his arcs. Thinking on it some more, I believe that I prefer the first half of the series to the latter half. It feels like the quality in general starts to ebb around Wine Dark Sea. It doesn’t help that Patrick Tull’s narration also starts to go south around that time too… but I guess I can’t begrudge him for his age. Hot Dog Day #82 fucked around with this message at 17:13 on Jul 18, 2022 |
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Jul 18, 2022 17:11
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Kylaer posted:IIRC that's exactly what happened. And yes, it's a very weird thing, not just that it happens but how little anyone seems to care. I think that for both characters mentioned, O'Brian is working at his absolute most extreme subtleness, where the reader is expected to interpret very faint shades of writing to communicate loss. It's interesting to me because of exactly that alignment of timing - I suspect O'Brian was writing from a profound place of loss and both didn't want to dive too deeply and explicitly into writing about that experience, and also probably expecting readers to feel how that loss casts a shadow across everything without directly writing it out, because that's what his experience is. I don't love the decisions he made, as a reader the things seem abrupt and under-developed, but I think it's an extreme case of some of the things he's done throughout, such as letting the reader realize long before anybody in-text does how badly Stephen is addicted to laudanum.
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Jul 20, 2022 19:29
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It's possible, but O'Brian does have a tendency to both create and later resolve major problems for his characters entirely offscreen with no input from the characters themselves. It feels kind of lazy, in that he wants a stumbling block for the sake of the overall plot and later doesn't need it so it gets cleared in the same fashion it was created. Prime example, minor spoilers and can't remember what books these took place in: Aubrey's father mucks around in politics, makes people mad and sabotages Aubrey's career. Later he dies and without his ongoing political meddling, Aubrey's career can advance again. I get that it's realistic that characters are subject to things happening outside of their control, but it still feels lazy.
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Jul 20, 2022 19:55
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Is there any sign that anyone feels anything about the death of Bonden? I suppose I could rationalize it as: Bonden, being crew, is on the other side of the wall from Jack (and Stephen, by association). Sometimes crewmen die and you just move on. By the time Bonden dies, Jack has seen a LOT of death, and us readers too have seen quite a few characters introduced in one book who get splattered the next, in breathtakingly perfunctory ways, disappearing without a ripple. So what we are seeing as readers is a kind of hard-heartedness of the Royal Navy. I might also argue that the books are basically Stephen's, and Stephen loves exactly two people: Diane and Jack. Bonden is not really anybody to Stephen. Diane is, but by the time she dies Stephen has been so harrowed by her, and his love for her, that his feelings are very mixed, with lots of love but lots of suffering, and what follows is numbness. Whatever remains is drowned in gentlemanly silence. These are aside from, POB just couldn't / didn't want to write it, which is worth consideration too.
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Jul 21, 2022 00:39
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There's at least one moment where Jack is about to reflexively call out to Bonden about prepping his gig, or have him demonstrate something to the youngsters, or something routine like that, and he has to stop himself. There's no pronounced sadness or expressed grief, just the (implied repeated) recognition that a person he liked, respected, and took for granted is gone. Days like normal, punctuated in mundane moments by "oh, right, he's dead ." I agree it's intentional, it leaves you feeling hollow and just sort of stunned. You can't assimilate it even though you know it's a fact. I think the same is true for the characters, they're mostly just in shock and haven't started to process the loss. I fortunately can't speak from much personal experience, but that initial (non)reaction to the death of somebody close is pretty frequent in e/n, at least.
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Jul 21, 2022 03:41
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Just watched "The Sea Beast", which apparently used a lot of the same production crew as the Master and Commander movie. The weather gauge and crossing the T are mentioned, and a suspiciously Jack like main character. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xZAMcd1kcTQ yaffle fucked around with this message at 08:13 on Jul 21, 2022 |
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Jul 21, 2022 05:08
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One of my great regrets is that they never made more Aubrey-Maturin movies. Hopefully one day they give the series the prestige streaming treatment it deserves.
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Jul 21, 2022 07:18
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Sax Solo posted:Is there any sign that anyone feels anything about the death of Bonden? It makes me wonder why he killed Bonden off at all. I suppose there's a poignancy to being killed in what would be one of the very last actions of the war, but nobody seems to dwell on that. Obviously the series was cut off by O'Brien's own death, but it does leave it in a rather awkward position - 19 books of Napoleonic action and then one and a half in Chile or whatever it is. Given that he pumped them out at a solid rate of one per year it makes you wonder how far he intended to take them, especially since he only ended 1812b and restored them to ordinary time in book 18.
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Jul 21, 2022 08:37
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yaffle posted:Just watched "The Sea Beast", which apparently used a lot of the same production crew as the Master and Commander movie. The weather gauge and crossing the T are mentioned, and a suspiciously Jack like main character. Where did you hear that about the production crew? Animated and live action films don't have much crossover in crew terms.
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Jul 21, 2022 10:05
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I think he did exactly what he planned: keep writing adventures until he died
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Jul 21, 2022 12:16
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Arglebargle III posted:I think he did exactly what he planned: keep writing adventures until he died This. Put me down as really liking the way Bonden's death is handled. I remember at least 2 bits where Jack reflects on Bonden, thinking that he had lost many shipmates 'but never a one to touch him for true worth'. I think that is a good way to depict the sudden, unexpected death of a constant companion of so many years, but still with the professional armour of rank and the job in hand.
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Jul 21, 2022 13:23
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a lovely king posted:Where did you hear that about the production crew? Animated and live action films don't have much crossover in crew terms. Not so much the whole crew, but the same <industry term for people who advise films on historical accuracy and detail>. I am in a Facebook group and one of the guys who does that work posted about it.
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Jul 21, 2022 14:24
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yaffle posted:Not so much the whole crew, but the same <industry term for people who advise films on historical accuracy and detail>. I am in a Facebook group and one of the guys who does that work posted about it. Then they should have advised against "crossing the T"  It was a fun movie though.
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Jul 21, 2022 14:45
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Genghis Cohen posted:This. Same. They were men of war; it went without saying many of them would not survive. No one wonders at Jack's and Maturin's many near miraculous escapes from death, tale after bloody tale. Thank God they haven't made a movie version of that particular novel with that damnable hobbit dying in it.
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Jul 21, 2022 15:35
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The Lord Bude posted:One of my great regrets is that they never made more Aubrey-Maturin movies. Hopefully one day they give the series the prestige streaming treatment it deserves. There was a story about a year ago about making a prequel movie but who knows if it will actually go into production: https://deadline.com/2021/06/20th-century-master-and-commander-patrick-ness-1234769535/
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Jul 21, 2022 15:48
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Mr. Mambold posted:Same. They were men of war; it went without saying many of them would not survive. No one wonders at Jack's and Maturin's many near miraculous escapes from death, tale after bloody tale. Jack has seen an unusual amount of action and it's remarked on quite a bit!
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Jul 21, 2022 16:44
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PlushCow posted:There was a story about a year ago about making a prequel movie but who knows if it will actually go into production: https://deadline.com/2021/06/20th-century-master-and-commander-patrick-ness-1234769535/ I don't know how you'd recreate the chemistry Crowe and Bettany had with other actors. It just wouldn't be the same.
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Jul 21, 2022 17:43
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It's as close as can be to a perfect film without making Acheron a proper Yankee ship. I'd love to see another one but the film stands on its own.
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Jul 21, 2022 18:31
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bettany was too good looking and too tall to play Maturin one flaw in an otherwise perfect film
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Jul 21, 2022 21:06
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:bettany was too good looking and too tall to play Maturin Oh I wouldn't go so far as to call that a flaw 
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Jul 21, 2022 21:46
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Arglebargle III posted:Jack has seen an unusual amount of action and it's remarked on quite a bit! Not what I meant, but by now I've forgotten what I was on about. Shall we try that Monteverdi sonata and some of this claret? "Killick, drat your eyes!"
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Jul 22, 2022 03:07
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Arglebargle III posted:I think he did exactly what he planned: keep writing adventures until he died For sure but it's weird the death happened almost but not quite at the end of the Napoleonic wars Genghis Cohen posted:This. I'm glad it apparently crops up in the next (last!) book, however subtly; in The Hundred Days it's barely mentioned apart from the event itself PlushCow posted:There was a story about a year ago about making a prequel movie but who knows if it will actually go into production: https://deadline.com/2021/06/20th-century-master-and-commander-patrick-ness-1234769535/ 20 years was a long time ago and the age of good films is over. My dream is now for an HBO series with a few books per season and a Game of Thrones level budget. Which I actually think would be a goer, if not for the fact that producers would immediately blanche at the notion of period-drama on-water filming and all the hassles and dramas involved in that.
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Jul 22, 2022 11:28
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freebooter posted:
The obvious answer to the difficulties of filming is to adapt the series as an anime 
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Jul 22, 2022 12:55
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Make it an anime so Stephen has unrequited feelings for Jack, it's not like I like you or anything, Aubry-san.
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Jul 22, 2022 15:40
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