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lol "oh I'm from a weird part of [x], you wouldn't recognize it" is my loving bat signal
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Jul 26, 2022 18:42
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Yeah, it's easy to forget if you're a map nerd, but there's a lot of people who don't really need or use maps much in their day to day life, and arguably memorizing shapes and things on a big world map of political divisions is the least useful way to use maps. It's handy for visual thinkers messing with international politics, but you don't actually need the visuals to express that information most of the time. And you don't actually need a spatially accurate map to do that. It's why medieval maps were so often just blorbs or shapes, and of course they'll seldom be oriented right for our expectations.     Most people, if they're using a map, they'll end up using a road map instead of a borders map. The big famous map projections were developed for naval navigation, but probably most people doing naval navigation these days will be using smaller, more detailed map instead of a whole map of the world. Subway maps are often famously not geographically accurate, because when you just have a bunch of long lines that the space between doesn't matter much, you can "untangle" that to present it as something easier to manage. Those medieval arab maps kinda "untangle" rivers, a lot of old maps that list a bunch of cities on them may be doing a sort of untangling on the spatial relations between towns. I think most people have inner mental maps that do a similar kind of untangling, and I know the one I have for the town where I was a kid isn't oriented properly north/south, so I always get confused. I think there's also a natural effect where people will often not keep their directions perfectly straight, their since of direction may be slightly curved, meaning that over distances, lines that would be straight on a map may get sucked into kind of a spiral shape. Premodern maps of smaller places also often tend to be more precise because they would be depicting more geographic features that people can perceive more on a human perspective. They still blur and untangle and simplify, and there's a lot of decorative features obscuring things (because visual illustration is still the primary purpose of a lot of maps), but people could do some navigating with them.   
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Jul 26, 2022 19:39
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SlothfulCobra posted:And you don't actually need a spatially accurate map to do that. It's why medieval maps were so often just blorbs or shapes, and of course they'll seldom be oriented right for our expectations.  Italy and Greece, the two identifiable countries. (And Dalmatia/Croatia I guess) 
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Jul 26, 2022 19:46
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Jul 26, 2022 20:16
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We are the 21 Federal Subjects of the Turkic Federation
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Jul 26, 2022 20:19
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Guavanaut posted:
this made me think of these maps, which are definitely not politically loaded at all:   quote:This map shows how the different countries of the world are connected to each other while disregarding actual geography. The world model is a very simple view that places various regions in clear zones. A design aim was to keep all text not-rotated for use as reference map of "global connections".Relative "power" is very loosely represented by font size. The outer ring and the Caribbean area represent the "island zones" outside mainland areas (where Scandinavia and Alaska are special cases and not "islands" per se). Land borders are black lines, while maritime separations are represented by blue lines. Some important strategic islands and bastions are also shown attached to the nearby mainland areas.This map is inspired and derived from another world topological map (link below) posted on Reddit recently, and is not intended to be definitive.
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Jul 26, 2022 20:32
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AAAAA! Real Muenster posted:Yeah I get funny reactions from friends in Discord when I get Worldle countries in one guess. I wish this knowledge had more practical use The real way to play Worldle is to disable the country outline. I play such that the answer to yesterday's puzzle is my 1st guess for today's. Having a single country as my starting guess was getting too easy.
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Jul 26, 2022 20:32
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Guavanaut posted:We are the 21 Federal Subjects of the Turkic Federation I hate you. 
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Jul 26, 2022 21:03
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I am the only non geography nerd here, i dont know why im surprised it should be pretty obvious most of yall like, care about that
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Jul 26, 2022 21:05
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mandatory lesbian posted:I am the only non geography nerd here, i dont know why im surprised it should be pretty obvious most of yall like, care about that All you need to know that people used to no idea how to make maps that weren't just funny squiggles on a napkin, but then Mercator came along and solved the map problem once and for all.
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Jul 26, 2022 21:14
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Haha no i like maps or else i wouldnt be following the thread. I just mean i dont know that many countries locations...or names
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Jul 26, 2022 21:28
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steinrokkan posted:All you need to know that people used to no idea how to make maps that weren't just funny squiggles on a napkin, but then Mercator came along and solved the map problem once and for all. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LpOIPb1_aCU
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Jul 26, 2022 21:33
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If I ever make a fantasy novel it's going to open with a map like any decent fantasy novel but the map would be in the style of a figurative medieval map.
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Jul 26, 2022 21:59
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Guavanaut posted:We are the 21 Federal Subjects of the Turkic Federation God loving damnit.
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Jul 26, 2022 22:01
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Count Roland posted:The real way to play Worldle is to disable the country outline. I play such that the answer to yesterday's puzzle is my 1st guess for today's. Having a single country as my starting guess was getting too easy. That's a good idea, I'm going to start that tomorrow. And I agree that map off is the only way to play.
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Jul 26, 2022 22:02
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Wait he lifts up the paper on the globe to reveal that Atlantis was under Sweden the whole time?
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Jul 26, 2022 22:33
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What if Atlantis was just Doggerland
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Jul 26, 2022 22:38
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Well that just raises the question of what's really under Sweden
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Jul 26, 2022 22:43
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steinrokkan posted:All you need to know that people used to no idea how to make maps that weren't just funny squiggles on a napkin, but then Mercator came along and solved the map problem once and for all. Everybody hated Mercator, but Arno Peters came along and invented a map projection that fixed all the world's sociopolitical problems, all on his own!
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Jul 26, 2022 22:49
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Guavanaut posted:Well that just raises the question of what's really under Sweden Probably caviar tubes
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Jul 26, 2022 23:02
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Teriyaki Hairpiece posted:Everybody hated Mercator, but Arno Peters came along and invented a map projection that fixed all the world's sociopolitical problems, all on his own!
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Jul 26, 2022 23:03
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Guavanaut posted:Well that just raises the question of what's really under Sweden
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Jul 27, 2022 09:44
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mandatory lesbian posted:Haha no i like maps or else i wouldnt be following the thread. I just mean i dont know that many countries locations...or names hell, same. heck, it was only last week (when randomly doing a worldle) that i realized that central america is aligned more northwest-southeast* than north-south. and don't get me started on my knowledge of the geography of, well, pretty much everywhere that isn't the first world i like the funny maps though  * just took another look and it's even worse than i thought. it's basically wnw-ese. and south america is very rudely far to the east of north america. still fucks me up
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Jul 27, 2022 12:06
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redleader posted:hell, same. heck, it was only last week (when randomly doing a worldle) that i realized that central america is aligned more northwest-southeast* than north-south. and don't get me started on my knowledge of the geography of, well, pretty much everywhere that isn't the first world Zoom in on the Panama Canal.
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Jul 27, 2022 12:14
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Platystemon posted:Zoom in on the Panama Canal. no. oh no. what the gently caress. jesus christ
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Jul 27, 2022 12:24
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https://i.imgur.com/2HW4gOK_d.png price of a cup of espresso in the capital cities. Man getting urls from imgur on mobile is annoying.
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Jul 28, 2022 07:14
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Jul 28, 2022 07:16
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im the missing capitals (eg bratislava, warsaw)
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Jul 28, 2022 11:09
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Carthag Tuek posted:im the missing capitals (eg bratislava, warsaw) The capital is in Prague  E: also the chart needs to be in hours @ median salary or something mobby_6kl fucked around with this message at 13:30 on Jul 28, 2022 |
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Jul 28, 2022 11:23
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Little known fact: the cheap/expensive coffee divide in Europe is delineated by the possessions of the finnic and korean hyper empires
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Jul 28, 2022 13:12
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Thought this might be of interest. Any time there are discussions of ancient maps, the medieval reproductions of Ptolemy's 2nd c. AD map of the oikoumene, or inhabited world, often get posted: But from the time of Eratosthenes onward (3rd c. BC), scientists widely accepted that the Earth was a sphere, had a pretty good idea of its actual size, and knew that the oikoumene filled only one part of its northern hemisphere. What, then, did they think the rest of the world was like? Well, an astronomer named Geminus wrote a treatise in the 1st c. AD called the Introduction to the Phenomena in which he discussed this. An English translation of Geminus' work was only published for the first time in 2006, and the work isn't widely known outside of research on ancient science. First of all, he notes: quote:The surface of the whole Earth is spherical in shape and is divided into 5 zones. Of these, the two around the poles, lying farthest from the path of the Sun, are called frigid and are uninhabited because of the cold. They are bounded by the arctic circles and extend to the poles. The next ones, lying in an intermediate relation to the path of the Sun, are called temperate. These are bounded by the celestial arctic circles and the tropic circles, and lie between them. The remaining [zone], in the middle of the aforementioned ones, lying under the very path of the Sun, is called torrid. It is bisected by the terrestrial equator circle, which lies beneath the celestial equator circle. Of the two temperate zones, it happens that the northern one is inhabited by those in our oikoumene. Then he goes on to discuss the oikoumene and cartography, with some early projection chat: quote:Our oikoumene is divided into three parts: Asia, Europe, and Libya [Africa]. The length of the oikoumene is approximately double the width. For this reason, those who draw world maps in proportion draw them on oblong panels so that the length is double the width. Those who draw circular world maps have wandered far from the truth, for the length [of a circular map] is equal to the width , which is not the case in nature. Of necessity, the proportions of the distances are not preserved in the circular world maps, for the inhabited part of the Earth is a certain segment of a sphere having the length the double of the width , which cannot be bounded by a circle. Then he speculates about the southern hemisphere: quote:When we speak of the southern zone and of those dwelling in it, as well as the so-called antipodes in it, we should be understood in this way: that we have received no account of the southern zone nor [any report of] whether people live in it, but rather that, because of the whole spherical construction [of the cosmos], and the shape of the Earth, and the path of the Sun between the tropics, there exists a certain other zone, lying toward the south and having the same temperate character as the northern zone in which we live. In the same way, we speak of the antipodes, not in the sense that people positively dwell diametrically opposite us, but rather that there is on the Earth a certain habitable place diametrically opposite us. He then discusses the "torrid zone" around the equator, noting that explorers had found it to be inhabited, and then states: quote:For those inhabiting the boundaries of the torrid zone are Aithiopians, who have the Sun at the zenith on the [summer] solstice. Indeed, by the nature of things, one ought to suppose there are two Aithiopias, with Aithiopians dwelling both around our summer tropic circle and around our winter tropic, which is summer [tropic] for the antipodes. Interesting that he seems to think about the southern hemisphere similarly to how astronomers think about the possibility of life on other planets today. MeinPanzer fucked around with this message at 15:24 on Jul 28, 2022 |
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Jul 28, 2022 15:22
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Also interesting how just nobody expected the New World. A huge landmass that's just disconnected with their continents.
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Jul 28, 2022 15:39
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It's weird to remember just how much an accident of tectonics put the vast majority of humans in the northern hemisphere. I assume being northern focused is just me being eurocentric but then I remember, wait, no, the equator passes through Brazil and Indonesia. We're all just up here, looming down on our southern friends with their weirdo seasons. Like, the most populous country that's entirely in the south is Tanzania. Indonesia, Brazil, and DRC take the top three if you count partially in the south, Tanzania being fourth. With Brazil and Indonesia having a digit on every other country. Australia has fewer people than Nepal. Australia is barely fewer humans than greater Paris. Is Australia even real? Edgar Allen Ho fucked around with this message at 15:57 on Jul 28, 2022 |
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Jul 28, 2022 15:55
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Well, 68% of all land is in the northern hemisphere to boot, so it follows that's where most humans are. The Americas are also collectively much smaller than the old world, and so much of the New World is splayed out in a line so that it was pretty hard for people to spill over between North and South America, while so much of the Old World is a big lump that it's nearly impossible to cut off the connection between the parts. Any big migratory groups looking to switch continents would either have to develop deep sea boats or they'd have to push through the dense jungle and civilization of Central America. And then Australia is hidden far over the seas through a maze of more appealing yet small islands, and if you make it there, it's incredibly hostile as an environment and mostly desert anyways. edit: More maps https://twitter.com/GasBuddyGuy/status/1552671768980213763 SlothfulCobra fucked around with this message at 18:34 on Jul 28, 2022 |
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Jul 28, 2022 17:18
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Edgar Allen Ho posted:It's weird to remember just how much an accident of tectonics put the vast majority of humans in the northern hemisphere. It’s easy to think of Africa as being largely in the Southern Hemisphere, but it extends further north of the Equator than it does to the south, and the northern part is much wider. Europe is just unparalleled. In the Southern Hemisphere, its latitudes are almost entirely water. In North America, Los Angeles is further from the Equator than is Cape Town. South America extends further south, about as far from the equator as Denmark does, but it’s even skinnier than Africa. Platystemon fucked around with this message at 23:12 on Jul 28, 2022 |
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Jul 28, 2022 22:08
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Platystemon posted:In North America, Los Angeles is further from the Equator than is Cape Town. I'm stealing this fun fact
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Jul 28, 2022 22:10
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I'm sure if you asked people to draw where they think the equator is on a blank Mercator map they would get it pretty wrong.
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Jul 28, 2022 23:06
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Its in the center isnt it...
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Jul 29, 2022 00:09
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mandatory lesbian posted:Its in the center isnt it... 
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Jul 29, 2022 01:29
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