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Gaius Marius posted:Serious though it's absolute poison on both ends. My buddy became a streamer and watching him destroy his life for fake clout online is the saddest poo poo I've ever seen. Dude only goes to work, the gym, and the goes home and streams gacha games for hours. He doesn't hang with anyone anymore and barely even talks at work. It's also destroyed his sense of self worth, homie is so focused on "blowing up" that he puts off any social life so he doesn't get buried by the algorithm. Online para social relationships and the culture it perpetuates is absolutely disgusting and one should stay as far away from it as possible. Counterpoint: your buddy sounds like a gently caress up who would be so regardless, not a representative example. I'm sidekick/twitch mod for my wife's stream and it whips rear end to get to do something we'd be doing anyway (video games- fun ones not gacha poo poo) and get a handful of extra dollars off the top. It's got nothing to do with internet clout. It's just fun.
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Aug 12, 2022 23:26
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Are you proud enough of the stream to promote it here? or just link it
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Aug 12, 2022 23:28
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Manager Hoyden posted:Patreon is also a mark of trash The best podcast, E1, is funded by a Patreon.
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Aug 12, 2022 23:30
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Shibawanko posted:even then i wouldnt. it's a stranger who might be lying. look at all the goobers who gave to lowtax gently caress off. If it's an obvious scam then don't, but I think getting pissy about people giving away a bit of change because the other person "might be lying" is like worrying the homeless person your giving money to will just spend it on drugs. It's the actions of someone whose completely unable to think that other people might tell the truth, or that people may just want to try and help anyway.
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Aug 12, 2022 23:38
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doverhog posted:Are you proud enough of the stream to promote it here? or just link it No, there's plenty of goon streamers if you're looking for someone to pay. I prefer keeping those bits of my online life separate. PHUO based on my title: christ on a cracker I hate people who get angry about my using "us/her/my wife." We're married. We're quite in love. I'm so sorry for being sweet on my wife, except lmao no, we're on the forum founded by Lowtax. Being in love with your wife kinda rules actually. It's been less than a year anyways. That's my world. She's about to have my fuckin children. I love that woman more than fuckin life. Can I have a honeymoon period please?
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Aug 13, 2022 02:58
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Edgar Allen Ho posted:No, there's plenty of goon streamers if you're looking for someone to pay. I prefer keeping those bits of my online life separate. Speaking of unpopular opinions inspired by your av, it's weird how many Americans are really passionate about the Russo-Ukrainian war. Like, it's bad to invade a country, Russia shouldn't have done that, I get why everybody is on the Russia shouldn't have done that wave. But you got Americans with absolutely zero connection to either of those countries posting videos of Russian soldiers getting killed and talking about how hard it makes them. It's really weird. And then they're all gonna act like it never happened once the war ends with a negotiated surrender that gives Russia most of what it wanted in the first place.
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Aug 13, 2022 03:17
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Gripweed posted:Speaking of unpopular opinions inspired by your av, it's weird how many Americans are really passionate about the Russo-Ukrainian war. Like, it's bad to invade a country, Russia shouldn't have done that, I get why everybody is on the Russia shouldn't have done that wave. But you got Americans with absolutely zero connection to either of those countries posting videos of Russian soldiers getting killed and talking about how hard it makes them. It's really weird. And then they're all gonna act like it never happened once the war ends with a negotiated surrender that gives Russia most of what it wanted in the first place. Decades of anti-Russian propaganda plus a socially acceptable outlet for American bloodthirst since Putin put Trump in the White House.
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Aug 13, 2022 03:37
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2nd Amendment posted:Decades of anti-Russian propaganda plus a socially acceptable outlet for American bloodthirst since Putin put Trump in the White House. Also, Putin is basically a supervillain. I mean, death by polonium poisoning? That's some SPECTRE poo poo
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Aug 13, 2022 03:43
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Gripweed posted:Speaking of unpopular opinions inspired by your av, it's weird how many Americans are really passionate about the Russo-Ukrainian war. Like, it's bad to invade a country, Russia shouldn't have done that, I get why everybody is on the Russia shouldn't have done that wave. But you got Americans with absolutely zero connection to either of those countries posting videos of Russian soldiers getting killed and talking about how hard it makes them. It's really weird. And then they're all gonna act like it never happened once the war ends with a negotiated surrender that gives Russia most of what it wanted in the first place. I get that your opinion is that the Ukrainians shouldn’t get weapons and should just lay down and let their country get destroyed without fuss, but other people tend to have a bit more moral outrage when a peaceful country gets invaded by its imperialist and genocidal neighbor
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Aug 13, 2022 04:18
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christmas boots posted:Also, Putin is basically a supervillain. I mean, death by polonium poisoning? That's some SPECTRE poo poo A Sexy supervillian. Такого как Путин
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Aug 13, 2022 04:19
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Edgar Allen Ho posted:No, there's plenty of goon streamers if you're looking for someone to pay. I prefer keeping those bits of my online life separate. Lmao have you, personally, ever made a single post without going MAI WAIF?
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Aug 13, 2022 07:03
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Gripweed posted:Speaking of unpopular opinions inspired by your av, it's weird how many Americans are really passionate about the Russo-Ukrainian war. Like, it's bad to invade a country, Russia shouldn't have done that, I get why everybody is on the Russia shouldn't have done that wave. But you got Americans with absolutely zero connection to either of those countries posting videos of Russian soldiers getting killed and talking about how hard it makes them. It's really weird. And then they're all gonna act like it never happened once the war ends with a negotiated surrender that gives Russia most of what it wanted in the first place. Russia wanted a quick conquest of Ukraine and tried to invade Kyiv with paratroopers and a tank column at the start, so Russia is never getting "most of what it wanted", it has already failed to get even close to that. IMO being passionate about the war is understandable and even important, because Russia is using the threat of nukes, even issuing statements like "don't interfere or we'll nuke you", while going on a massive rape and murder campaign. It's like someone forcing you to watch at gunpoint as they kill a baby (the baby here is Ukraine trying to leave Russian influence, and being killed for the crime of making Putin angry).
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Aug 13, 2022 07:44
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I mean, a sovereign nation loving with another foreign nation for stupid reasons based on realpolitik/imagined issues whilst daring the rest of the world to do anything about it and committing war crimes? Its still going to be bad. Its just that, well, we've all been there. We continue to be there in a lot of ways, and it loving sucks. I have more in common with the average Russian person though than I do with the people who run my country and I don't see why they should get blamed for the actions of their unelected leaders.
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Aug 13, 2022 08:09
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One good reason for Americans to care a lot about Russia's unprovoked war of aggression on Ukraine is that it represents a heightened risk of nuclear escalation; indeed, explicit nuclear threats have been made. Most of the Russian arsenal is pointed at the United States. I have a very personal interest in this strategy meeting nothing but failure.
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Aug 13, 2022 08:19
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Gripweed posted:Speaking of unpopular opinions inspired by your av, it's weird how many Americans are really passionate about the Russo-Ukrainian war. Like, it's bad to invade a country, Russia shouldn't have done that, I get why everybody is on the Russia shouldn't have done that wave. But you got Americans with absolutely zero connection to either of those countries posting videos of Russian soldiers getting killed and talking about how hard it makes them. It's really weird. And then they're all gonna act like it never happened once the war ends with a negotiated surrender that gives Russia most of what it wanted in the first place. Being furious about Russia invading Ukraine is a natural response to something really lovely happening in the world. Just because Something Awful and the internet as a whole is full of demented blood thirsty shut in mutants doesn't really make it less lovely or not worth being mad about.
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Aug 13, 2022 08:20
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Josef bugman posted:I mean, a sovereign nation loving with another foreign nation for stupid reasons based on realpolitik/imagined issues whilst daring the rest of the world to do anything about it and committing war crimes? Its still going to be bad. Its just that, well, we've all been there. We continue to be there in a lot of ways, and it loving sucks. “Atrocities happens all the time so you shouldn’t get upset by this one” is nihilist nonsense. And the Russian soldiers who kill and rape en masse? The citizens who proudly put up Z on their cars and say that Ukraine is full of Nazis? Do you have much in common with them? Are they blameless? And if they were, would that make sanctions any less necessary?
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Aug 13, 2022 08:27
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I'm not saying to not get upset. I'm saying we should have a consistent frame work about it. We shouldn't get more incensed at people in other countries for not "doing something" if we aren't doing similar when our own governments do heinous poo poo. I don't see how that follows from either what I said or from each other? Do sanctions stop the invasion? Do they do anything to prevent those things occurring? They can still be necessary but I am unsure that they do all that much in practical terms.
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Aug 13, 2022 08:39
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They are a cost that Putin must pay, and they should be much harsher. There are still lots of Russian connected property around the world that has not been seized and nationalized. Germany still pays Russia for gas, etc. Right now there are Russian tourists in the EU, they should all get their visas revoked. Any Russian that wants a visa in the future should have to sign a pledge where they condemn Putin and the war. Does that sound too harsh? Ok just no visas for Russians until Russia stops the war and gives back the areas already occupied. doverhog has a new favorite as of 08:48 on Aug 13, 2022 |
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Aug 13, 2022 08:46
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Sanctions are foreign policy aimed at compelling action but also publicly punishing bad behavior without resorting to escalatory violence. Even in the likely scenario where Russia achieves many of its goals, the sanctions will hurt a lot. Ten or twenty years down the road, someone might consider a similar war, and think: well, if I did this then the Americans would call in some favors and tank my economy and that doesn't sound very fun. I'm developing a very liberal argument here and you don't have to like it, but I want to stress the point that the perceived value of sanctions is not strictly about forcing your bitter enemy to quit a war, it's about propping up the fragile idea of consequences for actions at the international level.
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Aug 13, 2022 09:03
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I would love it if Putin paid any price at all tbh. But I am unsure that there is any way to do so, mainly because why would rich people want there to be consequences for other rich people? Blowing up families of people we aren't even at war with because they might be terrorists, poisoning land that was stolen and never returned, killing hundreds of thousands for the sake of revenge in an attack on an independent nation. These are all things our governments have done to people, should we to not be ashamed of ourselves for allowing it? If not, then why are we exempt and the citizenry of Russia is not? If we collectively punish everyone then why is the same not applied to us?
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Aug 13, 2022 09:05
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Josef bugman posted:I'm not saying to not get upset. I'm saying we should have a consistent frame work about it. We shouldn't get more incensed at people in other countries for not "doing something" if we aren't doing similar when our own governments do heinous poo poo. As an American, I am able to get equally angry at fascists abroad and at home. It’s very easy to do, in fact. Sanctions both put political pressure on Putin to stop the war and significantly hinder his ability to produce weapons of war—weapons that are killing Ukrainians as we speak, as well as set a precedent to other countries about what could happen to you if you start a war of aggression (ideally China takes the hint)
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Aug 13, 2022 09:06
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Josef bugman posted:Blowing up families of people we aren't even at war with because they might be terrorists, poisoning land that was stolen and never returned, killing hundreds of thousands for the sake of revenge in an attack on an independent nation. These are all things our governments have done to people, should we to not be ashamed of ourselves for allowing it? If not, then why are we exempt and the citizenry of Russia is not? If we collectively punish everyone then why is the same not applied to us? …people got enormously upset about all of those things. They still are, in fact. We can care about more than one thing at once. What are you even trying to argue. That the US ought to apply sanctions to itself?
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Aug 13, 2022 09:14
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Josef bugman posted:I would love it if Putin paid any price at all tbh. But I am unsure that there is any way to do so, mainly because why would rich people want there to be consequences for other rich people? I agree that the political leadership of the United States should face accountability for their many immoral acts of foreign policy. I also agree that V. V. Putin is unlikely to feel personal pain as a result of this, unless his political position deteriorated to the point he was at risk of harm. You appear to feel, though, that V. V. Putin is the only relevant decision-maker here. I am under the impression that there are a very large number of people with some real power in Russia, and they as a class are the ones being targeted. The deterrent effect is aimed at future classes of oligarchs: if you go along with something this aggressive, your expatriated money is not safe.
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Aug 13, 2022 09:19
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It's not about sovereignty it's about the fact that destruction of a democracy is a thousand times more horrible than the toppling of whatever tinpot dictator is being replaced in the world this week
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Aug 13, 2022 09:22
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thetoughestbean posted:
We should arrest the people responsible for the crimes that our governments commit? That seems like a pretty reasonable solution? Or at least apply sanctions to them by denying them an ability to own private wealth.
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Aug 13, 2022 09:47
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The US should prosecute Bush and Dick Cheney for their war crimes in Iraq. Or better yet hand them over to the international court.
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Aug 13, 2022 10:09
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doverhog posted:The US should prosecute Bush and Dick Cheney for their war crimes in Iraq. Yeah, it'd be a good start! So much more should be done and, if we believe in collective punishment for some, then all of us deserve it.
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Aug 13, 2022 10:34
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Josef bugman posted:We should arrest the people responsible for the crimes that our governments commit? That seems like a pretty reasonable solution? Or at least apply sanctions to them by denying them an ability to own private wealth. I mean, yes. I agree. Nobody was arguing otherwise
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Aug 13, 2022 10:35
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But we don't do that do we. What I'm arguing with is the idea that people are responsible for the actions of their government if they do not actively oppose it being applied selectively.
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Aug 13, 2022 10:59
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Josef bugman posted:But we don't do that do we. What I'm arguing with is the idea that people are responsible for the actions of their government if they do not actively oppose it being applied selectively. So… to be morally consistent, the international community should do nothing about Russia invading Ukraine? Makes moral consistency seem pretty bad tbh
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Aug 13, 2022 11:02
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The US did not invade Ukraine, so at the moment it's irrelevant what we might or should do if the US invaded Canada for example. The Russian invasion actually happened, and is still happening. If one person might kill you and rape your wife, and the other actually did it 5 minutes ago, it's pretty clear which one should be punished, right now not in some theoretical future.
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Aug 13, 2022 11:05
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doverhog posted:The US did not invade Ukraine, so at the moment it's irrelevant what we might or should do if the US invaded Canada for example. The Russian invasion actually happened, and is still happening. If one person might kill you and rape your wife, and the other actually did it 5 minutes ago, it's pretty clear which one should be punished, right now not in some theoretical future. Bad news for the guy who’s planning to kill my wife, though. Some other jerk did it first!
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Aug 13, 2022 11:07
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thetoughestbean posted:So… to be morally consistent, the international community should do nothing about Russia invading Ukraine? Not really, stuff should be done, but it should also be applied back and when people call it out it shouldn't be met with an immediate "you are Putins lackey" style of thing. If you don't wish to be morally consistent than just accept that your a hypocrite about certain actions. If your okay with that then fine, but it does somewhat undercut any moral case for stuff internationally. If we are moral actors inside of a system and the system continually makes immoral choices, what ability do we have to stop it, and by what metric do we apply the same calculus to others? Sure, but if you want to see one person punished for a crime they did and then say that the crime you committed should not be considered. It's a bit of a weird one, at least in my eyes. Again I would ask if we consider sanctions as anything other than collective punishment if it is targeted at the citizens of a nation and to what extent we should be considering it. If you think collective punishment for people is okay then we have no inconsistency. If you say that citizens of bad nations can be punished collectively whilst citizens of good nations must be tried as individuals then we kind of run into a definition problem. That's all I am pointing at. Sorry about blithering on/importing politics I don't mean to upset anyone, I'm just trying to see what folks think. Hope everyone is okay and do keep safe! Josef bugman has a new favorite as of 11:22 on Aug 13, 2022 |
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Aug 13, 2022 11:13
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Josef bugman posted:Not really, stuff should be done, but it should also be applied back Which country sanctioning Russia is currently trying to genocide its neighbor, Bugman?
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Aug 13, 2022 11:20
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thetoughestbean posted:Which country sanctioning Russia is currently trying to genocide its neighbor, Bugman? I would like you to define genocide, because I have seen it used for a lot of different actions and I'd prefer to work off the one you'd prefer me to use. If your comfortable doing that. I'm sorry if I seem obtuse but I don't want to use terms wrong.
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Aug 13, 2022 11:33
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There is no consistency to international politics, and I am not interested in moral outcomes, as those obviously are impossible. Bush is never gonna pay for his crimes, instead US media promotes his paintings. I'm also not USian, I'm Finnish and our country is joining NATO due to this war. It's not good, but when presented with the threat of Russian invasion or being under the US nuclear shield where Russia cannot invade without WW3, the choice is clear.
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Aug 13, 2022 11:40
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Josef bugman posted:I would like you to define genocide, because I have seen it used for a lot of different actions and I'd prefer to work off the one you'd prefer me to use. If your comfortable doing that. I'm sorry if I seem obtuse but I don't want to use terms wrong. They are doing forced relocation to concentration camps, rape of civilians, trying to erase the Ukrainian identity and turn it all to Russian soil.
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Aug 13, 2022 11:41
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doverhog posted:There is no consistency to international politics, and I am not interested in moral outcomes, as those obviously are impossible. Bush is never gonna pay for his crimes, instead US media promotes his paintings. That's understandable, but if you want it to be all about power, well then you've created a world in which people who possess nukes have a very simple "you cannot do poo poo about what I want to do" idea. I just think it's kind of hosed up. doverhog posted:They are doing forced relocation to concentration camps, rape of civilians, trying to erase the Ukrainian identity and turn it all to Russian soil. Okay in which case I can say that a variety of different nations states are doing some of those aimed at internal minority populations. But not at external neighbours. Would that be okay to argue?
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Aug 13, 2022 11:55
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Josef bugman posted:That's understandable, but if you want it to be all about power, well then you've created a world in which people who possess nukes have a very simple "you cannot do poo poo about what I want to do" idea. I just think it's kind of hosed up. It's hosed up, yeah. That is fair to say. Are they also actively bombing them? In any case what Russia is doing does not become less bad because someone else somewhere is doing it internally on a smaller scale.
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Aug 13, 2022 11:59
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Josef bugman posted:Okay in which case I can say that a variety of different nations states are doing some of those aimed at internal minority populations. But not at external neighbours. Would that be okay to argue? Every nation-state has done that. It's how a national identity monopolizes a state.
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Aug 13, 2022 12:05
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