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Ethiser posted:What?! I did not like G-Reco as a show at all, but the suit designs are great. Everything is either incredibly weedy or like bulbous with weird growths all over the place and it just doesn't fit with my taste at all. Though in looking up some to refresh my memory, discounting the shoulderpads, head, and feet, I do kinda like the Space Jahannam so that's something at least. Edit: Oh, and the Gaeon without the giant whatever the hell shroud thing is on it too. And the kneepads. ACES CURE PLANES fucked around with this message at 21:09 on Sep 12, 2022 |
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Sep 12, 2022 21:07
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| # ? May 26, 2024 17:35 |
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The important thing to know going into Reconguista, and I think this is what made a lot of people bounce off it, is that sometimes the characters will not state their motivations. Sometimes they even lie and at no point does someone else say, "waitaminute, that was a lie!" so you're kinda on your own to figure out if a character's actions and statements don't line up and from that you have to figure out what's going on in their head.ACES CURE PLANES posted:Edit: Oh, and the Gaeon without the giant whatever the hell shroud thing is on it too. And the kneepads. The Gaeon's hands are awesome 
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Sep 12, 2022 21:11
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If you don't like the Mack Knife you are objectively wrong
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Sep 12, 2022 21:14
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The coolest protagonist suit in Gundam
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Sep 12, 2022 21:16
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 THE STRONGEST
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Sep 12, 2022 21:22
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They should've used the proposed demo sketch design instead tbh
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Sep 12, 2022 21:22
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I don't know much about G-Reco but I do know it has a lady with big muscles and fluffy hair so it can't be all bad.
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Sep 12, 2022 21:40
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Gripweed posted:The important thing to know going into Reconguista, and I think this is what made a lot of people bounce off it, is that sometimes the characters will not state their motivations. Sometimes they even lie and at no point does someone else say, "waitaminute, that was a lie!" so you're kinda on your own to figure out if a character's actions and statements don't line up and from that you have to figure out what's going on in their head. I think this is true of Tomino's work in general, and what makes it interesting to discuss. People have been discussing Char's motivations and actions in Char's Counterattack, and to a lesser extent Zeta and 0079 for 40 odd years now for that exact reason. tsob fucked around with this message at 22:16 on Sep 12, 2022 |
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Sep 12, 2022 22:00
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My opinion on G-Reco should be made clear by my av. It's good. Watch the movies though.
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Sep 12, 2022 22:13
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Bloody Pom posted:My opinion on G-Reco should be made clear by my av. You say that, but Monaghan has G-Lucifer as an av and doesn't like the show, so the land of G-Reco avs is one of contrasts
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Sep 12, 2022 22:18
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Gripweed posted:The important thing to know going into Reconguista, and I think this is what made a lot of people bounce off it, is that sometimes the characters will not state their motivations. Sometimes they even lie and at no point does someone else say, "waitaminute, that was a lie!" so you're kinda on your own to figure out if a character's actions and statements don't line up and from that you have to figure out what's going on in their head. I'm pretty sure the reason people bounced off of Reconguista is not that it's secretly a really deep and complex show and people couldn't understand that.
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Sep 12, 2022 22:59
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Ethiser posted:I'm pretty sure the reason people bounced off of Reconguista is not that it's secretly a really deep and complex show and people couldn't understand that. It objectively is considering most the complaints are poo poo that's perfectly cromulent that only required the viewer to actually pay attention instead of going full zoomer brain
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Sep 12, 2022 23:05
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Heran Bago posted:I can't tell if you're pulling my leg. Like you're actually Beatrice posting "ohohoho yes watch that loving kids toy anime" but you didn't say in red if it's good. It's a Gaius post, and given they are the thread's resident contrarian gimmick poster, yes thread opinions on G Reco are mixed, mostly hung up on pacing issues. Ethiser posted:I'm pretty sure the reason people bounced off of Reconguista is not that it's secretly a really deep and complex show and people couldn't understand that. It helps if you understand the context that the show was largely a clapback against the political climate in Japan at the time, which was talking about remilitarization. Tomino did not like this, and made a whole rear end anime where everyone was gung-ho about militarizing and being soldiers while knowing nothing about what "war" is or what it costs. It's a very blunt show. I enjoyed it well enough on my first watch, but not enough to go back and watch it again. I should probably do that because there's a whole lotta holes in my memory about what happens after they go to Towasanga and Venus.
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Sep 12, 2022 23:05
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I post with my heart.
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Sep 12, 2022 23:10
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One of the favourite defences people use for G Reco is putting on a show that the people who dislike it were just too dumb to pay attention.
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Sep 12, 2022 23:25
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Heran Bago posted:I can't tell if you're pulling my leg. Like you're actually Beatrice posting "ohohoho yes watch that loving kids toy anime" but you didn't say in red if it's good. I would never Beatrice post about a Tomino show. Reco is a culmination of a career in a way that's rare to see in anime. Tomino engages with his previous works and the future of gundam in a way that's uplifting, hopeful, but still impactful. The fact that he managed to do it twice, Turn A, and in different ways is the reason I consider him a genius. Being as it's a show made by a director that's been directing longer than some directors have been alive, he and his staff show an absolute mastery of conveying meanings through action instead of exposition. Reco is a visual show in a way that many series are not it requires apt attention but is constantly rewarding both with character motivation and actions expressed physically, but also with humor sight gags and small touches that most directors would cut to save budget. To keep your attention the show is also beautiful, not in the pastoral sense of Turn A, but in a sort of expression of pure exuberance. Characters, robots, buildings are all splashed with color. The show is joyful and filled with vivacity that one wouldn't expect from someone with the reputation Tomino has, It's a celebration of life and the living of it.
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Sep 12, 2022 23:35
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I liked G Reco but it isn't my favorite Tomino show by a longshot. I enjoyed the cast and setting quite a bit though!
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Sep 12, 2022 23:38
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Never thought I'd see myself agreeing with Gaius on something, but here we are.
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Sep 12, 2022 23:39
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Ethiser posted:I'm pretty sure the reason people bounced off of Reconguista is not that it's secretly a really deep and complex show and people couldn't understand that. I remember the discourse at the time. "Oh please, Raraiya suddenly wanders off right when they're going to meet people who knew her before? That's convenient lazy writing." was a thing people actually said. Followed up a couple episodes later with "Oh so suddenly Raraiya is totally fine now? I don't think you go from brain damaged to fine in a day like that. Poorly written show"
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Sep 12, 2022 23:56
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Gripweed posted:I remember the discourse at the time. "Oh please, Raraiya suddenly wanders off right when they're going to meet people who knew her before? That's convenient lazy writing." was a thing people actually said. Followed up a couple episodes later with "Oh so suddenly Raraiya is totally fine now? I don't think you go from brain damaged to fine in a day like that. Poorly written show" Heck I specifically remember how Raraiya says she's sick before she happens to avoid the meeting but then later in that episode another character mentions how she doesn't appear to have a fever or anything.
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Sep 12, 2022 23:58
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I love G-Reco to bits, but on my recent rewatch I found the back half to be really rough. They really write a lot of checks the show simply does not have time to cash with the trip to Venus Globe. They spend roughly 95% of their screen time there fighting the G-IT goons in and around the artificial sea, have about two scenes of very inconsequential dialogue with the Venus Globe inhabitants, and then turn around and go home, but the remainder of the show really wants to treat the trip like it was a very important formative experience for the crew. A single awkward dinner scene does not a life-altering experience make. I can't help but compare it to the culture clashes in Turn A, which were given far more room to air out and breathe.
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Sep 13, 2022 00:00
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Srice posted:Heck I specifically remember how Raraiya says she's sick before she happens to avoid the meeting but then later in that episode another character mentions how she doesn't appear to have a fever or anything. I mean let's be honest here, who hasn't faked being sick to get out of an awkward family reunion?
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Sep 13, 2022 00:00
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It was really funny watching people lose their minds because one character wasn't telegraphing that she was just acting, and just straight up did it. It's also super funny seeing the "I am a healthy human woman" line without context, and you only get that context if you were paying close attention to that character's reactions earlier. But yeah G-Reco was very frank about tossing a bunch of information at the audience in the background and absolutely refusing to actually indicate that this was what was happening. It's like Tomino constantly sending gorillas walking through the back of the scene while you're trying to watch these kids play catch. I am not making any comment as to whether or not this is good storytelling.
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Sep 13, 2022 00:03
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Runa posted:It was really funny watching people lose their minds because one character wasn't telegraphing that she was just acting, and just straight up did it. One of my favorite characterization moments, and this one is pretty blatant, is when Bellri finds out Aida is is his sister and doesn't really have a big reaction to it at the time. But then later in the episode they see a couple enemy MS nearby and the captain says they're just gonna fire a couple warning shots to scare them off but Bellri decides that he'd much rather go out there and shoot them.
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Sep 13, 2022 00:12
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https://twitter.com/sociohat/status/1519719032836231168?s=20&t=pfUNVnCulP14NBdq56GVmQ
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Sep 13, 2022 01:01
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Waffleman_ posted:https://twitter.com/sociohat/status/1519719032836231168?s=20&t=pfUNVnCulP14NBdq56GVmQ So that is why Travis turns into Unicorn Gundam
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Sep 13, 2022 01:13
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Do we know when in October exactly G-Witch will start airing? I'm not really familiar with anime seasons so is there a standard date for fall shows to start?
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Sep 13, 2022 01:48
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wdarkk posted:Do we know when in October exactly G-Witch will start airing? I'm not really familiar with anime seasons so is there a standard date for fall shows to start? October 2. A bunch of this season's shows will be ending either next week or the week after (based on when they aired initially and episode counts being 12 or 13) if they haven't already, then G-Witch will show up.
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Sep 13, 2022 01:52
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I think a major problem for G-Reco is that it didn't really prove itself trustworthy. That is to say, there's not a big moment where it goes "See all these things that didn't seem to make sense? I just provided you context so they're all clear in their intent" to make it easier to trust the show later. There are small moments like that, but even they tend to be subtle and easy to miss unless you're paying close attention. That's not bad in-and-of itself, but you need a few showy moments to make the audience convinced you're on the level, rather than just doing a bunch of random crap for random crap's sake. People defend it as Tomino being Tomino, but even that's not really the case. The original Gundam, Zeta, Turn A, (and those are just ones I've seen in full) they all have characters who act as mostly reliable narrators, letting you find your feet in the complicated morass of motivations and information gaps. Sure, Loran doesn't know everything, but he has the basic lay of the land, and he's not trying to bullshit anyone, so you're able to kind of find true North by comparing everyone else's read of the situation to Loran's. Meanwhile, G-Reco has everyone be massively ignorant of the whole picture, and also much, much stupider than even the comic relief characters in prior shows. Yes, the militia in Turn A wanted to get back to Earth in a barrel, but they were really drunk at the time and had never been in space before. Meanwhile, the Amerians in G-Reco have been at war for decades without inventing the idea of a brig. Worse still, Reconguista isn't naturalistic with its explanations of in-setting information. It's awkward and spiteful. On the one end, you get one of the worst "As you know, Dan" infodumps on Kuntala, long after the show had provided the hints to let the viewer figure things out and after the website had given a detailed explanation, landing with an astonishing clunk. Similarly, in the first episode, Bellri unnaturally walked the viewer through the controls for his MS. But when he and Aida were naturally having a conversation that could contextualize why the Capital opposed the Amerian demand for more batteries? Boom. Cutaway to a MS fight for just long enough to entirely skip the explanation. The show also has terrible, terrible pacing, with pointless fights every episode that usually do nothing for the plot beyond killing the flow, before things pick up where they left off right before the fight. Even the regular interruptions in Zeta were smoother. Take out even a quarter of those fight scenes, the show would have more room to breath, and it could maybe get things done at a sensible pace. Instead, major plot points get rushed so that fights can get dragged out. It's a shame. G-Reco has some interesting ideas, cool MS designs, spots of great animation (everyone loves the teleport punch, and so do I) and moments that show off the kind of clever trusts-the-viewer writing that its defenders rush to, but the poor pacing, clunky-or-absent exposition, and confusing motivations prevent it from being great, or even good.
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Sep 13, 2022 02:04
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chiasaur11 posted:I think a major problem for G-Reco is that it didn't really prove itself trustworthy. That is to say, there's not a big moment where it goes "See all these things that didn't seem to make sense? I just provided you context so they're all clear in their intent" to make it easier to trust the show later. There are small moments like that, but even they tend to be subtle and easy to miss unless you're paying close attention. That's not bad in-and-of itself, but you need a few showy moments to make the audience convinced you're on the level, rather than just doing a bunch of random crap for random crap's sake. I dunno man, I was on board the whole time. I never needed the show to convince me that it was worth watching because the first episode had me from the get go and "The Earth is not square!" locked it down and I thought it was kickass from then on
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Sep 13, 2022 02:26
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I was trying to write down how I felt about G-Reco but chiasaur11 basically said it for me and way better than I could probably express it. I dunno if I'd go as far as saying it isn't good though, I think there's a good show there with a lot of flaws, rather than something that fails to even reach that level. It's far from a masterpiece, but it's an okay show that sadly doesn't really succeed in what it's trying to do at all, mostly due to bad pacing in general. If the movies really do fix that (and with the extra time and not being forced to cram a fight every 20-something minutes, they have no excuse not to), then I can imagine I could enjoy them. Hopefully they'll all be subbed soon and GundamInfo uploads them (again, I didn't expect them to last for such a short time!), I am very much interested in watching them (even if it's in a hurry so that mistake doesn't repeat itself again)
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Sep 13, 2022 02:28
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Gripweed posted:I dunno man, I was on board the whole time. I never needed the show to convince me that it was worth watching because the first episode had me from the get go and "The Earth is not square!" locked it down and I thought it was kickass from then on I'm glad it worked so well for you, but the whole argument is about why people who weren't sold instantly should invest. The first episode isn't enough for the show to reveal reasons for its odder decisions, so if you aren't onboard just because you like the energy, then it needs a pitch. And it's really not good with the pitch.
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Sep 13, 2022 03:17
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I liked G-Reco but it was a messy show that somehow felt rushed and needed more time but also a show that I didn't want more than 26 episodes off. But at least it was an interesting Tomino mess and not a boring Tomino mess
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Sep 13, 2022 04:49
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chiasaur11 posted:People defend it as Tomino being Tomino, but even that's not really the case. The original Gundam, Zeta, Turn A, (and those are just ones I've seen in full) they all have characters who act as mostly reliable narrators, letting you find your feet in the complicated morass of motivations and information gaps I think the problem with G-Reco is that Tomino wrote a show that clearly wanted and needed 50 odd episodes to tell, then realized that he's a 75 year old man and not up to that, so he scaled back the number of episodes but never actually scaled back the story he wanted to tell or pared it down a bit to what's important at all. He just stuffed the story he'd already intended to tell into a shorter timeframe. It's the same basic problem that F91 has, I think. The film keeps several things that, in a self contained movie go nowhere and don't actually add anything, like Annamarie's jealousy and defection. In a full series her actions would probably say something about people or the factions the way Emma and Reccoa's defections did in Zeta; the movie just kept the bare minimum needed to get the action of a defection across though, and loses any actual meaning because of it. The movie would have been better served by cutting that tiny subplot altogether, and even if it only saved a minute or so of screen time, it'd be a minute that could be used to focus more on plot that desperately needed it. F91 comes off as overstuffed and underserved because nothing has the focus it really needs, and while G-Reco isn't as extreme as F91, I think the reason that a lot of things have so little explanation or reiteration to help viewers is less Tomino trusting the viewer, and more Tomino going "Right, I foreshadowed that once; that's done, we can build on it now and not actually acknowledging it again means I have a few extra seconds/minutes to foreshadow this other thing once". So he managed to get everything he wanted in, but a lot of it doesn't feel like it's really built up or explored properly. Which, obviously some people love, but a lot of people bounced off G-Reco in a way they hadn't with previous Tomino works.
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Sep 13, 2022 15:23
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The fact you refer to the show as 'untrustworthy' and 'spiteful' drives home the issue not being entirely the show. It is not and doesn't try to be your enemy. Stuff like people being dumb about war because they haven't been in wars in a long time is exaggerated but not wrong. People who grew up in peace or isolated from the concerns of war get loving dumb. It is why so many people rush to 'why don't we use nukes more' or you have people wishing for war for a variety of reasons. Likewise the cut in the explanation isn't spiteful. It bluntly lets you know that specific info is irrelevant. It us a clear blunt sign that the show isn't going to show you stuff that doesn't matter. (Unless it is funny.)
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Sep 13, 2022 17:20
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G Reco was good because the eye catches were dances and I believe choreographed by his daughter. The ED with all the dancing was good too. Mask was consistently high kicking and all his mechs could high kick too.
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Sep 14, 2022 01:56
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G Reco was bad because a lot of the mechs I liked never got model kits.
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Sep 14, 2022 02:05
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wdarkk posted:G Reco was bad because a lot of the mechs I liked never got model kits. This is a legitimate criticism
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Sep 14, 2022 02:07
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ImpAtom posted:The fact you refer to the show as 'untrustworthy' and 'spiteful' drives home the issue not being entirely the show. It is not and doesn't try to be your enemy. Given the number of pointless fights, an argument in G-Reco's favor that depends on its commitment to excising all unneeded scenes is akin to an argument for The Creeping Terror that pivots on the film's cutting-edge special effects. And of course the show's my enemy. I'm an adult. It would hardly be Gundam if it wasn't.
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Sep 14, 2022 02:13
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chiasaur11 posted:And of course the show's my enemy. I'm an adult. It would hardly be Gundam if it wasn't. Tomino's cameo is by far the most positive any Gundam series has been about the role of the older generations.
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Sep 14, 2022 03:43
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