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Xiahou Dun posted:So you have no idea. Again, you just want to have the argument you want to have and that other guy you tried to call out hasn't come back yet, so you purposefully missed my entire point, chief. Again, no thanks.
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Dec 20, 2022 02:30
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mutata posted:And you missed my entire point, chief. Well done. Your criticism doesn't make any sense because it's bullshit decorum bloviating about a committee that hasn't actually done any decorum bullshit.
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Dec 20, 2022 02:32
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Xiahou Dun posted:Your criticism doesn't make any sense because it's bullshit decorum bloviating about a committee that hasn't actually done any decorum bullshit. This is wrong. I merely used the decorum line because it comes up so often on D&D. It's a comparison to illustrate how cynics see the committee's actions, and doesn't have any connection to the committee at all. Sorry if that was confusing. D&D thinks decorum is useless and distracting in the same way that cynics think this committee was another Mueller investigation. You can't blame people for being cynical about these big grand gestures congress makes because they so very often just fizzle and amount to nothing. You've studied it all and you see this as a bigger part in a larger machine. Fine, we'll see. Most people just see this as congress holding meetings while Rome burns and, again, considering the behavior of the legislative branch as a whole over the past 8+ years, that's not an unreasonable belief. Edit: Again, you're just wanting to have the argument YOU want to have, so I'm gonna stop responding to you. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST) mutata fucked around with this message at 02:38 on Dec 20, 2022 |
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Dec 20, 2022 02:36
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mutata posted:This is wrong. I merely used the decorum line because it comes up so often on D&D. It's a comparison to illustrate how cynics see the committee's actions, and doesn't have any connection to the committee at all. Sorry if that was confusing. Yes, and my point is that's a silly non-point because it ignores what the purpose of the committee is.
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Dec 20, 2022 02:38
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Grip it and rip it posted:Is it tiresome to post like this? if you don't think this process has any valid purpose then why follow and comment on it? Would you prefer that they not make a criminal referral? i have no idea if this process ever leads to the crowning 'gotcha' moment that plenty of people would love for it to lead to, but I don't think even the staunchest of nothing-matters poster 2 years ago could look at the current state of the republican party and trump's personal stock as a candidate and come to the conclusion that there have been no consequences or that this is anything other than a big loving deal for republican politics.
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Dec 20, 2022 02:41
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Herstory Begins Now posted:i have no idea if this process ever leads to the crowning 'gotcha' moment that plenty of people would love for it to lead to, but I don't think even the staunchest of nothing-matters poster 2 years ago could look at the current state of the republican party and trump's personal stock as a candidate and come to the conclusion that there have been no consequences or that this is anything other than a big loving deal for republican politics. and it continues to be a major issue which will directly effect the extent to which Trump is ever held to account for his actions. The idea that this is a nothinburger is strange to me - we are in completely unprecedented waters for U.S. politics. The idea that anyone on this forum can draw any solid conclusions about the impact of this committee and what transpired on January 6 is doubtful. What is clear is that there are factions wthin the republican party that want to be done with Trump - in many ways they have been handed a tool that could be used to accomplish that goal. Whether anything that major will happen remains to be seen.
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Dec 20, 2022 02:57
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Grip it and rip it posted:and it continues to be a major issue which will directly effect the extent to which Trump is ever held to account for his actions. The idea that this is a nothinburger is strange to me - we are in completely unprecedented waters for U.S. politics. The idea that anyone on this forum can draw any solid conclusions about the impact of this committee and what transpired on January 6 is doubtful. That's all fair enough.
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Dec 20, 2022 03:18
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Remember also that the mainstream news media is completely corrupted, so the coverage is usually tilted towards whatever right-wing nutjob outrage du jour is flowing through the intersphere (either directly, or as reactions to, as though it were a real thing) and consequently it lends the impression that we are not living through a pivotal and unprecedented period in US national politics, nor that real social change is actually going on. We all need feedback to some extent or another, and not seeing these things being reported by the larger chunks of mass media leaves the false impression that nothing progressive is landing/changing. Look at the midterms. Polling firms mis-read, or entirely missed, the real anger and frustration of the majority of voters, especially women. We all knew people affected by GQP policies, but that groundswell was never given the coverage it should have. I lived through Watergate and Nixon's resignation. It was a story of international scope that was in the press for years and had knock-on effects through all strata of society & media.
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Dec 20, 2022 03:45
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Herstory Begins Now posted:i have no idea if this process ever leads to the crowning 'gotcha' moment that plenty of people would love for it to lead to, but I don't think even the staunchest of nothing-matters poster 2 years ago could look at the current state of the republican party and trump's personal stock as a candidate and come to the conclusion that there have been no consequences or that this is anything other than a big loving deal for republican politics. Exactly, if nothing actually mattered in the past 5 years Trump would still be President.
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Dec 20, 2022 03:57
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Herstory Begins Now posted:i have no idea if this process ever leads to the crowning 'gotcha' moment that plenty of people would love for it to lead to, but I don't think even the staunchest of nothing-matters poster 2 years ago could look at the current state of the republican party and trump's personal stock as a candidate and come to the conclusion that there have been no consequences or that this is anything other than a big loving deal for republican politics. At this point we've been through the "it doesn't matter, Trump is gonna win again and pardon everyone who did crimes for him" to "it doesn't matter, the Republicans are gonna back Trump and overturn the election if he orders it" to "It doesn't matter, Biden is going to pardon everyone in the name of reconciliation" to "It doesn't matter, the attackers won't be charged" to "it doesn't matter, Congress won't do any real investigations" to "It doesn't matter, the investigation will pick some low-end fall guys rather than try to pin anything on Trump" to "it doesn't matter, they won't really make a criminal referral to an ex-president" to whatever it is now. To be clear, I'm not accusing any specific people of moving their personal goalposts over these last two years, I don't really know or care enough to sift through articles or posts on it. I'm just saying that confident "here's where it ends with a whimper" arguments have been wrong again and again and even It's true this time I feel justified asking what exactly the line for "consequences" is before I give anyone a ticket in the I told you so lottery.
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Dec 20, 2022 04:10
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PainterofCrap posted:Remember also that the mainstream news media is completely corrupted, so the coverage is usually tilted towards whatever right-wing nutjob outrage du jour is flowing through the intersphere (either directly, or as reactions to, as though it were a real thing) and consequently it lends the impression that we are not living through a pivotal and unprecedented period in US national politics, nor that real social change is actually going on. We all need feedback to some extent or another, and not seeing these things being reported by the larger chunks of mass media leaves the false impression that nothing progressive is landing/changing. I have no idea where you are getting the idea that the "mainstream news media" isn't covering progressive changes, nor the idea that they, whomever you're defining them to be, are tilting coverage toward "rightwing outrage du jour." It's not as if the committee's activities and referrals aren't getting coverage. Killer robot posted:At this point we've been through the "it doesn't matter, Trump is gonna win again and pardon everyone who did crimes for him" to "it doesn't matter, the Republicans are gonna back Trump and overturn the election if he orders it" to "It doesn't matter, Biden is going to pardon everyone in the name of reconciliation" to "It doesn't matter, the attackers won't be charged" to "it doesn't matter, Congress won't do any real investigations" to "It doesn't matter, the investigation will pick some low-end fall guys rather than try to pin anything on Trump" to "it doesn't matter, they won't really make a criminal referral to an ex-president" to whatever it is now. The rhetorical utility of futility arguments to ruin discussion is that they're structured as unfalsifiable, shifting counterfactuals.
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Dec 20, 2022 04:17
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It's a nothing burger because it's about a washed up has-been one term retired ex-president. Yeah, if a credible candidate for president had congress refer charge recommendations to the doj, that'd be a story - but Donald is a nobody now. Irrelevant to current events.
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Dec 20, 2022 06:32
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The goalpost-moving is really an emotional response to justice moving slowly, and I think we need to acknowledge it. For example, imagine Trump getting sent to ADX Florence with a 20-year sentence and no chance of parole. Rational thinking would say "well, that's the end of Trump," while an emotional response could say that the sentence is too lenient. That wouldn't be an incorrect response, but it wouldn't be grounded in reality either. Nobody, probably not even Merrick Garland, knows what the future holds with the criminal referrals - to say anything otherwise is dishonest. Honestly, I don't see the 118th Congress making a big stink about this, barring the usual crazies. With Mitch McConnell publicly putting the blame of the insurrection attempt at The Guy Who Did It, I feel as though harsh feelings for the January 6 Committee by the majority of Republicans will be kept behind closed doors.
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Dec 20, 2022 08:40
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Edward Mass posted:The goalpost-moving is really an emotional response to justice moving slowly, and I think we need to acknowledge it. For example, imagine Trump getting sent to ADX Florence with a 20-year sentence and no chance of parole. Rational thinking would say "well, that's the end of Trump," while an emotional response could say that the sentence is too lenient. That wouldn't be an incorrect response, but it wouldn't be grounded in reality either. Nobody, probably not even Merrick Garland, knows what the future holds with the criminal referrals - to say anything otherwise is dishonest. I think the house GOP will try to kick stuff off about it but will either not have the votes or get mostly ignored. My guess is they will just do some hunter Biden trial or something like that and try to push it as the same as treason and try to make it a prime time event only for it to not get the votes or something
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Dec 20, 2022 12:28
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You only have to read the first pages of the thread to find out that the consensus has always been "Trump is never going to jail, consequences are for poor people". But sure, the goalposts are just sprinting.
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Dec 20, 2022 13:08
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Xander77 posted:You only have to read the first pages of the thread to find out that the consensus has always been "Trump is never going to jail, consequences are for poor people". But sure, the goalposts are just sprinting. I've specifically stated what I consider consequences: Trump and other powerful people involved being charged, prosecuted and, potentially, convicted with sentencing including jail time for the more severe charges. I also stated why I don't think it will happen, which is that it sets a precedent about politicians and appointees in the executive and legislative branches seeing consequences for things they've done in while wielding the power of their offices. I'd be happy to surprised in this case.
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Dec 20, 2022 13:43
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Xander77 posted:You only have to read the first pages of the thread to find out that the consensus has always been "Trump is never going to jail, consequences are for poor people". But sure, the goalposts are just sprinting. This was never the consensus, there's just always been people saying it.
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Dec 20, 2022 14:14
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Blue Footed Booby posted:This was never the consensus, there's just always been people saying it. No that is and has been the consensus. Sorry about you being mistaken.
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Dec 20, 2022 14:31
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Inner Light posted:No that is and has been the consensus. Sorry about you being mistaken. Hi, user of forums https://forums.somethingawful.com here I would just like to chime in and say that that was never the consensus. Nothingburgers doomers don't and should in fact never be permitted to control the discourse. The consensus vote is now 2 to 1. Have a nice day!
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Dec 20, 2022 15:12
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Archonex posted:Hi, user of forums https://forums.somethingawful.com here I would just like to chime in and say that that was never the consensus. Nothingburgers doomers don't and should in fact never be permitted to control the discourse. The consensus vote is now 2 to 1. Have a nice day! 3 to 1. It's okay, though: manufactured consent is the playbook of tyranny everywhere.
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Dec 20, 2022 15:23
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Jesus if yall are gonna do... Whatever this is, would you at least take the time to quote each other's earlier posts? This tepid drek can't even really be called flaming, and it certainly isn't debate.
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Dec 20, 2022 16:58
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Ynglaur posted:Sometimes I think the nothingburgers actually just want mob justice. If they hanged Trump in front of the Capitol tomorrow morning they'd say, "It was And the "  at all costs" principle is bad because the logical conclusion to it is if the Nazis figure out how to exploit the democratic system to gain power, we should hand the keys over. America's history has moments of temporary authoritarianism to protect itself from more permanent authoritarianism. Yeah, blacksite the Republicans who were involved the coup including Trump. If Americans have a problem with it they can vote on it in 2024.
Automata 10 Pack fucked around with this message at 18:59 on Dec 20, 2022 |
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Dec 20, 2022 17:07
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Inner Light posted:No that is and has been the consensus. Sorry about you being mistaken. shut the gently caress up. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Dec 20, 2022 17:41
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Dapper_Swindler posted:My guess is they will just do some hunter Biden trial Maybe the right move at this point is just to impeach Hunter Biden.
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Dec 20, 2022 18:11
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I'm the 2023 committee hearing that's just 6 hours of showing photos of Hunter Biden's dick and asking why the Deep State was covering this up and violating Giuliani's first amendment.
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Dec 20, 2022 18:19
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Youth Decay posted:Exactly, if nothing actually mattered in the past 5 years Trump would still be President. This was a pretty direct result of the one thing everyone agreed actually mattered - Trump getting to appoint several Supreme Court Justices. When people talk about nothing mattering, they are not talking about presidents getting Supreme Court appointees.
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Dec 20, 2022 18:38
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GlyphGryph posted:This was a pretty direct result of the one thing everyone agreed actually mattered - Trump getting to appoint several Supreme Court Justices. "When people talk about nothing mattering they aren't talking about the things that mattered" is accurate as hell but still...
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Dec 20, 2022 19:21
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I’m going to disengage on this topic for the moment to avoid fanning any more flames or getting probed for being annoying, but I’ll state for the record the mattering goalposts are about lasting consequences to Trump and the GOP establishment. No one was arguing Trump himself is a nothing burger, and everyone agrees the justices are/were a BFD. Good luck everyone! (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Dec 20, 2022 19:38
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Inner Light posted:I’m going to disengage on this topic for the moment to avoid fanning any more flames or getting probed for being annoying, if you were going to disengage in good faith you would have stopped posting or you wouldn't have said anything more than this shut the gently caress up
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Dec 20, 2022 19:56
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Can we all lol that trump committed sedition and insurrection
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Dec 20, 2022 20:10
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TheSpartacus posted:Can we all lol that trump committed sedition and insurrection No. Laughter is haram. lol
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Dec 20, 2022 21:24
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TheSpartacus posted:Can we all lol that trump committed sedition and insurrection i have nothing left to weep after witnessing my country being brought to its knees by a cabal of grifters and idiots led by a pathetic orange clown. and so, i must lol - i lol at the fact that we very nearly had to rely on the candor of butchers and warmongers as the last line of defense against the desperate gamble of a greasy narcissist because so many of our institutions were foolishly founded on the idea that someone like him would never hold that kind of power. lol, and also: lmao.
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Dec 20, 2022 23:25
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America was doomed the moment Nixon could yeet away on Marine Force One without any repercussions. That being said I’m hoping the writers of this season of reality are building for some hilarious poo poo for Trump.
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Dec 21, 2022 02:09
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https://twitter.com/washingtonpost/status/1605368996492083200?t=TvRvGhcdu9-m4Vi1ncj1Kg&s=19
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Dec 21, 2022 02:15
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cr0y posted:https://twitter.com/washingtonpost/status/1605368996492083200?t=TvRvGhcdu9-m4Vi1ncj1Kg&s=19 Is this where we find out he has actually very little money, something far more pertinent and embarrassing for him personally than some silly little insurrection accusation?
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Dec 21, 2022 04:46
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britishbornandbread posted:Is this where we find out he has actually very little money, something far more pertinent and embarrassing for him personally than some silly little insurrection accusation? Chuck Schumer puts forth a bill to unseal Trump’s urologist’s notes. He slaps the leather bound hard copy onto his podium in a suggestive manner and stares into the camera.
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Dec 21, 2022 05:50
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britishbornandbread posted:Is this where we find out he has actually very little money, something far more pertinent and embarrassing for him personally than some silly little insurrection accusation? that's right
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Dec 21, 2022 05:57
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Xiahou Dun posted:Chuck Schumer puts forth a bill to unseal Trump’s urologist’s notes. I can just hear Schumer going, in his interminably Chuck Schumer way, with a full on cocky smile, "Yes folks, he has a small dick  "
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Dec 21, 2022 07:37
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Kith posted:i have nothing left to weep after witnessing my country being brought to its knees by a cabal of grifters and idiots led by a pathetic orange clown. and so, i must lol - i lol at the fact that we very nearly had to rely on the candor of butchers and warmongers as the last line of defense against the desperate gamble of a greasy narcissist because so many of our institutions were foolishly founded on the idea that someone like him would never hold that kind of power. "nearly had" as if the danger is over, lol indeed.
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Dec 21, 2022 07:57
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nine-gear crow posted:I can just hear Schumer going, in his interminably Chuck Schumer way, with a full on cocky smile, "Yes folks, he has a small dick O yeah part of the joke was that it’s Chucky loving Schumes. He’s like the putz equivalent of the gigachad archetype. The gigaputz.
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Dec 21, 2022 07:58
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