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Bongo Bill posted:I like picking things from a menu in video games. And in the context of Final Fantasy, I just feel turn based/menu suits the rpg genre. If you're going to have a story-driven game, that to me is one where I'm feeling like sitting down, having a watch and explore, and when I get into some battles they should be overall pretty under control. If I want to play an action game, I want to be playing an action game, not a maybe-you're-in-a-story-section-where-it's-slow or maybe-you're-in-a-frantic-battle-section, it just feels like mashing two things together that don't quite work right. I don't want to turn on Mario and have to patiently do a sudoku before I can jump on some goombas (I love doing both, but the pace switch doesn't mesh for me). ApplesandOranges posted:I had fairly low expectations for FF7R (y'know, as a cashgrab) but it was better than I expected. Still not my cup of tea, but I didn't get put off by the plot til the last bit and I appreciate it trying what it did.
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Mar 26, 2023 07:45
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https://twitter.com/magicswordking/status/1639071253007933441
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Mar 26, 2023 07:50
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NikkolasKing posted:If you don't mind me asking, why did you prefer VIII over, say, VI or VII in terms of gameplay? I know some people like how breakable it is so maybe that's it? Fundamentally, while I like games where you just pick things in a menu, the menu picking needs to matter. The turn-based ff games which I didn't list don't. They are easy and breakable and completely unrewarding to me. In general, the turn based games I like come in two flavors. 1. Games where resource management matters. Persona 3-5 or DQ8 for example, where you need to manage your mp well enough to make it through as much of the dungeon as you need to. At that point, decisions at least feel meaningful to me. This basically never happened in the older ff's outside of FF1. It has been exceedingly easy to outgrind things in most other ff games where you can just hit attack and sleep through most battles. Or cast spells and not really care about your MP because you are rolling in ethers. Granted, in Persona and DQ8 once you know what you need and where to get it, they're just as breakable but the first times through are a delight. 2. Much more relevant to your question is games that have timing elements. Sabin Blitzes in 6. Renzokuken/timing the gunblade explosion, Duel, and Trigger? (Irvine's Limit Break) in FF8. Tidus and Auron's Limit breaks. Xenogears, Legend of Dragoon, or Super Mario RPG. 8 is obscenely easy but at least there's something that I can engage with for my own amusement beyond just attacking relentlessly if I am so inclined. As an aside, I like it when weaknesses really matter too I suppose. I loved swapping dudes out in X and seeing that overkill come up. Love doing baton passes in p5 to exploit weaknesses and get those all in attacks. Octopath Traveler 1 had a miserable disjointed story and I would never recommend it because of that but it was pure satisfaction to line buffs and debuffs up on some character to absolutely level a monster through repeated weakness crushing.
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Mar 26, 2023 07:50
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kirbysuperstar posted:A focus on having the turn order readily viewable and delaying turns being a big factor (especially in Cold Steel) Sounds kinda like Xenosaga 1, too. Interesting. Thanks. Ytlaya posted:IMO the Cold Steel system becomes a lot worse once Break is introduced. I really don't like the way all boss battles devolve into "break the boss and unload everything on it, and hope to hell that kills it because you can barely do any damage when it isn't broken and it will trigger its rage mechanic at low health." I've also never liked Break mechanics. The one Neptunia game I tried had it, Xenosaga II had it, of course FFXIII had it. But I guess if I ever get around to the games I'll still have plenty to play and enjoy before I even get there. Failboattootoot posted:Fundamentally, while I like games where you just pick things in a menu, the menu picking needs to matter. The turn-based ff games which I didn't list don't. They are easy and breakable and completely unrewarding to me. In general, the turn based games I like come in two flavors. That all makes sense. I mentioned it earlier but you might like Blue Dragon given #1. It requires timed hits to do pretty much any action save for item usage, at least to my memory.
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Mar 26, 2023 07:57
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NikkolasKing posted:Flop? No. Utterly fail to make any meaningful impression in the gaming market a la FFXV? Possible. FFXV, despite being a mess and releasing at the tail end of a period of declining market relevance for the series, was one of the most financially successful FF releases of all time and along with the slow rehabilitation of FFXIV pretty much saved the series. XV sold more than 10 million copies, which is decent. We no longer live at a moment of decline for Japanese rpgs however, and the profile for Square-Enix titles has changed quite a bit in the last 7 years. Elden Ring came along and changed a lot of opinions over what is possible going forward. FFXVI is gonna sell like 20 million copies over its lifetime, half of all PS5 owners are going to buy this game.
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Mar 26, 2023 08:17
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Didn't 15 turn a profit in its first week
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Mar 26, 2023 08:17
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Also Bravely Default kicks rear end, someone poo poo on it earlier and I just wanted to say they're wrong. Game was a blast.
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Mar 26, 2023 08:22
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Mar 26, 2023 08:26
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BeanpolePeckerwood posted:FFXV, despite being a mess and releasing at the tail end of a period of declining market relevance for the series, was one of the most financially successful FF releases of all time and along with the slow rehabilitation of FFXIV pretty much saved the series. XV sold more than 10 million copies, which is decent. We no longer live at a moment of decline for Japanese rpgs however, and the profile for Square-Enix titles has changed quite a bit in the last 7 years. Elden Ring came along and changed a lot of opinions over what is possible going forward. Sales aren't everything. As a Metal Gear Solid fan for over twenty years, I know MGS3 sold half as much as MGS2. And yet which game was more beloved and is still raved about to this day and which game had a frothing hatred for the first decade of its lifetime? The game was so despised the next game went out of its way to mock it and belittle it repeatedly. FFXV can sell as much as it wants. It doesn't mean it made any real impression on gamers. It came, it had its five minutes, it went. It in no way has maintained its legacy like FFVI or VII or X.
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Mar 26, 2023 08:30
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Sure because FFXV was kinda mid. If FFXVI is not mid it will likely be perceived as a bigger deal by people talking on twitter or whatever. FFVIIR was an action game and had a very positive reception, while name recognition helped a lot I don't think it being an action rpg hurt it as much as some losers wanted to think it would. I don't think a change in genre will hurt the ff brand as much as you think
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Mar 26, 2023 08:35
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Noctis was in the top 20 characters in that December JP poll and everyone fondly remembers coming up with new resuhpees, photos and cup noodle along other things (like Jared), it has more cultural prominence than 12 or 13.
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Mar 26, 2023 08:41
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mandatory lesbian posted:Ff fans were not fans bc of the turn based combat, but bc they wanted to play long rpgs and watch melodramatic cutscenes. And ff has never stopped delivering on those fronts well also the music is goated
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Mar 26, 2023 08:44
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kirbysuperstar posted:Didn't 15 turn a profit in its first week It broke even in 24 hours 'shipping' 5 million copies in that early window, but took another 6 years to sell the other 5 mil, and the stats are probably massaged a bit. Those numbers are good but kinda niche considering budget/marketing, like on the level with the average FROM title, not what you would expect from a longstanding cultural icon that absolutely dominated the end of the 3D golden age. But that's because FF sales didn't really grow apace with the expansion of the videogame market between 2004-2014. FF7R did XV's numbers in a fraction of the time and launched during the onset of a pandemic on a single platform. So I would say that the series is on the uptick. That said, I would love to know what 7R's lifetime sales look like. Like I think I'm probably being somewhat generous to the upcoming XVI sales, but it's been a long rear end time since a game of its stature has released in such a privileged position as an exclusive. I think it's going to do extremely well both critically and commercially. NikkolasKing posted:FFXV can sell as much as it wants. It doesn't mean it made any real impression on gamers. It came, it had its five minutes, it went. It in no way has maintained its legacy like FFVI or VII or X. Noctis is in Tekken.
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Mar 26, 2023 08:54
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SyntheticPolygon posted:Sure because FFXV was kinda mid. If FFXVI is not mid it will likely be perceived as a bigger deal by people talking on twitter or whatever. I did not say it would flop, maybe just kinda come and go. But if Square wants a certified classic and it doesn't end up being that...I dunno, maybe it would prompt a change in direction. Or not. Or maybe it will be an instant classic. We'll find out soon enough. kirbysuperstar posted:Noctis was in the top 20 characters in that December JP poll and everyone fondly remembers coming up with new resuhpees, photos and cup noodle along other things (like Jared), it has more cultural prominence than 12 or 13. Well, XII is in the same "it came, it sold well, it went" wagon. And XIII, as we discussed recently, came out in a time very inhospitable to JRPGs. XV with the photos and Cup Noodles and all that, it definitely knew what it was doing to leave an impression with today's gaming audience. You're totally right that if you wanna spout off some memes, XV delivers way more than XII or XIII. But I'm not sure if that really translates into it being a massively beloved game. I've never seen it place super high in any poll. But I can just swap XV out for XII. All I was trying to say is "this game came out, it did well, but had no lasting impact."
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Mar 26, 2023 08:56
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kirbysuperstar posted:Noctis was in the top 20 characters in that December JP poll and everyone fondly remembers coming up with new resuhpees, photos and cup noodle along other things (like Jared), it has more cultural prominence than 12 or 13. Well I agree its better than those 2.
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Mar 26, 2023 09:00
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NikkolasKing posted:Maybe the answer is that both turn-based combat and a good story are why people liked the games. The pure turn based combat was easily the worst thing about the old games, introducing atb was the best thing the series did to make the games fun to play (along with jobs). Also there is no "we" get over yourself you pompous prick
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Mar 26, 2023 13:09
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mandatory lesbian posted:The pure turn based combat was easily the worst thing about the old games, introducing atb was the best thing the series did to make the games fun to play (along with jobs). I'm sorry, did I start this conversation? Strong Convections posted:I really feel for that person that said they don't want it to be an action game. I have never once barged into this thread and started talking about "turn-based gameplay when." If it's being discussed, I'll join in. So, yeah, there's definitely "we." Maybe it's only a few dozen of us, but it ain't just me. Also FFX had a better battle system than any of the ATB games.
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Mar 26, 2023 13:18
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A friendly reminder that FF1's battle system was built with the concept of American Football in mind, and FF4's ATB was designed to mimic the feel of F1 Racing, so really the early Final Fantasy games are more sports titles than RPGs. Anyway, yeah I'd like a turn-based FF16, but whatever, there's plenty of other turn-based games to play and part of the charm of the FF series is they just do whatever the gently caress they want with each iteration. That doesn't mean I like every title, but it also results in titles I loving love, so I'm cool with them experimenting and trying different poo poo. That's what the whole series is about ever since they decided to make FF2 a loving weird-rear end SaGa prototype where half the world's population is killed off by a guy who literally conquers Hell. I'll probably look into FF16 if/when it hits PC and probably enjoy it. Also FF16's sales are likely going to be heavily influenced by the install base of the PS5 more than anything, let alone what the gameplay is like. It's gonna be the first real big exclusive for that console and all, and mainline FF games do sell well generally. Mega64 fucked around with this message at 13:33 on Mar 26, 2023 |
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Mar 26, 2023 13:28
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SE deciding to reinvent the wheel with every mainline title is why i love FF. Even if it ends up with games like 16, which has a combat system that doesn’t look appealing to me.
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Mar 26, 2023 14:08
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To all you morons whinging about turn based combat have you even played octopath traveler 2 yet?????????.?,,
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Mar 26, 2023 14:41
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*looking at all this ff16 footage how gorgeous and detailed everything looks, how sick all the animation is, how fluid everything runs* ...this game should be turn-based 
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Mar 26, 2023 14:45
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People seem to praise S-E for being weird and experimental and every FF game being different spins on the formula, then in the next breath curse them for reinventing the wheel over and over again and hating that "this isn't the Final Fantasy I remember" or whatever. If it looks bad, skip it, no big loss, they'll make another one. You have at least 15 other ones to play, all of them readily available on multiple platforms. Or play a different Square-Enix game. Or one of the hundreds of other turn-based RPGs with old Final Fantasies as a direct inspiration. Brand loyalty and nostalgia are mental illnesses.
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Mar 26, 2023 14:49
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Stranger of Paradise question: does the trophy for completing all side quests include the weapon tutorials?
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Mar 26, 2023 14:58
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I will play every single final fantasy game whether its good or bad
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Mar 26, 2023 15:05
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They're all bad, but yes
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Mar 26, 2023 15:06
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Arist posted:They're all bad, but yes yeah but the most bad is your favorite, while the least bad is mine
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Mar 26, 2023 15:07
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fridge corn posted:*looking at all this ff16 footage how gorgeous and detailed everything looks, how sick all the animation is, how fluid everything runs* ...this game should be turn-based This but unironically.
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Mar 26, 2023 15:10
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"Eikonic abilities" "Eiokonic Clashes" Yes Koji Fox, I get it, iconic, eikonic, etc. I GET IT YOU DON'T HAVE TO MAKE EVERYTHING A PUN
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Mar 26, 2023 15:12
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NikkolasKing posted:I love FFX's battle systems and it saddens me it never got the chance to shine like Press Turn or 1 More because "innovation for innovation's sake." 
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Mar 26, 2023 15:15
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The rules are thus: Cartoon or pixel graphics: turn-based okay Realistic cgi graphic: turn-based not okay
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Mar 26, 2023 15:16
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I had this game on OG Xbox and loved it. My tastes are questionable
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Mar 26, 2023 15:27
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Final Fantasy XVI is gonna rule source: my son said so
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Mar 26, 2023 15:31
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FFXVI looks like what I expected future FF would play like when I was going through FFX 21 years ago. I think I just assumed the series would go full action at some point.
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Mar 26, 2023 15:36
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Attitude Indicator posted:SE deciding to reinvent the wheel with every mainline title is why i love FF. Every FF is janky or broken in some significant way because of this and I think that's great.
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Mar 26, 2023 15:46
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Every time Yoshida has a successful presentation, demonstrating his ability to manage a team, and see through a project to its end, I picture Nomura in a dark corner somewhere fuming. After FF7 remake, the thing about 16 that makes me really excited it the complete absence of any Kingdom Hearts bullshit. I haven’t even heard the words “fate” or “destiny” one time! The story is not complicated for no reason, and looks easy to follow!
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Mar 26, 2023 16:38
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I do hope the story is easy to follow for 80% of it, and then the final 20% is a complete rear end-pull of Clive fighting robot ghosts in the past, and then killing god, who is also himself. ”Landmark Discovered: Saturn” in XB1 is one of my favorite RPG moments. HD DAD fucked around with this message at 16:44 on Mar 26, 2023 |
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Mar 26, 2023 16:41
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Med School posted:Every time Yoshida has a successful presentation, demonstrating his ability to manage a team, and see through a project to its end, I picture Nomura in a dark corner somewhere fuming. Why would Nomura be fuming? Dude literally has the best track record in the company when it cones to releases. Also directly from the 16 website: For centuries, people have flocked to her Mothercrystals to partake of their blessing—the abundant aether that fuels the magicks they rely upon in their everyday lives. As the aether begins to fade and the lifeless deadlands spread ever further, so too does the struggle for possession of the final flickers of the Mothers' light grow ever more fierce. Yet amidst the gathering storm, there are those who believe that the legacy of the crystals has shaped mankind's destiny for long enough. The first fully fledged Action RPG in the mainline Final Fantasy series. Clive Rosfield is on a mission to free mankind from its fate, and must use the Eikonic powers at his disposal to overcome every obstacle his enemies lay before him. The tagline of the game is *literally* "Fate is written in fire" ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 17:00 on Mar 26, 2023 |
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Mar 26, 2023 16:56
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Med School posted:Every time Yoshida has a successful presentation, demonstrating his ability to manage a team, and see through a project to its end, I picture Nomura in a dark corner somewhere fuming. what kind of delusion is this
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Mar 26, 2023 16:59
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Med School posted:Every time Yoshida has a successful presentation, demonstrating his ability to manage a team, and see through a project to its end, I picture Nomura in a dark corner somewhere fuming. Because that's what I play Final Fantasy games for: a simple, straightforward story without any grandiose concepts. Real down-to-earth stuff, going all the way back to FF1
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Mar 26, 2023 17:00
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They literally marketed the ability to pause cutscenes and have access to an encyclopedia so you know what the hell is going on. This game is going to be maximum convoluted.
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Mar 26, 2023 17:04
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