|
His Divine Shadow posted:It was repulsive to me, I was wondering why so many people thought Tuon was cool? Yeah I think it gets lost because it's a plot that takes place mostly in the ending run up, and you the reader have to fight through brain fog induced by excess Perrin Moping that happens at the same time, but there's a good amount of time spent on like, Tuon and Setalle Annan talking/debating philosophy and freedoms and Tuon remains, like, entirely and completely unrepentant. It gets another good highlight in Aviendha's trip through the arches, just how bad things with the seanchan get post third age. I know Jordan had all those plans to go do another series addressing Matt, Tuon, and the empire, and I can't imagine his intent (As a guy from South Carolina no less) with that was "And neither was able to change anything, slavery remained the bedrock of their society!", but if course we never got that so it is kinda left in a really unsatisfying place.
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 13:57
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 5, 2024 06:21 |
|
|
Isn't Tuon also like the only character explicitly noted to be black, lol It's all pretty gross in the later books. Mostly swing and a miss. Though I'm surprised to see people in these threads suggesting the Egwene damane chapters in TGH weren't great, I mean they're awful to read but I thought very very effective (I havne't seen the episode to compare)
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 14:14
|
|
|
The Sea Folk and most of the Tairen are also black
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 14:27
|
|
|
His Divine Shadow posted:It was repulsive to me, I was wondering why so many people thought Tuon was cool?
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 14:31
|
|
|
El Grillo posted:Isn't Tuon also like the only character explicitly noted to be black, lol Not remotely. Sea Folk, Tairens, Semirhage, Juilin, other Seanchan. I'm sure there's more I can't remember.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 14:59
|
|
|
El Grillo posted:Though I'm surprised to see people in these threads suggesting the Egwene damane chapters in TGH weren't great, I mean they're awful to read but I thought very very effective No, I think the chapters are good, it's more that you're several books past them when you start dealing with the allied seanchan, so a lot of the impact of it is blunted by time. I think in the visual medium of TV this episode was exactly as it needed to be - brutal.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 15:14
|
|
|
Also Egwene herself doesn't have to confront the seanchan again until the tower attack (Where she slaughters them en masse) and then at the last battle itself. The other characters who interact with the seanchan (notably Perrin and Matt) never even caught up with Egwene or talked with her about her experiences, because that was well in to the part of the books when everyone split up and actively avoided communicating with each other. The best reaction/ follow up we get is Nynaeve and Elayne's Tanchico escapades, which is going to be an interesting plotline in the show.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 15:19
|
|
|
Has the show already established that some people are born with the spark vs can be taught to channel? My memory of s1 is a bit spotty. It seems harder to do the whole "sul'dam can actually channel" reveal to shake the foundations of the empire if the earlier episode with them testing all the women in a village for channeling was supposed to establish that everyone with any ability gets found.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 15:20
|
|
|
Yeah I don't think they've made the distinction between sparkers and those that have potential but don't do it spontaneously in the show
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 15:34
|
|
|
Given how much they’ve been doing of just-in-time explanations, I am confident it’ll come up and that it’s probably still the direction they’re going.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 16:17
|
|
|
cailleask posted:Given how much they’ve been doing of just-in-time explanations, I am confident it’ll come up and that it’s probably still the direction they’re going. They already sorta laid the ground work, with Suroth talking about how sul'dam train for years. Someone, either in this thread or the show only thread, was like "Did they just say sul'dam can channel?"
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 16:19
|
|
|
I already reread past this part but already I've forgotten the details and have to go back and find it again: when Egwene is in Tanchico via TAR researching the Black Ajah (TGH) and sees people randomly blinking in and out of the dream world, is it because they're ... falling asleep on their feet? Or was there a way for people to phase into TAR without going to sleep When she runs up on Amys who is hunting at the time, obviously she's not narcolepsy-spearing things lol
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 16:32
|
|
|
Data Graham posted:I already reread past this part but already I've forgotten the details and have to go back and find it again: when Egwene is in Tanchico via TAR researching the Black Ajah (TGH) and sees people randomly blinking in and out of the dream world, is it because they're ... falling asleep on their feet? Or was there a way for people to phase into TAR without going to sleep They were dreaming about walking around town and popping in and out of Tel'aran'rhiod. Their dream selves don't have to be where their actual sleeping bodies are. The Aes Sedai start their dreams where they're sleeping because they don't know what they're doing.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 16:35
|
|
|
Gwaihir posted:Nynaeve and Elayne's Tanchico escapades, which is going to be an interesting plotline in the show  Aside from the Black Tower, Taim and Asha'man stuff, this is probably my most anticipated plotline. Don't cheat us of the circus Ralph Jenkins 
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 16:43
|
|
|
I have no confidence the circus will happen and I don't think it even should really.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 16:47
|
|
|
I feel like the circus stuff would be more fun to watch than it was to read. And I kinda enjoyed the dynamic between the escaped aes sedai and the kidnapped sul'dam.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 16:57
|
|
|
CainFortea posted:They already sorta laid the ground work, with Suroth talking about how sul'dam train for years. Someone, either in this thread or the show only thread, was like "Did they just say sul'dam can channel?" Yeah I remember that line, you're right it could be resolved simply like establishing that the test for sul'dam potential takes place way earlier than the damane test or something like that. I always thought in the books it was a bit unrealistic that no one in the past 1000 years had ever tried putting an a'dam on a sul'dam before just for fun or to try it out, especially since we hear the current Empress likes making dudes at court try it on to see if they die horribly because they can channel. I would have found it more interesting if the empresses/emperors had always known about this and were constantly using the "seekers for truth" to stamp out this knowledge whenever someone in the empire discovers it by accident, to prevent the whole system from crashing down, but i guess then it would have been unrealistic for such a shaky foundation to last for 1000 years anyway.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 16:58
|
|
|
shen posted:I always thought in the books it was a bit unrealistic that no one in the past 1000 years had ever tried putting an a'dam on a sul'dam before just for fun or to try it out Given how hard the books play on the reality of how poorly information travels, I don't think we can rule out that it didn't happen. It could have come up hundreds of times before and buried.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 17:00
|
|
|
Rarity posted:The Sea Folk and most of the Tairen are also black Devorum posted:Not remotely. Sea Folk, Tairens, Semirhage, Juilin, other Seanchan. Tairens as basically well tanned white Floridians or Mediterranean. White people in Florida or Sicily are way darker than in Wisconsin, Virginia or England. Sea Folk as white people who spend all day every day with their shirts off in the sun sailing around the Caribbean/Mediterranean. Tuon, Semirhage, some other Seanchan and Sharans are explicitly described as black.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 17:17
|
|
|
Tairens are largely likely like Spaniards and Italians or other Mediterranean complexions, but Sea Folk are definitely very dark like Caribbean, and Two Rivers folk are relatively dark completed compared to like Cairheinin or Aiel
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 17:24
|
|
|
I thought the episode was very good. My wife, who hasn’t read the books, and is a big fan of the show, said “wow, I can’t wait until we see all these Seanchan killed”. She also kind of had a wtf reaction when Renna made Egwene burn down the tree: “wait…can the Sul’damme feel then power too when using the bracelet?”. I had to hold my tongue. I think that says a lot at how the show is getting the ideas across to people who haven’t read the material.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 17:28
|
|
|
I wish TAR was portrayed as a bit weirder, as it's described in the books. We get a bit of that with Ishy's weird jumps but the environments themselves are static and indistinguishable from the real world. Having doors open and close or place settings on furniture change from cut to cut would be cool and unsettling
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 17:34
|
|
|
tylertfb posted:said “wow, I can’t wait until we see all these Seanchan killed”. 
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 17:43
|
|
|
Renna's actress did a great job making me loving hate her.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 17:45
|
|
|
CainFortea posted:Renna's actress did a great job making me loving hate her. You just know she thinks she's "one of the good ones." She's kind to her damane, let's them keep their name, gives them praise... and utterly oblivious to the power dynamic and the cruelty she is party to because she is convinced damane aren't human
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 17:48
|
|
|
It's definitely going to the hilt with the "British (or at least commonwealth) accent is the good guy, American accent is the bad guy,  " angleVery refreshing
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 17:55
|
|
|
There are plenty of bad guys with Randland (commonwealth) accents.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 17:57
|
|
|
CainsDescendant posted:I wish TAR was portrayed as a bit weirder, as it's described in the books. We get a bit of that with Ishy's weird jumps but the environments themselves are static and indistinguishable from the real world. Having doors open and close or place settings on furniture change from cut to cut would be cool and unsettling I suspect the aiel dreamers will introduce a lot more weirdness into TAR.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 17:59
|
|
|
DarkHorse posted:Tairens are largely likely like Spaniards and Italians or other Mediterranean complexions, but Sea Folk are definitely very dark like Caribbean, and Two Rivers folk are relatively dark completed compared to like Cairheinin or Aiel I've got some news for you about Southern Spaniards. My wife has predicted that since Nynaeve could channel inside the arches, then the strictures of ter'angreal in general don't apply to her and she can't be collared. Also, I think it's silly to think that sul'dam training hints at then being able to channel. There's other types of training...like being good at torture, manipulation, and general shitheadedness. That's the training they're talking about in the show.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 18:00
|
|
|
Devorum posted:
Silly or not it happened. vOv. Things can be two things at the same time.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 18:04
|
|
|
Dr. Clockwork posted:There are plenty of bad guys with Randland (commonwealth) accents. Yeah but I mean this episode in particular. Now that they have the "Seanchan sound like Texans" deal they can really milk it
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 18:04
|
|
|
Data Graham posted:Yeah but I mean this episode in particular. Now that they have the "Seanchan sound like Texans" deal they can really milk it Renna's accent also seemed quite thicker than most of the other seanchan.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 18:05
|
|
|
Still liking this season, but honestly pretty lukewarm about that episode. I like the obvious amount of work they've put into the storyboarding. Everything lines up and flows much better than last season. HOWEVER.... so many things are just so drat cheesy. still feels like a CW teen drama, like everything is so heavyhanded with the melodrama. the shot of the hand holding above is a good example. it just feels like the directing has zero restraint when it comes to the storytelling, and everything ends up way cheesier than it should be. aviendha's fight scene looking like an 80s kung fu movie, for instance. or how egwene got that burst blood vessel in her eye, which i noticed right away and thought "wow, i wonder if maybe she actually did that for real" and the next scene now she has both eyes red. lots of little things like that especially in terms of action and visual storytelling that are just too much.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 18:11
|
|
|
They're not going to put HP bars above actor's heads. There's only so many ways to show "This person is getting physically hosed up". And Stranger Things has tapped the entire well of "bloody nose" tells.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 18:13
|
|
|
CainFortea posted:Given how hard the books play on the reality of how poorly information travels, I don't think we can rule out that it didn't happen. It could have come up hundreds of times before and buried. Yeah I suspect it's been known before and suppressed for the good of the empire.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 18:23
|
|
|
here's an example of a fight scene done by a director and choreography team with restraint (it's really really viscerally brutal so CW if you need that) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Em7I41ew8C8 i know this is an unfair comparison, but there are many ways to tell the story of a character getting hosed up that don't involve 'hp bars'.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 18:26
|
|
|
Yeah but Aiel are cool desert ninjas and that over the top fight scene was great, gritty realism and restraint is not the point of this series
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 18:32
|
|
|
yeah lol what series did you read if you were expecting understated restraint? Because this is the one where the antagonist for the first three books is a dude with literal burning fires for eyes who cackles in dreams as he tortures rats. The conclusion of this very book is a gigantic anime fight between burning eye dude and Our Boy Rand IN THE SKY while everyone can see, and an army of heroic ghosts charges in time with the sky battle across the field.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 18:38
|
|
|
i'm not expecting the grit of deadwood in wheel of time. it was just an example. the show could just use a bit of restraint in its storytelling. non-book readers i've talked to have said similar things about the melodrama and cheese
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 18:40
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 5, 2024 06:21 |
|
|
Did anyone else notice Renna's tattoos? I could ha e been imagining it but I swear they started really faint and got more vivid as the episode went on.
|
|
#
?
Sep 22, 2023 18:53
|
|
