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Yeah, maybe that was just good luck. On the way out, the train was delayed enough that I missed my connection to the Empire Builder, so I stayed overnight in Portland. Now, on the way back, they're telling me there's no way I can make the connection to the Coast Starlight. Another night in Portland. That's 9 days of travel for a 4-day visit, for those keeping track. I still like it: it means I get a free couple nights in a cool city. But this is 100% not the way to travel if you're in a hurry.
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Oct 27, 2023 17:23
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I see I haven't gone on a rant about freight rail in this thread, so I'm going to take the 1½-2 hours we're sitting still to explain why Amtrak on-time performance is so lovely. By law, freight rail must yield to passenger rail in the United States. But this slows down freight, and this is one of the reasons why freight trains are so drat long. You may recall a recent event where a miles-long train derailed and spilled toxic chemicals all over a town in Pennsylvania: they do this to lower labor costs per car, and also so that they don't have to yield to Amtrak. Here's why:  In order for a train to pass another train, they need to be on parallel rails. The United States has hundreds of thousands of miles of rail, and most of that is just one rail. In order to let trains pass each other, the rails have little pullout sections. But because the freight trains are so long, they can't pull to the side to let Amtrak through. It's just not physically possible for a 2-mile train to yield to a 1000-foot train on a 2000-foot pullout. So Amtrak has to pull to the side, sometimes for hours, to let freight pass, despite the (unenforced) law that it's supposed to be the other way around. As I wrote this, we got passed by a freight train going the same direction we were. Some people in my car took a video of it. I wish I could go back to not being enraged about this. Anyway, the train that passed us isn't the reason we've stopped: we're stopped for some other train ahead of us, and there must be no pullouts between where we stopped and where that train is currently. So we pull to the side, sit here for hours, and then finally we can get on our way again. Making matters worse is the new trend of "precision scheduling". This technique, employed by the freight operators, essentially means "we no longer schedule trains, we just send them off whenever we feel like it." This means Amtrak has no way of knowing when these monster freight trains are going to be on the rails, so there's no way to try to schedule around them. This bullshit, combined with the fact that Amtrak is legally forbidden from reinvesting profits from the Northeast corridor into rail upgrades in other areas to speed up service, are the primary reasons why it's going to take me 5 days to get home, when driving would take 3. At least, that's my understanding. Perhaps a train nerdo will read this and hop in with a better-informed explanation. 
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Oct 27, 2023 17:43
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sounds like we should replace the interstates with rail lines
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Oct 27, 2023 18:54
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Are you planning to keep this up, or was it just a one-off New Year's resolution to try it out for 2023? It's odd -- it seems like they could also pretty trivially address long stoppage times by adding a 2 mile stretch of parallel tracks every 50 miles or something. Doing that for passenger traffic would be a huge money pit, but seems like that would also help freight traffic substantially, since freight also goes in both directions. For going over the Rockies maybe that would be challenging, but for anywhere else it seems like something that a country like Turkey or China could get fixed nation-wide in about a year. Or something that a country like Germany might be able to manage in 50 years.
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Oct 27, 2023 20:44
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Saladman posted:Are you planning to keep this up, or was it just a one-off New Year's resolution to try it out for 2023? I couch this as a goofy new year's resolution so people don't yell at me. The real reason I'm doing this is to cope with my own anxiety about climate change. So this is how I get places from now on. I realize my writing this down is going to make some people angry, or like they want to try and make me see how it actually is. I guess I would just ask that those folks try to consider that I'm doing this as a personal stress response, and it's probably not worth getting upset about. Try to pretend I took up oil painting or something.
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Oct 27, 2023 20:56
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andreas malm covered the only reasonable reaction to climate change, but none of us are going to do it yours is nice and good and anybody who yells at you is not your friend.
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Oct 28, 2023 14:34
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cruft posted:I couch this as a goofy new year's resolution so people don't yell at me. The real reason I'm doing this is to cope with my own anxiety about climate change. I can't imagine why anyone who is not your partner/family/close friends would care enough to get angry over it? I mean I certainly believe you, some people are weird. OTOH the boyfriend of a close friend of mine is also like you, in that he takes his 2 tons of annual carbon extremely seriously... which is definitely going to cause some issues with their relationship, in that she is close with her family (sibling in Canada & most are ~1500 km away in Europe). It'll be interesting to see how that turns out - either he'll have to fly again, or I can't imagine them staying together much longer. It'll be interesting how their Christmas this year turns out, the first outside-of-Europe one for her since they've been together. It's nice to see these firsthand Amtrak accounts regardless of the motivation behind it, even if my interest is just morbid curiosity at this point, like reading those stories about people who do ultra-marathons across the Sahara in summer. Sounds like absolute nightmare hellzone, but it's a good read! I don't mean to come off dismissively with that, I also think it's really great that people like doing ultramarathons, and biking across Mongolia, and bushwacking their way across the Amazon, I just know it's not for me.
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Oct 28, 2023 20:38
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Saladman posted:I just know it's not for me. Yeah, definitely. Know thy self. For example: I've just learned that coconut milk lattes are not for me! I don't know why it took me so long to realize this, but just now, eating a hot bowl of vegan ramen in downtown Portland, planning to check out the Saturday market and then stop by a barcade on the way back to the station, I realized the frequent overnight travel delays are actually awesome! In fact, now that I'm looking back, I've been enjoying these unplanned overnight expenses-paid vacations every time they happen. When you have to stay overnight due to a missed connection, Amtrak books you a nice hotel, and gives you $10 for breakfast, $10 for lunch, and $20 for dinner, depending on how long you're staying. Sometimes that has to be spent inside the hotel, but today they just handed me cash. Because of overnight delays, I've gotten to grub around Portland, Los Angeles, and Chicago, all of which have awesome downtown areas full of places to visit and things to do. Now that I'm looking at them in this light, I might be more inclined to spend a little of my own money to expand the scope of my tourism. I mean, poo poo, for $10.50, I can take the bus from LA Union Station to Disneyland. Not being tethered to an airport in the outskirts of town is actually hella rad, and I'm not sure why I hadn't realized this until now. I don't even have to go through security when I come back to the union station. There may be days when I just don't want to trudge around, and that's fine too. But today was frickin' awesome, and I think I'm going to try to have more days like this. cruft fucked around with this message at 21:00 on Oct 28, 2023 |
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Oct 28, 2023 20:58
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cruft posted:Making matters worse is the new trend of "precision scheduling". This technique, employed by the freight operators, essentially means "we no longer schedule trains, we just send them off whenever we feel like it." This means Amtrak has no way of knowing when these monster freight trains are going to be on the rails, so there's no way to try to schedule around them. Reminds me of that George Carlin bit about how the government will name legislation the exact opposite of what it actually does.
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Nov 12, 2023 04:03
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How does your wife feel about your long haul addiction?
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Nov 19, 2023 05:44
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She's in graduate school doing clinical rotations all over the state, so she's away from home a lot too. I wouldn't have wanted to try this when we were both at home raising a kid.
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Nov 19, 2023 06:19
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One day I will do one of these trips but it seems like you need to book the roomettes a year in advance to get reasonable rates. We once did a sleeper train in Europe but it wasn’t as fun as I wished since it was basically just the sleeping part from 10 PM to 8 AM. And the sleeping wasn’t that great.
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Dec 28, 2023 19:49
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smackfu posted:One day I will do one of these trips but it seems like you need to book the roomettes a year in advance to get reasonable rates. i assure you it was better than the uzbekistan platzkart sleeper featuring a bed that a 5'10" person can't lie flat in, either the body heat of too many people or a fully-open window blasting air in your face, and the lower bunk playing muslim devotional music at 2am for god knows what reason
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Feb 22, 2024 06:56
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Qtotonibudinibudet posted:i assure you it was better than the uzbekistan platzkart sleeper featuring a bed that a 5'10" person can't lie flat in, either the body heat of too many people or a fully-open window blasting air in your face, and the lower bunk playing muslim devotional music at 2am for god knows what reason Genuinely interested in reading more of this story before my 3-day ride to Louisiana in 2 weeks.
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Feb 22, 2024 15:02
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Lol I have a uzbekistan platzkart story too but it's not much of one, so hopefully Qtotonibudinibudet has a better story. This was like 8 years ago, I got on in the evening in Buchara and woke up around Toshkent. It was in March so it wasn't too hot. Not exactly a luxurious experience, like trying to sleep in a moving hostel dormroom. I got the shittier longitudinal bed like on the right here:  It sucks because IIRC it was somewhat narrower and your entire body including the heard is basically in the hallway. In the other beds you could lie down with your head facing away so somewhat isolated from people walking around. I don't remember how I slept, porbably not great but I guess not terrible enough to remember it either. Otherwise mostly unremarkable.
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Feb 23, 2024 21:45
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In 2022 I took my kids on Amtrak from DC to Chicago (14 hrs). My kids were independent in the row behind me, my seat buddy was a hs teacher on summer break bumming around the country on Amtrak, the person in front of me was a stonermom on her way to stay with a midwest old testament cult that doesn't use any electricity. The Mennonites were chill, in the dining car there was a teenage boy who was fascinated by the condiment packets.quote:The next thing that happens in any case is you get a little slip of paper on which is written some combination of your car, seat, and destination city. You go find your seat, then jam the paper into the space between the carpet headliner and the steel edging. Then you sit down. Sometimes the conductor comes through later to scan your ticket. DC did this and it was embarrassingly analog compared to other travel I've done. The conductors asked where we were going and told us which car to line up at. They gave us hand written slips of paper with numbers, let's say I got 28. When I got to my seat someone was already sitting there, their paper also said 28. People were getting on one car and walking through to another and the staff had no way to track or enforce who sat where. The dining car had one guy to handle orders for the whole train and he was not happy. My daughter dropped her cool hat under the seat and it was never returned to lost and found. We saved over $1000 by taking Amtrak instead of flying and I would ride it again with a decent neck pillow.
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Mar 3, 2024 07:41
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Hi, I'm in New Orleans. Got here by train. Southwest Chief leaves Lamy at about 13:38 on Saturday. Arrives the next day in Chicago around the same time. Walked around Chicago looking for Ramen, found it, then walked back to the train station for a 17:30 call to line up. Chicago Union Station is under construction and it was chaotic, but I got on the City Of New Orleans, which left on time at 18:05. Contrary to the Arlo Guthrie song, this train was at 100% capacity: the conductors even remarked on it when they were changing shifts. Rolled into New Orleans around an hour early, maybe 12:30. Then walked to my hotel in the rain. Now all my stuff's hanging in front of the air conditioner. Good thing I've got that rain cover built in to the backpack. I love that backpack. Nothing else to report except that Mississippi was absolutely gorgeous at sunrise, and I get the impression that the humidity is a real pain in the rear end to deal with. Things look like they fall apart so quickly here compared to the dry Rocky Mountains where I live. e: oh, actually, I'm getting tired of bringing hard boiled eggs. Keeping them cool is a dumb pain in the rear end. This morning's eggs felt a little dicey. I ate two, and threw the remaining two away: wasting food makes me feel bad. I guess I'm in the market for alternative breakfast items. I'll see what this bodega down the street in downtown New Orleans has. Maybe somebody makes a ready-to-eat breakfast that's not 60% sugar. ee: I couldn't find Tasty Bites at the store before I left, so I got Ben's Rice. The first one was pretty good cold! I think it was a rice pilaf? The second one wasn't great, it was red beans and rice. Not bad, just bland. Third one is cheese and broccoli rice. I have high hopes. cruft fucked around with this message at 04:07 on Mar 5, 2024 |
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Mar 5, 2024 04:00
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cruft posted:Hi, I'm in New Orleans. Got here by train. 
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Mar 5, 2024 08:02
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mobby_6kl posted:Lol I have a uzbekistan platzkart story too but it's not much of one, so hopefully Qtotonibudinibudet has a better story. Is this four beds per... cell?
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Mar 15, 2024 17:25
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cruft posted:Is this four beds per... cell?  These beds with the pillows by the window I think would be quite a bit better than the one I got, which was like this on the left 
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Mar 19, 2024 11:38
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mobby_6kl posted:Yess. Two beds on each side, IIRC that top one is just a shelf thankfully, though you could probably cram two more people there in an emergency. I guess I didn't take any photos there so just stuff from google: I'm 187cm tall (6'2") and would probably have to curl up to fit in one of those, but at first blush it looks like I'd get a better night's sleep than I do on Amtrak. I'm attaching a photo of an Amtrak coach seat fully reclined. I never could sleep on airplanes at all, so at least on Amtrak I can sleep a little. The way it's usually worked for me is that the first day of travel I'm well rested, and then I'm just tired for the rest of the trip. I guess I sleep better the second night, due to fatigue. I should try doing calisthenics on day 1, or something else to wear me out.
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Mar 19, 2024 15:12
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I have to get from home (Lamy, New Mexico) to Dallas. Amtrak's web site says "you can't get there from here", but you can. Here's how. First, you download a system map. Currently that is this link but it may change in the future. Looking at this map, I can trace a line from Lamy to Dallas, going through Newton. There's a green segment there, which means you take a bus, because the American highway system is subsidized so much more heavily than the American passenger rail system. Next step is to talk to an agent. I used the online chat thingy. I asked if I could get from Lamy to Dallas using the thruway bus from Newton. It took the agent a while but they came back with a route and times for it, which was neat. They also let me know how to book this trip: either as a two-stage trip through the web site, or using an agent. I recommend not booking a two-stage trip, unless you are certain you can get the same ticket ID for the entire thing. The risk here is that if you have a delay, and two separate tickets, you're going to have to really fight them to obtain a hotel room. If it's all on the same ticket, it's easy. So there you go! It's a 4-segment trip: 25-hour trip out, and around 27 hours coming back, and you'd have to go back to 1967 to get a better route on passenger rail in this country. Rail cost is $305; air travel would cost $543, so once again this will be easy to justify to my corporate travel office. cruft fucked around with this message at 16:35 on May 23, 2024 |
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May 22, 2024 20:42
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I took Amtrak from Seattle - NYC once. I decided to spring for a Roomette -- it was expensive, but I knew I wasn't going to be able to sleep in a coach seat for three nights. It was surprisingly on time, and I had a few hours to kill in Chicago. When my son is older, I'd absolutely do that again with him. My work will pay for a business class upgrade in a train, but they won't pay for a sleeper. I think that policy was invented for people traveling from Boston - NYC or around Europe, and doesn't anticipate people making four day train journeys. As it stands, I would have a hard time justifying four days out, five days in the office, and four days back away from my family.
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May 23, 2024 19:25
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Safety Dance posted:away from my family. I talk to people about my weird train thing pretty often, and I'm quick to point out that I wouldn't expect anyone with kids to even consider this. Right now it's just Ms Cruft at home, and we're fine with me being gone an extra 2-4 days. We've seen each other almost every day for 24 years now, so 4 days isn't a big deal. Maybe the needle will move on this gauge as people become increasingly alarmed about CO2 emissions, but right now, it's just an unreasonable ask for people with children. I waited until the kid was in college before I even tried it.
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May 23, 2024 21:03
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Safety Dance posted:My work will pay for a business class upgrade in a train, but they won't pay for a sleeper. I think that policy was invented for people traveling from Boston - NYC or around Europe, and doesn't anticipate people making four day train journeys. Ours will book Acela too but I can’t justify the upgrade even when it’s someone else’s money. Mainly because I’m only doing half of that Boston-NYC trip so the time savings is only 10 mins.
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May 25, 2024 19:27
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Really wish the US had better train infrastructure and was not so car and aircraft dependent for interstate travel. I have to travel for my job.
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Jun 1, 2024 18:27
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Cross country Amtrak rules so very hard. Quantum Spouse and I did Portland --> Minneapolis --> Chicago --> Boston --> Baltimore --> DC on Amtrak with a private sleeper cabin as part of our cross country honeymoon, spending a few days in each city in between time on the train. A+ will 💯 travel like that again. Just remember your gummies and never ever sit too close to the Amish/Mennonite unless you are really keen on discovering what someone who's understanding of personal hygiene is sincerely stuck in the 1600's as an important article of faith smells like. P.s. if you can, make sure you pick a route that participates in the rangers on rails program when you go through state and federal parks. Quantum Cat fucked around with this message at 19:33 on Jun 1, 2024 |
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Jun 1, 2024 19:19
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cruft posted:I'm doing this mostly because of climate change. I have a job that requires a fair amount of travel, and I want to be able to say I did everything I could to slow the planet's inexorable march into being a smoldering hellscape for my offspring. If you're interested in reading more about this reasoning, here's a random article about it. It seems to be getting sort of the same numbers I got when I calculated the carbon emissions of rail vs air. I actually calculated a way bigger savings, but whatever. There's a pretty significant savings. You're coming from a good place and as much as I am a fan of trains, there's a giant asterisk in the article you linked. quote:However, there were a number of assumptions and simplifications when calculating these emissions, such as a 100% load factor in both rail and flight. In reality, the load factor for commercial air travel is about 80%, while trains are closer to 50%. Every ton of emissions from train travel is effectively multiplied by 2 to account for that empty space, while it's 1.2 for plane travel. That alone brings emissions to parity, more or less. Part of this is a chicken and egg problem, rail infrastructure needs to be competitive to be more popular. But part of it is a fundamental difference between the modes of travel, it's far simpler to shift airline routing to match demand than it is for train routing. Unless trains become a national infrastructure priority and passenger preferences value emissions and comfort over speed and price, you're spitting into the wind.
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Jun 1, 2024 20:51
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My favorite part about amtrak is not having to go through security lines and getting to bring all the food and drink I want Most of the times I've ridden they haven't even checked my ticket until hours later Business class isn't generally much more than coach for what you get and if you're going solo they generally have a single-seated side. The bigger stations have a place to drop off your bags if you have a ticket so you can walk around more freely before or after your ride
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Jun 1, 2024 21:23
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Quantum Cat posted:Cross country Amtrak rules so very hard. Quantum Spouse and I did Portland --> Minneapolis --> Chicago --> Boston --> Baltimore --> DC on Amtrak with a private sleeper cabin as part of our cross country honeymoon, spending a few days in each city in between time on the train. A+ will 💯 travel like that again. Just remember your gummies and never ever sit too close to the Amish/Mennonite unless you are really keen on discovering what someone who's understanding of personal hygiene is sincerely stuck in the 1600's as an important article of faith smells like. Nice, yeah. If you can afford first class, it has some real benefits over coach: much more than on an airplane. You get actual walls, and an attendant, and you can lie down. Not to mention decent meals in the dining car. And did I mention the walls? Those sleep buds have been working really well when some kid can't get to sleep because he's watching movies without headphones, but walls are even better. I'm really hoping at one point I'll have enough points that Ms Cruft and I can come up to West Glacier with our bicycles and camp out at the KOA. Maybe we can even go first class: the economics start making more sense when you've got a second passenger. I... may have just about convinced Cruft Jr. and Jr.'s boyfriend to make this trip too. We'll see! moist turtleneck posted:My favorite part about amtrak is not having to go through security lines and getting to bring all the food and drink I want Holy moly yes. An hour ago I flew in to Washington State from Arizona (timing of the train just couldn't work) and it's just a totally different experience. I suppose if trains ever get popular again, the crowds will come, and probably some security checks, but right now it's just super chill. And frick, I love that when I get a connection in Los Angeles I can wander out to see what sort of festivals are going on at the park across the street. I'll have 2 hours to kill in Portland on Friday, pretty pumped to at least get some good ramen, who knows what else is going on. You miss things when you never get to leave the airport. AreWeDrunkYet posted:Unless trains become a national infrastructure priority and passenger preferences value emissions and comfort over speed and price, you're spitting into the wind. I'm aware that this is partially "something must be done. this is something. therefore I must do it." But how do we get more riders? My take is to convince people that it's a viable option. I can't move the needle of an entire nation, I can only move the needle on my social circle. But the needle is moving! It feels good to be doing something tangible: maybe in 10 years people I know will go "well it's 160MPH now, and that old man did it when it was 70. maybe I can too." Colorado looks like they're primed to build out some rail, which would be awesome. If we could connect Albuquerque and Denver, that would be a game changer for my entire extended family. New Mexico has already got a start on in. Come on, Colorado. We already beat your rear end at the chile license plate, are you really going to let New Mexico outdo you with intercity passenger rail, too? And having been on maybe two dozen long-distance Amtrak rides in the last year, I can tell you that in my experience, the load factor feels a whole lot closer to 80% than 50%. When I rode the City Of New Orleans south from Chicago, the entire train was at capacity after a couple stops. Arlo Guthrie's experience was pretty different to mine: there weren't even any bags of mail. cruft fucked around with this message at 23:46 on Jun 1, 2024 |
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Jun 1, 2024 23:29
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I romanticize trains and wish we could prioritize it but as it stands, time is infinitely valuable and most people value arriving at their destination and not the journey. You've said it yourself, lots of boredom! There's a strong argument to be made that boredom is good, but people will not choose it. Also it's...not cheaper? Maybe for particular cases but I just did a quick look at a roundtrip Chicago -> Seattle. Amtrak was $322 and the cheapest flight on Google Flights was $328. Flight time total is 9 hours and train ride total is over 90 hours. I am not trying to dissuade you, I think it's admirable, but train travel in the US is extremely dire.
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Jun 1, 2024 23:50
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withoutclass posted:I romanticize trains and wish we could prioritize it but as it stands, time is infinitely valuable and most people value arriving at their destination and not the journey. You've said it yourself, lots of boredom! There's a strong argument to be made that boredom is good, but people will not choose it. I certainly hope nothing I've posted so far is making it sound like I think this is a practical option for most people. I even said that in the OP: cruft posted:Taking Amtrak when you need to get somewhere is a complete pain in the rear end. Maybe I need to be more forceful. Don't do this unless you've got lots of time and are up for a lot of inconvenince. withoutclass posted:Also it's...not cheaper? Maybe for particular cases but I just did a quick look at a roundtrip Chicago -> Seattle. Amtrak was $322 and the cheapest flight on Google Flights was $328. The numbers in your post have Amtrak cheaper than a flight: 322 < 328. For me to do this with my corporate travel system, I eat any cost over an equivalent flight, and so far I have not eaten any cost. I do have to take "personal travel days" to do this, and on those days, I don't get reimbursed for food or lodging. Lodging isn't a problem if I'm on the train: it's part of the fare. Food isn't a huge problem if I bring my own. If your argument is that, when taken as a whole, including the value of your time, air travel is cheaper: you're right. I didn't meant to imply you will spend fewer overall dollars taking the train. I did mean to imply that a travel office can be persuaded this is less money. --- I get that US rail travel isn't an option for a whole lot of people. I'm not going to try to tell anyone to do it anyway: you'd be bonkers to try this if you have children, for instance. Or if you have to be in two different parts of the country in under 5 days. Or if you live in Tennessee. But there's some segment of the population out there who's seriously considering abandoning air travel and is maybe a little nervous about diving in: this thread's for you. The rest of you can enjoy reading about what a total poop show this is. cruft fucked around with this message at 00:47 on Jun 2, 2024 |
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Jun 2, 2024 00:09
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Here's a drawing I just made to explain to the people stuck with me in Pasco why Amtrak doesn't know when the train will get here. BNSF broke down and it's blocking our train. I don't know if this is exactly what the problem is, but for illustrative purposes, this is close enough.
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Jun 7, 2024 18:04
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If they're down then they're blocking half the line for sure. Also that route being down is rough for a lot of folks, I think that's the most popular Metra commuter line here in Chicago.
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Jun 7, 2024 18:22
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I curse Warren Buffett every time BNSF do dumb poo poo, so lots of times.
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Jun 7, 2024 18:26
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cruft posted:By law, freight rail must yield to passenger rail in the United States. Three weeks ago I was in Vancouver BC and had to wait an hour for a freight train to when were maybe 20 minutes from the station Seattle -> Vancouver was scheduled at 4.5 hours, and ultimately was nearly six hours. On the upside, sure I can walk around, give Mom a call, recharge the Switch. Didn't want to take a bus which was scheduled as a 3.5 hour trip because of the claustrophobia
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Jun 7, 2024 18:28
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Coffee Jones posted:Didn't want to take a bus which was scheduled as a 3.5 hour trip because of the claustrophobia My best option for going from Pasco to Santa Fe involves two or three bus trips. They're okay, but they're only for like 40 minutes each. 3.5 hours on a bus sounds like a bad time, even if it's a nice touring bus.
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Jun 7, 2024 18:46
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