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Read the main series but not Esstlemont’s stuff. As there’s a book out called Assail, do we find out what the deal is with that place and it supposedly being the most dangerous place in the world to the extent it can chew up and destroy entire Imass clans?
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Dec 6, 2023 16:45
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If I've learned anything from this thread it's that that book will take every glamourous idea that you have of Assail in your head, and destroy it utterly and completely, along with the Crimson Guard
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Dec 6, 2023 17:17
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team overhead smash posted:Read the main series but not Esstlemont’s stuff. As there’s a book out called Assail, do we find out what the deal is with that place and it supposedly being the most dangerous place in the world to the extent it can chew up and destroy entire Imass clans?
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Dec 6, 2023 17:55
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Sailor Viy posted:Cool! I will persevere then. The ending 3rd or so of MoI is epic as gently caress. But the siege of Capustan would be it's own book in most series.
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Dec 7, 2023 00:46
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Yeah, Assail pretty much ruins anything interesting about Assail, Orb Scepter Throne pretty much ruins anything interesting about the Seguluh, Blood and Bone doesn't quite ruin EVERYTHING interesting about Jacuruku
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Dec 7, 2023 01:06
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snoremac posted:I also felt put off by MoI and wondered if the series was for me when it's so heavily praised, but House of Chains and Midnight Tides were both bangers (MT is my series fave) and there's still a lot to love about this series to come. Those two books expand the world considerably with some significant shifts in perspective. MoI has some excellent *moments* but it just doesn't work as a book for me. The entire barghast plot just seems to happen and you're not given much of a reason why any of it matters. Ditto Paran and the Deck of Dragons stuff - he spends ages ruminating on a decision that is never really explained, the arguments and consequences of his choice are so unclear they might as well not be there etc. it rivals the opening of GotM for "people talking about things without ever saying what those things are". The vibes are great, Itkovian owns, and the denouement is Erikson at his best. Agreed that HoC and MT are great though. HoC in particular I think is really underrated.
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Dec 7, 2023 12:36
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I'm just a bit into Bonehunters, but I have a thought or two about the BOI stuff you are talking about. Spoilers: sometimes contemporary politics bleed into these books. Also don't read the K&B books, thats where the author puts all the stuff they can't help but write. Deadhouse gates has a lot about how a Roman Empire speedrun treats tribal groups. Most are slowly destroyed, some get incorporated as "brand name cavalry," and the Wickans manage to pull off joining en masse and retaining their identity. Letting tribal groups join as an indigestible mass is great for them but a sign of the empire being in decline. The Barghast plot is about how an Imperial force could respectably ask a tribal group for help. At least partly to differentiate the Malazan empire from the historical Roman Empire. A tribal group actually getting some of their ancestral lands and grave goods respected is also an exciting development from a North American's perspective. This group argues that our entire political system should be destroyed. Should we let them become one of our political parties: y/n? The Chained god themselves is an rear end in a top hat for well established reasons. But giving all of their allies a chance to air their grievances with the existing system might yet pay off.
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Dec 8, 2023 00:19
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Korbal Broach and Bauchelain are awesome.
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Dec 8, 2023 00:26
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Strom Cuzewon posted:MoI has some excellent *moments* but it just doesn't work as a book for me. The entire barghast plot just seems to happen and you're not given much of a reason why any of it matters. Ditto Paran and the Deck of Dragons stuff - he spends ages ruminating on a decision that is never really explained, the arguments and consequences of his choice are so unclear they might as well not be there etc. it rivals the opening of GotM for "people talking about things without ever saying what those things are". I was really digging the first couple hundred pages or so, with all the lore bombs, but the barghast stuff isn't really doing it for me and I'm feeling it dragging.
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Dec 8, 2023 00:31
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The barghest stuff does pay off in later books but yeah, it’s not the most interesting part of MoI.
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Dec 8, 2023 00:33
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imagine dungeons posted:The barghest stuff does pay off in later books but yeah, it’s not the most interesting part of MoI. I'm not a fan of the entire Barghast subplot, series wide, even though I know what he's doing. It's just too depressing. But it's not much of the book and the rest is really great.
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Dec 8, 2023 04:54
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imagine dungeons posted:Korbal Broach and Bauchelain are awesome. I am with you 10000%, drat they are fun characters.
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Dec 8, 2023 05:51
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The actual stories are a bit uneven to say the least, though. I still think Crack'd Pot Trail is in a way the most Malazan thing ever written but stuff like Wurms of Blearmouth or The Healthy Dead feels completely skippable.
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Dec 8, 2023 13:30
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The books are really uneven, but I doubt you could get any group of people to agree on which ones are best. The Healthy Dead is the worst, though. And A Crack'd Pot Trail is "what if Toll The Hounds but more oblique", which is definitely some people's jam, but I found it a bit of a slog.
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Dec 8, 2023 15:21
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The Barghast stuff is weird because unless I'm misremembering something the resolution (book 9/10 spoilers) isn't that their cruelty and savagery is their undoing, it's that they're just kind of in the way of a god showing up who incidentally kills them all without knowing or caring. I'm not sure what to take away from that because 'random mass death just happens' sometimes is already a lesson deeply embedded in the series so I'm not sure we needed another example? Also this is unrelated but recently I've been playing Vampire Survivors and it's the only game I've ever played that comes close to capturing the feeling of one of those big Malazan '1-2 guys just obliterating dozens of soldiers at a time' battle scenes that crop up a couple times per book. Not sure if anyone else got that vibe.
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Dec 9, 2023 22:47
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Five books down. The Kindle says I have 92 hours left. Tehol is cool. This is a long series.
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Jan 2, 2024 04:28
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Alright, after bouncing off the series a few chapters into MT about a year ago, I’m back in. I wish there was a way to put a custom spoiler-free dictionary into my Kobo for looking up characters/place names to help re-align my brain to this massive world.
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Jan 17, 2024 12:51
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Yeah, be very careful. I remember googling a character, and got an auto-complete suggestion of "[character name] death". Always a risk. I was so careful when reading Wheel of Time for this reason.
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Jan 17, 2024 15:38
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This thread could use more action, feel free to post here! Edit and you can also listen to the excellent read along podcast Ten Very Big Books BigHead fucked around with this message at 01:25 on Jan 18, 2024 |
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Jan 17, 2024 23:57
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The good news is at least with MT there aren't too many returning characters to worry about having forgotten.
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Jan 18, 2024 00:07
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I am most of the way through Dust of Dreams, and I still don't feel like I understand what is happening.
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Jan 18, 2024 00:16
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Understanding is reserved for a re-read.
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Jan 18, 2024 00:32
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OneSizeFitsAll posted:Yeah, be very careful. I remember googling a character, and got an auto-complete suggestion of "[character name] death". Always a risk. I was so careful when reading Wheel of Time for this reason. being dead doesn't really slow people down all that much in malazan
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Jan 18, 2024 00:34
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I just got to my first section with Bugg and Tehol. Already loving it
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Jan 18, 2024 08:00
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Uhmmm did Udinaas just get dream-fisted?
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Jan 18, 2024 11:32
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neurotech posted:Alright, after bouncing off the series a few chapters into MT about a year ago, I’m back in. You can highlight a word and have it show other instances of that word in the book (at least I can with my Kobo). For older book there's http://searchofthefallen.com/#!/ where you can search per book and chapter for just names if you need a quick refresher.
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Jan 18, 2024 11:39
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The Malazan Wiki always helped me on rereads. Looking back over at it now there is quite a bit of effort on avoiding spoilers but caveat emptor. There is probably something to be said for experiencing the first read as confusing and weird as it is, honestly. It is a huge series with a ton of names but none of us had any idea what the hell was going on either the first time we trudged through these books.
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Jan 18, 2024 15:53
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I'm pretty sure it took me most of the series to realise that Dessimbelackis and Dessembrae were not the same person
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Jan 18, 2024 18:27
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It's ok I thought Dessimbelackis was another region of Genabackis for a bit sooo
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Jan 19, 2024 00:22
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kingturnip posted:I'm pretty sure it took me most of the series to realise that Dessimbelackis and Dessembrae were not the same person When I hung out with Erikson years ago he had to explain to me the difference between Anomander and Anomandaris (one is the dude, the other is a poem written about the dude)
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Jan 19, 2024 01:02
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Thordain posted:I am most of the way through Dust of Dreams, and I still don't feel like I understand what is happening. When I finished the series my opinion was Reaper's Gale was the worst in the series, but over time I remember so much I love about it while with DoD and TCG I remember so little, including how the story even ends. Maybe there were parts of RG I found boring that I forget, though I only remember Redmask in that respect, which I don't think was much of the book. Edit: maybe the Silchias Ruin side of things was boring/confusing too. snoremac fucked around with this message at 04:37 on Jan 19, 2024 |
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Jan 19, 2024 04:28
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neurotech posted:Uhmmm did Udinaas just get dream-fisted? Menandore does it amazon style
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Jan 19, 2024 04:33
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Thordain posted:I am most of the way through Dust of Dreams, and I still don't feel like I understand what is happening. basically you're only reading half of a very long book, per the author, but you do get a really awesome climax scene as a treat
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Jan 19, 2024 18:59
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Jaxyon posted:basically you're only reading half of a very long book, per the author, but you do get a really awesome climax scene as a treat Oh I just finished it, and it was a very cool scene. I am still so confused
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Jan 19, 2024 19:19
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wow knight of knives was terrible. is it viable to just read the malazan wiki summaries for the other novels of the malazan empire? i don't think i can read another ICE book, but apparently some plot driving thing/things happens in the crimson guard book?
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Jan 24, 2024 23:55
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Some are better than others. Night of Knives is his debut and by far the worst imo. Even if ICE rises to 'average fantasy author' he still suffers greatly in comparison to Erikson though. How important is having the backstory of all the characters filled in for you? How desperate are you for more Malazan content?
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Jan 25, 2024 00:13
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srypher posted:wow knight of knives was terrible. is it viable to just read the malazan wiki summaries for the other novels of the malazan empire? i don't think i can read another ICE book, but apparently some plot driving thing/things happens in the crimson guard book? none of what happens in the ICE books matters in Erikson's 10 book series. people will mention a certain character dying, but that death has no effect on Erikson's series crimson guard is just as bad as night of knives, just stretched out for a few hundred more pages and with a mary sue character named Kyle
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Jan 25, 2024 00:34
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Still laugh at "Kyle". A real-world-name-inserted-into-fantasy too far.
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Jan 25, 2024 00:39
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needs more apostrophes. Kyl'e, bang, done.
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Jan 25, 2024 01:36
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I don't agree that RotCG is as bad as Night of Knives. After NoK I also thought I wasn't going to be able to read another ICE book, but he definitely steps it up from one to the other. RotCG is not amazing but is definitely much better. Also as a previous poster said there is an extremely significant event which takes place in RotCG that wraps up some large loose ends from the main series. If you don't read the ICE book the event is just dropped offhandedly during a side conversation and never mentioned again. Granted, the series takes a narrative shift after Toll the Hounds, and in the last two books it's true that said event doesn't really impact anything, but I am much happier having read RotCG before I read TtH and I feel like if I hadn't I would have felt a little short changed despite it's lower quality.
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Jan 25, 2024 02:00
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