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Yeah... I never really got the sense that Scott felt like he was safe and belonged until he was being openly dismissive of the school, barely three minutes of screen time after Hank restores his sight, and maybe a few days after he's arrived there at all? That's a problem. It makes him seem... ungrateful, I guess, but he is a teenager. Was it his throwaway line of "This place isn't as bad as I thought." before the other kids openly shun Jean in front of him that was supposed to give me that sense? If so, it failed. A quick exchange of "What about Kurt's... y'know... blue?" "That's their problem." would have worked for the purposes of the theatrical release, and maybe it gets addressed in the deleted scenes. I hope it does, because I like this movie, and I want to have faith in it, but it's as clumsy with its metaphors as it is with everything else.
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Jun 15, 2016 21:56
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Well it's simply a bad movie.
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Jun 16, 2016 01:05
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It was pretty funny that Jubilee got to ride in the Main Characters Of The Movie Car but they end up ditching her when everyone went to Stryker's base.
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Jun 16, 2016 02:59
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Away all Goats posted:It was pretty funny that Jubilee got to ride in the Main Characters Of The Movie Car but they end up ditching her when everyone went to Stryker's base. I was going to point out that her powers are pretty much useless so she's the last person on earth you'd take to a fight against Apocalypse and his Horsemen but I decided to google her to make sure I remembered her powers correctly and it turns out that her little fireworks light shows actually mean that she has "the untapped ability to detonate matter at a sub-atomic level, which in theory is the equivalent of a nuclear fusion bomb" and she was potentially one of the most powerful mutants ever.  But then she lost those power and got turned into a vampire.
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Jun 16, 2016 03:49
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Snowglobe of Doom posted:I was going to point out that her powers are pretty much useless so she's the last person on earth you'd take to a fight against Apocalypse and his Horsemen but I decided to google her to make sure I remembered her powers correctly and it turns out that her little fireworks light shows actually mean that she has "the untapped ability to detonate matter at a sub-atomic level, which in theory is the equivalent of a nuclear fusion bomb" and she was potentially one of the most powerful mutants ever. Doesn't every X-Man have "is potentially one of the most powerful mutants ever through possibly tenuous extrapolation of their powers" as a plot point?
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Jun 16, 2016 04:20
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Snowglobe of Doom posted:I was going to point out that her powers are pretty much useless so she's the last person on earth you'd take to a fight against Apocalypse and his Horsemen but I decided to google her to make sure I remembered her powers correctly and it turns out that her little fireworks light shows actually mean that she has "the untapped ability to detonate matter at a sub-atomic level, which in theory is the equivalent of a nuclear fusion bomb" and she was potentially one of the most powerful mutants ever. You can do this with just about any mutants power if you sperg about it enough, but some have had it happen canonically. Iceman got this treatment, cyclops turning the sky red, magneto and his purple-do-anything-waves. The only guys stuck without this possibility are dudes like beast and angel, so they change up their appearance a bunch (Hank>beast>cat beast>ape beast, Angel>archangel). If you really try to explain "mind powers/shoots stuff out of their hands" you quickly realize it means they can do more or less anything.
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Jun 16, 2016 04:22
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Cythereal posted:Doesn't every X-Man have "is potentially one of the most powerful mutants ever through possibly tenuous extrapolation of their powers" as a plot point? Pretty much any A-lister psychic/telekinetic mutant could end the world in a couple of minutes on a bet.
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Jun 16, 2016 04:27
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I guess if you give a character an ability that defies the laws of physics on even a tiny level and then crank them through 50 or 60 different writers it's pretty much inevitable that one of them will extrapolate that out to the nth degree
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Jun 16, 2016 04:30
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Yes and Wikipedia power entries always nonchalantly list the most godly example of whatever that character has done under any writer, without adding context (and when you read the Wiki character bios it makes comics seem even dumber than they actually are).
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Jun 16, 2016 04:40
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I liked that the Patrick Swayze-looking army guy's plan for what to do if Wolverine got out was just to tell everyone he'd be right back and then just leave them all to die. It was a fun deflation of pointless escalation of security poo poo for the x-men to fight when it would just be more of a distraction from getting back to Oscar Isaac. Xavier's subversion of Apocalypse's message was weird, as it didn't seem to be a command or anything, but just like an announcement that probably confused everyone. Also Apocalypse didn't even seem annoyed with that, unless he didn't actually listen to what Professor X was sending. Set design and costumes are on point with all these loving period-piece x-men movies. Sansa's blazer-and-stripey-shirt combo is the 1983-est thing that would be plausible in the setting and not parody. Major kudos to these guys for choosing a specific year and sticking to it instead of just throwing the whole decade in a blender like most movies would.
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Jun 16, 2016 06:37
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Moira had the 1983-est office work clothes as well. I could have done for more period architecture, like Peter Dinkledge's office building from the last one.
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Jun 16, 2016 06:39
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Snowglobe of Doom posted:I guess if you give a character an ability that defies the laws of physics on even a tiny level and then crank them through 50 or 60 different writers it's pretty much inevitable that one of them will extrapolate that out to the nth degree
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Jun 16, 2016 10:45
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Snowglobe of Doom posted:I guess if you give a character an ability that defies the laws of physics on even a tiny level and then crank them through 50 or 60 different writers it's pretty much inevitable that one of them will extrapolate that out to the nth degree Honestly I love the concept that most x-gene mutations are godlike powers and it's just a matter of a bunch of people getting thrown in with totally random powers and no instruction manual to use them. I genuinely like the idea that with a pretty okay life dazzler just never figured out her powers were anything more than pretty fireworks and it wasn't till she had to fight that she started realizing they could blow things up and not till later someone said "umm, these are fusion bombs actually". Or that iceman is basically the magneto of heat energy but he never thought past using it to make snowballs. I really like the idea of mutant talents being rooted in the mutant's own understanding of their powers and mostly that not being the most violent death death death refinement and training possible. That everyone is just using tiny fractions of their potential because no one ever listed out what their powers even are and they just made up their own ideas of how they work.
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Jun 16, 2016 14:02
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And most of the characters do need to go Super-Saiyan to go truly cosmic. Storm could re-align the cosmos or turn the earth into a single hurricane system with herself as the eye, but would probably melt unless she's doing it because somebody she likes got fridged. About the only one who is nonchalantly godlike is Professor X, but he makes himself feel every death or what the gently caress ever he does to justify it and is pretty much always knocked out of position in the first act of any X-Men story anyway.
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Jun 16, 2016 20:10
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I remember seeing the first X-Men in the theater and wondering if they were going to take Professor X off the board then Mystique broke into Cerebro with that poop vial and that was that.
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Jun 16, 2016 20:13
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OneThousandMonkeys posted:About the only one who is nonchalantly godlike is Professor X, but he makes himself feel every death or what the gently caress ever he does to justify it and is pretty much always knocked out of position in the first act of any X-Men story anyway.
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Jun 16, 2016 20:15
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Honestly humans are right to be concerned.
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Jun 16, 2016 20:24
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TheScott2K posted:Honestly humans are right to be concerned. Considering several of the "Omega-level" mutants are straight-up evil or guilty of genocide (and/or attempted genocide) and Xavier's School, the only real mutant governing authority, tolerates a few of those existing, yes, humans are right to be terrified.
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Jun 16, 2016 21:15
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It's okay they can just reset the fabric of reality if things go too badly. They got this under control, guys.
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Jun 16, 2016 21:17
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That has always been the flattest part of x-men using mutants as a stand in for various civil rights issue while also constantly being shown as legitimately the most harmful things on the entire planet and constant nonstop threats at every level of society almost daily.
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Jun 16, 2016 21:58
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The mutants are also shown as inevitable, and without moral judgement associated to their mere existence. Like gay people, they are there and you must accept that, and some are good and some are bad, but either way they are there, and your child might be one.
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Jun 16, 2016 22:16
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Also famous good guy professor x was used three times in one movie as a world-changing tool of evil and he just kind of shook it off.
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Jun 16, 2016 22:33
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doverhog posted:The mutants are also shown as inevitable, and without moral judgement associated to their mere existence. Like gay people, they are there and you must accept that, and some are good and some are bad, but either way they are there, and your child might be one. Basically mutant as stand in for various real world groups is always a thing that is half way between an interesting way to explore topics that wouldn't be explored in popular culture otherwise and having a bunch of weird and lovely implications on comparing real people with a bunch of fictional monsters.
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Jun 16, 2016 22:41
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It's a power fantasy about the marginalized group being able to fight back, or being able to show compassion and still defend their oppressors, rather than just being brutalized and murdered. The relationship to real-world discrimination is one of relatability and applicability, not metaphor or allegory. They're allowed to do the X-Men 2 coming out speech without having to make mutants reflect real-world power dynamics.
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Jun 17, 2016 00:31
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Sir Kodiak posted:It's a power fantasy about the marginalized group being able to fight back, or being able to show compassion and still defend their oppressors, rather than just being brutalized and murdered. The relationship to real-world discrimination is one of relatability and applicability, not metaphor or allegory. They're allowed to do the X-Men 2 coming out speech without having to make mutants reflect real-world power dynamics. It is that but then it also juxtaposes the gay stand ins with very clear demonstration that they are actually a real threat to society.
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Jun 17, 2016 00:40
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Owlofcreamcheese posted:It is that but then it also juxtaposes the gay stand ins with very clear demonstration that they are actually a real threat to society. The ability to threaten society, and also to restrain from doing so, are part of the power fantasy. And they're not "stand ins." They have some similar experiences, but they don't literally represent gay people.
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Jun 17, 2016 00:50
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Yeah, speaking as an LGBT person, Kodiak's pretty much on the money. I don't read/watch X-Men because I think it's a good way to reach out to homophobes or sums up the LGBT struggle perfectly or anything, I do it because the thought of melting homophobes with laser eyes tickles my lizard brain.
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Jun 17, 2016 01:50
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I have a weird complaint: Apocalypse wasn't impressive enough physically. Oscar Isaac is awesome but gently caress get some lifts on that man. I dunno I guess I expect larger-than-life ultra-villain Apocalypse to stand out some more. gently caress that drat potato sack; walk around 9 ft tall wallpapering every other motherfucker you see until everyone is bringing you their firstborn. The only grandiose moment he had was the missiles, and I was hoping he'd make a better show of it. Didn't hate the movie but Apocalypse was disappointing. Dunno how you'd fix it other than CGI but eh
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Jun 17, 2016 04:42
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TheHoosier posted:Oscar Isaac is awesome but gently caress get some lifts on that man.
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Jun 17, 2016 07:10
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i don't buy a country lacking common sense gun laws requiring mutants to register.
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Jun 17, 2016 22:01
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Chocolate Teapot posted:What makes the film so good, please tell. The fact that it's a 2 hour live action episode of the bad rear end 90's X-Men cartoon I grew up loving. High art? No. Good? yes.
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Jun 17, 2016 22:11
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Na'at posted:The fact that it's a 2 hour live action episode of the bad rear end 90's X-Men cartoon I grew up loving. actually its bad
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Jun 17, 2016 22:12
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Na'at posted:The fact that it's a 2 hour live action episode of the bad rear end 90's X-Men cartoon I grew up loving. it isn't like the cartoon at all. i would've liked it a lot more if it was that apocalypse (since he was my fave as a kid). it's criminal these movies didn't use that theme song as their theme too.
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Jun 17, 2016 22:21
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Dr. Tim Whatley posted:actually its bad Oh shiiiiiii Groovelord Neato posted:it isn't like the cartoon at all. i would've liked it a lot more if it was that apocalypse (since he was my fave as a kid). You're right. Storm should have given a 20 second speech to call the weather to do whatever she wanted, they really dropped the ball there. Basically it had a bunch of mutants going around doing mutant poo poo on a global scale and it was just fun stuff. They weren't trying to punch prejudice or whatever just being pseudo-gods and punching each other. I mean I guess if you require some sort of ideological analysis explaining why in the context of Kant's table of absolute value by way of Lacan's post-structural critical theory for me to explain why it was a fun movie then I can't help you. Mostly cause I just want to enjoy what I watch and not pretend I'm an analytical meat computer
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Jun 17, 2016 22:28
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It wasn't a good movie but it was a fun movie. They spent $178m to make the movie and have made $427m globally so far, so another movie is all but guaranteed.
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Jun 17, 2016 22:47
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Louisgod posted:It wasn't a good movie but it was a fun movie. They spent $178m to make the movie and have made $427m globally so far, so another movie is all but guaranteed. It's still a huge step down down from X-Men: Days of Future Past's performance, and X-Men: Apocalypse won't even make its budget back domestically. The franchise pretty much peaked in the mid 00s and has been limping along since then, they've been pumping more money into the films for lower returns ever since. Days of Future Past looked like it was going to revive the franchise but Apocalypse is pretty much a return to the slump but the films have been doing better and better internationally so perhaps Fox will be happy with that. Deadpool is, of course, an inexplicable outlier in all of this. Snowglobe of Doom fucked around with this message at 02:51 on Jun 18, 2016 |
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Jun 18, 2016 02:48
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Xmen films are weird. Like they're done by hatchet men and not by people who genuinely love the franchise and are familiar with the characters. I really have no idea if that is the case, but whenever I see a trailer I get the feeling it will be a movie of people doing super hero stuff with zero chemistry or fun to it. It comes across in every shot. It's hard to get excited about them and I get excited during EVERY trailer.
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Jun 18, 2016 03:01
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bring back old gbs posted:Xmen films are weird. Like they're done by hatchet men and not by people who genuinely love the franchise and are familiar with the characters. Those guys have been struggling really hard to figure out just how much Wolverine to put into their movies to keep the fans happy. "Hmm, the fans seem to love this Wolverine guy! We'll give them a film that's JUST Wolverine!" .... "Okay that did really badly, maybe we were completely wrong about this Wolverine dude, we'll give them a film that's 99% the other guys and only a tiny bit of Wolverine" ... "Okay that did even worse, let's try doing another Wolverine film again just to check" ..... "Okay okay that sucked again, let's just go back to the original plan where we throw a hole bunch of characters on screen but Wolverine is the main guy" .... "Oh my god it worked!!! We finally figured it out!! Just do that again ~ what? We wrote him out of the timeline and Hugh Jackman is quitting anyway? Oh poo poo ...." They must be really panicking that Jackman is only contracted to do another Wolverine solo film (which always end up sucking) and then abandon the franchise.
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Jun 18, 2016 03:17
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Clearly the answer is Wolverine: Civil War 
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Jun 18, 2016 03:57
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Snowglobe of Doom posted:It's still a huge step down down from X-Men: Days of Future Past's performance, and X-Men: Apocalypse won't even make its budget back domestically. The franchise pretty much peaked in the mid 00s and has been limping along since then, they've been pumping more money into the films for lower returns ever since. Days of Future Past looked like it was going to revive the franchise but Apocalypse is pretty much a return to the slump but the films have been doing better and better internationally so perhaps Fox will be happy with that. Deadpool is more explicable when you realize no one's really been that excited about an X-Men film for 10 years. Plenty of money is on the table for the right comic book movie. X-Men movies don't really know how to do an ensemble well, the script is always too busy with tertiary characters, and X-Men is always for better or worse trying to do pathos rather than focusing on action figures being mashed together on a playground somewhere. Name Change fucked around with this message at 04:42 on Jun 18, 2016 |
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Jun 18, 2016 04:40
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