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squidflakes posted:knux The only way to get the sky to come out as vivid as it is a that moment is to balance the amount of light on the subject so neither is blown out. In the instance of the photo with all the groomsmen, they were lit by a soft box and a few rim lights. That way I could balance the light on the subjects with the light in sky without much of a worry. Do you do any post processing to your images? You'd be surprised how much you can selectively crank a color before it starts looking completely unrealistic in Lightroom or Photoshop. You can push the saturation of the entire image as long as you keep skin tones looking normal.
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Aug 27, 2009 20:33
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Knux posted:Do you do any post processing to your images? You'd be surprised how much you can selectively crank a color before it starts looking completely unrealistic in Lightroom or Photoshop. You can push the saturation of the entire image as long as you keep skin tones looking normal. Yes, I shoot RAW and put everything through photoshop before I let it out the door. My Nikon tends to run hot, so my normal first step is to cool the image a bit. Again, on the machine where I'm doing all the editing, everything looks fine. It's only after saving it off and viewing it on another computer that it looks like poo poo. Do you calibrate your monitor with the PS tools?
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Aug 27, 2009 20:49
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I used a spyder 3 pro to calibrate my monitor and I couldn't recommend doing that more. Luckily I have a friend with one and he let me borrow it, but if you could get your hands on one it's completely worth it.
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Aug 27, 2009 21:01
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Nifty, I'll try to find one. I've got the B&W version for calibrating monitors for xray and MRI viewing, but.. yeah, completely useless for color. Alright, back to the wedding thread: What's the worst thing that's happened to/around you while shooting a wedding? I had the brother of the bride decide to jump in to the family pool while I'm taking shots of the bride and her bride's maids. He did a back flip and kicked my old Nikon right in the barrel of the lens. The whole rig ended up at the bottom of the pool and the CF card had to be sent to a data recovery place to save the images.
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Aug 27, 2009 23:01
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teamgod posted:....photographer's nightmare.... Once you get more experience and a lot more bookings you can hopefully spot these people at the initial consultation and turn them away.
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Aug 28, 2009 00:08
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Hey Knux, I had a look at those Alien Bees flash units. They look pretty slick and the price doesn't seem that bad. How many do you take with you and how do you have them rigged up? Do you have them set on slave and have them both flash when they pick up your camera's flash? I'm kind of a newbie when it comes to rigging up portable flash units like that, but it would be perfect for taking along at weddings, believe me.
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Aug 28, 2009 13:40
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teamgod posted:Alien Bees When shooting the set-up shots of bride/groom/families you can usually get away with two lights depending on the setting. If you're looking for a good starter deal from Alien Bees, grab 2 units (400 or 800 for your first will be fine) and a folding softbox. I use three generally though to even out the rim lights or to brighten up the room if it's a dark church alter. They come with a sync cable so you wouldn't need a triggering system if this is all you use them for. During the reception though I only use two. I place them on opposite sides of the dance floor usually since all the events happen there and either put them up high facing down to so flare is easier to handle, or bounce them off the ceiling if it's white. Since the units are plugged into the wall you don't have to worry about slow recharging. ABs come out of the box with built in optical slaves that are always turned on unless you have something plugged into to control them otherwise. I roll with a few cybersyncs and they've never misfired. I recommend at least some way to fire the slaves non-optical though for reception since everyone is snapping photos and you might miss a few from other people shooting just before you.
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Aug 28, 2009 14:02
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Thanks for the info! Where would you use that softbox though? Sorry if this sounds too noobish but do you use it with a constant light source? Do you even rig up a unit like that? In my head I'm imagining a softbox over a constant light source while you use the two ABs on the side. Also, what are rimlights and how are those used?
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Aug 28, 2009 14:29
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teamgod posted:Thanks for the info! Where would you use that softbox though? Sorry if this sounds too noobish but do you use it with a constant light source? Do you even rig up a unit like that? In my head I'm imagining a softbox over a constant light source while you use the two ABs on the side. Also, what are rimlights and how are those used? The softbox goes on one of the AB units, not a constant light. The power of the flash units is WAY more powerful than any constant light source so any constant light you use it near useless. Rim lighting is the term people use when they talk about placing a light to the side of the subjects. It helps add depth and dimension to the subject. I shoot with two AB 800s. I've never used them at a reception, but I might give that a try. I really like that one you posted earlier. I recommend the cybersyncs as well. I use mine all the time, and bought a hot shoe adapter so I can plug one into my normal flash too, to use for situations when I can't get AC power.
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Aug 28, 2009 16:03
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I too have two B800s, though I've never really considered bringing them to a wedding. I only have the sync cord that came with them, is there an affordable wireless one that you guys recommend? Also, have you had anyone complain that they take up too much space or that they're annoying?
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Aug 28, 2009 16:08
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If you're lucky enough to have a white ceiling or anything to bounce the strobes off, you can make the reception look insanely clear. Heres an example shot of my assistant from a wedding we shot under a dark white tent: The strobes balanced very well with the light outside so there wasn't any overexposed backgrounds in the shots that used them. You can see in the background how I set it on the corner of the dance floor away from the main traffic. The other one was hidden behind the dj booth. Both strobes created enough soft light to light up whatever I needed.  This shot was of the more dramatic type with the strobes pointed down at the people. Since the light is hard it creates some shadows here and there, but sometimes you can pull it off pretty well. Not to mention the awesome rim/hair lights they consistently create depending on where you stand. I'll post more shots of this method later this evening and the various other techniques you can do. I've never had anyone complain about the strobes being in the way, but I usually ask about it before agreeing to shoot the wedding. Most couples are impressed honestly and are happy to try any newer techniques out.
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Aug 28, 2009 16:26
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Knux, or anyone else who uses strobe units during weddings... Could you also share some more info on how you light for the ceremony? Do you ever have problems with churches or venues disallowing the use of strobes? Have you ever needed to use a portable power source? (Since there is a lot of AB talk in here, does anyone use a Vegabond?)
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Aug 29, 2009 19:19
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squidflakes posted:Knux, or anyone else who uses strobe units during weddings... I've never used them during a ceremony. Personally, even as a photographer, I think that's pushing it. They are REALLY bright compared to a normal flash, so they'd be pretty distracting. That and it's not style to use them for shots like that. I prefer a photojournalistic take on the ceremony. As for a VAGAbond (sorry, way to many people spell that wrong and don't understand what a vagabond is) I don't have one, but I plan to get one. For right now I'm just using my wireless triggers and my sigma flash. Most weddings you'll shoot will have access to power. Even my outdoor ones have, but for a few of my shots we were way too far away to run an extension cord.
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Aug 29, 2009 22:07
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squidflakes posted:Knux, or anyone else who uses strobe units during weddings... I don't really know of many wedding photographers worth their salt who use artificial light during a ceremony. Churches usually don't allow it, and even if the venue does, I personally think that the photog would be kind of an rear end in a top hat for using flash. As for the Vagabond, it's really, really loving awesome and worth EVERY cent. I've shot ~75 frames with three WL X1600's, full power, without the pack dying AND a decent recycle time. I don't know how many more frames I could have squeezed out; I've never actually ran the thing out on a full charge. It has also saved my sweet rear end a few times when I've needed to charge a battery or my laptop on the drive to a shoot. Possibly irrelevant: mine was recently soaked in the rain during a camping trip (it was used to power a boombox.) Sucker still starts up and holds a charge like nobody's business.
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Aug 31, 2009 01:46
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squidflakes posted:Could you also share some more info on how you light for the ceremony? Since most churches I've shot at don't allow flash during the ceremony, I don't have any tips for lighting a ceremony. I've done it once because I forgot my 430ex at home. I had permission from both the church and the couple and hid it pretty far back and up on the balcony pointing straight up at the ceiling. I only used it a handfull of times actually but it did the job alright. Mostly it's always been natural light for ceremonies. I rock the Vagabond during most of my outdoor set-up shots unless there is power on hand. Best investment i've had though, worth every penny.
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Aug 31, 2009 05:13
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Knux posted:Since most churches I've shot at don't allow flash during the ceremony, I don't have any tips for lighting a ceremony. I've done it once because I forgot my 430ex at home. I had permission from both the church and the couple and hid it pretty far back and up on the balcony pointing straight up at the ceiling. I only used it a handfull of times actually but it did the job alright. Mostly it's always been natural light for ceremonies. Can a Vagabond power other stuff, too? Like if I plugged in a laptop to charge or an ipod that's on its last legs?
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Aug 31, 2009 06:50
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The manual states you can run most lighter electronics off it, including your laptop. I've charged it off it a few times without a problem. It's basically a mini-car battery with an outlet and shoulder strap. However, you're not supposed to run any constant lighting off of it. Apparently this drains the battery too fast to the point where it could damage it. If you run alien bees, make sure you don't run the modeling lamps the whole time.
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Aug 31, 2009 13:34
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Helped with another wedding yesterday, it was some weird orthodox church; the bride was meek and didn't so much as crack a smile until after the ceremony, and even then rarely. Natural-light only in the church, so a bunch of the shots were taken at ISO 800; I think they'll be ok (it was bright, just not quite bright enough for 400) but time will tell. They're all gonna be a little less sharp than I'd like, and for drat sure they're less lively than the first wedding. Reception had no dancing and no drinking to speak of (Trader Joe's wine, strictly in moderation), and as soon as we got there people started eating so it's hard to take pictures then. Overall a pretty boring day, me and the other photographer joked that between us we probably got 100 shots of the cake and personalized napkins, there wasn't poo poo else to shoot and they only hired us for three hours. The photographer was asking all kinds of questions about my 40D and lenses; she uses Nikon D300s and I think she was pleasantly surprised at the quality I put out at the first wedding. I was surprised to learn her main lens is the 18-200 f/3.5-5.6. I mean I know it's versatile, but goddamn that's slow. Good news is I actually got some use out of my 50 f/1.4 at the ceremony; I was beginning to wonder if I'd ever find a need for it. Split the rest of the time between my 100 f/2.8 and 17-50 f/2.8.
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Aug 31, 2009 14:25
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jackpot posted:Reception had no dancing and no drinking to speak of Ugh those are awkward. I shot one at the beginning of the year and the girl running the dry bar and I kept joking about how awkward the whole ordeal was. People were slipping out mid-speeches. jackpot posted:I was beginning to wonder if I'd ever find a need for it. (50mm f1.4) Whaaat? If I were you that lens would have been my go to for most of the night. I've never shot a wedding with the 100mm though, you should post some of your shots.
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Aug 31, 2009 14:54
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Knux posted:Whaaat? If I were you that lens would have been my go to for most of the night. I've never shot a wedding with the 100mm though, you should post some of your shots. 
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Aug 31, 2009 15:21
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jackpot posted:70-200 f/2.8 Yeah that's one I always make sure I can get a hold of, be it rent/borrow, for a wedding. It's my next lens I'm looking at picking up and should complete my range. You can just camp the middle aisle during the ceremony and pull off some awesome shots.
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Aug 31, 2009 15:50
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Knux posted:Yeah that's one I always make sure I can get a hold of, be it rent/borrow, for a wedding. It's my next lens I'm looking at picking up and should complete my range. You can just camp the middle aisle during the ceremony and pull off some awesome shots. Yeah, I bought the f4 version for that same reason. I set up a tripod in the center aisle for the shots at the alter. It's an awesome lens for it.
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Aug 31, 2009 16:08
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squidflakes posted:How do you light a ceremony with strobes? rockcity posted:Don't Hot Cops posted:Don't Kunx posted:Don't See, I'm coming in to this thread assuming I'm doing everything wrong. Knowing that I'm doing a couple of things right, and by choice even, is pretty drat great. Thanks again for the help there guys. The talk on the vagabond was also incredibly helpful. To continue, how do you position yourself during the ceremony? One thing I've noticed is that while everyone wants great pictures of the vows and ring and blah, no one really wants you in the places you need to be to get those shots. The last couple of weddings I did, I just had the bride and groom do some ring exchange and first kiss poses after the actual ceremony. This lead to a lot less hauling my fat rear end around and generally making a spectacle.
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Aug 31, 2009 16:14
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squidflakes posted:See, I'm coming in to this thread assuming I'm doing everything wrong. Knowing that I'm doing a couple of things right, and by choice even, is pretty drat great. Thanks again for the help there guys. The talk on the vagabond was also incredibly helpful. I tend to go all over the place during the ceremony, but I do my best to avoid blocking the guest's line of sight. That means a lot of shots down the center aisles and from the sides. I work from the balcony a lot if there is one (and it's not in use). One church had a really convenient stage-like area that I could get to through a door in the side of the sanctuary. I used that to get behind the ceremony and get facial expressions of the bride and groom as the preacher spoke. I usually try to avoid being behind the bridal party like that, but the stage-like choir area gave me a bit of hiding room where I could be mostly unnoticeable.
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Aug 31, 2009 16:30
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Attend the ceremony rehearsal the day before and talk with the officiant to see what you can get away with. This will also give you time to figure out when the pauses in the ceremony are so you can plan your position changes. I try not to get in anyone's way, but the photographer is third place in wedding day hierarchy behind the bride and groom and they're counting on you to get great shots so do what you need to do.
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Aug 31, 2009 16:46
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squidflakes posted:See, I'm coming in to this thread assuming I'm doing everything wrong. Knowing that I'm doing a couple of things right, and by choice even, is pretty drat great. Thanks again for the help there guys. The talk on the vagabond was also incredibly helpful. I stick to the aisles or sometimes crouched down near the front row. My better shots usually end up shot with my 70-200 at 200 from the rear of the center aisle. I set it up on a tripod collar to get the shots really crisp and centered. I find that helps a lot.
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Aug 31, 2009 16:54
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Bread Zeppelin posted:...but the photographer is third place in wedding day hierarchy behind the bride and groom and they're counting on you to get great shots so do what you need to do. You have to keep this mindset the whole time. Obviously don't be getting in peoples way and crouch down as much as possible, but the couple will expect you to get that crucial kiss shot, and won't mind if you jump up for a few quick snaps. Personally if I'm alone I work the sides and the aisle. I usually set something in a pew along the center, middle of the aisle and start/end there to get all the walk in's down the row.
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Aug 31, 2009 16:58
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I always attend any kind of rehearsal and plan out my positions on paper before hand. You would be surprised what you can get away with, I had one wedding this year where the best man was very large, and I was able to crouch behind him for a portion of the ceremony and get some great close ups of the ring exchange. Of course it all depends on how comfortable you are doing that sort of thing, and how much you can do without disturbing the ceremony.
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Aug 31, 2009 17:06
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squidflakes posted:To continue, how do you position yourself during the ceremony? One thing I've noticed is that while everyone wants great pictures of the vows and ring and blah, no one really wants you in the places you need to be to get those shots. * From their site, and seriously these people have no sense of humor about it at all: The Orthodox Church is not something new conceived by the creative ingenuity of a pastor or worship committee responding to the ever-changing tastes of our society. It is not a new movement owing its existence to a dynamic religious leader or hot trend in outreach and evangelism. It is not a recently contrived worship model that promises to interest a new generation with a faith they will judge as being relevant. The Orthodox Church most definitely is not the product of a new best-selling approach to living the Christian life, promising happiness, success, and accumulated assets as evidence of God blessing one’s life.
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Aug 31, 2009 17:07
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I did my first "real" wedding last Saturday. The pictures turned out nicely, but I have to stress something for all of the new, budding photographers here: protect yourself with a specific contract. Here's what happened to me: since this was my first wedding where the client wasn't a friend, I did not have any preconcieved notions about my rates. We ended up agreeing (verbally) that it would be a flat rate, and that we would do pre-ceremony getting ready candids, formals, ceremony, and reception. For the reception, we told them that we would stay for the major events -- the entrances, speeches, cake cutting, first dances, bouqet-garter toss, and guest photos. Everything went wonderfully until the reception (well, formals went well after we told everyone else to stop trying to take pictures and interfering during posing). When we got to the reception, we spoke with the great DJ, who walked us through the itinerary, ran people placement by us, and generally did everything he could to make our job easier. The first mishap was that my other shooter and I did not have a seat/table, and were not fed. In an earlier meeting, the bride asked me what we were doing for food -- I said that we would eat when everyone else was, because people eating their food is not conducive to good photos. Well, apparently she forgot about that. The food was served per-plate by the reception hall staff, and they didn't ever serve us. So my lunch and dinner was a cupcake. Anyway, the second mishap involved the bouquet and garter toss. When the DJ took us through the schedule, we learned that after the first dances, there was going to be a "free dance" period for the guests, and that the bride and groom would do the bouquet and garter toss after that. The free dance would last however long the bride/groom wanted, but the general idea was that the toss would happen between 8 and 9. When 9:30 rolled around, I asked the DJ what was going on, and he said that he was waiting for the bride/groom to tell him when to do the toss. We went and found them, and the groom was pretty drunk. The conversation went like this: Us: Hey, are we still going to do the bouquet/garter toss? Groom: Oh, yeah. Hey, where's your cameras? Us: They're in the hall; we're waiting on you two to do the toss. Groom: Oh, are they like on a tripod all set up? (he was sort of talking over us) Us: No, we're just waiting on you guys. Groom: Oh. Well, why don't you go get your cameras and then ask me again. (I don't think he understood what was going on) So, after a talk with the DJ when the two came into the hall a few minutes later, we nixed the bouquet and garter toss. So basically, we stood around for 2-3 hours with nothing to shoot except guests dancing, waiting on the tosses that never happened -- all on empty stomachs. This was our fault. We should have had a signed contract that specified the amount of time we would stay, and then if the bride/groom wanted us to stay longer, an agreed additional hourly rate. I had relied on verbal agreements and casual arrangements, and it bit me in the rear end. So, my first "real" wedding was a learning experience. It happens. But, instead of having this kind of stuff happen to you, learn from my mistakes! It's much better that way, I assure you.
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Aug 31, 2009 20:58
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Always set a time limit or you can end up at a wedding for 14 hours...
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Aug 31, 2009 21:09
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dakana posted:story time First thing is first. Get a contract. I don't care if it's for a friend, still have them sign it. It's not going to hurt your friendship and it could save you. I'm not sure why you were so gung-ho about doing the garter toss. Sure it can be fun to shoot, but I've never had a single person buy that photo so I don't think you were missing out on much. As for food, I always clarify that with the bride and groom beforehand. I've never had an issue with not being able to eat. When people start to get drunk like that, that's typically when I start to call it a night, mostly because they probably don't want photos of them being drunken idiots mixed with them exchanging marriage vows. For most, this doesn't mix.
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Aug 31, 2009 21:15
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If I were to setup pricing (for all my imaginary clients), is it pretty common to have a per-hour fee and a minimum? Like $150 per hour and/or $700 minimum? If you do that, does the price include any prints or an album, or do you just link them to a site where they can order prints (pictage, smugmug, etc), or just give them a CD? What's common? Where online can I put together a good, moderately priced album?
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Aug 31, 2009 21:24
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jackpot posted:If I were to setup pricing (for all my imaginary clients), is it pretty common to have a per-hour fee and a minimum? Like $150 per hour and/or $700 minimum? If you do that, does the price include any prints or an album, or do you just link them to a site where they can order prints (pictage, smugmug, etc), or just give them a CD? What's common? I don't do per hour pricing, but I set a maximum time. Per hour pricing leaves way too much up to the event to determine how long you'll be there and how much the couple will owe you. It also gives people a chance to book less time and then try to keep you longer. I honestly wouldn't do it. You can include whatever you want when you shoot, just make sure you price accordingly. Some people prefer to book people on time alone and then sell them everything afterward a la carte. Some people like to book big packages with hundreds of dollars in print credit, albums, disc, slideshows, etc. It's all in how you and your couples want to do it really. I like to give them options, but typically what I do is I start them off by pricing them for my time and a hardcover book. I like the book because it's something a little different. It's not as cookie cutter as an album and you can do some really nice things with it. It's also only about 20 pages, so it gives you the chance to use only your best photos from the day. I just got one made last week oddly enough. After that I put up web-sized proofs on instaproofs.com. It gives them a full gallery that they can pass around and anyone can order from. I usually give the bride and groom some more options on top of that as well. For instance I'm making some custom thank you cards for the wedding I shot a couple weeks ago.
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Aug 31, 2009 21:36
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rockcity posted:a hardcover book I've been wanting to offer a hardcover, and gently caress me, it was after catching like 4 minutes of a drat Gary Fong video. Still, the idea is great and I'd like to know if you could recommend some good vendors.
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Sep 1, 2009 04:45
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I've only shot two weddings, one when I was broke and one for a good friend, and what I didn't realize is how much work it is to process all images. I don't know how people who are shooting one every week or so do it.ConfusedUs posted:Can a Vagabond power other stuff, too? Like if I plugged in a laptop to charge or an ipod that's on its last legs? I have one and I've used it to power laptops, phones, strobes (3-4 WL X1600's, never run out of power on a shoot), garment steamers, and other stuff and it works fine. The only thing that didn't work was I used the inverter from the v1 to power a Profoto pack off a car battery and I'm pretty sure that broke it. Paul C Buff replaced it with a v2 for the cost of shipping, which is another reason to buy AB/WL - the customer service is really good.   WL with a softbox + 580 on camera 
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Sep 1, 2009 05:09
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brad industry posted:I don't know how people who are shooting one every week or so do it. Nice photos. The key to quickly finishing the post on a wedding is that you can't polish the images like you would a commercial shoot unless someone is paying for that. I run them through lightroom and only open photoshop to do noise reduction.
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Sep 1, 2009 05:30
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8th-samurai posted:Nice photos. The key to quickly finishing the post on a wedding is that you can't polish the images like you would a commercial shoot unless someone is paying for that. I run them through lightroom and only open photoshop to do noise reduction. Yeah, pretty much this with the exception of the formals. Those are always worth spending more time on. But reception? Who cares.
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Sep 1, 2009 05:38
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Hot Cops posted:Yeah, pretty much this with the exception of the formals. Those are always worth spending more time on. Yes but I don't get crazy. I make it clear to my clients that anything that would require extensive retouching is not included.
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Sep 1, 2009 05:48
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I'm still starting out and trying to decide on what to offer, but I'm thinking offering a standard 40-50 photos retouched in a hardcover book as part of the package deal, plus the rest of the shots on a DVD.
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Sep 1, 2009 05:59
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