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SpiritOfLenin posted:Anybody know what's the point of the maze of memories? i'm currently messing with it and my best guess is using it to instantly complete multiple treasuries and/or achievements for filling the map
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Mar 5, 2021 19:24
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| # ? Jun 10, 2024 00:09 |
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DurosKlav posted:I think you guys should stop trying to build every building before you complete chapter 2. The grind is not that bad. The grind is bad for me cause I am collecting resources 30% of the drops at a time.  Oh god, why am I so bad at this game
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Mar 5, 2021 19:26
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oh also the game has variant dialogue for refighting bosses, perk unlocks for rekilling bosses, and lore unlocks for the tokens you get from overfilling your hand, so i think they expect you to replay earlier chapters a bit
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Mar 5, 2021 19:27
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K8.0 posted:Did you grind the hell out of the demo? Without massive grinding or EXTREME luck on item drops, you're not making it past maybe loop 5. No, grinding the demo is like max leveling to wow by just picking flowers. Sure it can be done but its boring and you just skipped the majority of the game. I started a completely fresh run after 10+ hours in the demo.
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Mar 5, 2021 19:28
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nerox posted:The grind is bad for me cause I am collecting resources 30% of the drops at a time. I'm in this post. "One more loop then I'll bail so I can collect this stuff."
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Mar 5, 2021 19:29
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Man I totally owned that last loop only losing 5% of my hp. I can totally do another one! *dies after second encounter*
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Mar 5, 2021 19:31
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Man, chapter 4 is something alright
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Mar 5, 2021 19:31
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also it behooves you to check the encyclopedia because some things are more common drops from particular enemy types or encounter setups (i.e. encounters with 4+ enemies, which basically requires you to set up some enemy farms in vampire country; or encounters with swarms, which requires you to do Shenanigans™ to create overgrown farmland from regular farmland by either placing it next to a fake forest village or destroy the village the farmland was placed by)
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Mar 5, 2021 19:37
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Athanatos posted:I've not really grinded very hard nor played the demo much. [b]I think it's just farming the later acts you get a ton of stuff even on short runs.[/b They really don't. You don't get any meaningful amount of resources until you're deep in loops with a lot of tiles laid down, which is impossible past A1 without either massive grinding or massive luck. I played the demo for 5-6 hours, I've put 11 hours into the main game, and in all that time I've only seen 1 set of gear that could maybe have pushed past loop 6 on A2. I seriously wonder what people who consider A2+ playable are doing.
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Mar 5, 2021 19:45
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I seem to have somehow unlocked a Dark Slime in my encyclopedia. Anyone know where this thing is from?
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Mar 5, 2021 19:49
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K8.0 posted:They really don't. You don't get any meaningful amount of resources until you're deep in loops with a lot of tiles laid down, which is impossible past A1 without either massive grinding or massive luck. I played the demo for 5-6 hours, I've put 11 hours into the main game, and in all that time I've only seen 1 set of gear that could maybe have pushed past loop 6 on A2. I never really farmed A2 and have been doing A3 for my "grinding." I just make sure I have my tiles balanced so they don't all gently caress me over and never try and stack things that get crazy. I'm not taking Ruins or Graveyards very often in with me, because those will get you got real quick on the rogue. I also make sure to save up oblivions for any goblin camps, ?Village, or Bandit camps those also can end a solid run if you are not careful. It's really about not overextending yourself. I basically set up 2 large camps of healing and battles on either side of the loop and just work my way between them.
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Mar 5, 2021 19:52
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Beat chapter 1 last night after a biffed attempt at the boss without gym, can confirm the upgrades go a long way to beating him. Going to stream it if anyone wants to see whats going on, on chapter 2, so some spoilers i guess, though i dont know about a lot of the more complex interactions for tiles so i'll probably just be stumbling over those. https://www.twitch.tv/bobatronics
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Mar 5, 2021 19:53
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Broken Cog posted:I seem to have somehow unlocked a Dark Slime in my encyclopedia. Anyone know where this thing is from? Not sure on the specifics but I believe it has something to do with using oblivion on a monster.
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Mar 5, 2021 19:55
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Athanatos posted:I never really farmed A2 and have been doing A3 for my "grinding." I just make sure I have my tiles balanced so they don't all gently caress me over and never try and stack things that get crazy. I'm not taking Ruins or Graveyards very often in with me, because those will get you got real quick on the rogue. I also make sure to save up oblivions for any goblin camps, ?Village, or Bandit camps those also can end a solid run if you are not careful. Wait, you're doing rogue? How are you even surviving long enough to place tiles as rogue in A2? By loop 3 if you don't have god-tier weapon drops you aren't going to kill anything before it punches through your necklace and then you're doomed. Is there something I'm missing that dramatically ups the quality of item drops or something?
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Mar 5, 2021 19:55
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Snowballing is extremely important. Even just the number of initial slime spawns makes a MASSIVE difference, to the point where if you don't start with the max you might as well restart. You want to maximize the amount of time you are spending in early fights (by not equipping any gear that adds damage) to give your monster spawners more time to work. Vampires on every tile helps, too. You want a lot of early, big fights before the enemies start scaling with loops. I was watching jorbs stream before I went to bed last night and employing this strategy he was able to fill every single tile on the 3rd map by loop #4.
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Mar 5, 2021 19:57
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K8.0 posted:Wait, you're doing rogue? How are you even surviving long enough to place tiles as rogue in A2? By loop 3 if you don't have god-tier weapon drops you aren't going to kill anything before it punches through your necklace and then you're doomed. Is there something I'm missing that dramatically ups the quality of item drops or something? you should post a screenshot of what your average layout looks like by the time you get overwhelmed because you're clearly doing something wrong
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Mar 5, 2021 20:13
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DurosKlav posted:Not sure on the specifics but I believe it has something to do with using oblivion on a monster. Traxis posted:Snowballing is extremely important. Even just the number of initial slime spawns makes a MASSIVE difference, to the point where if you don't start with the max you might as well restart. You want to maximize the amount of time you are spending in early fights (by not equipping any gear that adds damage) to give your monster spawners more time to work. Vampires on every tile helps, too. You want a lot of early, big fights before the enemies start scaling with loops. Some tricks I use: Set up a killbox near camp with ransacked villages and blood groves. The archers from the camp towers will help you clear them out without much trouble. Ruins are actually not that bad for grinding, as long as you don't let them fight on their terms. space them out and make sure they are covered by a blood grove, that way they won't be able to escape. Same with cemeteries, just make sure they come before something that doesn't have ranged. Try to remove ?villages if you are playing rogue, as the wooden dummies packs a serious punch. As necromancer they are free loot though. As I mentioned earlier, outposts are extremely good for rogue, since he's not really affected by the downside. Put them everywhere you can, they even join bossfights. They don't work for necro though (you even get a special scene for it) blood groves blood groves blood groves blood groves blood groves blood groves blood groves blood groves blood groves blood groves Broken Cog fucked around with this message at 20:21 on Mar 5, 2021 |
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Mar 5, 2021 20:17
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President Ark posted:you should post a screenshot of what your average layout looks like by the time you get overwhelmed because you're clearly doing something wrong I don't think how you place stuff matters in any significant way, as long as you're not doing obviously stupid things like letting worms spit on meaningful fights. This is a run that will 95% wipe on loop 5, and if it doesn't loop 6 is certain death.  I could have placed one of the double spider nests on the left, but either way whether you go for more grouped or split fights is just gambling on what items and perks you get with no way to control it.
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Mar 5, 2021 20:49
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Am I fundamentally misunderstanding something about the game or does the game just do a really crap job of explaining itself? According to the tooltip monster strength is supposed to go up by like 5% a loop so looping isn't a big deal but it seems the loop scaling fucks you up way, way, way harder than that, which would just completely change how you're supposed to play the game.
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Mar 5, 2021 20:59
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guys i've found the secret to rogue runs ditch mountains (IMPORTANT: YOU ALSO NEED ARSENAL!), take forests and deserts, get chrono crystals, vampires and spider nests. stick spider nests everywhere with chrono crystals. if you can get a first/2nd loop vampire village, do it. get the maximum amount of mobs early on so you get overleveled gear from mad stacks of trophies. if you've got the library card (or whatever it was called unlocked), use it, and keep it around so you can swap cards you don't need atm for more forests and deserts. use a lot of +attack speed and +damage to all. marvel at the carnage. i literally filled the map with that strat lol
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Mar 5, 2021 21:00
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I’m also getting owned in Chapter 2 and not retreating when I should. Every new building costs 1,000,000 metal orbs so I want to farm with the rogue but I usually just die horribly. There’s something screwy where the spiders scale ridiculously high by like loop 3. We People are recommending all these cool cards but I still only have Swamp and Blood Grove. Just got Ruins which seems ok as long as you’re not an idiot and build it next to stuff (which I did).
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Mar 5, 2021 21:39
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K8.0 posted:I don't think how you place stuff matters in any significant way, as long as you're not doing obviously stupid things like letting worms spit on meaningful fights. The entire game is "how you place stuff matters". Setting things poorly is just setting yourself up to fail. Taking too many fights back to back, or not comboing things together to give you an advantage. That corner there to the right is a murder house. Double Spiders, and vamps that leads right into a grove with no healing in there. Then if you survive that, you have the entire loop of no healing till you get back. Meadows are pretty poor unless they are bloomed AND under a crystal. That +22 hp a day is nothing when you have 800hp, 22 is less than a single hit from a spider. Even if you wanted to meadow as your main healing, you need to spread your fights out so it has time to work. By piling the fights you MAYBE get a heal or 2 times in that cluster, if you spread your fights, the meadow heals can at least do some work. Your screenshot stats are really spread thin also. Focus on 1 or 2 stats and pump them. That's mostly RNG if you can, but having 40% evasion is better than 10 vamp, 10 evasion, 10 counter, 10 attack speed. space uncle posted:We People are recommending all these cool cards but I still only have Swamp and Blood Grove. Just got Ruins which seems ok as long as you’re not an idiot and build it next to stuff (which I did). I didn't read the card when I first got it and put 3 of them in a row
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Mar 5, 2021 22:03
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Damage To All is weak, unless specifically from the camp scythe that converts 3% of your damage to damage to all on the rogue. It's in the same tier as non focused regeneration on warrior, a secondary thing you occasionally include because it's alongside more useful stuff. It's neat that you get new level up talents from boss wins, but at a point you wonder if you want to dilute your level up pool with stuff like time flows 15% faster. That could have been +1 skeleton!
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Mar 5, 2021 22:08
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Athanatos posted:The entire game is "how you place stuff matters". It really, really isn't. It's "what RNG you get matters." As you state yourself here : Athanatos posted:Your screenshot stats are really spread thin also. Focus on 1 or 2 stats and pump them. That's mostly RNG if you can, but having 40% evasion is better than 10 vamp, 10 evasion, 10 counter, 10 attack speed. Just make choices that you don't get! If I spread stuff out, I'd still have no healing - in fact there is no way to get healing other than good RNG. I just wouldn't be able to take advantage of AOE stats and perks if I happened to get them. You're imagining that this game has a lot more you can do than it actually does. e - and to be clear, placing (spawner) cards is an absolute shitshow. You have to do it pretty much instantly because otherwise you won't get enough loot to survive, which means "plan ahead" means "lol just guess what random drops you're going to get". K8.0 fucked around with this message at 22:19 on Mar 5, 2021 |
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Mar 5, 2021 22:12
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Blind Duke posted:It's neat that you get new level up talents from boss wins, but at a point you wonder if you want to dilute your level up pool with stuff like time flows 15% faster. That could have been +1 skeleton! All of them except the resurrection seem like a full on non-reversible trap option which is uncool to say the least
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Mar 5, 2021 22:13
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K8.0 posted:It really, really isn't. It's "what RNG you get matters." As you state yourself here : Villages are fantastic at keeping you going, just ease off on creating murder placements before you get some. Also items are going to be a trade off to get what you want, maybe you want evasion but everything is counter, go with what the RNG is giving you and don't force it, just dont spread yourself too thin. By loop 5 you should have a solid stat no matter what the RNG is giving you, unless you are the worst luck'd fellow of all time. Might be possible. Not every run is going to be the one. Sometimes you gotta bail on something if you don't get it set up early. If I don't have my villages buffed by round 3 or 4, I call it a loop and start it over. You use the RNG it gives you to create the difficulty.
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Mar 5, 2021 22:19
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K8.0 posted:It really, really isn't. It's "what RNG you get matters." As you state yourself here : It really is about placement and working around your RNG. In your screenshot you pretty much made multiple murder gauntlets and are now wondering why you're getting murdered. You dont have to place cards the moment you get them. Give it a few battles so you can plan the fights. Also a good way to move forward is to make sure the deck you're running suits your class. You have desert cards while running a warrior which seems super counter productive, that health reduction applies to you as well. Also saving filling in around a treasury until you need it is a good strategy. DurosKlav fucked around with this message at 22:35 on Mar 5, 2021 |
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Mar 5, 2021 22:31
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SpiritOfLenin posted:guys i've found the secret to rogue runs Sheesh, this makes the game play itself. I just went and did dishes and it automatically soloed loops 13-17.
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Mar 5, 2021 22:36
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DurosKlav posted:It really is about placement and working around your RNG. In your screenshot you pretty much made multiple murder gauntlets and are now wondering why you're getting murdered. You dont have to place cards the moment you get them. Give it a few battles so you can plan the fights. Also a good way to move forward is to make sure the deck you're running suits your class. You have desert cards while running a warrior which seems super counter productive, that health reduction applies to you as well. Also saving filling in around a treasury until you need it is a good strategy. Health reduction is always good because increased health doesn't reduce the damage you take, it just provides a small bump to the very limited number of %-based heals you get. It has no negative impact on the majority of your healing. You have to rely on blowing things away in as few hits as possible. If your healing is less than the damage you take you will lose, more HP just means it might take 1-2 more fights to die. The only ways to win the race are more damage (which you can't control) and desert cards (which you can). Thus desert is basically mandatory. I maintain you cannot delay placing spawner cards. I've tried it several times and it's absolute doom. You get no loot and just die on loop 3 or 4. Placing a spawner right away at a distance where it will spawn before you get there lets you kill monsters sooner, which drops more cards and loot giving you more rolls on the RNG to survive the fixed damage increase of looping. There is no way around this, it's not like this game has any input other than this poo poo and the math doesn't add up. Delaying to place around treasuries is the kind of incredibly obvious thing that I don't believe anyone actually misses. You just don't get to choose sometimes because the RNG gives you the cards it gives, and letting cards burn early game (or getting bad cards in general) is just an auto wipe.
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Mar 5, 2021 22:43
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Dude in your screenshot you're not exactly in danger of running out of card space had you not enclosed the treasury. If you really needed to you could have placed them somewhere else. I'd rather let a card burn tI'm thinking maybe this game isnt for you. For record this is my current chapter 2 rogue run.  I only just now filled in most of the treasuries and have beaten the boss. DurosKlav fucked around with this message at 22:55 on Mar 5, 2021 |
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Mar 5, 2021 22:52
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K8.0 posted:I don't think how you place stuff matters in any significant way, as long as you're not doing obviously stupid things like letting worms spit on meaningful fights. yeah your problem is you've clumped up all your spawners in one spot so you won't get day-to-day healing from meadows between fights, plus one of your spider spawners (the one on the outside of the east edge) isn't doing anything. also you're using battlefield as rogue without stacking them to spawn blood clots - in case you haven't noticed, rogues get very little from chests, you'll only get resource shards and no loot. (the flip side of this is that rogues get a lot of benefit from outposts - losing orange/yellow drops doesn't matter because rogues don't get those from fights anyway) President Ark fucked around with this message at 23:09 on Mar 5, 2021 |
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Mar 5, 2021 23:02
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President Ark posted:(the flip side of this is that rogues get a lot of benefit from outposts - losing orange/yellow drops doesn't matter because rogues don't get those from fights anyway) This is a neat thing, each class is a bit different with them: Warrior - Costs regular items Rogue - Costs nothing because no items drop anyway Necro - They hate him and only shoot the battlefield with arrows
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Mar 5, 2021 23:10
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there's a lot of poo poo like that i'm noticing. necromancer has no downside from the ancestral tomb gold card (which makes you lose the hp bonus from armor) because they don't wear anything in the armor slot anyway and zero minus zero is still zero
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Mar 5, 2021 23:19
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President Ark posted:i'm currently messing with it and my best guess is using it to instantly complete multiple treasuries and/or achievements for filling the map I'd like to get back to this, since I noticed a pretty interesting line in the changelog they posted to steam forums: Buffed the labirynth of memories cards While that might just mean "made the card do a little more", I suspect there's something more to that specific gold card.
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Mar 5, 2021 23:29
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Just beat the 3rd boss with full lvl 14 hear on loop 10 thanks to Marauder, just went full nuts with it and stacked spiders on every grove / wheatfield square and got like 60 trophies every loop. Also got a crazy amount of resources. Something like 30 wood and 10 iron just from this one. You really start getting resources alot faster later. My only real gripe with the game is how much cooler it is once you have a few buildings. The sudden slowdown at act 2 really didnt have to be so steep. Just make smithy really cheap or something because the game is alot better once you have Arsenal for war / rogue or necromancer with crypt.
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Mar 5, 2021 23:34
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God drat this talent is amazing.
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Mar 5, 2021 23:40
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President Ark posted:yeah your problem is you've clumped up all your spawners in one spot so you won't get day-to-day healing from meadows between fights Why would I care about this, though? It's not like you need healing in between fights, either you have the stats to do them basically damageless or you're going to die. The actual buffer you have from your HP pool only matters on bosses and flesh golems where you need to survive significant damage to get loot (though even those are far more about RNGing good gear than anything else). For your main grinding around the loop, you are either health positive and sustainable, or health negative and you WILL die. You'd have to get into some incredibly unusual edge situation for it to make the difference between pass and fail. You're right about that one spider spawner being off one tile, though, which is costing me a mob kill per loop there. Also I'm playing warrior in that shot. The fact of the matter is, it's very easy to prove that the grind and RNG are what matters. If they weren't, it'd be easy to just fire up a new save and play through beating each boss without stopping. You can't do that specifically because player agency is almost completely insignificant. K8.0 fucked around with this message at 23:45 on Mar 5, 2021 |
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Mar 5, 2021 23:43
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i mean, here's my first run after dinner where i just loaded up rogue and i'd say i'm probably in a better spot than you are now, on the start of loop 3/end of loop 2: i've stacked some spider spawners next to chrono crystals that, despite being next to each other, are depositing on opposite sides of the track, i've got enough time between fights to recover between them, and i've also got my first treasury open so it's not like i'm slacking there. the majority of my runs are like this. but nah i guess the multiple people telling you are wrong are just delusional and you're the only person who really understands this game!
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Mar 5, 2021 23:47
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Not every game is going to be for everyone. If you dont like it and think it's unfair, that's 100% fine, move on and live your life. You don't need to spend time telling us about the fun we are not having. Go find something you do like doing instead of smashing your head into this game. Find something cool and enjoy your time.President Ark posted:but nah i guess the multiple people telling you are wrong are just delusional and you're the only person who really understands this game!
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Mar 5, 2021 23:49
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DurosKlav posted:God drat this talent is amazing. Lots of the *loop effects seem anemic, but not this one. Instapick ASAP because you are getting another level next you cross the campfire.
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Mar 5, 2021 23:50
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