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Serious Frolicking posted:SAO was the shittiest idea for a game imaginable. A fantasy MMO where the only classes available are all melee. Ranged options were a joke. Magic was nonexistent. The only buffs and healing came from consumables. This was discussed in the source material I believe, SAO was one of the first Virtual Reality MMORPG's, so that was its main selling point, we can see that with how Alfheim and the other games were quick to expand their gameplay.
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Jul 12, 2014 22:27
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HerpicleOmnicron5 posted:But I just don't understand all the Sinon love here. She's fairly dull in my opinion, with the dullest most wafer thin motives, character, and she doesn't even look that cool, even with what little we've seen of her in the anime. At least all the other characters have emotions and character. Even in this episode you can see her getting all emotional and berserker-ish about killing people and fighting. She's just the type who suppresses her emotions by pretending to be cold. Which is pretty much the basic skeleton for a character arc, which is already two steps ahead of every other character who only exists to reflect Kirito's awesomeness back at him. I mean, a motivation alone puts her ahead of Asuna.
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Jul 12, 2014 23:26
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Holy poo poo this episode was terrible. Like, seriously what's up with the pace? Also, dragging Kirito along with this thing without having him being a meaningful character (ever) just creates meaningless baggage for the show. Makes you realize that the best parts of the original were the not completely terrible romance part and Asuna. And the world-building and random characters and events. Kirito is completely worthless to the story and I can't believe I'm only realizing it now.These two episodes feel like some terrible anime I dropped after one or two episodes in previous seasons, but I'll continue to watch it if only to see people's reactions to Kirito wielding a light saber. (I wonder if Star Wars will be directly referenced at all?) Also, I don't remember the two other characters that were with Leafa but I think I've seen them before. Why in the gently caress should I care about them in regards to this story? Actually, the entire scene at the end had four girls and Kirito. And tentacles. Ugh. Also, Asuna's deadpan confused face at the end somehow felt egregious, like in a "strip a character completely of any agency whatsoever"-way. I didn't dislike the first part of SAO and even the second had a lot of redeeming features or something. Now I can't stop getting *almost* annoyed by all the dead weight this story is holding. Also, Christ with the asspans, getting really uncomfortable (really just eye rolling) territory for some reason and I didn't have problems with KLK apart from few isolated scenes. Well, the only good thing going for this episode was the action scenes to some extent and the fact neither the PVE party or the people ambushing them were shown as villains, but people of moral amguity since it's a game I'm not as angry as I sound about this show. Just a little...disappointed for what it has been so far, even though I didn't expect much. Dessel fucked around with this message at 02:10 on Jul 13, 2014 |
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Jul 13, 2014 02:05
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The other two characters are two of the girls who fell in love with Kirito during SAO of course. You can see this here, in the scene they copy-pasted from season 1  You're welcome
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Jul 13, 2014 11:39
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Oh don't worry, I'll be told when Toonami runs it that in SAO it's reusing animation and in some other show that didn't pull its full run on CN proper that it's a callback gag.
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Jul 13, 2014 11:49
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Dessel posted:Holy poo poo this episode was terrible. Like, seriously what's up with the pace? Also, dragging Kirito along with this thing without having him being a meaningful character (ever) just creates meaningless baggage for the show. Makes you realize that the best parts of the original were the not completely terrible romance part and Asuna. And the world-building and random characters and events. Kirito is completely worthless to the story and I can't believe I'm only realizing it now.These two episodes feel like some terrible anime I dropped after one or two episodes in previous seasons, but I'll continue to watch it if only to see people's reactions to Kirito wielding a light saber. (I wonder if Star Wars will be directly referenced at all?) Also, I don't remember the two other characters that were with Leafa but I think I've seen them before. Why in the gently caress should I care about them in regards to this story? Actually, the entire scene at the end had four girls and Kirito. And tentacles. Ugh. Also, Asuna's deadpan confused face at the end somehow felt egregious, like in a "strip a character completely of any agency whatsoever"-way. Breathe dude, I'm sure it will pick up some.
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Jul 14, 2014 05:00
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Raenir Salazar posted:It seemed obvious to me, considering how we can infer some things from how combat in GGO works now: They're doing a pretty horrid job of explaining the mechanics but basically: 1. All weapons have those 'sight lines' so people can judge where their enemy's aim is, since the players each have a device that 'locks on' to the weapons being fired at them by people not in their party. It takes about a minute of inactivity (and no visual of the enemy) for the 'sight lines' to reset, hence the guy's mention of how he was going to guy 60 seconds for Sinon to change firing positions. Sniper rifles are really advantageous thanks to not showing a sight line until they've fired the first round and they can be well out of enemy visuals so it's much easier for them to get the reset and fire off a shot of opportunity. The mechanic also makes it important to flank enemies and get in their blindspots so they don't see the lines incoming. 2. Correct, but projectile weapons (near-instantly applied damage) are much harder to dodge. The long distance between Sinon and Behemoth gives enough time to dodge completely, but up close it's almost impossible unless specced for insane Agility. Behemoth wasn't nearly as successful at dodging up close. 3. Huge plot hole right here, she would've been more useful for her team to keep the sight line trained on Behemoth's head to take his attention away from the approaching group. It's pretty drat hard to evade a sniper whose sight is trained on you while still trying to gun down other foes. Once he got out of her LOS she could've just sniped the rest of the mooks. 4. Energy weapons are slower and easier to stop, but they're primarily PVE weapons that deal massive damage to NPCs, but at close range they become far more deadly (since most NPCs in GGO are melee-focused). Projectile weapons are the favoured for the faster trajectory and aren't blocked by those energy shields, but note how even Sinon's group mentioned it was a bad idea to get too close to them. Their party was hunting carebears, if you've ever played EVE Online you can compare it to going to blow up some dudes mining or running missions in low-sec. edit: Oh, and the LN would've only been able to cover about 10 episodes tops at a reasonable pace, so yeah they're going to drag this out a lot. HiveCommander fucked around with this message at 05:39 on Jul 14, 2014 |
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Jul 14, 2014 05:34
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I really hope they don't try to stretch GGO out for the full episode run. That would be beyond horrible.
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Jul 14, 2014 05:48
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Since the next arc is shorter I think it makes sense to stretch it a bit.
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Jul 14, 2014 06:14
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The pacing was pretty bad and something's lost without the novel's explanations, but at least the action was kinda interesting, I guess? Sinon grew on me as the arc went on, but I admit she's somewhat poorly represented here. At least she gets more backstory and characterization than "Kirito's so dreamy!", unlike most of the rest of the female cast. The author has been doing explanations over twitter as the show airs, and he specifically talks about how PvE is still main in GGO, even if what we see is mostly PvP, how some top players like the guy in episode 1 have been accused of Pay2Winning it up with real money and the auction house. He also clears up some stuff like loot rules (there's a chance for equipment to drop on death: the guy with the minimi dropped it when he was sniped).
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Jul 14, 2014 10:52
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That was so stupid and melodramatic that I half smiled, half laughed though the first half. Then the Kajiura soundtrack kicked in and I lost it. As someone who really enjoyed the SAO ark of the first season, I think the show has surpassed Fairy Dance levels of stupid in just this one episode. I agree with everyone who's been saying the "tactical combat" was just pretentiousness on the writer's part. Even the canned Rainbow Six Siege demo at E3 felt more legit than this. Why not tell everyone about the minigun (which would have saved that one guy's life)? Why not pick off the energy gun fodder before helping the team take down minigun dude? Why would a sniper ever leave and advantageous sniping location to run right into the fight? I'm starting to think he didn't mess up SAO only because it's hard to mess up stabbing things in spectacular ways.
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Jul 14, 2014 15:13
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ViggyNash posted:That was so stupid and melodramatic that I half smiled, half laughed though the first half. I am not sure who has been lying to you, but I remember GGO being about as tactical as a John Woo movie. In fact that is a good way to think of the game its not a FPS, MMO, RPG, or whatever its a Hollywood action move MMO. The game play is in shooting at people like Rambo and dodging bullets like John Preston(equilibrium). Note it been a long time since I read the GGO books so this is all half remembered. As for why she didn't radio, I think they just did a poor job on giving you a sense of the timing between the two parties. Basically as soon as Sinon fires round one the rest of the PVP team opens up on the PVE group. She misses the 2nd shot, the mini gun guy ditches his cape, and the death of the first PVP guy all happen with in seconds of each other. Then the PVE guys retreat into an industrial park were their are really no good lines of site so Sinon joins the rest of her team.
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Jul 14, 2014 15:54
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Really, if you're playing a game where there's FFA pvp in some places, and there's different weapons suited to pve/pvp, who wouldn't carry a pvp weapon to hotswap to if needed? Unless there's some dumb arbitrary mechanic where you can't change equipment out of safe areas or something.
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Jul 14, 2014 15:59
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Hagop posted:I am not sure who has been lying to you, but I remember GGO being about as tactical as a John Woo movie. In fact that is a good way to think of the game its not a FPS, MMO, RPG, or whatever its a Hollywood action move MMO. The game play is in shooting at people like Rambo and dodging bullets like John Preston(equilibrium). My point is that it feels like the show sometimes feels like it's trying to portray a super legit tactical shooter despite being utterly stupid for 90% of it, but it doesn't feel ridiculous in the same way as a John Woo movie. It managed to find an ugly no-man's-land between the two and ended up just being plain bad and entertaining except in being amused at how bad it was.
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Jul 14, 2014 16:00
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ViggyNash posted:My point is that it feels like the show sometimes feels like it's trying to portray a super legit tactical shooter despite being utterly stupid for 90% of it, but it doesn't feel ridiculous in the same way as a John Woo movie. It managed to find an ugly no-man's-land between the two and ended up just being plain bad and entertaining except in being amused at how bad it was. I think this is just a perspective problem Sinon plays the game like its a life or death kinda thing. Also that PVP group are some hard core, try hard, "oh no my K/Ds", kind players. Blhue posted:Really, if you're playing a game where there's FFA pvp in some places, and there's different weapons suited to pve/pvp, who wouldn't carry a pvp weapon to hotswap to if needed? Unless there's some dumb arbitrary mechanic where you can't change equipment out of safe areas or something. I think its as simple as PVE groups just not wanting sacrifice the weight limit for a second sets of guns and ammo that could be going toward hauling drops.
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Jul 14, 2014 16:20
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Blhue posted:Really, if you're playing a game where there's FFA pvp in some places, and there's different weapons suited to pve/pvp, who wouldn't carry a pvp weapon to hotswap to if needed? Unless there's some dumb arbitrary mechanic where you can't change equipment out of safe areas or something. It's hard to hot swap when you are instantly put in combat by a Sniper sitting way the hell away. They were returning from a PVE encounter of some kind and probably just being careless, read stories about people losing expensive rear end ships in EVE. You are giving your average MMO player too much credit.
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Jul 14, 2014 16:30
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HiveCommander posted:3. Huge plot hole right here, she would've been more useful for her team to keep the sight line trained on Behemoth's head to take his attention away from the approaching group. It's pretty drat hard to evade a sniper whose sight is trained on you while still trying to gun down other foes. Once he got out of her LOS she could've just sniped the rest of the mooks. I hate to nitpick here but lest the term lose all of its meaning, a character making dumb choices isn't a plot hole!!
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Jul 14, 2014 19:13
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People making dumb choices in an anime is in fact plot, rather than plot hole.
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Jul 14, 2014 19:24
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Srice posted:I hate to nitpick here but lest the term lose all of its meaning, a character making dumb choices isn't a plot hole!! It's as much a plot hole as 'why didn't Gandalf summon the great eagles to fly Frodo over to Mt Doom'. The tools for the job were there (great eagles, Sinon's sniper rifle), the characters just didn't make use of what they had at their disposal.Part of the definition of a plot hole involves illogical events, such as the best sniper in GGO deciding to give up a vantage point to try using a sniper rifle at close range.
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Jul 15, 2014 04:31
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Simple answer here: Sinon's a glory hog who cares more about earning kills than supporting her team. The limited characterization of the episode indicates this too.
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Jul 15, 2014 04:43
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Xx_Gun420Gale_xX Something funny I found https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1A5mM9j54zA
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Jul 15, 2014 04:46
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Chillyrabbit posted:Xx_Gun420Gale_xX If you haven't watched episode 2 yet, please just watch this instead. It provides better characterization than the episode itself.
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Jul 15, 2014 06:22
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Chillyrabbit posted:Xx_Gun420Gale_xX Unironically less insufferable than the try-hard rp bullshit we had to deal with in the actual episode.
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Jul 15, 2014 07:37
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brainwrinkle posted:If you haven't watched episode 2 yet, please just watch this instead. It provides better characterization than the episode itself. So I watched the youtube video first and, yeah, infinitely more enjoyable.
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Jul 15, 2014 07:44
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Chillyrabbit posted:Xx_Gun420Gale_xX Not enough dubstep. My immersion. 
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Jul 15, 2014 07:47
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Chillyrabbit posted:Xx_Gun420Gale_xX This is indeed the superior version of episode 2.
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Jul 15, 2014 17:03
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HiveCommander posted:It's as much a plot hole as 'why didn't Gandalf summon the great eagles to fly Frodo over to Mt Doom'. The tools for the job were there (great eagles, Sinon's sniper rifle), the characters just didn't make use of what they had at their disposal.Part of the definition of a plot hole involves illogical events, such as the best sniper in GGO deciding to give up a vantage point to try using a sniper rifle at close range. That example isn't actually a plot hole either!!
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Jul 15, 2014 17:47
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"gently caress yeah snipers are cool, I'm gonna write a character who is an emotionally dead sniper so loving cool" [...] "Turns out killing people from a distance is boring and doesn't lent well to explosive set piece action scenes. Good thing my setting is a zero-stakes game that allows for arbitrary rules and stupid decisions."
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Jul 15, 2014 20:12
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Chillyrabbit posted:Xx_Gun420Gale_xX This is what the American version should be like. As an aside, SAO continues the tradition of being pretty and beautifully animated(Seriously, that was great animation), but being mind-numbingly boring and full of rear end pull Mary Sue poo poo. Which is why I can't wait until Kirito comes in and makes every single player out there his bitch, even though he's only been playing for a total of five minutes. Also, did anyone else get a "OH NOOOO!!! MY K/D RATIOOOOOOOOOOO" from that guy in the cowboy hat? It's a loving game(minus the murders)! This is not SAO. It's not even ALO where people were kept in rape-comas. It's loving Wildstar Online with more anime. (Then again, it probably did capture the EVE setting perfectly. Are there any real downsides to dying in this game?)
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Jul 16, 2014 02:52
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Postal Parcel posted:This is what the American version should be like. My guess is you lose the stuff in your inventory, maybe hanging on to your currently equipped gun, probably something they'll describe next episode while Kirito's getting acquainted. Assuming he even goes in next episode and doesn't spend the entire time arguing with Asuna about his safety. I haven't read the novels, do they get in a spat before he hops into GGO?
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Jul 16, 2014 02:58
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TARDISman posted:My guess is you lose the stuff in your inventory, maybe hanging on to your currently equipped gun, probably something they'll describe next episode while Kirito's getting acquainted. Assuming he even goes in next episode and doesn't spend the entire time arguing with Asuna about his safety. I haven't read the novels, do they get in a spat before he hops into GGO? Of course they don't. That would imply Asuna is capable of doing anything besides reeling with how awesome Kirito is.
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Jul 16, 2014 03:11
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From experience playing MMO that had actual item loot (EQ's Tallon Zek back before patched out and Eve-Online later on) I know for a fact that any poo poo they'll get from Pking is poo poo not worth looting. Nobody goes out dressed to the hilt. The only time this it ever happens is when it's in a super safe environment, like a raid with 40 friends in equal gear status who are super vigilant or the player is so stupidly rich he doesn't give two shits if he dies a hundred times wearing expensive stuff. Popping random dolts wandering around usually yields jack poo poo. I'd go 6 months in EVE before I'd die in a rather expensive ship and never break even though I looted 100s of players in that timeframe. PvP is always a lie 
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Jul 16, 2014 03:57
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TARDISman posted:My guess is you lose the stuff in your inventory, maybe hanging on to your currently equipped gun, probably something they'll describe next episode while Kirito's getting acquainted. Assuming he even goes in next episode and doesn't spend the entire time arguing with Asuna about his safety. I haven't read the novels, do they get in a spat before he hops into GGO? The PK group seemed confident in the reasoning for the repeated success of their plan: that their targets would still end the day with a profit despite the attack, so I doubt the death penalty is that severe. It's probably just a timer or some poo poo (reduced by buying credits!).
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Jul 16, 2014 04:16
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YouTuber posted:PvP is always a lie Back in the ye ol' Ultima Online days you could make bank hunting down players out in the wild, nothing beat the thrill of an unlocked house and slugging the poor occupants with a mace and robbing them blind while their ghosts screamed Oooo's at you various degrees of capitalization. God I need an MMO with proper looting and thieving again. Was anyone else a little disappointed when the mobs in the show ended up generic fantasy monsters instead of ones more fitting the theme like robots, mutants, or aliens. It's like they're not even bothering to make a cohesive game here.
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Jul 16, 2014 11:34
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I seem to remember that dying in general is non-trivial in terms of progression lost and that their is a lowish chance of dropping a few of your equipped items.
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Jul 16, 2014 14:21
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Hagop posted:I seem to remember that dying in general is non-trivial in terms of progression lost and that their is a lowish chance of dropping a few of your equipped items. Yeah, I even think at one point *Novel Spoilers* the green haired chick says to Kirito it's not a big deal at all to just die and respawn. Kirito freaks on her, saying as long as he can lift a sword he'll never let anyone of his friends die. Dude is carrying some baggage from his SAO days, especially with the first girl from the panther group (whatever their names were).
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Jul 16, 2014 17:46
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Chillyrabbit posted:Xx_Gun420Gale_xX That exact thing was what I was most looking forward to this season.
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Jul 16, 2014 21:03
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To be fair, virtual reality would probably make an FPS game pretty goddamn intense, especially when it's at the level of the Amusphere. I don't remember if you can actually feel pain through it or not, but it makes sense that getting shot and killed would be pretty intense given the setting. and honestly if I was playing a virtual reality MMO i'd be completely into that poo poo at all times, screaming battlecries and whatever given the slightest reason
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Jul 17, 2014 00:24
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klapman posted:To be fair, virtual reality would probably make an FPS game pretty goddamn intense, especially when it's at the level of the Amusphere. I don't remember if you can actually feel pain through it or not, but it makes sense that getting shot and killed would be pretty intense given the setting. That said, if you play this like you'd play any other MMO, you'd get used to that pretty quickly. Anyone who can grind for hours on end to find a magic mushroom or something and not give a gently caress probably wouldn't care much about a little artificial pain.
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Jul 17, 2014 00:46
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klapman posted:screaming battlecries and whatever given the slightest reason Just play Chivalry.
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Jul 17, 2014 08:13
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