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Hedera Helix posted:I just hope that the kids don't have to go through the same things their parents did. That's the entire point of the ending. In the end, it doesn't matter whether or not punpun is happy or finds his way or kills himself or whatever, because every day new kids are born and every day the world still doesn't care, and every day humans make the same mistakes over and over and over. Eeryone has their own journey and has to figure out happiness for themselves, and though we've seen what it took for Punpun, in the end his story is insignificant because it's just like any other. Al-Saqr posted:amazing series, quick question though because I'm confused:- Punpun is the guy in the striped shirt (more parallels to Asano himself? He always seems to manifest in a striped shirt) that you never fully see all of during that final conversation, and the last time Harumi and the audience see him is back to his childlike bird self looking melancholic and waving. Another aspect of the cyclical nature of the story being told.
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Nov 6, 2013 16:44
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Man I'm not sentimental at all about media but I nearly lost it at "that scene". Some years ago I made a long and arduous journey by bike to that island with the spaceport that Punpun and Aiko went to, I liked how much the illustrations looked like the real place, it conveyed exactly the atmosphere that was there. I was also kinda depressed when I was there so it struck pretty close to home in a weird way. dazat posted:Who/what do you think Punpun's God was, in the end? What did it symbolize when he 'killed' him? And how do you feel all that stuff with the cult contributed to the narrative? I think Punpun's God is supposed to be a manifestation of his Freudian death drive. Throughout the story Punpun struggles with some kind of pathology triggered by his awakening sexuality upon meeting Aiko. From the point he met her he in some sense wanted to be destroyed by his own love. The point where he kills him is when he finally shakes this complex and simply says farewell to his childhood dreams. The central theme of the story is something like "change hurts".
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Nov 6, 2013 22:29
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Sometimes existential nihilism is the happiest thing you can hope for. The ultimate meaninglessness of Punpun's madness is a freedom for him to become ordinary and a confirmation that life goes on, even after death. Goodnight and good luck, Punpun; the world turns with and without you.
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Nov 7, 2013 04:28
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dazat posted:I felt like they kind of glossed over the culmination of the case with Aiko and her mom. Punpun says he got probated, but how long was he in jail? What did they charge him with? Well, the murder was in self-defense. The "worst" things he'd done, in the eyes of the law at least, were probably evading arrest and neglecting to take Aiko to a hospital.
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Nov 7, 2013 06:24
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Silentman0 posted:Well, the murder was in self-defense. The "worst" things he'd done, in the eyes of the law at least, were probably evading arrest and neglecting to take Aiko to a hospital. He bashed her on the head repeatedly before strangling her, and then Aiko stabbed her body repeatedly; I don't think that would hold up as self-defense very well. Manslaughter, maybe. Running off with the victim's daughter only for her to wind up dead as well doesn't make him look good either... but I guess it doesn't matter. Punpun has been surrealistic from the start so there's probably no point in dwelling on the details. Re-reading the last few volumes since finishing and it just makes me sadder and sadder for Aiko, though. Her life was hell, even worse than Punpun's, and the way things spiral out of control for her right when she thought she was going to be able to escape her monster of a mother is so depressing. I'm really glad Punpun found some measure of peace in the end, and was surrounded by people who cared about him, flawed as they were... but it just reinforced to me how Aiko never even had that and now, she never will. Poor Aiko. Edit: I forgot how much of a bastard Punpun acted toward her, too, like dragging her away from the Tanabata exhibit and crumpling up the paper with her dream on it. 
dazat fucked around with this message at 07:36 on Nov 7, 2013 |
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Nov 7, 2013 07:19
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Paper Lion posted:That's the entire point of the ending. In the end, it doesn't matter whether or not punpun is happy or finds his way or kills himself or whatever, because every day new kids are born and every day the world still doesn't care, and every day humans make the same mistakes over and over and over. Eeryone has their own journey and has to figure out happiness for themselves, and though we've seen what it took for Punpun, in the end his story is insignificant because it's just like any other. No I don't agree with this, the point is not the common wisdom of "finding happiness". If it were, it would be a boring rehash of common self help books and stupid life wisdoms. In the end Punpun doesn't exactly find happiness anyway, more like a kind of emboldened resignation to the fact that life is poo poo, that our own dreams deceive us and that all we have is each other. If he'd found happiness I would have been sorely disappointed. The ending relates to the idea of eternal recurrence. We are all at some point disconnected from the Real through our fall into the imaginary and symbolic order - this happens to Punpun progressively through meeting Aiko and other things as well, the whole first half of the story describes this fall from the world of immediate needs of childhood into the world of drives. Aiko is the source of Punpun's death drive and vice versa, the "God" is a kind of Big Other who encourages their excessive pleasure. I'm not sure if I actually like the solution since Aiko essentially sacrifices herself for Punpun since she realizes that all they want is to destroy each other, wasn't there some other way to solve the problem other than that route? It's an extremely pessimistic ending which reminded me a lot of Mishima for instance, with Mishima the lovers usually (but not always, as in Shiosai) destroy each other. In the end the symbolic order is not changed, it merely passes through an apparent "crisis" and reforms. The difference is that Punpun destroyed the part within himself that tied him to it and might be ready to resist, the ending with his group of friends is a bit like a bunch of ideal Zizekian proletarians, a "community of believers united by love". Punpun's shapeshifting is usually said to be due to selfperception but I think it relates more to the fact that he is a "bare subject" deprived of agency. He has no real control over the world and his "soul" (his appearance) is determined entirely by outside forces. He has no identity of his own, which is why he has a silly name too. You can really only understandably read Oyasumi Punpun through Lacan. Shibawanko fucked around with this message at 13:59 on Nov 7, 2013 |
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Nov 7, 2013 13:21
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I'm bummed we never got to see his face in the end, but I guess that would have been too easy.
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Nov 7, 2013 14:08
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So is this ever going to be licensed and printed in English? I'm surprised Vertical hasn't snapped it up, it's exactly in their wheelhouse.
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Nov 7, 2013 21:26
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SALT CURES HAM posted:So is this ever going to be licensed and printed in English? I'm surprised Vertical hasn't snapped it up, it's exactly in their wheelhouse. I think it's a little long for their tastes. You may notice a good deal of the books they bring out are either one-shots or less than 5 volumes. Printing books is really pricy and each installment tends to sell less than the one before it, plus the whole thing is on the internet already so the only people buying it would probably die-hard fans like you or I. It's a shame though, I'd love to own a version in English!
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Nov 7, 2013 23:44
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Shibawanko posted:You can really only understandably read Oyasumi Punpun through Lacan. Zizek account spotted.
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Nov 7, 2013 23:47
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SALT CURES HAM posted:So is this ever going to be licensed and printed in English? I'm surprised Vertical hasn't snapped it up, it's exactly in their wheelhouse. If it get published stateside it would be by Viz since it's a Shogakukan title. They have published stuff by Asono before so they just might.
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Nov 8, 2013 00:11
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I can't believe how long I've been following this. I was a bit down in my first year of uni and read Solanin and what a wonderful world. The whole Bitter-sweet hopeful youth thing was like crack to me at that point, and I started reading Pun Pun hoping for more of the same. Jesus christ I was wrong. If it ever is brought out in the west I will definitely buy it. Although I think its got a very limited audience.
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Nov 8, 2013 13:25
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For one, PunPun had a more sympathetic male lead than Solanin.
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Nov 8, 2013 21:07
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Kunster posted:For one, PunPun had a more sympathetic male lead than Solanin. I dunno, while punpun was a really really effective story, Solanin and the characters in it was much more relatable to a lost twenty-something with no clue how to live their lives and are stuck being 'average'.
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Nov 9, 2013 00:21
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Hence why I said "sympathetic male lead". I liked everyone else on Solanin, while desiring to shoot the male lead right into the Sun. I mean I cringed a lot more during PunPun, but didn't exactly wanted PunPun to perish, no matter how dark his story went.
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Nov 9, 2013 15:59
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Honestly, if Punpun got printed in America, its audience wouldn't be THAT limited because it would have a lot of crossover appeal with people who don't ordinarily read manga. It's basically literary fiction that just happens to be in comic format, and if they treated it well and gave it enough exposure it would be a pretty sure seller.
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Nov 9, 2013 20:07
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SALT CURES HAM posted:Honestly, if Punpun got printed in America, its audience wouldn't be THAT limited because it would have a lot of crossover appeal with people who don't ordinarily read manga. It's basically literary fiction that just happens to be in comic format, and if they treated it well and gave it enough exposure it would be a pretty sure seller. I'd love to recommend Punpun to some of my more bookish friends but they'd take one look at it and go "ugh manga". Most people are like that I think. It was translated into Italian though I think. Which is weird.
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Nov 9, 2013 21:19
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It's the kind of Manga my local comic shop would push like hell. They've spent the last decade or so working to legitimise graphic novels in the eyes of the public, it's really worked here. They love it when they get to showcase manga beyond pulp shonen crap.
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Nov 9, 2013 22:14
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Shibawanko posted:I'd love to recommend Punpun to some of my more bookish friends but they'd take one look at it and go "ugh manga". Most people are like that I think. Why would that be weird? Manga is much better regarded in Italy, France, etc. than it is in the US. Edit: Goodnight PunPun! trucutru fucked around with this message at 03:57 on Nov 11, 2013 |
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Nov 11, 2013 03:48
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Was piqued by the sticky, marathoned chapter 1-92. I am pretty sure this is the single most devastating work I have ever read. It's absolutely sublime, but I experience the opposite of enjoyment reading it. Plus, I've got a sneaking suspicion it's all going to get even worse and Punpun is gonna end up reenacting the taped over porno in the end. Does everything else this woman writes make you want to kill yourself? Geez
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Nov 13, 2013 08:06
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A big flaming stink posted:Was piqued by the sticky, marathoned chapter 1-92. This is definitely Asano's most depressing work. You should def check out Asano's Solanin(arguable her most famous work) or What A Wonderful World! Both have been official released in English before anyone says anything, Asano identifies as a her now. EDIT: In other news, did anyone ever translate that one shot Asano released last month? Zackcat fucked around with this message at 21:14 on Nov 13, 2013 |
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Nov 13, 2013 20:53
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Good ending to a series that had some spectacular moments, I felt like some things fell through the cracks at the end (In particular it felt like the lovers cult resolved in a really weak way despite all the build-up time they got?) but this series had some amazing chapters.
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Nov 17, 2013 01:53
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TheresNoThyme posted:Good ending to a series that had some spectacular moments, I felt like some things fell through the cracks at the end (In particular it felt like the lovers cult resolved in a really weak way despite all the build-up time they got?) but this series had some amazing chapters. Yeah, I feel like it fell apart towards the end somewhat but I'm really interested in what Asano's doing next.
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Nov 18, 2013 14:53
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Wait...was the leader of the lover's cult related to Aiko? I'm flashing back to a chapter involving the cult leader's brother that may or may not have pointed to this.
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Nov 19, 2013 07:53
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Professor Latency posted:http://blackinque.imgur.com/ Here is everything translated. Can't sit here and watch y'all suffer. This was the first manga I've read all the way through. I think I picked a good one 
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Nov 29, 2013 22:14
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Mrs. Asano hinted at a future comic of hers being about transgender stuffs. From that article, I assume it would be preferable to refer to the comicbooker as a she from now on.
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Dec 5, 2013 00:41
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I'm going to assume it's better to call the manga writer Inio Asano
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Dec 5, 2013 01:19
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I'm really excited about Inio Asano's interest in writing a transgender manga. From what I've seen, Hourou Musuko is just about the only manga out there right now that even acknowledges transgender characters as people and not as "traps." She could write something really new, important, and incredible.
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Dec 5, 2013 17:15
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I just marathoned all of Punpun after seeing the thread stickied a while back. That... sure was an interesting experience. A bittersweet ending was still better than I was expecting. As for the cult I got the impression that the general end of the world thing wasn't really about the end of the world, but the end of Pegasus' world. Seems to line up well, since it looked like he merely predicted his own death, and that of the rest of the Good Vibrations cult too. Can't wait to see what Asano's next manga is like. If nothing else, it's all but guaranteed to be generally happier than this one was. 
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Dec 24, 2013 00:08
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It is going to be about transgender issues. It will probably be at least as depressing as punpun.
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Dec 24, 2013 15:44
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Hox scanlated the final volume for anyone who was waiting for it. Read his thoughts about it here; http://hoxtranslations.blogspot.com.au/2014/01/good-bye-punpun.html
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Jan 30, 2014 23:11
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Finally got around to finishing punpun and I think I'll just pretend that it ended after volume 10, because nothing after that makes any god drat sense.
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Jan 31, 2014 05:25
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Read Solanin on a whim and loved it. I just noticed on Amazon that Nijigahara Photograph is getting a US publication and will be hardcover too, and well I'm a sucker for hardcover compilations. I know that it's extremely different from Solanin, so would I like it if I liked Solanin that much and wanted to get into his other stuff? I'm into weird/horrory stuff but I never read manga (unless its Jojos), I just watch anime if I want that stuff usually. Solanin kinda really made me appreciate manga much more as a whole though. I feel like Punpun would be more up my alley because it seems absolutely insane but it'll be a ways off until it gets an official publication I feel. http://www.amazon.com/Nijigahara-Holograph-Inio-Asano/dp/1606995839/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1392595719&sr=1-1
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Feb 17, 2014 01:20
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Cromlech posted:Read Solanin on a whim and loved it. I just noticed on Amazon that Nijigahara Photograph is getting a US publication and will be hardcover too, and well I'm a sucker for hardcover compilations. I know that it's extremely different from Solanin, so would I like it if I liked Solanin that much and wanted to get into his other stuff? I'm into weird/horrory stuff but I never read manga (unless its Jojos), I just watch anime if I want that stuff usually. Solanin, from what I remember of it (I think it was the second or third Asano piece I read, waaay back when I first discovered Punpun- so five or more years ago), was relatively upbeat and straightforward, with no fantasy elements. Nijigahara Holograph* is pretty much right at the other end of Asano's spectrum- it's relentlessly bleak, trending into despairing, and the narrative is dense and highly nonlinear, if not flat out byzantine. It's also something of a magical realist piece. I think it asks the reader to do a lot more work than anything else Asano's ever written- you have to read it very carefully, and probably more than once. This is the page I usually use to plug it in one page threads,  because I think it captures a lot of the essence of the manga without spoiling much (not that any page could spoil this manga, really- it's hard to pick out the significance of anything in context). So, if the vibe you get off of that image appeals to you, I think the manga will too. *It is Holograph, not Photograph, and I think it's actually kind of important, in that it's (or, I think it is, at least) a clue to how to read the story. One of the interesting properties of a holograph is that you can cut one up into an arbitrary number of pieces and each piece will contain a complete copy of the original image- from a slightly different perspective. Which reflects the structure of the manga: a hundred different fragmentary interludes, each of which reflects the complete story. Oh, and I don't know if you know this, but they shot a film version of Solanin in 2010. Might be worth checking out?
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Feb 17, 2014 02:19
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Whoops! I kinda wrote that post in a rush, I feel silly now. I dig that panel though so I think I'll go ahead and preorder it. I like the idea of it being a challenge of sorts. I heard about the live action Solanin; perhaps someday I'll give it a shot. For some reason live action adaptations of manga/anime seem too "stilted" for me but I'm sure that's just on a per-film basis, really..
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Feb 17, 2014 02:33
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Aag March! I totally thought it was coming out in February, at least it's a short month I guess. I'm curious to see how I feel about Nijigahara Holograph, I loved Solanin, but haven't read too much of his other work because it seemed way to bleak for me to deal with. Sooner or later that feeling will change and I'll finish Punpun. Regardless I have Nijigahara Holograph on pre-order, so we'll see how I feel about it next month.
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Feb 17, 2014 02:52
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Double postin' because:  Regarding Asano's gender identity, there was apparently something of an edit war about it on Wiki, and finally Fantagraphics' translator for both Nijigahara Holograph and Wandering Son just decided to ask: quote:So ask him I did, this time very publicly, rather than through an intermediary using e-mail. And here is his response. There's a whole hell of a lot more about it at Thorn's blog, including the interview that started the whole thing, which anyone who's interested in can find on his site here and entries both before and after that one.
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Mar 6, 2014 04:30
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I ran into this capsule machine today, right across from a children's play area at a food court.
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Mar 6, 2014 07:44
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Just read Nijigahara Holograph. That book is absolutely filthy and ridiculously bleak but I'm pretty sure I loved the poo poo out of it. I'm going to have to read it two more times to completely wrap my head around it but christ was I impressed. All this stuff I've been reading about Punpun REALLY makes me want an English publication of it something fierce. Are there any other Manga authors that have a writing style similar to Asano's? I liked the horror displayed in this story but I also like the bleakness that is in every one of his other works I've read.
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Mar 6, 2014 20:33
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Chococat posted:I ran into this capsule machine today, right across from a children's play area at a food court. Please buy me toys and let me paypal you. I'll paypal you before you even go to get the punpuns.
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Mar 7, 2014 22:05
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