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If the rules of that game were "you can't leave turtle" then what's the point? It feels like a guard passing drill where person on bottom isn't allowed to go for sweeps or submissions. If you're not allowed to do anything other than hold your legs rigid, then there are probably a lot of guard passes that work suspiciously well. I go to turtle a lot. I'm fat and it lets me catch my breath. I alternate between being tight to rest and moving about to try to reverse position. I've got a handful of things I do from there that work well for me. The majority of the time I turtle I either reverse position or re-guard. Yes I'm vulnerable there but for me it's safer than side control bottom so if someone passes my guard turtling is often something I'll do.
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Mar 9, 2024 05:10
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If you want to have some fun see how often you can get to turtle from bottom of whatever position after being passed. It’s more often than you’d think.
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Mar 9, 2024 05:15
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I'd probably get more use out of turtle in a BJJ gym. As it is, a good 80% of what we drill on the ground is attacking turtle so it just kind of seems like you're giving judokas an opportunity to do what they're best at.
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Mar 9, 2024 05:20
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Hellblazer187 posted:If the rules of that game were "you can't leave turtle" then what's the point? It feels like a guard passing drill where person on bottom isn't allowed to go for sweeps or submissions. If you're not allowed to do anything other than hold your legs rigid, then there are probably a lot of guard passes that work suspiciously well. I think it was more about the top person; we'd been learning turtle attacks, not turtle escapes. So it would be like we learned how to pass the guard and then played positional rolling where the bottom person just wants to keep the guard. But, tellingly, I found the best plan when on the bottom was to skirt the edge of the rules and do a lot of shifting, leaning, shuffling, and little movements to keep adjusting the turtle. Neon Belly posted:If you want to have some fun see how often you can get to turtle from bottom of whatever position after being passed. It’s more often than you’d think. Unrelated to this class on turtle attacks, this is something the gym owner has been stressing after the last tournament. To go to turtle (and then stand up/scramble) more often when the guard is passed, and especially top turn into turtle before the guard is fully passed.
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Mar 9, 2024 05:27
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My judo has me feeling pretty safe in turtle, so I go there whenever I can, and from turtle it's really easy to stand up or improve position if you're active about it.
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Mar 9, 2024 06:26
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Jack B Nimble posted:Someone please reality check top turtle for me. I play a lot of turtle and feel pretty comfortable there against most people, but I train occasionally with a smaller black belt lady who absolutely shuts me down from there with the exact grips you're describing. If I try to stand up, she takes my back immediately, and turning in either direction feels impossible because of the grips even with a significant size advantage. I do think that those are especially powerful grips in general for a variety of reasons, not least of which is that they're basically impossible to break--you have to put your arms in a compromised americana/kimura position to even begin dealing with either one, AKA the weakest points in their entire range of motion.
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Mar 9, 2024 16:38
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Jack B Nimble posted:Someone please reality check top turtle for me. When I was working close to Eduardo Telles gym I got a short membership to drop in at lunch and learn about turtle. I learned a few things while there (just my short experience): 1. Turtle is a transitional position that is underutilized as a "weak" position by most of the jiu jitsu community. 2. Its a quick transitional positional, but arent most guards supposed to be that way?? 3. Trapping a far side arm and off balancing is HIGHLY effective since a lot of people like to grab under. I use this in my own game fairly often. Works really well against people that are a little lighter than you and if timed right, pretty well against bigger people. There are a ton of shoulder and arm lock submissions when they give you that arm. Looks up Telles' submissions from turtle for example. 4. When they are in front of you trap a leg and use it to dump them on their side, when they extend the leg, recover back to an open guard/close guard position. 5. When they are behind you and a leg is between yours, roll through to recover back to guard or initiate a scramble. If you want to just have someone back on their back from the turtle position, reach through their legs, grab their belt (not their dick!) and flip them. Believe me, this works even on big dudes. First time I showed this in my gym, the guys were amazed how well it works. Learned that one from Sylvio Behring. Tacos Al Pastor fucked around with this message at 20:31 on Mar 9, 2024 |
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Mar 9, 2024 20:26
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the turtle game is basically just wrestling and a lot of bjj guys break out in hives if they have to wrestle so it's not very popular
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Mar 9, 2024 20:39
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Mechafunkzilla posted:the turtle game is basically just wrestling and a lot of bjj guys break out in hives if they have to wrestle so it's not very popular
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Mar 9, 2024 20:47
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Mechafunkzilla posted:the turtle game is basically just wrestling and a lot of bjj guys break out in hives if they have to wrestle so it's not very popular True, a lot of sitting out, peaking out, etc that type of stuff. Its all hip movement, but while someone is on top of you, so yeah not too popular.
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Mar 9, 2024 20:49
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If all you're doing is "defending" then you're giving your opponent the opportunity to beat you, in any position. At all times you need to be trying to get to a position where you're actually controlling the other player.
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Mar 10, 2024 03:24
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starkebn posted:If all you're doing is "defending" then you're giving your opponent the opportunity to beat you, in any position. At all times you need to be trying to get to a position where you're actually controlling the other player. This is one of those things that clicked with me recently that really changed the way I play. Making moves to get reactions to capitalise on rather than waiting for the ideal moment to hit the perfect technique (which never comes). Went to an open mat on Saturday and rolled with a heap of other coloured belts I've never met before with lots of standing starts. Managed to make a lot of my game work which was a relief. One of the big things I want to work on is passing knee shield type guards especially in no gi; I had a tricky time finding something that could consistently get me to chest-to-chest
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Mar 10, 2024 12:59
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Ever since "just stand up" became the mantra of a decent sized minority of our gym, people have gotten much better at attacking and defending the turtle. At least in the sense of being active on bottom and attacking posture from the top. Half the time my turtle "escape" is F-ing up and giving back control but then just escaping from there... But it's still fun to pretend I can wrestle.
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Mar 11, 2024 00:48
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CommonShore posted:My judo has me feeling pretty safe in turtle, looking at the referee and going "ref, ref, they're not working"?
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Mar 11, 2024 08:36
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Green Toad posted:looking at the referee and going "ref, ref, they're not working"? Did you know if youre strong enough to deadlift your opponent and your opponent bails to turtle you can lift and dump them for ippon or wazari if you havent also gone to the ground? My judo club didnt until I got there.
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Mar 11, 2024 15:58
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There was a big throw going viral on social media a while back, doing exactly that, and iirc tori didn't actually get a score. But he did win later in the match. Edit: found it! https://www.instagram.com/reel/C3YMSNnvvOn/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link
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Mar 11, 2024 16:44
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Green Toad posted:looking at the referee and going "ref, ref, they're not working"? you should try turning over a judoka with competitive experience from turtle sometime. Really what I often do is sit there until they give me a makikomi, a single leg, a half guard pull, or a backdoor escape. If they try just to flip me over I roll into a butterfly guard. If you're confident in your turtle defense, you can often simply stand up - that's actually what The Black Beast and Gastelum do for their Just Stand Up: go to turtle, stand the gently caress up.
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Mar 11, 2024 17:13
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Hellblazer187 posted:There was a big throw going viral on social media a while back, doing exactly that, and iirc tori didn't actually get a score. But he did win later in the match. Hmmmm they must have given it no score because of how he adjusted his grips, and they must have declared that was a transition to ne waza - the same throw but from the grips that tori had before uke's attempt probably would have scored. I'll ask my national B ref friend. E. a medium level ref says posted:Looks like the ref scored it and the table waved it off. I'd say there was too long lifting blue into the air. It wasn't immediate. CommonShore fucked around with this message at 17:22 on Mar 11, 2024 |
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Mar 11, 2024 17:17
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I really like how Judo has a ref and a table of two and rulings are with that majority.
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Mar 11, 2024 17:33
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Jack B Nimble posted:I really like how Judo has a ref and a table of two and rulings are with that majority. I think that system is great but unfortunately that system is in flux. The last tournament I reffed had a version where it was ref on mat + higher-ranking mat chief with video review where the mat chief can unilaterially overrule the on-mat ref, but that might just be because we don't have as many refs available as we'd like in our area, and that way the refs get longer breaks. Not sure if they're making that change at the international level e. Confirmed that they made that change at the international level. CommonShore fucked around with this message at 18:13 on Mar 11, 2024 |
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Mar 11, 2024 17:42
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Defenestrategy posted:Did you know if youre strong enough to deadlift your opponent and your opponent bails to turtle you can lift and dump them for ippon or wazari if you havent also gone to the ground? My judo club didnt until I got there. My favorite "just deadlift them" move is the suitcase/ball-and-chain armbar, not because I'm any good at it, just because of how ridiculous it is. One of my coaches isn't a weak guy by any means, but it still feels comical to get picked up so casually. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iWIiQesHEG4
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Mar 11, 2024 19:31
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CommonShore posted:you should try turning over a judoka with competitive experience from turtle sometime. Turtle is an incredibly weak position when someone is all balled up and doesnt have some sort of grip on you and its relatively easy to at least get them on their side if not their back. Going back to the Telles example, once people were onto his game it was relatively easy to counter, and its the reason why you dont see a lot of high level IBJJF players really going to turtle anymore.
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Mar 12, 2024 16:25
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CommonShore posted:you should try turning over a judoka with competitive experience from turtle sometime. I'll just steal the technique the Georgian judokas do: deadlift them and slam them down
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Mar 13, 2024 03:56
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I did not even know this was a thing (double kneebar) until I got into this position last night and tapped someone with it. It does come on very quickly, although Im still not sure why. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XhaAizhILpw
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Mar 13, 2024 16:20
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Tacos Al Pastor posted:I did not even know this was a thing (double kneebar) until I got into this position last night and tapped someone with it. It does come on very quickly, although Im still not sure why. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OD7EOCZLjm0 I utilize it fairly rarely when I'm feeling spry. Paulson calls it the morning news paper, exact same setup as in this video, you just kick over both legs.
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Mar 13, 2024 17:00
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Haha thats a good name for it.
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Mar 13, 2024 18:56
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What's a good timeline for going back to rolling with a newborn. I am so germ phobic and didn't think about it really in the lead up but I've been sitting out for two months now and I'm gonna be a fat useless purple with a target
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Mar 13, 2024 19:16
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Live my life for me combat goons
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Mar 13, 2024 19:16
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probably wait until they're at least 6 months before submitting them
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Mar 13, 2024 19:17
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I don't have a child myself, but google suggests that at six weeks it's both safe for your child to go to day care also safe for you to take them to crowded places like malls. Much less commonly I'm seeing a more conservative estimate of 9 weeks. Since you're mostly talking about introducing the child to that kind of public space (by proxy), that seems like a reasonable yard stick? But really, the pediatrician could answer this question, I'd think? Finding regular time to go to BJJ sounds like a good way to both claw back some personal time and also ensure that you use it as you intended; the forced removal from smart phones etc isn't a benefit I'd considered but it's probably a major plus for some.
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Mar 13, 2024 19:24
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I'm a bit of a dummy I mean from me getting sick from someone and bringing it home lol. I'll ask the doctor which I should have done last week but we're weirdos and have basically just isolated Really need to get back at something physical to get rid of the baby weight
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Mar 13, 2024 19:58
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After we had our kid I was back training within a week. My understanding is that you're supposed to avoid taking kids out and about into general public too early is because they haven't gotten routine vaccines and immunizations, and assuming you have it's not like you're going to be bringing home measles to them because you're immune. On the other hand kids are born with functioning immune systems that can handle day to day stuff like colds, and ideally you don't have training partners who are training when sick anyways, but even if you did something like that's going to be way lower risk to a kid if they picked it up than whooping cough or some poo poo.
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Mar 13, 2024 20:29
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No I mean, that's what I was getting at; if it's safe to take your kid to the mall, or to daycare (both places they can be exposed to sick people) then it's also safe for you to go some place you could get sick and then return home.
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Mar 13, 2024 20:42
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I think you're more limited by supporting your partner and baby logistically than disease exposure. I went back ~a month after both of mine were born but I was doing the minimum number of classes and intensity for probably 6 months or so. Really only got back to full speed about 2 years after my oldest was born. However my wife and I have no family nearby so if you have a better setup, significantly easier. Fwiw I think it's worth it to back off jiu jitsu to be there in the early days. And if you're sleep deprived your retention and recovery are such poo poo it's sort of wasted anyway.
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Mar 13, 2024 21:12
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I took off until my kid could get a Covid vax. There’s a large gap in intimacy with people in a bjj class versus say a mall or grocery store.
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Mar 14, 2024 00:34
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I took about 12 years off when my first kid was born
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Mar 14, 2024 01:12
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It's hilarious to worry about getting kids sick when I have gotten sick from teaching kids class almost twice a month for the past year.
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Mar 14, 2024 07:22
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heeebrew posted:It's hilarious to worry about getting kids sick when I have gotten sick from teaching kids class almost twice a month for the past year. I feel this.. I work as a school custodian and if I'm not skipping training because I have some sorta insane illness from working near kids I skip training cause I pull something insanely hard from having to roll and then go to my job where I walk 6 miles and lift poo poo for 8 hours a day 😅.
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Mar 14, 2024 08:59
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Xguard86 posted:I think you're more limited by supporting your partner and baby logistically than disease exposure. This. Make sure you're washing everything right after a session and the baby will be good. heeebrew posted:It's hilarious to worry about getting kids sick when I have gotten sick from teaching kids class almost twice a month for the past year. It doesnt end when you have kids either. My daughters whole wrestling team had Noravirus last week and guess who had the fun of enjoying it with them?
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Mar 14, 2024 13:06
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The annoying part is when a kid shrugs off whatever they brought home but it knocks you out for a week+.
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Mar 14, 2024 15:07
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