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LateToTheParty posted:End of Evangelion and the Audience Author Membrane: http://blip.tv/foldablehuman/s3e2-end-of-evangelion-and-the-audience-author-membrane-6540094 This is one of the best summations of the themes in the series I've ever seen. Wow, thanks for sharing.
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Apr 21, 2013 22:56
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After watching EoE, I disagree with puppet guy's assessment that the ending of the movie is supposed to be a condemnation of Shinji as a total failure of a human being. Shinji goes from catatonic depression to turning down paradise, and that's a hell of a step in the right direction. I think what people don't understand is that his rejection of Instrumentality doesn't mean his depression vanished instantly and he was chipper for all time, but that from then on he would make an honest-to-god commitment to being happier. So here's Shinji lazing around on the LCL beach with nothing but his thoughts to occupy him (judging by how visibly aged Misato's cross looks, it's been some time), and suddenly he turns and sees the one girl that's pushed his neurotic buttons the most. He's still so caught him in his mental drama the first thing he does is strangle her but when he feels Asuka gently caress his cheek, he realizes that love is possible in even the most terrifying places. And then the dam breaks and he breaks down crying. I think Ano was trying to say to man the gently caress up and to not let depression rule you, but to also understand that like every great undertaking in life, it's a long, arduous process.
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Apr 25, 2013 15:40
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House Louse posted:The puppet's argument was that Shinji turned down Instrumentality for the wrong reasons, which I hadn't thought of before. Interesting idea but I want to rewatch EoE before deciding, and anyway, wouldn't a better Bad End be accepting Instrumentality? Also a better example of giving the fans what they want and then showing them why it's so awful, which he already did with in episode 26 anyway. Well, I watched the Japanese version of EoE, which puppet guy says characterizes Shinji as more childish and spiteful compared to the English dub, and I didn't get the impression that Shinji was trying to stick it to humanity at all. Shinji's entire life has been defined by his constant need to run away, and when he is presented with the option of the ultimate escape - returning to the Source/Absolute/whatever - he turns it down. Not because he wants everyone to suffer with him, but because he realizes it doesn't solve the human condition, it just sweeps it under the rug for an entirely different mode of existence. He understands that the only way to make peace with reality is not to transcend it, but to live with the cards you're dealt with. He even says something to the effect of "this doesn't feel right, this feels wrong somehow" during the gigantic clusterfuck that is the second half of EoE. I didn't read spite or hatred in his lines at all. I still agree with everything else the guys says, he's just confusing Ano's (really) tough love with maliciousness.
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Apr 27, 2013 01:00
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notZaar posted:Nothing in this movie made any god drat sense and the writing was atrocious besides. And there weren't nearly enough action sequences to make up for this kind of wanking. Man, and I really liked what they were doing with the first two movies too. Pretty much this. Watched the movie twice and I still don't have a goddamn clue what happened. And the technobabble, ugh.
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Apr 30, 2013 01:28
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abraxas posted:I even sat down and watched all 3 Rebuilds in succession after my last post in here that had like a million questions and all it did was confuse me some more Nope, sounds about right to me 
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May 7, 2013 17:07
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Humans don't have cores because they are the ultimate product of the Fruit of Knowledge evolutionary cycle. Where Angels have S2 engines, humans have brains. Combine the two, like Unit 01 does when it eats Zeruel's core, and you become God. 
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May 8, 2013 01:40
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bof_man posted:To add to this, I always saw Kaworu as some sort of Saint/Buddha. This is why he's always depicted with a smile : it's the Buddha smile. It's the smile of someone who has reached enlightement, is offering enlightement, is above the fray, can't loose, and is always serene whatever happens. It's also mocking in a way. It's really striking in the original anime. Hah, I really like this because it says a lot about the nature of Adam's angels compared to humans. Adam's angels appear to be singular, self-contained entities, the sole member of their species, and so don't appear as prone to the psychological foibles of humanity*. Since Adam is the progenitor of these beings, it makes sense he is depicted a Buddha/Saint-figure, completely independent and detached. After all, he doesn't even give that much of a poo poo about triggering Third Impact. Lilith, though, from what we can glean of her nature through Rei, is an aloof but confused being that feels a bond with all things but struggles to express it. It's touching and sort of beautiful, in a way, that the mother of humanity takes a special liking to a particularly damaged member of it (Shinji). *Except for that weird double helix angel that tries to merge with others to alleviate its loneliness. I guess existential loneliness is what unites the two species together.
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May 16, 2013 23:35
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MadRhetoric posted:Armisael, Arael, Kaworu and Leliel all could be seen as the Angels attempting to understand the Lilim. Straightforward destruction didn't work so good for anyone but Zeruel, but the attempts to understand, to connect and intermingle, do the most damage. Remember, Leilel is the first Angel we get the weird colors and drugs sequences with, as well as the first one to really shake Asuka and Misato. Arael and Armisael are obvious, and Kaworu breaks Shinji's heart and/or will to live (although Misato helps. It's funny how even the Angels, godlike as they are, are supremely lonely beings interested in only returning to their own Source (Third Impact) or understanding their diminutive cousins (their clumsy attempts at communication with humanity). Power is no substitute for love, a platitude we also see illustrated in Gendo, who could probably have taken over the world ten times over with NERV's Evas but still only wants to be reunited with his wife. And Eva is the only franchise I was introduced to at 12, and still love, nay, appreciate more ten years later. loving Anno, man.
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May 17, 2013 03:49
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I disagree with Riddle of Feel's assessment that the final scene in EoE is symbolic of the post-Cold War generation inheriting a dying planet. It's a very interesting take on the series and I don't disagree with his conclusions, but I don't think Anno purposely set out to create such a nihilistic portrait of modern life. Bleak, depressing, painful, definitely, but ultimately meaningless and futile? Ehh, that's a little too grimdark for my tastes. Yui's speech at the end of EoE isn't some incoherent spiel about love and rainbows; she's very lucidly saying that as long as you're alive, you don't know what tomorrow will bring. You can continue to wallow in your self-imposed narrative of isolation and abandonment, or you can be open to the near-infinite gamut of experience life has to offer, even if some it is painful. Saying "all epiphanies go up in smoke because the world is hosed anyways" is kind of disingenuous to the source material, since Evangelion is primarily a story about our difficulty in connecting with others, and I honestly don't feel the brainchild of a depressed anime director would say so much with so much gusto for the final takeaway to be "yeah, life does suck". EoE's ending is dark and depressing and bleak but its tinged with a very cautious optimism that will, ultimately I think, make all the difference for Shinji.
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May 23, 2013 21:38
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What's problematic is I don't know if Anno & team are being purposely obtuse to set us up for the masterstroke that will be 4.44, or they've just lost their touch . I do like 3.33, it's a gorgeous movie, but man I'm not so sure it was a good idea to go off the beaten path like it did. Time will tell.
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May 26, 2013 04:36
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EoE's ending is glorious. Seriously, it's loving art.
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May 26, 2013 06:05
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Dred Cosmonaut posted:Yeah I'll fuckin' fight you if you dislike Eva's endings. That poo poo is gloriously insane. Shinji floats in the black void of his self conscious as he psycho analyzes himself is the only time I have ever stared at screen and truly felt disbelief. And then in EoE Rei strips naked, turns into the stay puft marshmallow man and turns the world into tang. I don't know how I can phrase this without coming off as the "you just don't get it  " guy, but people who honestly, genuinely hate EoE because it makes "no sense" are not the type of people it was made for. Eva doesn't have to speak to your soul or whatever - not everyone has struggled with the same feelings that compelled Anno to write Eva the way he did, and that's okay - but nerds who refuse to engage with anything beyond a purely superficial level are the worst kind of fans.edit: not calling you out, but there are people out there who share the sentiments you express. Yeah yeah I know stop getting mad about animu
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May 26, 2013 06:19
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Eva in a nutshell: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tcRkvXvs5Rc
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Jun 7, 2013 21:51
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3 is a gorgeous mess but worth watching. Watch it a few times to let it sink in, one viewing doesn't do it justice.
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Jun 7, 2013 22:54
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Mari is just proof that there are normal, well-adjusted people in the show's world
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Jun 30, 2013 17:20
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"Normal" in the sense that she acts exactly how Shinji's detractors want him to act: full of shounen energy and burning passion edit: Only in Eva would an almost non-character that likes to chill out and joke around with her friends be so drat conspicuous Edged Hymn fucked around with this message at 17:58 on Jun 30, 2013 |
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Jun 30, 2013 17:48
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House Louse posted:What, weren't Kaji, Misato, and Ritsuko enough? Anyway, those aren't the three adjectives that leap to my mind when I think of Mari... how about conspiring, exhibitionist, berserker? Misato has serious daddy issues, and Ritsuko put her heart on the line for a guy whose using her to revive his dead wife. But yeah I'll give you Kaji 
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Jul 1, 2013 00:38
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