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I know exactly when I first got into Gundam as I have the posts on this very forum to prove it. Although I had been contemplating watching Gundam for years before this. I kept putting it off and putting it off because of the elements of the fandom I had been exposed to. I won't pretend SEED is my favorite Gundam show or anything but to hear the people I used to talk with tell it, Gundam SEED is responsible for all the suffering in the world. Once I actually became a fan myself though and saw more of the fanbase, I realized it wasn't so bad. I even discovered that there are people who don't like Zeta. I don't know why this is but there are.
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Oct 16, 2015 15:34
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Arcsquad12 posted:Okay, first episode of Zeta, dubbed. First impressions: this is gonna be so 80s it hurts. Not big on the music, but the cheesy saxophone ending is awesome. It looks like they have an actual budget this time around, much better picture quality and animation (though they spent a huge amount of time showing us Kamille's legs as he ran). As for voice acting, it's actually not that bad. It's certainly Blue water/Ocean's second team and not their frontrunners like Scott McNeil or the Dobsons, but it's perfectly functional. Tom Edwards is no Michael Kopsa, but he still works for Char in that understated, calm performance. Kamille's voice actor is rather good as well, sounds enough like a teenager while different from Amuro. The dub is fairly decent with some great performances here and there. It's the same team did that did G Gundam. Master Asia is the Narrator, Captain Henken and a lot of other minor characters. Although Zeta Amuro would go on to voice Shinn in the Destiny dub so he moved up I guess. I really liked Kamille's voice and he helped make Kamille my favorite Gundam MC. But most of the best VAs won't be showing up for a while. Begemot posted:The dub opening is better The second Japanese Zeta OP is really good I think. "From the [Something] Star with Love." And a poster on here once said there are more punches thrown in Zeta than in G Gundam. I always thought that was apt.
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Oct 27, 2015 01:15
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Arcsquad12 posted:Zeta gundam should have the subtitle: Disproportionate Retribution. Kamille just made that officer dance using loving vulcan guns. Music still isn't grabbing me the same as the mad trumpets from 0079, but I still like that soft saxophone. I think I hated the Titans more than I ever hated Zeon. Stuff like beating up Bright just showed they were petty thugs. Zeon might have been evil but you can still respect evil if it's intelligent or determined enough. Nobody respects brainless brutes, however.
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Oct 27, 2015 19:57
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Zechs was a good pilot. In fact, he stays the best pilot for the whole show. Granted, I never was certain if theTallgeese was superior or inferior to the Gundams. It's a prototype but then again, so was Wing Zero. The Gundams felt like they were "dumbed down" maybe. Plus in their second fight Heero wasn't at optimum battling capacity. He was using Heavyarms IIRC and his arm was hosed up.
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Oct 31, 2015 02:59
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One of Char's weaknesses, at least to me, is that his Newtype abilities are subpar at best. I seem to recall it being explained that Lalah was so amazing that her presence awakened both Amuro and Char but Char seemingly had very little to "awaken." His powers have nothing on Amuro, let alone the super Newtypes like Kamille or the ZZ guy.
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Nov 1, 2015 04:17
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Neddy Seagoon posted:I don't know if the US is getting it, but Madman Entertainment's announced a G no Reconguista DVD set in Australia. First half of the series gets released in January. Only with subtitles I presume?
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Nov 3, 2015 07:46
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TNG posted:I think taking it on a show by show basis is probably the best course of action. Mobile Suit Gundam's politics towards war are quite different than Gundam SEED's for example. I would argue they're much better too, and is one of the reasons I don't care for SEED as it exists in a very cynical post 9/11 approach to violence and intervention. Gundam, as well as all military sci-fi in general, exists under the banner of American military hegemony. In a Japanese context, the worst stuff tends to run the gamut from being dreadfully naive to outright pining for the days where their military could go out and kill a lot of people. MSG and its "spiritual successor" have clear ideas of war but what about Wing and 00, the other two most alike Gundams? You said show by show basis, after all. I never could understand what 00 was getting at, especially since CB's terrorism ended up working perfectly. Until Season 2 anyway.... Gyra_Solune posted:today i learned: apparently in the dub of war in the pocket, bernie was voiced by david hayter He was also Tamahome in Fushigi Yuugi. Sadly I don't think he liked being a voice-actor much and was just using it as a springboard into the business. Snake seems to have been the exception. Midjack posted:The Garma's Funeral Speech stand is pretty excellent too: I would buy this.
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Nov 5, 2015 04:42
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TNG posted:I think when looking at those two, you can't get the specter of commercialism out of the way when engaging with their themes. Wing especially, but 00 does it as well. I think 00 is a far more intelligent show than Wing, but I also have a gigantic soft spot for Wing for a variety of reasons. Wing's kind of loving crazy though, especially when you regard the philosophy of "Absolute Pacifism" and look at what Relena actually accomplishes during the show. She kind of drifts from one thing to another, the posh academy, the Sanc Kingdom, being Vice President(not even full president!) of the Earth Sphere UN or whatever, and is always kind of bailed out by her brother, Heero, one of the other Gundam pilots whenever she's about to be atomized. It's kind of comedic when everyone just lifts her up as this amazing person when she's really kind of passively(lol) milquetoast. She's made a philosophy out of being someone who kind of stands around and lets others do all the heavy lifting. You counter that with Trieze's batshit ideal of "War is beautiful, and I will help bring about the most beautiful war of all, and it will lead to peace because all those brave and beautiful 100K+ people I personally remember will all be dead" and you get a very loving confused show about what it's trying to say. Oh well, sells a lot of wall scrolls and gunpla, so whatever. I don't think you're being fair to Relena here. For all their giant robot goodness, Heero and the others don't really do much. Consider Treize's speech, which inspired the manga retelling of the show. "Glory of the Losers." That says it all right there. Heero and the others, after walking into Treize's trap, and then being abandoned by the colonies, are left pretty much powerless. I don't even think they have their Gundams at this point but even if they did, what good would they do? There's a reason Endless Waltz reveals the Operation Meteor we see in the show was a last-second spur-of-the-moment thing with no forethought or planning. Five teenagers with attitude in giant robots aren't going to change the world, no matter how good those robots are. Which is why we focus on them and their futile antics while the real plot is being set up off-screen. Relena re-establishing the Sanc Kingdom was the actual threat to the villains. The Gundam Pilots were nothing and no one except Treize cared about them anymore. Hell, Treize even tells Heero he thinks Relena is stronger than Heero where it really matters. Relena also had probably the best character development in the show, going from the girl who pined over Heero and tried to blow Lady Une's head off, to the woman trying to fix the world and refusing to kill Lady Une when given the chance. Yeah, Gundam Wing is a loving ridiculous and silly show but I think Relena Peacecraft was a genuinely pretty good character.
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Nov 5, 2015 08:04
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boom boom boom posted:It's strongest in the beginning, so if you don't like it now, you aren't gonna like it more in the future I don't know why people think this. It's just a clone of MSG at the start only now you have to suffer through watching he same flashback a bajillin times. The end is easily my favorite part as everything is crazy and all the villains and no more dealing with stupid teen angst.
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Nov 11, 2015 06:37
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Gammatron 64 posted:With a lot of shows, especially Gundam, a lot of episodes just kind of blend in and aren't super memorable, too. Or they are just part of a longer arc. Sorry but I felt original Gundam was mostly filler of the worst kind. Some episodes were just weird and random, like the Great Old People Revolt.
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Nov 11, 2015 20:20
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Lemon Curdistan posted:Of all the episodes you could have picked, that's one of the ones that's most clearly not even remotely any kind of filler. It's early on so I remember it. My brain sort of deactivated later on in the show as everything got so tedious and boring. I would re-watch it to refresh my memory but eh.
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Nov 11, 2015 20:46
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closeted republican posted:I want a crossover event where the Gundam characters with the most ridiculous names fight the most useless Gundam characters to be deemed the number 1 Gundam misfit. Replace Reccoa with Fa. I actually like Reccoa but apart from that, Fa fits the bill better because it's actually part of her character arc that she's useless at fighting.
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Dec 10, 2015 06:03
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Are you watching the dub or with the original Japanese OP? Both are pretty good, just curious. Zeta is my favorite Gundam series, along with Wing. I hope you continue to enjoy yourself!
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Jan 2, 2016 08:55
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Dangerous Person posted:Watching the dub because dubs tend to be easier for me to stick with when it comes to actually following through a whole series. I had never seen the dub mentioned in this thread before I came across it so I made sure it wasn't one of those weird ones like the Big Green version of DBZ. Yeah the Zeta dub isn't too popular from what I've seen. This forum is one of the few places I go where it's mostly received positively. I personally like it a lot. Kamille's VA does a fantastic job and I liked the new Char. I think he does well as Quattro. Also lots of other great performances from characters you have yet to meet. As for the soundtrack, it is one of my favorite Gundam OSTs. You have many great songs to hear in addition to many great voices. Are you liking Kamille? He tends to be a Love/Hate sort of main protagonist. I love him because he makes by far the strongest first impression I have ever seen out of a Gundam MC.
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Jan 2, 2016 09:34
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That's one of the great pieces of music I was saying Dangerous Person had to look forward to. It really is even more lovely in orchestra form, although I miss the guitar. I'm also really glad I found this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cgohpd2UstQ&list=FLP-LDRKFvPIJNN5KyW_Gq_Q&index=19
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Jan 2, 2016 20:33
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I have been speaking English all my life and I have literally never heard anyone pronounce it in any other way than Tie-tan or Tie-ten. If it's wrong, the dubbers probably didn't even realize it any more than I did.
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Jan 3, 2016 20:59
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Titties? Oh, the shower scene with Lila? After all the outright stupid names, I think she has the best name. Lila Mira Rira.
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Jan 5, 2016 04:36
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Dangerous Person posted:I didn't think I'd feel bad for Jerid but goddamn Um....about that... Forewarning, it's going to be an emotional rollercoasterr with Jerid. I liked Lila though so I was sad to see her die. I think she had potential and should have stuck around longer.
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Jan 5, 2016 05:45
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So a guy I know posted some pics which I guess are endings for the game Gihren's Greed. Char/Casval and Sayla/whatever her real name is take over Zeon. vs.  Garma takes over Zeon. It just made me curious, which would have been better for the UC? I would assume Deikun's kids restore Zeon to its more democratic or republican government but loving Char is still a major player. On the other hand, I would assume Garma continues the Zabi dictatorship but we know Garma is actually a good person and would not be another Gihren and kill billions of people.
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Jan 10, 2016 08:12
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Dangerous Person posted:RIP Jaburo. You were the setting of one of my favorite battles in The Origin. Did you like Jerid's little insanity mantra? Also, how are you liking the AEUG crew so far? Emma and Reccoa, specifically? Oh and do you like Quattro any more than Char or about the same? Sorry to bombard you with questions, it's just rare that I meet a newcomer to Zeta. I only saw it for the first time about two years ago now myself.
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Jan 10, 2016 08:55
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Well...you might want to try and desensitize yourself about Katz. He's gonna be sticking around. Glad to hear you like Emma. She's one of the best ladies in all Gundam. And yeah I forgot you haven't seen much of Reccoa yet. Speaking of ladies though, you're approaching the Hong Kong Arc which has another favorite Gundam female of mine in it.
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Jan 10, 2016 09:08
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Kuroyama posted:Isn't Garma's issue that he just lacks the skill for his position? And not because of any personality flaws, he just simply wasn't that good of a strategist/fighter/whatever. I remember him actually acknowledging the nepotism that got him as far as he had before he died, and one of his big motivations is trying to prove he's good enough. Yep, he's the sole Zabi who suffers from a lack of confidence rather than an abundance of it. As I said, he's a legitimately good person who just wants to make his family proud while not overstepping himself. He could easily just coast given his birth but he'd rather be out there, showing others he deserves this. I found it interesting he seemed especially attached to Kycillia. I wonder if she cared anything for him. Pureauthor posted:Dozle looks so proud in that picture. I love this pic for a lot of reasons and Dozle's big grin is one of them. NikkolasKing fucked around with this message at 11:57 on Jan 10, 2016 |
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Jan 10, 2016 11:54
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Well Degwin was a pretty good leader it seems. Not exactly a nice leader but not Gihren levels of evil.
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Jan 11, 2016 00:23
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Well I just meant Degwin was good leader in that, after Deikun's death, he got his family into supreme dictatorial power and Zeon became super awesome in terms of technology and stuff. Zeons military lags behind the Federation mainly due to the Feddies having a ton more resources in terms of materials and manpower. Degwin must have done something right to forge the Principality into such a powerhouse.
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Jan 11, 2016 01:38
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Dangerous Person posted:20 episodes deep into Zeta. I burst out laughing when the 80s guitar wail hit during Kamille and Four's date. This show has excellent music. I love Four. Her character, voice, theme, design... Glad you're enjoying yourself. dogsicle posted:
Same. To me, Four is everything Lalah should have been.
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Jan 15, 2016 06:26
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The thing bout Zeon being the purest definition of awful is that everyone in UC keeps reinventing them and their "ideals." Zeon killed half of the human population should be a pretty damning statement but nope, they still have supporters and revivals aplenty. So there must be something attractive about the Principality in-universe so I assume the same thing attracts real life fans, too. In a way, I kinda think SEED did this whole thing better. It fucks up the execution but the PLANTS at least have more legitimate grievances than Zeon. Also it was an actual war between the Earth and the colonies, not the Earth and one colony.
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Jan 15, 2016 11:23
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Given Haman was propping Mineva up as a rallying symbol and figurehead, how can Axis Zeon be anti-Zabi? This was something some people were talking about elsewhere, actually. A guy was upset with Unicorn because he couldn't understand where these guys got all their awesome toys since Char threw everything he had into that final battle and then that all got pretty much wiped out. The answer others came up with is that the Sleeves were more Axis than Char's Zeon. Char's Zeon was the anti-Zabi anomaly. I dunno if this is true or not since I never finished Unicorn. I don't doubt the allure of power. People want to be led. But the thing about the Nazis is that most of their followers deny their crimes. That's why Holocaust denial exists. There is no denying what Zeon did. Wait, well, I guess there kinda is if I'm remembering Cima's backstory right. Even other high ranking Zeon remnants thought what she had done was some sort of renegade move, right? It's why she had to throw in with the Federation.
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Jan 15, 2016 16:57
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Has anyone here read Crossbone Gundam? I ask because we wee talking about "the best Zabi" elsewhere and someone put forth Dozle as a better choice than Garma because Garma was just as crazy as Gihren and Kycillia, all based on some crazy Newtype lab that apparently is from Crossbone.
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Jan 26, 2016 09:06
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SeanBeansShako posted:The better question really is which Newtype has the best hair? Haman's hair is an interesting color and shape.
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Jan 26, 2016 21:03
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Blaze Dragon posted:Counterpoint: Kamille's character growth is completely erratic, and he'll go from bratty teenager that punches people for existing to WAR AND VIOLENCE ARE BAD and back depending entirely on what the episode needs. Or sometimes, just for the sake of having Kamille punch someone. I think the one and only time Kamille says violence isn't the answe is when Wong is nearly beating him to death. Kamille might punch people but the poo poo Wong does to him is just loving brutal.
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Jan 27, 2016 02:01
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So if I'm remembering right, Kira and Cagalli are super special Coordinator babies. Then Cagalli went on to be the daughter of the leader of Not Japan aka ORB. Why does Kira have the Japanese name then and Cagalli has...um...whatever her name is? It's not really important, I was just reading the posts about ORB being Japan and it struck me that everyone in ORB has Japanese names except her.
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Jan 27, 2016 19:20
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Were Rau and Mwu actually supposed to be Newtypes? I thought they only had that reactin to each other because Rau was a clone of Mwu's father or something like that. Basically they had no real psychic powers like actual Newtypes, they just had the ability to sense each other's presence because of that connection. As I am learning, I remember few of the finer details of SEED. I thought Kira and Cagalli went through the same stuff because they were siblings and I remember this big soap opera reveal/drama involving Cagalli's parents appearing all remorseful and stuff. I dunno, I need to rewatch SEED it seems.
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Jan 28, 2016 02:51
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Dangerous Person posted:Zeta Episode 36: If Jerid was judo flipped off a thousand more mountains, it still wouldn't be punishment enough. ImpAtom posted:No, they are Newtypes. This was another 'confirmed by the director' thing. In addition to their bond Mu and Rau both have the precognition about attacks and the enhanced spatial awareness that allows them to more readily use remote weapons, as well as Newtype flashes. This is more heavily emphasized in Astray X where another of the Da Flagas (Prayer Reverie) shows up and basically walks his way down a checklist of Newtype tropes including viewing the black flames of rage that appeared in Tomino's novels. The games have danced around it but Mu has been a Newtype in more than one and in others has had a unique skill called Enhanced Spatial Awareness which is literally identical to the Newtype skill with a different name. Hm, so is this how Rau pretended to be a Coordinator? Psychic power substituting for genetic abilities?
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Jan 28, 2016 03:23
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I love many things about Wing but Treize and his magnificent dress sense rank in the Top 5 or 10. I think I like Dorothy more. Maybe it's her and her cousin's eyebrows. But fantastic post SeanBeansShako. I look forward to more.
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Feb 4, 2016 00:37
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Kanos posted:I dunno, Relena is pretty goddamn amazing. It's pretty hardcore when your show's peace princess character manages to be the biggest badass in the show. Peace is awesome. I'll never forget how Relena stared down multiple Gundams without even flinching. Plus while Heero and the others were off in space accomplishing not much of anything, she managed to re-establish a country and create the biggest opposition to the villains on the face of the planet. An opposition so good they just said "well...let's try and see if she can win people over to our side." Then she just won people over to her side again right under Romefeller's noses. Relena is the real hero of Gundam Wing.
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Feb 4, 2016 01:40
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taichara posted:Nah. She had Sanc handed over to her and then up and abandoned it and anyone living in it to their fates as soon as Romefeller clamped down so she could follow her boneheaded ideology; that's the opposite of being a hero, or even cognizant of her people's safety. I'm gonna make a tl;dr post about Wing's plot and characters so fair warning. The Sanc Kingdom had been destroyed years earlier. She re-founded the country which is believable enough, seeing as she's a long lost heir to a popular monarchy returned to everyone in an hour of need. I've often heard that chick from Gundam 00 being useless is some sort of "commentary" about how ineffective someone like Relena would be in reality. Unfortunately, the 00 writers didn't make her a 1:1 copy of Relena. Relena has advantages Marina or whoever she was did not, such as the aforementioned long lost royalty thing. Basically, just as Romefeller poses to crush the entire world under its boot heel, a savior arrived in the form of a dynasty long thought dead and buried. It's very easy to see why people rallied around her, quite apart from any natural charisma she might have. Romefeller in effect controlled the entire Earth and most of the colonies. It was Relena and the Sanc Kingdom that offered the first real resistance to their tyranny. Unfortunately, the Mobile Dolls meant that Romefeller had pretty much an infinite army to throw at a tiny group of dwindling rebels. When Romefeller took off the kid gloves, they could have easily laid waste to the entire Sanc Kingdom, killed everyone, and Relena knew that. One of the most recurring themes in Wing is that the Pilots are loving useless. It doesn't matter if a Gundam can destroy a 100 Leos,, that isn't going to destabilize the government. Five teenagers with attitude cannot topple a planetary government. Enter Relena. Heero, the supposed main character, is little more than her bodyguard. He and Quatre go to the Sanc Kingdom specifically because it's the only place that can resist Romefeller and they recognize the best they can do is support her. Unfortunately, as I said, they are "Losers." They are defined by fighting against utterly hopeless odds. And so Relena chose to become Romefeller's pawn instead of seeing her kingdom annihilated just like happened last time. Only, she was too good at her job. Duke Whatever His Name Was hoped to make use of Relena's popularity to make everyone submit to the Romefeller Empire. All that happened was that the less warhawk members of Romefeller rallied around Relena as someone who could turn things around and make things better. I think one thing that really sets Relena above and beyond her clones like Lacus is that Relena was not created this way. She was not always Ms. Peace and Love. She was originally just a lonely rich kid piningover Heero. Then her dad got murdered and where as Lacus just kind of boohoo'ed about that, Relena went out, got a gun, and tried to blow off Lady Une's head. It's the first really proactive thing she does in the series and it's fitting that one of the last things she does in the series is specifically pass up the chance to repeat the incident without missing this time. In short, Relena was not born some great messiah of love and pacifism, she actually had development that made her that way. We got to see her grow and change in a way none of her clones did. So yeah, I love Relena Peacecraft and think she's a legitimately good character. Sorry.
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Feb 4, 2016 09:33
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ImpAtom posted:.. What? She was doing that all before he was murdered, if the montage in SEED is in the correct order. I literally have that scene right here if you want and Lacus' speeches were happening before they found and killed her dad. Her dad dying didn't really change much. quote:This is, I think, another case of the weird character divorce between SEED and Destiny coming into play. In Gundam SEED Lacus is scheming as poo poo. Her entire sweet act is just that, an act. She acts sweet and naive and uses Haro to hack open the doors in the Archangel and gather information and so-on while going "oh gosh, Mr. Haro, you're just so naughty." Once things start going south in PLANT she's literally shown broadcasting on hijacked television signals with a fake CGI Lacus Clyne and having soldiers kill people and masterminding robotjackings and stuff. The entire point of the character is that she is a lot more cunning than she lets on and only rarely lets anyone see it. She's not Haman Karn but there's a reason the "Lacus Clyne masterminded everything" jokes have an edge of truth to them. I can see what you mean here, though. I never liked Lacus and I don't doubt Destiny might have further distorted my memories.
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Feb 4, 2016 20:08
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TheManSeries posted:Sadly it can't be. No one on that staff has the pull to make Kira and Lacus anything other than unquestionable heroes with no flaws. I really wish that one quote that said Durandal was the hero and Kira/Lacus were the villains was legit. In any event, we still have no idea if that attack at the start of Destiny was organized by anybody. The crazy guy who tried to drop...something on Earth, I forget what.
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Feb 6, 2016 03:30
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I forget how SEED ended for the EA. I know one conscientious fodder stopped Zala and GENESIS, and I remember Yzak's mother was arrested by what I guess were a moderate faction, but what stopped the EA? Or did Azrael getting blown up do that?
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Feb 6, 2016 23:50
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I dunno what it was but I loved Azrael and hated Djibril. When you get right down to it they are both simply one-dimensional cackling madmen but Azrael was a better take on this than Djibril I guess? Also LOGOS wasn't so much Blue Cosmos as they were just a stereotypical Illuminati type group. I think that's one thing I genuinely liked about SEED. I can believe a Human/genetically altered human war would break out, and you'd get a bunch of crazies wh think neither side is the same anymore. Someone like Azrael, while a cartoon villain, is still a believable cartoon villain. Djibril went too far. He's introduced petting a cat and talking about how best to manipulate what remains of humanity after that thing falls on the planet. I think it was a bit much, to say the least.
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Feb 7, 2016 00:27
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