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Mustang
Jun 18, 2006

“We don’t really know where this goes — and I’m not sure we really care.”
Did legendary campaign Calus by myself and it was really easy with Assassins Cowl strand build and Witherhoard. Witherhoard just wrecks his health bar.

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Lord Packinham
Dec 30, 2006
:<

GoGoGadgetChris posted:

Crafting has reduced my tolerance for chasing rolls. It hasn't eliminated it, and for guns that have No Bad Perks I will grind those til the cows come home

But if it's hard to get the gun to drop & even harder to get a worthwhile roll? Forget that poo poo, there's probably a reasonable substitute in the crafting menu

This is basically where I’m at. There is a middle ground between the seasonal crafting weapons and grinding onslaught’s loot pool that is only going to get bigger. I think focusing would be a good middle ground to at least target the weapon you want.

GoGoGadgetChris
Mar 18, 2010

i powder a
granite monument
in a soundless flash

showering the grass
with molten drops of
its gold inlay

sending smoking
chips of stone
skipping into the fog
Osiris: This 'Strand' may hold the key to beating Calus

Osiris: Strand is the only thing Calus won't have seen coming

Osiris: Guardian, use your 'Strand', and Calus won't know what hit him

Players: What guns should I use on this bigboy

hiddenriverninja
May 10, 2013

life is locomotion
keep moving
trust that you'll find your way

maybe if I get a perk 50 times let me slot it into a different Coup

Lord Packinham
Dec 30, 2006
:<
Also, does attuning even do anything? It doesn’t seem to effect the drop rate at all or is too small to notice.

haveblue
Aug 15, 2005



Toilet Rascal

Lord Packinham posted:

Also, does attuning even do anything? It doesn’t seem to effect the drop rate at all or is too small to notice.

It’s all RNG so everyone had a different experience, but I just did a couple of onslaughts and got half a dozen mountaintops and one or two other guns

GoGoGadgetChris
Mar 18, 2010

i powder a
granite monument
in a soundless flash

showering the grass
with molten drops of
its gold inlay

sending smoking
chips of stone
skipping into the fog

Lord Packinham posted:

Also, does attuning even do anything? It doesn’t seem to effect the drop rate at all or is too small to notice.

It sets the drop rate for the attuned gun at 50%, and all other Brave guns at 50%. I don't know for a fact if Attunement applies to all of the following, though

- Random drops from completion of an Onslaught Wave
- the 1-2 chests from completing every 10th wave of Onslaught, and the 3rd chest from completing Wave 50
- Spending 10 Trophies at the Shaxx Chest
- The Shaxx Engrams from vendor rep
- The Shaxx Engrams from Arcite Bounties

sunday at work
Apr 6, 2011

"Man is the animal that thinks something is wrong."

Lord Packinham posted:

Also, does attuning even do anything? It doesn’t seem to effect the drop rate at all or is too small to notice.

It makes the chance of the attuned weapon dropping from any source of Brave weapons by 50%.

FlapYoJacks
Feb 12, 2009

GoGoGadgetChris posted:

Osiris: This 'Strand' may hold the key to beating Calus

Osiris: Strand is the only thing Calus won't have seen coming

Osiris: Guardian, use your 'Strand', and Calus won't know what hit him

Players: What guns should I use on this bigboy

Osiris could say, "Guardian, Strand will do 25% more damage to Calus, give you unlimited health, and bring Lance Reddick back from the dead." and players would still ask what to use against him.

hiddenriverninja
May 10, 2013

life is locomotion
keep moving
trust that you'll find your way

FlapYoJacks posted:

Osiris could say, "Guardian, Strand will do 25% more damage to Calus, give you unlimited health, and bring Lance Reddick back from the dead." and players would still ask what to use against him.

The final shape is cold, hard efficiency

sunday at work
Apr 6, 2011

"Man is the animal that thinks something is wrong."
Osiris (grapples into the arena, takes off half of Calus’ health bar with a Needlestorm): Use the Strand, Guardian!

The Guardian: Did they patch the cheese spot?

GoGoGadgetChris
Mar 18, 2010

i powder a
granite monument
in a soundless flash

showering the grass
with molten drops of
its gold inlay

sending smoking
chips of stone
skipping into the fog

FlapYoJacks posted:

Osiris could say, "Guardian, Strand will do 25% more damage to Calus, give you unlimited health, and bring Lance Reddick back from the dead." and players would still ask what to use against him.

Hmmm will that 25% stack, though? If a goon is asking for advice, it's safe to assume they're in a Well

Oxyclean
Sep 23, 2007


EVGA Longoria posted:

Once you have a pattern, every single drop of that gun for the rest of time is a wasted, meaningless drop that could be replaced by glimmer. Arguably that's the case BEFORE the pattern too. That kinda sucks in a looter shooter.

Yes, most drops are garbage anyway and will be sharded. But there's at least a reason to care about them/look at them. Without crafting, a full 5/5 god roll is rare enough to be worth looking at every drop, even when I've got something with the main perks I want.

I love crafting, I'm glad it's in the game. But every single source of every weapon does not need to be craftable, IMO. Sorry you had a string of not getting the specific perk you wanted?

Non-deterministic RNG sucks rear end, I'm sorry you like pulling the slot machine. Repeatedly doing an activity to not get what I want, not knowing when I ever will, kind of sucks rear end and makes me less interested in playing over time.

The game does not making looking at every drop a fun and pleasant experience. Loot and inventory management sucks in this game, and flavor of the month, metas, artifact, and poor tooltip information all often make it hard to discern if it you should shard or keep something, particularly as a new player.

My personal concept for the crafting system before they introduced it was just one that let you smash all your guns into one mega-gun that lets you pick from the sum total of perks found. I dont think this solves one of my issues (non-determinism - you could go countless drops without acquiring the perk you want) but it'd go a long way to making players feel like they aren't about to throw away something they should have kept, and streamlining collection management.

I think I'm okay with not every gun in the game being craftable, the focus system is generally pretty when you can collect a ton of resources and just sit down and figure out what you need to pull from the machine, but I also don't really enjoy the experience of spending like 1-2 resets worth of crucible/vanguard/gambit engrams only to not even get the 2/5 -> 4/5 roll I was hoping for.

I think it sucks rear end that even trying to get one personal roll of one of the Brave guns has felt like an annoying pain in the rear end, particularly with all the time limited BS around Brave stuff. The activity and guns might not be going away, but once the destination goes away, you'll have less opportunities to get the guns because there won't be the box anymore.

GoGoGadgetChris
Mar 18, 2010

i powder a
granite monument
in a soundless flash

showering the grass
with molten drops of
its gold inlay

sending smoking
chips of stone
skipping into the fog
Shinies are going away which means interest in the Brave Guns is going to drop to near-zero


Also holy poo poo I just remembered how Crafting worked when it came out. Remember all the different bits and bobs? Using a redframe gun so you could harvest one of 7 different currencies depending on which Perks it had?

Orv
May 4, 2011
I had a vague memory of "This seems improved, I remember something horrible about crafting?" but I didn't remember that part, don't like that.

Happy Noodle Boy
Jul 3, 2002


GoGoGadgetChris posted:

Shinies are going away which means interest in the Brave Guns is going to drop to near-zero


Also holy poo poo I just remembered how Crafting worked when it came out. Remember all the different bits and bobs? Using a redframe gun so you could harvest one of 7 different currencies depending on which Perks it had?

It was the ultimate form of Bungie Gameplay.

FlapYoJacks
Feb 12, 2009
The original Red Border crafting had several different currencies. Raid weapons had currencies that you had to obtain through the raids. These currencies were super rare drops and were so hated that they were removed entirely within a season.

life_source
May 11, 2008

i got tired of looking at your edgy baby avatar that a 14-year old would be proud of
Looking at how the old transmog and crafting systems work makes it very clear that the devs and playtesters are playing a wildly different game than the rest of us.

https://www.bungie.net/en/Explore/Detail/News/50272
"
Before we get too deep, here’s a quick list of steps that players will take to convert their armor appearance into Universal Armor Ornaments:

Defeat enemies to earn Synthstrand.
Spend Synthstrand on bounties to earn Synthcord.
Convert Synthcord at the Loom in the Tower into Synthweave.
Use Synthweave to convert an unlocked armor appearance (Legendary quality or lower) from Collections into a Universal Armor Ornament.
"

There's also a quote somewhere about weapon crafting where the plan was originally "extract outlow from a gun to put it on your crafted gun for a cost".

sure okay
Apr 7, 2006





I failed twice fighting Calus solo using Strand as Hunter. I switched to my usual Void stealth build with Frost-ees and Wavesplitter and it became a breeze.

What the gently caress does damage matter when the enemy can never see you? I doubt even Osiris could answer that. Also a supercharged wavesplitter did just as much as any Strand weapon I tried on him

Mill Village
Jul 27, 2007

life_source posted:

Looking at how the old transmog and crafting systems work makes it very clear that the devs and playtesters are playing a wildly different game than the rest of us.

That’s their job.

GoGoGadgetChris
Mar 18, 2010

i powder a
granite monument
in a soundless flash

showering the grass
with molten drops of
its gold inlay

sending smoking
chips of stone
skipping into the fog

sure okay posted:

I failed twice fighting Calus solo using Strand as Hunter. I switched to my usual Void stealth build with Frost-ees and Wavesplitter and it became a breeze.

What the gently caress does damage matter when the enemy can never see you? I doubt even Osiris could answer that. Also a supercharged wavesplitter did just as much as any Strand weapon I tried on him

Strand Abilities are what guts him. Something like 1,000% bonus damage, I would guess? Literally 1x super to knock him down to last stand, and then just grapple melee him for phase 2

Lib and let die
Aug 26, 2004

GoGoGadgetChris posted:

Strand Abilities are what guts him. Something like 1,000% bonus damage, I would guess? Literally 1x super to knock him down to last stand, and then just grapple melee him for phase 2

Ok but Quicksilver Storm doesn't seem to be doing much damage to him?????

GoGoGadgetChris
Mar 18, 2010

i powder a
granite monument
in a soundless flash

showering the grass
with molten drops of
its gold inlay

sending smoking
chips of stone
skipping into the fog

Lib and let die posted:

Ok but Quicksilver Storm doesn't seem to be doing much damage to him?????

Just take the catalyst off and instant 10% damage boost!

sure okay
Apr 7, 2006





Speaking of Catalysts I was extremely underwhelmed by Ager's Scepter.

Stasis never really clicked with me but I figured Id give it a shot in onslaught. It's decent, save for the minor flaw of never having a super. Warlock stasis super is bad in general, but feeding it into a gun somehow feels worse.

I switched back to solar just in time for my Well to be up for the wave 40 boss and an ally literally typed "TY" in chat. With their fingers. I couldnt believe it.

Orv
May 4, 2011
Warlock stasis super is so bad that feeding Ager's is a massive DPS increase over it or at least used to be, maybe they realized that was insane. There's some fun stuff you can do with it, it can feed some particularly ridiculous Bleak Watcher setups but if you're not feeling it that isn't likely to change.

RBA Starblade
Apr 28, 2008

Going Home.

Games Idiot Court Jester

The warlock stasis super is nice for freezing everything in a GM NF for your turrets or for really pissing someone off in pvp when they're about to do something cool with their super. Similarly the turrets are excellent for making your teammates mad when you throw them down and realizing the little guys are body blocking all of their shots.

EVGA Longoria
Dec 25, 2005

Let's go exploring!

The best part of Prismatic is getting Bleak Watchers without that lovely super.

Orv
May 4, 2011
I'm sad we will not be able to get all three souls, threadlings and bleak watchers at the same time. Would that be a balance problem? Probably, sure. Do I care? Gimmie the weird pet build, Bungie.

sure okay
Apr 7, 2006





The little turret dudes are nice but I hate anything that involves having to charge up a grenade. It gets me killed a lot and makes me mad!

Like, just make it a grenade aspect so I can throw it instantly. I've never thought, like, "oh wow sometimes I want the turret and other times I want a cold snap grenade." If Im going turret bois then I'm only making turrets, period.

EVGA Longoria
Dec 25, 2005

Let's go exploring!

sure okay posted:

The little turret dudes are nice but I hate anything that involves having to charge up a grenade. It gets me killed a lot and makes me mad!

Like, just make it a grenade aspect so I can throw it instantly. I've never thought, like, "oh wow sometimes I want the turret and other times I want a cold snap grenade." If Im going turret bois then I'm only making turrets, period.

if you're using osmiomancy gloves you should be throwing almost as many coldsnaps as you do turrets, because it can net you more than a full grenade charge back.

Pirate Jet
May 2, 2010
The definitive take on the crafting vs random roll debate

https://youtu.be/SUSyiacp46E

GoGoGadgetChris
Mar 18, 2010

i powder a
granite monument
in a soundless flash

showering the grass
with molten drops of
its gold inlay

sending smoking
chips of stone
skipping into the fog
There's one really good way to use the Warlock Stasis super. You drain your super fast when you throw the freezeballs, but you barely drain it at all when you wag the pimpcane for the Shattering pulse

If somebody can do your freezing for you, say, a pair of bleak watchers, then all you have to do is periodically cast the shattering pulse. It gives you an incredibly powerful, high damage & long-lasting super

Blog Free or Die
Apr 30, 2005

FOR THE MOTHERLAND
I love sniping on this map

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vMZiU6URoUw

PERMACAV 50
Jul 24, 2007

because we are cat
Trailer
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vNh1KBRluC0

syntaxfunction
Oct 27, 2010
I have a bunch of crafted guns and as many random rolls. Especially with random rolls being enhancable going forward it's all very same-same for me. Just use the guns it's fine. I still use the non crafted Zaouli's Bane I have because I like it and I have yet to get the pattern, and I don't know when I ever will.

I masterwork a bunch of craftable guns I don't have the pattern for if I know it might be a while and they're good rolls (usually raid stuff). It's not like those resources are scarce, and very rarely is the enhanced perk make or break.

And yeah I shard weapons I have a pattern of but then again I also shard non pattern weapons I have my favourite roll of so it's not very different. Would be cool if we could set an autodismantle check on weapons for any extras that drop, but also that's a lot of work for such little point.

Really what should happen tho is Banshee resets need to add more perks rows already. Every vendor source should. Some of the world drops are my favourite guns, it'd be cool to get extra rolls on a weapon.

GoGoGadgetChris
Mar 18, 2010

i powder a
granite monument
in a soundless flash

showering the grass
with molten drops of
its gold inlay

sending smoking
chips of stone
skipping into the fog
I have some IRL Buddies who dabble in Destiny and they have that same mindset of "eh rolls, perks, stats.... no thanks, I'm here to shoot guns not play a RPG lol"

I respect it

FlapYoJacks
Feb 12, 2009

GoGoGadgetChris posted:

I have some IRL Buddies who dabble in Destiny and they have that same mindset of "eh rolls, perks, stats.... no thanks, I'm here to shoot guns not play a RPG lol"

I respect it

:colbert: :sever: :colbert:

GoGoGadgetChris
Mar 18, 2010

i powder a
granite monument
in a soundless flash

showering the grass
with molten drops of
its gold inlay

sending smoking
chips of stone
skipping into the fog



Me explaining that every point of Blast Radius Masterwork is directly reducing his Mountaintop's damage by 1.1% and he has to switch to Hard Launch & Spike Grenades or he won't do enough damagerino

The other guy is saying Ha ha ha shiny yellow border looks nice

Mustang
Jun 18, 2006

“We don’t really know where this goes — and I’m not sure we really care.”
Somehow I have Final Shape + season pass and the preorder items despite never paying for it. Nothing in my recent transactions either.

Used the preorder gun even for like 5 minutes. Maybe it'll all be gone when I log back in, but stuck around through a couple hours of playing.

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Orv
May 4, 2011

Very funny that an expansion destination armor set that isn’t actively hideous is a novel idea.

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