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I hope it also punishes you for getting your affection too high with everyone.
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Dec 18, 2023 21:51
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I like that they had a genuine reason to believe that Pencilgon took them on a wild goose chase ending with a hole where you'd die from fall damage. Just because trolling them like that would amuse her. They're such good friends. 
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Dec 18, 2023 22:07
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Found it.
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Dec 18, 2023 23:13
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amigolupus posted:Another detail I liked was how Cazzo used Repel Counter, a skill that Sunraku also has. It's a nice reminder that this is still an MMO and how players with different builds can still find themselves having a thing in common. The general idea of the skill gardener is a nice patch on top of the thing you sometimes get in VRMMO stories where you can just pick up a skill that changes your game forever by doing random stuff. The gardener can tell you about the skills in the game and what you have to do to learn, evolve, and level them - Sunraku's gotten a bunch of skills that support his build by choosing and playing the build, which is exactly the thing you'd expect from a well-designed game. He just has no idea he could have checked.
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Dec 19, 2023 01:01
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I can't help but enjoy the ANN reviews for this series for unintentionally hilarious they are. It's like they picked the person least knowledgeable on videogames and videogame culture to review a series all about that.
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Dec 20, 2023 20:29
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And then the user reviews are giving every episode 4 to 5 starts, because the show is precisely what they want.
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Dec 21, 2023 02:34
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Lots of stuff came out today, from the episode and the Mini (Rei's got more issues than a newsstand), to the preview of the second cour's opening and closing songs, but the wackiest has to be the two holiday shorts the studio posted. I don't think links to shorts work with SA's forums, but you can see them if you go to the YT channel for the series.
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Dec 24, 2023 21:11
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Doodles posted:Lots of stuff came out today, from the episode and the Mini (Rei's got more issues than a newsstand), to the preview of the second cour's opening and closing songs, but the wackiest has to be the two holiday shorts the studio posted. I don't think links to shorts work with SA's forums, but you can see them if you go to the YT channel for the series. maybe you could link to the channel they're on, because searching for things on the internet is dead
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Dec 24, 2023 21:43
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rodney mullenkamp posted:maybe you could link to the channel they're on, because searching for things on the internet is dead And sometimes it's hard if it's in Japanese. Edit: It just now occurred to me that Rei is just like Kou from Wotakoi. Both are insanely awkward gamer girls who have little to no interpersonal skills with their crushes and suffer all of the cringe. doomrider7 fucked around with this message at 22:07 on Dec 24, 2023 |
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Dec 24, 2023 22:00
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doomrider7 posted:I can't help but enjoy the ANN reviews for this series for unintentionally hilarious they are. It's like they picked the person least knowledgeable on videogames and videogame culture to review a series all about that. Makes sense because the titular game in this series looks like it was conceived by someone who's only had second hand exposure to video games. Like someone had to make a fake video game that was the focus of an SVU episode.
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Dec 24, 2023 22:34
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Lamebot posted:Makes sense because the titular game in this series looks like it was conceived by someone who's only had second hand exposure to video games. Like someone had to make a fake video game that was the focus of an SVU episode. I dunno, pretty much everything seen and done in the series including the titular game has a real life equivalent in real life and the writer being enough of a Turbo Gamer that they wanted to buy Armored Core 6 on the company dollar as a business expense. Ditto for taking numerous breaks that coincided with the releases of BotW, Elden Ring, TotK, Armored Core, and several other games.
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Dec 24, 2023 23:48
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Episode 13 Illustration
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Dec 25, 2023 04:01
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rodney mullenkamp posted:maybe you could link to the channel they're on, because searching for things on the internet is dead https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AFNZzbQ8tVI is the closest thing I can find (it's a cour 2 preview). Also a shorts page: https://www.youtube.com/@TV-kt7jx/shorts
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Dec 25, 2023 04:25
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Lamebot posted:Makes sense because the titular game in this series looks like it was conceived by someone who's only had second hand exposure to video games. Like someone had to make a fake video game that was the focus of an SVU episode. I think that, in many cases, it's just that "people playing a realistic MMO" (regardless of whether it's VR) simply doesn't make for an interesting or entertaining story. In real-life MMOs there simply isn't room for someone to be skilled/strong in the specific ways that translate to entertaining media.
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Dec 25, 2023 05:41
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I don't play video games so if someone can explain what a "realistic full dive VR MMO" would be like compared to what Shangri la Frontier is showing us that would be great.
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Dec 25, 2023 06:23
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Nemo2342 posted:Also a shorts page: https://www.youtube.com/@TV-kt7jx/shorts
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Dec 25, 2023 07:12
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in SVU he'd have the highscore in the mmo
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Dec 25, 2023 10:15
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and it would constantly make atari noises
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Dec 25, 2023 10:15
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Here have some seasonal shorts https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cxM6TI-idkk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cXRh5wcSF0Y Doodles posted:I don't think links to shorts work with SA's forums 
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Dec 25, 2023 14:47
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Guyver posted:I don't play video games so if someone can explain what a "realistic full dive VR MMO" would be like compared to what Shangri la Frontier is showing us that would be great. Real MMOs trace their origins back to RPGs, so being good at them is some combination of 1) knowing the right abilities/spells to use 2) building your character in specific ways and 3) hitting your buttons fast enough. Additionally these games will have finite development time and resources, so there are going to be a lot of constraints on how you can interact with the world that will further limit the ways your characters can be good at the game. For instance, you can't throw a fireball at your feet to propel yourself upwards in World of Warcraft, or duck a monster's swing to let it damage another enemy in Final Fantasy 14. Fantasy MMOs (especially the VR ones) tend to throw out all the restrictions that should be in a game, and instead claim that the game models the real world to such an exacting degree that you can do anything you can think of. That's because it's way more interesting as a casual viewer to see the protagonist pull off crazy off-the-cuff ideas than to watch them perform the same set of abilities in a specific order for 10 minutes.
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Dec 25, 2023 20:25
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They went full TotK on the engine
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Dec 25, 2023 20:57
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Guyver posted:I don't play video games so if someone can explain what a "realistic full dive VR MMO" would be like compared to what Shangri la Frontier is showing us that would be great. MMOs, in order to accommodate the large amount of players that the "massive" hints at usually have combat that depends entirely on your character skills and stats (unlike, say, doom or street fighter which are player execution dependent) because that reduces the amount of information that has to be transmitted to the servers and other players, which keeps lag and other issues down. (And because it makes the game more approachable to more people) So, in general, the combat in an MMO is completely unlike the combat you're seeing in this show. If a monster is in range and swings a blade at your character its armor, evasion stat, skills and so on will determine if you get hit, not the player actively making the character evade the attack (they can actively use an evasion skill, of course) . Have a high level thief character go to a low level area and the monsters will be literally unable to hit, even if you fall asleep at the keyboard. This goes the other way around: if you character is low level and you find an ancient death dragon or whatever you're not hitting that thing and that thing is not gonna miss. Sunraku at low level evading that wolf's attacks? no way. Player combat skill is mostly shown in knowledge about what to do in a certain fight, when to use which skills, having good awareness, etc. But since that kind of combat would be really loving boring to watch and SLF is set in the future anyways the company behind the game has built a fast paced action game with almost unlimited freedom that is also massively multiplayer.
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Dec 25, 2023 21:58
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Nemo2342 posted:Real MMOs trace their origins back to RPGs, so being good at them is some combination of 1) knowing the right abilities/spells to use 2) building your character in specific ways and 3) hitting your buttons fast enough. trucutru posted:But since that kind of combat would be really loving boring to watch and SLF is set in the future anyways the company behind the game has built a fast paced action game with almost unlimited freedom that is also massively multiplayer. Why should those restrictions/limitations be present in a game that literally processes what you're thinking into actions? Guyver fucked around with this message at 22:11 on Dec 25, 2023 |
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Dec 25, 2023 22:06
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Guyver posted:Why should those restrictions/limitations be present in a game that literally processes what you're thinking into actions? Making that stuff work correctly costs money. I would say that the fighting game in shangri-la is actually a good example of what we should realistically expect from someone making a game for magitech thought computers.
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Dec 25, 2023 23:21
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Guyver posted:Why should those restrictions/limitations be present in a game that literally processes what you're thinking into actions? Well, even in that fantasy future most games can't deal with all the programming, bug fixing, design, feature balancing, etc. required to give players that sort of experience, which means that it's extremely difficult and/or expensive to do so. SLF is supposed to be the exception. But also, quite honestly, cooperative games with any sort of real challenge where player skill (instead of character power) is of the uttermost importance breed the worst playerbases. SLF would in reality be a thousand times more toxic than league of legends. Limitations/Restrictions are also a tool to balance this. trucutru fucked around with this message at 00:04 on Dec 26, 2023 |
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Dec 26, 2023 00:02
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The thing you have to keep in mind is that Sunraku doesn't know how this game is played. He's just been doing the things that seem reasonable to him because like hell a kusoge's got a tutorial. Just a manga reader here, and we haven't seen anything definitively there, but based on the incidental conversations it seems like a lot of people are playing SLF as a conventional numbers collider. Probably one of the NPCs in Firstia is there to teach people about tab targeting and some kind of VATS-like system that auto-aims ranged and melee attacks based on some targeting parameters.
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Dec 26, 2023 02:57
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I also assume it introduces them to the proper plot and some starter quests.
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Dec 26, 2023 07:01
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Had a good laugh when he brought up that there's a skill garden in Rabbit Town. Dude is never going to the starter town.
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Dec 26, 2023 14:25
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Why should he, when the one in Rabbituza is likely to be better.
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Dec 27, 2023 02:20
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Ah, the anime caught up to the line in the thread title. I absolutely love that thesis, and how his whole family lives it in their own way. Wholesome AF and highly motivating.
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Dec 29, 2023 10:55
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Emul and Sunraku are getting married.
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Jan 1, 2024 05:33
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Who knew Sunraku was a furry?
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Jan 1, 2024 19:39
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Doodles posted:Who knew Sunraku was a furry? I mean to be fair, 
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Jan 1, 2024 21:10
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Glazius posted:The thing you have to keep in mind is that Sunraku doesn't know how this game is played. He's just been doing the things that seem reasonable to him because like hell a kusoge's got a tutorial. I think the unrealistic part is that this would result in anything other than "just being worse than other players," especially for a popular game with a huge player-base. This sort of conceit actually makes more sense in "isekai to a game-like world" stories, since in that setting it can at least make sense for the protagonist to have such a radically different mindset from the "natives" that it gives them an advantage (and the "game" in question is also often literally designed by a god, so there's no need for realistic development limitations).
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Jan 1, 2024 23:02
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doomrider7 posted:I mean to be fair,  Okay, point taken.
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Jan 1, 2024 23:44
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Ytlaya posted:I think the unrealistic part is that this would result in anything other than "just being worse than other players," especially for a popular game with a huge player-base. I was leaning towards this to at first, but then I thought about it some more. What would the ideal way for him to practice be? It would be to have a fully controllable instance of the grave keeper boss battle where he could freely explore the ai of the boss and how it reacts to things, effectively allowing him to choreograph the manual equivalent of a tool assisted speedrun. How close to this optimum can we approach? It is a unique encounter so we can’t visit mini versions of the boss and practice off of them. We do however have Pencilgon’s personal experience and her recordings that she has presumably fully shared, allowing them to approach that ideal choreography at the beginning of the fight, deviating more and more as the stages of the fight progress and we have less information. Thus, we need to practice fighting in low information settings against high powered enemies. We know from sunraku’s experience that 1 hit KO is atypical for the game excepting level differences. But this boss is pretty clearly built to say “I 1 hit KO people.“ Thus he needs a good way to train vs that type of enemy. Fair enough, let’s imagine he portals to an end game area. Unless he has people doing crowd control it’s reasonable that he could snowball with adds and die to attrition, have to reset and waste a bunch of time coming back. This is also ignoring him being famous. Even if he avoids this, the monsters he fights aren’t going to be on par with a boss’s ai. This means that he gets skilled at evading dumber enemies that don’t necessarily have stages. Let’s assume instead that he gets friends to port him to every boss monster in the game. This actually would be viable except for the insane logistics because it would train him against boss level one hit KO enemies that have ai designed by shangri la devs. But this is just too difficult to work out logistically. Let’s try again, but instead of porting to dungeons he asks Aniki to bring the bosses to the arena. This would work well, but given the flavor of Rabituza it is unlikely the developers would allow this to fly. Ok, if bosses and normal mobs are out, how about players? They are super adaptable and can do the one hit KO thing? We run into the problem of him being famous and getting overwhelmed. We know he has transferable “motor” skills and “perception” skills so given how difficult it is for him to train directly in game for this boss fight he has chosen to work on those skills in a game where doing so is fast, easy, and easily resettable.
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Jan 2, 2024 03:11
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I think that the core premise can make sense in a setting like this where the VRMMO is functionally almost the exact same as an isekai (and is less a "game" than it is "another world that happens to have various game-like rules"). The only real issue is "the game itself being completely unrealistic/implausible," but that doesn't bug me that much. I can just treat the story as a fantasy where such technology exists. If you're willing to accept the premise of "it's possible to make hyper-complex VRMMO games that resemble a game-like isekai more than they resemble actual video games," then it makes perfect sense that "someone with highly-trained perception/reflexes" would be able to do exceptionally well.
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Jan 2, 2024 03:41
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A lot of action game skills are transferrable, if you toss a mario speedrunner into a new mario game he's gonna be way better at it the first time than some random chump, even if that chump has already played enough to have beaten the game.
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Jan 2, 2024 04:37
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This is also the only Superboss that's feasible for him to fight. It's gets stronger depending on Party Size so the fewer needed to fight him the better, It auto saps your levels so being at the level cap does not matter. From Pencilgon's experience given that her main allies don't want to try and actually beat the boss, Relying on people she knows and that are good at this type of game is the best move. Also Sunraku is getting better at the game via having mechanics he missed explained to him.
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Jan 2, 2024 05:34
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Tunicate posted:A lot of action game skills are transferrable, if you toss a mario speedrunner into a new mario game he's gonna be way better at it the first time than some random chump, even if that chump has already played enough to have beaten the game. Yeah I'm going to do a hell of a lot better in a New Bayonetta or DMC game after my hundreds of hours in character action games than say, my sister who only plays Animal Crossing and Flight Sims. That's probably the least weird part of the training.
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Jan 2, 2024 06:33
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