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Beef Of Ages
Jan 11, 2003

Your dumb is leaking.

priznat posted:

I知 flying for business in a couple weeks (YVR<-> YYZ, about a 4-5 hour flight depending on direction) and I知 eyeing the Air Canada seat upgrade bids. Are these a worthwhile deal on points for business or premium economy?

I have a modest 100k aeroplan points saved up. Do the prices fluctuate closer to the departure? Right now the bid range goes as low as 46k for business and 27k premium economy. I知 tall and getting crammed in economy is not fun. I値l gut it out if it痴 seen as a sucky deal though. I know very little about points rewards and rarely fly for pleasure trips.

It depends on what the cost is and how much you value the premium seat for a longer flight like that. 27k for PE seems like a decent deal to me, though if you have no other use for those miles and don't travel often, business is not the worst use. I use my Delta miles for upgrades because redeeming them for award flights is a laughable goal in most cases. I usually value premium seats at around $50 an hour, but that's a personal valuation and not any sort of widely applied metric.

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vanity slug
Jul 20, 2010

BA finally aligned everyone's tier points year. Gonna suck to book tier points runs but nice to be in sync with my partner now.

runawayturtles
Aug 2, 2004

Beef Of Ages posted:

What you're seeing is the difference between revenue and award tickets. Airline award tickets have dramatically smaller availability than revenue tickets do for obvious reasons, and booking via the Chase portal is actually booking a revenue ticket from the airline's point of view, but Chase takes points from your account to pay itself back for buying you a revenue ticket via its travel agency (Expedia). So the key is exactly what you're experiencing: find an award flight available on a Chase partner airline, then transfer the points. In almost all cases this is a better value for the points you have, but it's much more difficult to find award space. That's the nature of the game.

Much further in advance or much closer in are two potential strategies, but award availability will vary widely between markets, routes, and seasons. Successful award ticket redemption often involves a lot of flexibility on your part so I'd also be checking BOS, IAD, PHL, and possibily even ORD, ATL, IAH, and other big international gateways that are relatively easy to get to from NYC. Additionally, check LHR, FRA, MUC, CDG, and other big international gateways in Europe. Paying for a comparatively inexpensive domestic ticket and the extra connection (either in the US or in Europe) may be worth the time and effort if you find a good award redemption for the over-water segment.

I know the Chase portal is for revenue tickets, but are you saying that the tickets on airline websites when searching to pay with points may also be revenue tickets, and that's why the points costs are so high? If so, is the only way to find award tickets just to experiment with different days and airports until something reasonable shows up?

To give an example, on one random day the cheapest one-way JFK -> AMS on KLM is 68,000 points + $86, ordinarily $458. That's a horrid .5 cents per point, so obviously much cheaper through Chase. So is that a revenue ticket with an awful points rate, and I just need to try different parameters to find the decent award ones?

Beef Of Ages
Jan 11, 2003

Your dumb is leaking.

runawayturtles posted:

I know the Chase portal is for revenue tickets, but are you saying that the tickets on airline websites when searching to pay with points may also be revenue tickets, and that's why the points costs are so high? If so, is the only way to find award tickets just to experiment with different days and airports until something reasonable shows up?

To give an example, on one random day the cheapest one-way JFK -> AMS on KLM is 68,000 points + $86, ordinarily $458. That's a horrid .5 cents per point, so obviously much cheaper through Chase. So is that a revenue ticket with an awful points rate, and I just need to try different parameters to find the decent award ones?

Sort of, but not quite. Super helpful, I know. :v:

For most airlines, including the majors in the US, they have moved to revenue-based pricing for awards. So when you search for an award ticket, it comes from an award bucket but there are (usually) multiple award fare buckets just as their are multiple revenue fare buckets. The non-discount awards have variable pricing that tends to move up and down with the equivalent revenue cost of that particular seat at that time.

Thus, the example you provided of the KL seat is indeed a poo poo redemption value. If you can use Chase points for a lower point value on a revenue ticket instead of transfering them 1:1 to FlyingPoo for a redemption, then you got good value from your Chase points. As you noted, other dates/times/destinations will have different point values for redemption so, as always, flexibility is key in finding a good fare, be it an award or a revenue ticket.

runawayturtles
Aug 2, 2004

Beef Of Ages posted:

Sort of, but not quite. Super helpful, I know. :v:

For most airlines, including the majors in the US, they have moved to revenue-based pricing for awards. So when you search for an award ticket, it comes from an award bucket but there are (usually) multiple award fare buckets just as their are multiple revenue fare buckets. The non-discount awards have variable pricing that tends to move up and down with the equivalent revenue cost of that particular seat at that time.

Thus, the example you provided of the KL seat is indeed a poo poo redemption value. If you can use Chase points for a lower point value on a revenue ticket instead of transfering them 1:1 to FlyingPoo for a redemption, then you got good value from your Chase points. As you noted, other dates/times/destinations will have different point values for redemption so, as always, flexibility is key in finding a good fare, be it an award or a revenue ticket.

Alright, I understand, thanks. Confirms my decision to eventually move off of travel cards towards straight cash back in the future, lol. I hate this kind of stuff.

mobby_6kl
Aug 9, 2009

mobby_6kl posted:

I think that was to avoid them messing that up too. She was going to some lodge in the middle of a rainforest that required a boat and a 4x4 to get to so who knows how that'd work out.



E: seems like Saudia's new schedule is out and I'd now have a 30h layover instead of 4 or whatever if I accept it

On the upside that should get me a free hotel and visa so it might not be a bad thing
So to follow up on this, they don't want to rebook me on this flight. I've tried several different helpdesk numbers and actually went into a brick and mortar office in Madrid (they told me to call the line but were helpful by trying to find different options).

Sometimes the website has multiple options

but sometimes they disappear completely. Which happened during my last attempt lol. Still eventually I got the guy to admit that there's a flights with the ~30h layover, but he still didn't want to make the change because it's not "one flight with a connection" or something. Even though it does show up in the booking system. They really want me to take the refund but I just want to go to Koreaaaaa :qq:

HookShot
Dec 26, 2005

priznat posted:

I知 flying for business in a couple weeks (YVR<-> YYZ, about a 4-5 hour flight depending on direction) and I知 eyeing the Air Canada seat upgrade bids. Are these a worthwhile deal on points for business or premium economy?

I have a modest 100k aeroplan points saved up. Do the prices fluctuate closer to the departure? Right now the bid range goes as low as 46k for business and 27k premium economy. I知 tall and getting crammed in economy is not fun. I値l gut it out if it痴 seen as a sucky deal though. I know very little about points rewards and rarely fly for pleasure trips.

If you already paid for the tickets AND that's what they want as the bid to upgrade, I would probably pass, personally, but that's also because I do travel a lot on Aeroplan points and want to maximize their value. TBH if you're not likely to use the points for anything else, given as you're tall and it's a fairly long flight I would probably go for the PE upgrade. But it's certainly not what I would call a good deal.

priznat
Jul 7, 2009

Let's get drunk and kiss each other all night.

HookShot posted:

If you already paid for the tickets AND that's what they want as the bid to upgrade, I would probably pass, personally, but that's also because I do travel a lot on Aeroplan points and want to maximize their value. TBH if you're not likely to use the points for anything else, given as you're tall and it's a fairly long flight I would probably go for the PE upgrade. But it's certainly not what I would call a good deal.

It ended up not winning the bid on the one way but getting it the other so I am good with that. It was pretty drat cramped on the flight out so I am really looking forward to it! Thankfully a 787 both ways and no clapped out airbuses.

goodness
Jan 3, 2012

When the light turns green, you go. When the light turns red, you stop. But what do you do when the light turns blue with orange and lavender spots?
Is French Bee from NYC to Paris worth the risk of them being a budget airline? Its under $250 one way.

Beef Of Ages
Jan 11, 2003

Your dumb is leaking.

goodness posted:

Is French Bee from NYC to Paris worth the risk of them being a budget airline? Its under $250 one way.

It depends on what you're looking for.

Is it a risk in terms of them operating as an airline? Probably not? They have to pass the same quality and maintenance procedures as any other airline that flies in Europe and the US so I wouldn't worry about it from that standpoint.

It is a risk to your sanity from being crammed into tiny seats for many hours? Yeah, probably. Their standard Y seat is only 16 inches which is ludicrously tiny. Most airlines offer Y seats that are between 17 and 18 inches wide and that inch makes a really big difference, especially for a transatlantic flight. But that's all personal comfort issues; if all you care about is getting to Paris and you're not a large person, go for it.

Jean-Paul Shartre
Jan 16, 2015

this sentence no verb


goodness posted:

Is French Bee from NYC to Paris worth the risk of them being a budget airline? Its under $250 one way.

Are you only flying one way? If you either have date flexibility or are willing to connect, I壇 expect to find AF or AA/BA for 550 or 600 round trip, and the difference between flying them and goddamn French bee is worth fifty bucks (or less if you want to check a bag or eat on the plane or such)

goodness
Jan 3, 2012

When the light turns green, you go. When the light turns red, you stop. But what do you do when the light turns blue with orange and lavender spots?

Jean-Paul Shartre posted:

Are you only flying one way? If you either have date flexibility or are willing to connect, I壇 expect to find AF or AA/BA for 550 or 600 round trip, and the difference between flying them and goddamn French bee is worth fifty bucks (or less if you want to check a bag or eat on the plane or such)

I wish, coming back from Oslo on Norse Atlantic.

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Beef Of Ages
Jan 11, 2003

Your dumb is leaking.

goodness posted:

I wish, coming back from Oslo on Norse Atlantic.

I see you've embraced the new "Glutton For Punishment" fares.

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