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Especially in light of poo poo like the loadouts, the respawn time changes, the respawn clocks, even the nerf to the LG and the implementation of HMG is more worthy of scorn IMO.
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Oct 30, 2014 21:08
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But, that all said, if you play q3 with osp or cpm, or pay to play the good modes in ql, and hell probably even q2, qw, q4 and maybe warsow are still better than UT.
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Oct 30, 2014 21:09
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Wormskull posted:But, that all said, if you play q3 with osp or cpm, or pay to play the good modes in ql, and hell probably even q2, qw, q4 and maybe warsow are still better than UT. if you think quake 4 is better than any of the UTs you might be slightly bitter
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Oct 30, 2014 21:10
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Quake 4 1v1 still is but I can imagine the team based modes being kind of lovely.
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Oct 30, 2014 21:11
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Wormskull posted:But, that all said, if you play q3 with osp or cpm, or pay to play the good modes in ql, and hell probably even q2, qw, q4 and maybe warsow are still better than UT. lmfao
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Oct 30, 2014 21:15
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Loadouts destroy DM too. It becomes a kamikaze-fest because dying doesn't matter. I should have communicated it better, but I meant that loadouts were a better idea than auto-bunnyhop for bridging the gap between newbies and experienced players. The main source of frustration for new players is fighting the guy with the rocket launcher when all they have is a piddly machine gun. Some sort of "Frag Fest" game mode, which would be classic DM except players spawn with a loadout (or even all weapons), could have been fun in a completely mindless way. It would also allow newbies to get better at aiming without needing to get better at getting the weapons first. Auto-bunnyhopping on the other hand? I doubt strafe jumping is the main concern on any new player's mind, or even a source of frustration. At most they'll see some guy speeding across the map and will want to learn that. It's not an issue because strafe jumping provides map mobility, not combat mobility. They should instead have worked on better tutorials to learn strafe jumping. Not only did they not do that, they actually made the tutorials slightly harder to find. All the changes they made were terrible, but I think bunnyhopping is the stupidest one, even though it had the least impact on the game. Falsum fucked around with this message at 21:44 on Oct 30, 2014 |
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Oct 30, 2014 21:42
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the latest version of Quake 4 was a faster, arguably better Q3/QL, but it's a dead game anyway so meh. wallrunning in the new UT looks fun in theory, but like everything in UT, it feels slower than it should be and will probably be unbalanced because UT is about showing off as much cool poo poo as possible.
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Oct 30, 2014 21:44
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Map mobility is an issue because playing proper quake is half if not more about controlling the map. Making things good for people in a mindless way doesn't fix anything and if you wanted to learn how to aim you could always just play clan arena or start up a server with all the weapons or something, which was a thing for a year or so with the Start A Server feature that came with a pro subscription. I don't know what you mean by DM unless you mean like FFA in which case, yeah it ruined that too I guess.
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Oct 30, 2014 21:46
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And people who want to take the game seriously, that is, play the game the way it becomes the best multiplayer shooter there is rather than just the best mindless shooting people game, aren't going to be satisfied with the small speed boost the autojumping gives. People who wouldn't try to learn proper movement with the autojumping probably wouldn't have tried without it since they're interested in going on a server and shooting there friends for an hour and then doing homework or whatever.
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Oct 30, 2014 21:51
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Unless by stupidest you mean like, why did they do it this way, in which case I don't know, I guess. Making it so weapons respawn instantly in TDM is pretty stupid, and the implementation of the item clocks in world is pretty stupid, although it's not a really horrendous concept IMO. If "they could of done it better" is your argument I don't even care though since, well, I'm talking about the relative quality of games and this particular change doesn't really do much one way or the other to affect the quality.
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Oct 30, 2014 21:56
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Heck I even seen some decent arguments against the damage number pop ups they put in, though I'm skeptical of them because given enough (and likely a short amount) time pretty much everyone who plays the game can approximate that stuff with decent precision, and it's not like it tells you how much health they had before you shot them or whatever, and the main complaint is stuff like "Well it would take risks out of the game" or something.
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Oct 30, 2014 22:00
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It's been a while since I followed QL, but I don't remember it having loadouts.
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Oct 30, 2014 22:02
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Iron Casanova posted:It's been a while since I followed QL, but I don't remember it having loadouts. When they brought it to steam to try to make it easier to get into they put a bunch of dubious crap in for newbies that probably at this point after the month initial f2p phase are just vestiges of the time the iDiots needed a lot of money for there hemorrhaging game.
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Oct 30, 2014 22:05
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Wormskull posted:When they brought it to steam to try to make it easier to get into they put a bunch of dubious crap in for newbies that probably at this point after the month initial f2p phase are just vestiges of the time the iDiots needed a lot of money for there hemorrhaging game. didnt it backfire horribly and make most of the few people still playing it leave? at least thats what i hope happened
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Oct 30, 2014 22:06
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I agree that map mobility is important, what I'm saying is that Id never thought for a second they would play proper Quake, that's why free Duel still uses the classic ruleset. All those changes were intended to decrease new player frustration, and map mobility is not one of their problems. Yeah, when I say stupidest, I mean "why did they do this, it accomplishes nothing." It doesn't have any impact on the game, but while I can get how loadouts help new players, I don't think auto-bunnyhop does anything for them. Quake Live would have been better served by the implementation of proper matchmaking, and strafe jump specifically could use better tutorials. I'm not familiar with QL's engine, but a system could actually present the player with feedback on how they're messing up strafe jumping.
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Oct 30, 2014 22:07
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It made those people complain a lot but a lot of them at least stuck around to pad there k/ds on the newbies or something.
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Oct 30, 2014 22:07
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THE PENETRATOR posted:rest in peace. half life 2 dm. The only time I ever played HL2DM, I killed someone by hitting them in the head with a toilet and laughed my rear end off in the middle of an internet cafe.
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Oct 30, 2014 22:09
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HL2DM was so cool, killing players with objects never got old.
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Oct 30, 2014 22:10
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MondayHotDog posted:The only time I ever played HL2DM, I killed someone by hitting them in the head with a toilet and laughed my rear end off in the middle of an internet cafe. I remember I was playing G-Mod once on a goon server and there was a big ole highway and some guy was doing something on it I guess because when I was seeing how accurate the magnum thing was at long range I shot some prop and then I seen the flying toilet icon murder a guy named NecroDwarf or something and he started going crazy in the chat and I quietly left.
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Oct 30, 2014 22:11
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Wormskull posted:When they brought it to steam to try to make it easier to get into they put a bunch of dubious crap in for newbies that probably at this point after the month initial f2p phase are just vestiges of the time the iDiots needed a lot of money for there hemorrhaging game. Wow, didn't even know it was on Steam.I guess they figured it would breath some life into it.
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Oct 30, 2014 22:11
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Wormskull posted:I remember I was playing G-Mod once on a goon server and there was a big ole highway and some guy was doing something on it I guess because when I was seeing how accurate the magnum thing was at long range I shot some prop and then I seen the flying toilet icon murder a guy named NecroDwarf or something and he started going crazy in the chat and I quietly left. the best way to play any gmod game is through social engineering and ghosting with a group over vent/ts/mumble
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Oct 30, 2014 22:21
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Falsum posted:I agree that map mobility is important, what I'm saying is that Id never thought for a second they would play proper Quake, that's why free Duel still uses the classic ruleset. All those changes were intended to decrease new player frustration, and map mobility is not one of their problems. I think the playerbase is too small for proper matchmaking these days, the tier system used to work fine when it was in open beta and a solid amount of people played. That was when they had a real opportunity of making Quake a thing again, but id decided to put it in a browser instead of on Steam and didn't bother to fix the friendslist for years. In conclusion, free market won and Halo is the only arena shooter left.
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Oct 30, 2014 22:43
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muddream posted:Halo is the only arena shooter left. It's been 10 years since I played a Halo game, was it really an arena shooter?
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Oct 30, 2014 23:42
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im a wormskull sympathizer
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Oct 30, 2014 23:51
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Iron Casanova posted:It's been 10 years since I played a Halo game, was it really an arena shooter? I only played the first two and in those games everyone starts with the same basic guns and you need to control the map to safely access weapons/vehicles/powerups. I believe they added loadouts with Reach and expanded on that with Halo 4, but Halo 2 Anniversary won't have any of that stuff. The lack of health/armor pickups doesn't alter the core gameplay structure for TDM/CTF. Obviously duel and clan arena aren't viable modes, but the same can be said for UT.
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Oct 31, 2014 09:39
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