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GRILLARY CLINTON
Mar 5, 2016

I know the devil is real.
I know the devil is real.
also OP depending on how down to the nitty gritty you wanna get the answer is always just going to end up being "that's just what we observe :shrug:"

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The Protagonist
Jun 29, 2009

The average is 5.5? I thought it was 4. This is very unsettling.

GRILLARY CLINTON posted:

I'm not sure exactly what you mean, but I was referring specifically to the fact that electric charge (which, yes, is one of many types of charge of which we know) may be positive or negative, while gravitational mass (which is the only kind of mass we know about, by the equivalence principle) is only positive.

you're right baout electric charge, but there's also color charge of quarks which has three flavors but follows the same same-opposites rule, and we also know about antimass but it's unconfirmed(?) at this point if it is repelled or attracted by massive gravitational fields yet

GRILLARY CLINTON
Mar 5, 2016

I know the devil is real.
I know the devil is real.
right, there are three color charge carried by quarks and gluons and three electroweak charges that get broken down to a single EM charge at low energies.

i don't know what you mean by antimass, but we don't currently know of any particles with negative mass (and such a thing is prohibited from appearing in a relativistic quantum field theory by causality). there are antiparticles/antimatter, but they all have positive mass and there are no (classical) open questions about how they interact with gravity

fuck. marry. t-rex
Jan 23, 2014

Lipstick Apathy
Opposites attract and that's tragic
Cuz I'm drawn to bitch OPs like a magnet

The Protagonist
Jun 29, 2009

The average is 5.5? I thought it was 4. This is very unsettling.

GRILLARY CLINTON posted:

right, there are three color charge carried by quarks and gluons and three electroweak charges that get broken down to a single EM charge at low energies.

i don't know what you mean by antimass, but we don't currently know of any particles with negative mass (and such a thing is prohibited from appearing in a relativistic quantum field theory by causality). there are antiparticles/antimatter, but they all have positive mass and there are no (classical) open questions about how they interact with gravity

i'm saying that the sense of antimatter acceleration in a gravitational field is actually still as of yet unknown, or unconfirmed, even if it is suspected it has the same sense as regular matter

Masturbasturd
Sep 1, 2014
It's like how a drug crazed serial rapist and an innocent unsuspecting sexy victim just kind of magically connect right?

GRILLARY CLINTON
Mar 5, 2016

I know the devil is real.
I know the devil is real.

The Protagonist posted:

i'm saying that the sense of antimatter acceleration in a gravitational field is actually still as of yet unknown, or unconfirmed, even if it is suspected it has the same sense as regular matter

i guess that is true in the sense that there is no smoking gun experiment that shows that antiparticles couple to gravity the same way as "regular" particles, but theory and a lot of circumstantial evidence says they do. you would be hard-pressed to find a physicist who would say it's a totally open question and not just a matter of dotting a couple "i"s.

MiracleWhale
Jun 30, 2015


is op neg or poz

The Protagonist
Jun 29, 2009

The average is 5.5? I thought it was 4. This is very unsettling.

GRILLARY CLINTON posted:

but theory and a lot of circumstantial evidence says they do.

i'm legit interested in what literature there is on this because i'd taken it for granted antimatter falls down until i encountered a physicist who corrected me in that it was unknown.

Applewhite
Aug 16, 2014

by vyelkin
Nap Ghost

The Sphinxster posted:

Why would they lose mass? Momentum changes when they move.

They'd lose mass because, hypothetically, they were converting some of it into propulsive energy. Obviously they don't but why they don't was one of the questions.

Kirk Vikernes
Apr 26, 2004

Count Goatnackh

loving magnets, how do they work?

Applewhite
Aug 16, 2014

by vyelkin
Nap Ghost

Dirk Squarejaw posted:

loving magnets, how do they work?

Original thread title.

But then I realized the real question was why do they work.

Nathilus
Apr 4, 2002

I alone can see through the media bias.

I'm also stupid on a scale that can only be measured in Reddits.

I too am a stray tomcat and have a thing for 80s chicks. I'm not quite clear on how these two things are opposites tho.

GRILLARY CLINTON
Mar 5, 2016

I know the devil is real.
I know the devil is real.

The Protagonist posted:

i'm legit interested in what literature there is on this because i'd taken it for granted antimatter falls down until i encountered a physicist who corrected me in that it was unknown.

i'd say the two most important bits of indirect evidence are
  • in the standard model, which as you probably know is very well-tested, antiparticles have positive inertial mass. if their inertial was negative, all the LHC predictions would be wrong basically. then by the equivalence principle, inertial mass is the same as gravitational mass. so antimatter interacts with gravity the same as matter
  • quantum field theory, which is the framework under which the standard model falls, prohibits negative inertial mass on the grounds that it would violate causality
there's also the fact that we've detected both neutrinos and antineutrinos from a supernova behaving the same, although we (arguably) don't really understand neutrinos fully. The intro to this paper, which is a(n inconclusive) direct test, has references to literature discussing these and other points.

granted, we don't have a quantum theory of gravity, we don't understand why there's more matter than antimatter in the universe, and we don't know how to account for all the dark matter and dark energy in the universe, so there's a lot about gravity and mass we don't know. it could turn out that we need a radically different theory where antimatter "falls up" to explain all this. i'm open to that, but think it's unlikely.

Applewhite
Aug 16, 2014

by vyelkin
Nap Ghost
My theory is that there is an equal amount of matter and antimatter in the universe, but the antimatter was all blown backwards in time at the instant of the big bang. Normal matter traveling backwards through time is indistinguishable from anti-matter.

Izzhov
Dec 6, 2013

My head hurts.
ClamdestineBoyster is really good at technobabble.

Applewhite posted:

They'd lose mass because, hypothetically, they were converting some of it into propulsive energy. Obviously they don't but why they don't was one of the questions.

Mass isn't the only way to store energy. Charged particles store it in the electric field.

Izzhov
Dec 6, 2013

My head hurts.
Also the real answer is electrons and protons attract by shooting lasers at each other

http://physics.stackexchange.com/questions/57874/do-protons-exchange-photons-with-electrons

penus penus penus
Nov 9, 2014

by piss__donald
That's a fundamental question of the universe Mr apple , right up there with why does gravity do what it do and how do magnets actually work

Communist Bear
Oct 7, 2008

Applewhite posted:

My theory is that there is an equal amount of matter and antimatter in the universe, but the antimatter was all blown backwards in time at the instant of the big bang. Normal matter traveling backwards through time is indistinguishable from anti-matter.

*nods thoughtfully*

But how will this help me in having sex with Paula Abdul?

OXBALLS DOT COM
Sep 11, 2005

by FactsAreUseless
Young Orc
Because gender is real and is in fact a fundamental force in the cosmos, op

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ClamdestineBoyster
Aug 15, 2015
Probation
Can't post for 10 years!

GRILLARY CLINTON posted:

i'd say the two most important bits of indirect evidence are
  • in the standard model, which as you probably know is very well-tested, antiparticles have positive inertial mass. if their inertial was negative, all the LHC predictions would be wrong basically. then by the equivalence principle, inertial mass is the same as gravitational mass. so antimatter interacts with gravity the same as matter
  • quantum field theory, which is the framework under which the standard model falls, prohibits negative inertial mass on the grounds that it would violate causality
there's also the fact that we've detected both neutrinos and antineutrinos from a supernova behaving the same, although we (arguably) don't really understand neutrinos fully. The intro to this paper, which is a(n inconclusive) direct test, has references to literature discussing these and other points.

granted, we don't have a quantum theory of gravity, we don't understand why there's more matter than antimatter in the universe, and we don't know how to account for all the dark matter and dark energy in the universe, so there's a lot about gravity and mass we don't know. it could turn out that we need a radically different theory where antimatter "falls up" to explain all this. i'm open to that, but think it's unlikely.

There isn't actually anti-matter though. When they do those particle collisions they are knocking the electron cloud out of place so fast that the proton can't catch up. It's a broken electrical circuit then so the proton seeks ground, expending all of its angular momentum that is stored like a spring in its atom state. Since a little speck of noire is created by the particle collision, that little black hole is the most conductive groundpath relative to the proton, so you essentially have a little curved laser beam orbiting a speck of noire (heat expanding into cold) and it's angular momentum is expended in a short period of time, which we can see as it emits light or radio frequency as its inertia evaporates. So it's not a subatomic particle :airquote:, it's light, and light as it behaves after it crosses the threshold of absolute zero temperature. It can curl clockwise or counter-clockwise and there is no way of predicting which way it will go.

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