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JBP posted:Do you have any symptoms or are you participating in the big test? Hopefully you're all good. Bad sore throat yesterday. Coughing today. They said if you get more symptoms after the first day to come in and get tested, partially because they can test everyone now. Been in bed most of the time, I’m not feeling too bad apart from the throat. It’s probably not the Rona but you can’t pretend it isn’t. If it is and we don’t it will explode again. Just look at Singapore.
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Apr 29, 2020 05:19
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Comstar posted:Bad sore throat yesterday. Coughing today. They said if you get more symptoms after the first day to come in and get tested, partially because they can test everyone now. Yeah good move getting tested. Hopefully it's a negative on covid and just a lovely flu. On scribes thing, he's referring to a study that's less than a week old saying throw open the gates. It's absolutely stupid to immediately say it's all fine prior to peer review and prior to thinking through a management plan for drop offs, parental contact, possibility of transmission (some children have got covid and some have become sick) and any other ancillary factors. He's advocating a really dangerous read on a real scientific finding for personal reasons. It's galling. E: and the teachers union aren't going to agree to poo poo until this work is done properly. NSW seems to have a decent staggered return and I imagine we will do something similar based on the response of teachers there which seems positive. JBP fucked around with this message at 05:30 on Apr 29, 2020 |
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Apr 29, 2020 05:27
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JBP posted:Yeah good move getting tested. Hopefully, it's a negative on covid and just a lovely flu. So your opinion is that the medical experts in Australia advocating for schools to open are wrong? quote:University of Sydney infectious diseases expert and professor of paediatrics Robert Booy said it appeared Victoria was "following a counsel of perfection" and choosing not to act on evidence suggesting it was safe to reopen schools. https://www.theage.com.au/national/victoria/evidence-says-it-is-safe-to-reopen-schools-20200427-p54noi.html
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Apr 29, 2020 05:30
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CelestialScribe posted:So your opinion is that the medical experts in Australia advocating for schools to open are wrong? No. Please read more carefully.
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Apr 29, 2020 05:30
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JBP posted:No. Please read more carefully. It seems that's what you're saying.
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Apr 29, 2020 05:32
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CelestialScribe posted:So your opinion is that the medical experts in Australia advocating for schools to open are wrong? Might want to read the whole article there chief, there's a whole bunch of other professors saying "we don't know" and a study that is yet to be peer reviewed. Also "But experts agreed strict hygiene standards and social distancing would be crucial to preventing outbreaks if schools were to reopen.". Just loving lol if you think this is going to happen in our currently overworked and under supported public school system. E: I have a kid at home and she's driving me loving bonkers - I'm working from home full time and my wife is doing her thesis. I want her to be back in school so she can see her friends and continue learning in an environment she's better suited to learning in. But like JBP's said below, this poo poo doesn't happen in a vacuum - other countries that have opened schools have thrown considerable resources at things like mandatory temperature checks on entry and more staff to ensure social distancing. There's NO sign of that even being considered with Australian schools. If we put that in, sure, lets re-open schools. If they're not going to? Not worth the risk without solid peer reviewed data on hand that says that these measures don't actually matter. Mattjpwns fucked around with this message at 05:47 on Apr 29, 2020 |
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Apr 29, 2020 05:33
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Pleasant Friend posted:It looks like South Australia and Northern Territory have already eliminated it, Western Australia had only one case. I'm really trying to avoid getting my hopes up too much here in SA, because while the numbers certainly look like that could be the case it only takes one undetected case out there for everything to go bad. Probably the reason they still aren't officially talking about goals of elimination yet, because if they started getting people to hope that might happen and it doesn't it would be a pretty big blow.
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Apr 29, 2020 05:36
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CelestialScribe posted:It seems that's what you're saying. You quoted what I said. Read more carefully. Doctors are not education administrators. Doctors are not policymakers. Children do not teleport to school. Doctors are saying they have evidence to support opening schools, that does not mean policymakers should throw open the gates with no thought or caution. You also need communications campaigning because parents aren't going to just start sending kids to school. poo poo doesn't occur in a vacuum around your circumstances.
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Apr 29, 2020 05:36
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JBP posted:You quoted what I said. Read more carefully. Doctors are not education administrators. Doctors are not policymakers. Children do not teleport to school. Doctors are saying they have evidence to support opening schools, that does not mean policymakers should throw open the gates with no thought or caution. You also need communications campaigning because parents aren't going to just start sending kids to school. Okay. At what point do you think schools should open? Because that's the other thing - the Government isn't being clear with its guidelines. It isn't saying, "we want to see X, Y and Z" before schools open again. That's a problem.
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Apr 29, 2020 05:37
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JBP posted:NSW seems to have a decent staggered return and I imagine we will do something similar based on the response of teachers there which seems positive. This is not the case at all amongst the NSW teachers I've spoken to. My understanding (unless it's changed) is that it's being left up to the schools with no guidance about how/when to manage students returning, and teachers are still being expected to teach the students online as well as in class simultaneously, because only a quarter of students per class will attend daily. It's an absolute shitshow that's being motivated by Alan Jones and "gotta open fast".
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Apr 29, 2020 05:56
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Whitlam posted:This is not the case at all amongst the NSW teachers I've spoken to. My understanding (unless it's changed) is that it's being left up to the schools with no guidance about how/when to manage students returning, and teachers are still being expected to teach the students online as well as in class simultaneously, because only a quarter of students per class will attend daily. It's an absolute shitshow that's being motivated by Alan Jones and "gotta open fast". Yeah this is the thing that shits me the most about it, teachers are being expected to pull a ridiculous workload whilst putting themselves at risk. Where's the extra teaching aides to help? I know that there's things you can't do without proper training and education, but even getting some people in there with Working With Children checks to help with physically moving things around to accommodate new arrangements, taking on playground duties, etc. Or, I dunno, started training people in specific duties weeks ago to help out with this when schools were first closed down and we knew we'd have to ramp back up in this manner? There doesn't appear to be any extra support from anyone and I fully support the unions going "gently caress you" until there is. Teachers are underpaid and underappreciated in the best of times, and these are not the best of times.
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Apr 29, 2020 06:04
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Whitlam posted:This is not the case at all amongst the NSW teachers I've spoken to. My understanding (unless it's changed) is that it's being left up to the schools with no guidance about how/when to manage students returning, and teachers are still being expected to teach the students online as well as in class simultaneously, because only a quarter of students per class will attend daily. It's an absolute shitshow that's being motivated by Alan Jones and "gotta open fast". Oh yeah for sure. I'm talking more generally that the teachers union have approached it positively. I'm not under any misunderstanding that there will be teachers utterly opposed. The onus on teachers to just work all of this stuff out themselves has been one of the things that's pissed me off since day one. As far as opening schools in Vic. Get the peer reviewed info. Get the month on month data mid May. Work on a return plan that is manageable and safe prior to that date. Then on that date, should the ducks align, open schools in staggered stages. Don't promise people that if XYZ happens that you'll do it for sure. This isn't a beep boop situation. Things are coming in sideways and unpredictably. We are in a global crisis that's unrivalled in my life and a bullish approach to any easing of restrictions or other public health policy could result in catastrophic outcomes. E: Mattjpwns posted:Teachers. Hell yeah buddy.
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Apr 29, 2020 06:05
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Mattjpwns posted:Yeah this is the thing that shits me the most about it, teachers are being expected to pull a ridiculous workload whilst putting themselves at risk. Grade 1/2 teacher coming in to say that the workload is actually higher at the moment than it is in the classroom, at least at my school. Between giving feedback on every activity (and there's 5-7 per day), planning meetings and constant phone calls to parents, it's a lot more than normal.
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Apr 29, 2020 06:14
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GlenMR posted:Grade 1/2 teacher coming in to say that the workload is actually higher at the moment than it is in the classroom, at least at my school. Between giving feedback on every activity (and there's 5-7 per day), planning meetings and constant phone calls to parents, it's a lot more than normal. Yeah that's been the experience of the three teachers I know too, two of whom are in early primary. I'm sorry you're not getting the support and assistance you need, there are a lot of parents I know (myself included!) that are furious about your situation and it's just not good enough. Is there anything that parents can do that helps you out a little?
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Apr 29, 2020 06:17
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My wife's a high school teacher, and it mirrors GlenMR's situation. She's teaching, while also on the phone to parents non stop, and is also trying to be an interim tech support worker to everyone as their video conferencing fails in new and interesting ways. She's doing 10+ hrs every day, then having staff cohort meetings on weekends to prepare for the next week. But she's also very hesitant to just be back in the classroom, because there's absolutely no way to enact social distancing for a classroom of 30 kids.
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Apr 29, 2020 06:19
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JBP posted:Oh yeah for sure. I'm talking more generally that the teachers union have approached it positively. I'm not under any misunderstanding that there will be teachers utterly opposed. The onus on teachers to just work all of this stuff out themselves has been one of the things that's pissed me off since day one. Do you think schools returning at the same time we have community cases is a good idea?
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Apr 29, 2020 06:21
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CelestialScribe posted:Do you think schools returning at the same time we have community cases is a good idea? Depends on management and tracing. I'm not a doctor or a policymaker. All I can go on is support for schools is fine, but implementation will take some time. We have very few community infections right now and if that keeps up I think schools should start returning in two weeks with that surety and planning around it. The only issue is if we increase social gatherings or ease restrictions on business that these things can play together and new clusters may emerge, which makes everything pointless and returns us to today or last month. We should only proceed with the greatest levels of surety.
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Apr 29, 2020 06:28
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If we send kids back and everyone is fine in the main, but a cluster kills a child via complications like Kawasaki, was it worth it? That child is dead. No catch up, no retry, no renewed effort.
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Apr 29, 2020 06:31
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JBP posted:If we send kids back and everyone is fine in the main, but a cluster kills a child via complications like Kawasaki, was it worth it? That child is dead. No catch up, no retry, no renewed effort. In that case we shouldn’t open schools until we have a vaccine.
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Apr 29, 2020 06:35
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CelestialScribe posted:In that case we shouldn’t open schools until we have a vaccine. Or until we are at 0 cases of community transmission for 2 weeks.
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Apr 29, 2020 06:38
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CelestialScribe posted:In that case we shouldn’t open schools until we have a vaccine. We are accidentally approaching virtual eradication. If in two weeks we still have single digits (and I'm talking 1 or 2 right now) positive testing even with the enormous testing drive that's being run they should go back in stages to accommodate ongoing restrictions. That is a strong level of surety.
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Apr 29, 2020 06:39
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JBP posted:We are accidentally approaching virtual eradication. If in two weeks we still have single digits (and I'm talking 1 or 2 right now) positive testing even with the enormous testing drive that's being run. They should go back. That is a strong level of surety. And what happens if it somehow comes back? My point is we will never be at 100% certainty no matter what.
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Apr 29, 2020 06:40
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CelestialScribe posted:And what happens if it somehow comes back? Then we strive for as close to, rather than firing the gun four days after a paper is published. Just wait on the testing drive results. We might find there are loads of silent cases and avert a disaster. We might find there are few and have surety around easing restrictions.
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Apr 29, 2020 06:43
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That's the crux of all of this to me. We can't ask for 100% certainty, but we can wait on the results of widespread community testing over two weeks. (Which is the bit I like about what Andrews is doing by drastically broadening the testing criteria) If the results from that are good (I'd leave it for others to define good, but ultimately you'd want to aim for an NZ situation of "We know explicitly where all the cases are with a high degree of certainty so we can contain it and monitor effectively"), then lets start the windback. Two more weeks in the overall picture to ensure a better risk assessment is worth it, I feel. YMMV.
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Apr 29, 2020 06:47
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JBP posted:Then we strive for as close to, rather than firing the gun four days after a paper is published. My child and many other children are actively being harmed every single day they are not at school. Disagree with me on opening schools, fine. Just something worth thinking about. “Just wait on the results” means something significantly different for me than it does for you.
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Apr 29, 2020 06:49
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CelestialScribe posted:My child and many other children are actively being harmed every single day they are not at school. I'm comfortable with that.
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Apr 29, 2020 06:50
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JBP posted:I'm comfortable with that. I’ll just tell my son to pull his disability up by his bootstraps.
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Apr 29, 2020 06:52
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CelestialScribe posted:I’ll just tell my son to pull his disability up by his bootstraps. Knock yourself out.
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Apr 29, 2020 06:53
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JBP posted:Knock yourself out. Congrats, this is post number 22,222.
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Apr 29, 2020 07:00
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BurgerQuest posted:Congrats, this is post number 22,222. Auspol Summer - Knock yourself out.
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Apr 29, 2020 07:03
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Mattjpwns posted:Auspol Summer - Knock yourself out. Wake me up when this poo poo thread ends
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Apr 29, 2020 07:04
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GoldStandardConure posted:Wake me up when this poo poo thread ends
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Apr 29, 2020 07:10
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Mattjpwns posted:Yeah that's been the experience of the three teachers I know too, two of whom are in early primary. I'm sorry you're not getting the support and assistance you need, there are a lot of parents I know (myself included!) that are furious about your situation and it's just not good enough. I've been pretty lucky with my kids, their parents have been awesome and supportive throughout the whole thing. A couple have been frustrated with a lack of access to devices, but hard copies of all the tasks are available too. What parents can do is appreciate that this is new ground for everyone. We worked our arses off planning for this shift last term, but schools were given leave to prepare in their own ways, and not every school will have the same strategy. Everyone from leadership to teacher to student to parent is going to get something wrong along the way. We all need to forgive a little bit more than normal. As far as returning goes, I'd rather one whole isolated term than a bunch of kids out for funerals.
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Apr 29, 2020 07:11
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It is time for Auspol Autumn. This poo poo thread is over.
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Apr 29, 2020 07:19
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