|
Fallom posted:So what's it mean when organizations claim that a booster is "unnecessary" without any further explanation? Does one only become "necessary" when the effectiveness of the existing doses drops below a certain level? that's fine for you but pretty much no public health agency would agree
|
#
?
Sep 13, 2021 15:20
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 4, 2024 21:04 |
|
|
Are we talking about the lancet article published today? Its talking about the fact that on a population level the marginal benefits from using boosters on serious illness/death compared to the ability to save lifes on unvaccinated populance makes it useless. In a situation where its booster or nothing, I guess it would make sense (though would be interested if for healthy 30/20s we're at the point where risk of blood clotting/heart problems are reaching the marginal benefit of a third) https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cn...s-conclude.html
|
|
#
?
Sep 13, 2021 16:15
|
|
|
I want to share my perspective from Hong Kong since this thread is so often about the US only. Last year and for the first few months of this year, it felt like Hong Kong was doing a great job with its Covid response. Despite being one of the first places hit with Covid, the government and the population responded in a way that limited outbreaks and kept the case and death total low despite an extremely dense, very elderly population. It seemed highly grounded in science and precautionary principles. And it was all done in a way that didn't seem to impact life too much. Restaurants were at limited capacity and hours. Gyms and bars were closed at times. Other large-crowd events were canceled. Masking and hygiene were universal except in natural parks. Outdoor sports were allowed. There were a few 'waves' that paled in comparison to waves in other countries, both in absolute and relative senses. Interestingly to me, in every case past Wave 1, the source of the outbreak had some sort of link to social issues in Hong Kong. An airline pilot (the epitome of expat self-entitlement) abused his entry privileges and went straight from landing to a popular restaurant, setting off one wave. A band performed in multiple bars in the nightlife zone and set off another major wave. Rich elderly women holding private 'dance parties' with young 'dance instructors' brought in on speedboats from mainland set off another wave. Another wave involved foreign prostitutes living in unlicensed hostels on expired visas. It seemed like every outbreak told some story about haves and have nots in Hong Kong. Vaccine programs began in early 2021. Demand was nonexistent. Anti-vaxx messaging was (and is) all over the place. Government policies to encourage vaccination are frequently counterproductive. Just today the government issued a warning to the national airline for firing a worker who refused to get vaccinated. The anti-vaxx sentiments in HK are different from the US. Partly it's sensationalist rags promoting bullshit; partly it's skepticism of vaccines made in China. Unfortunately it seems like some people have rallied around the lovely tabloids that promote disinfo because of the concurrent anti-democratic crackdowns on those publications. It has become increasingly difficult to understand what the government is trying to do. They've tripled down on a 'zero covid' strategy without doing much to accelerate vaccination. The PM of Singapore threw shade on HK when announcing their own abandonment of a zero covid strategy. The HK government has increased quarantine periods to 21 days for inbound travelers from most countries in response to a case that was later determined to be transmitted during quarantine. So it might be the only place that is actually increasing risk through its quarantine program. They continue to move the goal posts on milestones that would see policies relaxed. They've continued to count cases in a strangely exaggerated manner. For example, a couple that traveled to Kyrgyzstan for 2 weeks returned to HK, tested positive, and were logged as 'local cases' rather than 'imported cases' because the HK government claims there is a 21-day incubation period and that the couple could have carried Covid with them to Kyrgyzstan and back. But they've also reduced the quarantine period for foreign domestic workers from the Philippines and Indonesia (both legitimately high-risk origins), because god forbid people don't have their servants. I suspect that it is all heavily driven by politics with mainland China. Before Covid, HK was having enormous pro-democracy protests. Since Covid, countless anti-democratic policy changes have been made that hand more power to the Party and accelerate the full transition of HK to mainland China. I do not think a lot of these changes would have been made under non-Covid circumstances when more of the world's attention would have been on HK. At the risk of being a conspiracy theorist, I also suspect that HK's Covid policies are going to be increasingly twisted to meet the political direction coming from the mainland. The new policy is that reopening with mainland must come before reopening with the rest of the world, as some sort of symbolic gesture. But reopening with mainland will not happen until at least the Beijing Olympics have ended, and more likely after Xi's third term begins in late 2022. And until then, HK authorities will have to keep coming up with embarrassingly unscientific justifications for maintaining strict (or just plain absurd) policies, like 21-day incubation periods and time-traveling infections. Smeef fucked around with this message at 16:43 on Sep 13, 2021 |
|
#
?
Sep 13, 2021 16:41
|
|
|
At this point if you come to work sniffling and coughing and refuse to wear a mask you should just have "rear end in a top hat" branded on your forehead. That he's allowed to do that is ridiculous.
|
|
#
?
Sep 13, 2021 16:59
|
|
|
Weasling Weasel posted:Are we talking about the lancet article published today? quote:They said there are risks to distributing boosters too soon, including the potential for side effects such as a rare heart inflammation condition known as myocarditis, which is more common after the second dose of mRNA vaccines. Wow antivaxx much? They’re not saying the risks outweigh the benefits. They’re just concern trolling.
|
|
#
?
Sep 13, 2021 17:05
|
|
|
The comparison in the US isn't boosters vs. vaccinating the unvaxxed, it's boosters vs. dumpsters
|
|
#
?
Sep 13, 2021 17:15
|
|
|
Fallom posted:The comparison in the US isn't boosters vs. vaccinating the unvaxxed, it's boosters vs. dumpsters Other countries have sold or given away doses that were otherwise headed to the dumpster. I’m sure once boosters are given the average American poster on here still won’t want to see the rest of the world vaccinated, they’ll just argue that the US needs a stockpile ‘just in case’.
|
|
#
?
Sep 13, 2021 18:43
|
|
|
Yeah, while I'm sure you can't recapture 100% of vaccines to go to other countries before they expire (getting vaccines that have already been distributed to individual pharmacies is probably impractical for example), certainly there's a way to manage your supply chain so that excess vaccines are kept centralized and can be diverted somewhere else if they're at risk of spoiling. Canada has a set number of vaccines in it's stockpile (4 million, IIRC) and is planning to continually ship the older vaccines out and replace with new ones to maintain that number long-term.
|
|
#
?
Sep 13, 2021 18:51
|
|
|
Got Moderna #2 yesterday, but I also had one dose of Sputnik, so I’ve technically had 3 separate shots. Really was hoping that side effects on the third one would be mild but no luck. I hope they refine boosters quite a bit because having to deal with 36-48 hours of side effects every time is gonna loving suck.
|
|
#
?
Sep 13, 2021 19:32
|
|
|
Ur Getting Fatter posted:I hope they refine boosters quite a bit because having to deal with 36-48 hours of side effects every time is gonna loving suck. Did you take Tylenol or anything else for it? I haven’t, out of perhaps misplaced caution, but if this happens every year, I’m going to have to.
|
|
#
?
Sep 13, 2021 20:00
|
|
|
Platystemon posted:Did you take Tylenol or anything else for it? I'm taking 400mg ibuprofen every 8 hours and that helps quite a bit, and to be fair the side effects are significantly milder than on the second dose, but I still spiked almost 103 and I'm just extremely tired. Managed to avoid the headaches this time, at least.
|
|
#
?
Sep 13, 2021 20:05
|
|
|
New thread is going up today. Before I close this one, does anyone want to throw out new thread title ideas? Short and sweet so I can keep an updated date in the thread title. Thinking about going with Delta Force but I dunno, it's lacking in cleverness or a certain je ne sais quois that a Something Awful thread title should typically have.
|
|
#
?
Sep 13, 2021 20:12
|
|
|
I had absolutely zero side effects from my third dose (I had a pretty intense headache from my second, but certainly not any insanely serious side effects). All pfizer. I was on immunosuppressants for the 3rd and not the previous 2 so that may be a factor.
|
|
#
?
Sep 13, 2021 20:14
|
|
|
Coronavirus: Stop trying to make NPIs happen, they're not going to happen! (mean girls) Coronavirus: This thread is the most Biden can do Coronavirus: Mostly horse-paste reccomendations vvv aaaaaaaaaaaand we're done Jaxyon fucked around with this message at 20:35 on Sep 13, 2021 |
|
#
?
Sep 13, 2021 20:24
|
|
|
Coronavirus: Don’t listen to the neigh-sayers.
|
|
#
?
Sep 13, 2021 20:26
|
|
|
Coronavirus: You are not a horse. You are not a cow.
|
|
#
?
Sep 13, 2021 20:27
|
|
|
blastron posted:Coronavirus: Don’t listen to the neigh-sayers.
|
|
#
?
Sep 13, 2021 20:27
|
|
|
blastron posted:Coronavirus: Don’t listen to the neigh-sayers. 
|
|
#
?
Sep 13, 2021 20:34
|
|
|
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-09-12/with-economies-on-the-brink-southeast-asia-chooses-to-reopen It sounds like things could get really bad in Southeast Asia. quote:Even as they struggle with one of the world’s worst Covid-19 outbreaks, nations across Southeast Asia are slowly realizing that they can no longer afford the economy-crippling restrictions needed to squash it. Is the US sending over surplus vaccines to Vietnam? It should be.
|
|
#
?
Sep 13, 2021 20:55
|
|
|
Just flat out admitting that Capitalism makes it impossible to adequately respond to pandemics.
|
|
#
?
Sep 13, 2021 21:11
|
|
|
Jaxyon posted:Just flat out admitting that Capitalism makes it impossible to adequately respond to pandemics. Yeah. That's the lesson I've taken from the past 2 years. A societal order whose existence depends on generating a certain amount of profit all the time is basically unable to cope with serious, uncontrollable developments.
|
|
#
?
Sep 13, 2021 21:13
|
|
|
Jaxyon posted:Just flat out admitting that Capitalism makes it impossible to adequately respond to pandemics. Being incapable of responding to any "crises of the commons" such as a pandemic would be is one of the foundational contradictions of it to the point that it was something Smith and Ricardo sought to find answers for. They also said stuff like rent seekers and landlords are bad tho so lol. Marx also addressed it, but his take was more along the lines of "they'll address a tuberculosis outbreak by making it mandatory to catch tuberculosis" as elaborated upon in Kapital and, well,
|
|
#
?
Sep 13, 2021 21:14
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 4, 2024 21:04 |
|
|
New thread is here: https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3979298
|
|
#
?
Sep 13, 2021 21:43
|
|