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punk rebel ecks posted:Isn't Bread and Roses mostly anarchists as oppose to Something Awful (CSPAM) which is mostly communists? https://twitter.com/oridschweitz/status/1379252275139461123 They are trots I would say calling them anarchists is really funny given how much their chapters loving hate mutual aid and doing anything that isn't canvassing for M4A, the Rank & File Union strategy, and holding deathgrips of chapters they have control over. Philly's sect was so toxic that they had to rebrand themselves to Bread and Roses since the name Momentum got so toxic.
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Apr 6, 2021 20:17
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punk rebel ecks posted:Like many organizations, the DSA really pushed forward electing left wing politicians into Congress. But unlike most others, they achieved it and didn't know exactly what to do once they succeeded in the objective. I'd assume advocate for whatever Decomcratic Socialists believe in, right? Isn't that what most political parties and factions do?
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Apr 6, 2021 22:26
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ah i see bread n roses wants to bring over all the worst tendencies from the ISO.
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Apr 7, 2021 00:55
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https://twitter.com/organizeworkers/status/1381988805318705157 Why are they booking a SWERF 
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Apr 13, 2021 22:20
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achillesforever6 posted:https://twitter.com/organizeworkers/status/1381988805318705157 DSA is a decentralized organization so that means no complaining my friend. Feel free to do something different in your chapter. 
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Apr 14, 2021 02:13
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WorkerThread posted:DSA is a decentralized organization so that means no complaining my friend. Feel free to do something different in your chapter.
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Apr 14, 2021 02:40
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achillesforever6 posted:I can complain when it's openly reactionary that has no place in the org; like imagine it was a TERF or anti-abortion person Without knowing any of the details personally, I probably agree with you. I don't see how that's different from supporting Jon Ossof for senate, though. Both are harmful to the goal of building a socialist society, something I expect an organization called the Democratic Socialists of America to be doing.
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Apr 14, 2021 02:43
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achillesforever6 posted:I can complain when it's openly reactionary that has no place in the org; like imagine it was a TERF or anti-abortion person You're responding to a CSPAM posting, D&D thread troll.
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Apr 14, 2021 03:42
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droll posted:You're responding to a CSPAM posting, D&D thread troll. That's not very good faith of you.
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Apr 14, 2021 21:29
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Political education is different from electoral outreach.
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Apr 14, 2021 22:42
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I was just curious what pro DSA posters would say to the same response that seems to shield the DSA from being criticized at all-- the fact that chapters appear to be autonomous to a degree that lets them do any activity and call it socialism. You can do some weird semantic thing where you say one is political education and one is political outreach, but I don't see a meaningful difference to my original argument.
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Apr 14, 2021 22:52
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That's not a weird semantic thing at all. Take, for instance, Bernie Sanders, who ran on a milquetoast social democratic ticket but who received the broad support of an increasingly communistic DSA. Idealists might argue that being a radical socialist means never backing a candidate or reform which itself is not radically socialist, but that's not really persuasive or effective.
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Apr 14, 2021 23:05
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For a fast type, you continue to misunderstand my question. Of course I have opinions on whether any given activity done by the DSA is a good or bad idea for advancing socialism, but that's not why I posted. I wanted to see how someone who spends 90% of their posts talking about some evil faction of Pennsylvania socialists responds to "can't make any criticism of local chapters cause they're independent".
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Apr 14, 2021 23:17
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But you're the only one who's raised that defense in the first place. DSA members frequently criticize their own and each others' chapters.
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Apr 14, 2021 23:57
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I can't believe you would gaslight me like this. DSA thread regulars all gave that exact same defense, for example, when questioned why national and the Atlanta chapter were promoting Ossof for senate (lol). I'm guessing you even offered it somewhere in the mountains of text you tend to write.
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Apr 15, 2021 07:02
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No, they didn't. You're just a very slow reader and prefer to imagine what posts contain rather than commit yourself to the struggle of making it to the end of as many as three or four sentences in a row.
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Apr 15, 2021 18:47
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https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?noseen=1&threadid=3808020&pagenumber=931#post511699640 Didn't feel like looking for more examples
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Apr 15, 2021 20:37
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That's not a post in which someone is saying that you can't make any criticism of local chapters because they're independent (your own words). In fact they seem to be accepting the criticism. I can't do much about Philly DSA's organizational form, either, which is a shame, because it's bad. It's actually pretty easy to raise a defense of "DSA Goes Down to Georgia", Ossoff included, since the point is obviously to ensure a Democratic majority in the legislature so as to make sure a COVID bailout goes through. And, indeed, Ossoff seems to have voted for the latest relief bill. I don't know whether these efforts also helped to build DSA's base in Georgia, although it'd be pretty sweet if they did. Ferrinus fucked around with this message at 21:23 on Apr 15, 2021 |
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Apr 15, 2021 21:20
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Wow yeah, socialism would be great if it weren't for all the socialists, as this line of posting clearly demonstrates. Please release me from this hell
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Apr 16, 2021 19:00
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That's idealism. What we have to deal with here is a communist society, not as it has developed on its own foundations, but, on the contrary, just as it emerges from capitalist society; which is thus in every respect, economically, morally, and intellectually, still stamped with the birthmarks of the old society from whose womb it emerges.
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Apr 16, 2021 19:32
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Ferrinus posted:That's idealism. What we have to deal with here is a communist society, not as it has developed on its own foundations, but, on the contrary, just as it emerges from capitalist society; which is thus in every respect, economically, morally, and intellectually, still stamped with the birthmarks of the old society from whose womb it emerges. 
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Apr 16, 2021 19:45
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Marx? Pfooie! I only got into this "socialism" business to obsessively follow the media statements of specific politicians with my pals in GBS!
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Apr 16, 2021 20:04
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https://twitter.com/lesbianmarxism/status/1394524216129511425?s=19 Lol Trots mad because people make ice pick jokes
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May 19, 2021 00:34
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Trots really love their drama
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May 19, 2021 09:10
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https://twitter.com/pghDSAPAC/status/1394863292691140614?s=19 In cooler news we won this primary by 41 votes
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May 19, 2021 11:16
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Wait, the same dude ran in the GOP and Dem primaries simultaneously? That's a thing you can do?
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May 19, 2021 20:47
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You can make fun of Trots all you want but at least they aren't "democratic socialists" lmao
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May 20, 2021 20:21
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achillesforever6 posted:https://twitter.com/lesbianmarxism/status/1394524216129511425?s=19 Nice to see the anti-#metoo revolutionaries turn theory into praxis by doxxing people I know.
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May 23, 2021 00:00
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Jamaal Bowman not getting kicked out of the DSA is ridiculous. Like Christ, if you don't stand against apartheid than what the gently caress?
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Dec 14, 2021 03:44
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Have you or anyone in your family been affected by Trotsky revisionism? You may be entitled to monetary compensation. Call 1888-UNCLJOE *This is sarcasm
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Dec 14, 2021 06:31
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punk rebel ecks posted:Jamaal Bowman not getting kicked out of the DSA is ridiculous. Like Christ, if you don't stand against apartheid than what the gently caress? From a member in the NPC who while not voting to expel him brought up that AOC & Tlaib called the NPC angry and saying they would speak out against the org publicly if they expelled Bowman. Also a member of the NPC, Jose, who is a part of the Socialist Majority Caucus (the socdem caucus whose idea of socialism in the US is just a shittier Nordic Country) was telling the other members of the NPC that if they expelled Bowman he would resign and then call the org racist/anti-black. He also in a meeting with the BDS Working Group was asking if they were taking orders from Hamas. Finally there is also a member of the NPC who is involved in the Green New Deal Campaign, which Bowman is heavily involved in, doing backroom deals with Bowman behind everyone's back. So yeah things are hosed, locally my chapter is fine as usual and honestly I'm resolving myself to running for NPC in 2023 lol
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Dec 16, 2021 14:40
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Yeah that’s a shitshow. I’ve already cancelled my membership and looking for a new national org (thinking of SAlt or/and IWW). I completely under that the DSA is a large organization and as such people have to make some concessions to have the organization relevant. But okaying Bowman for his stance on Israel and AOC to cave time and time again with zero consequences is just too much. Also, yeah the party is way too afraid of being labeled racist. I understand that a lot of the members are white pepper who are desperate to be “allies”, but just because a minority has an opinion doesn’t put them on a pedestal. I think you may recall the shitshow in Portland a few years ago, where a few candidates (one white transwoman and the others POC) came to appeal for our organizations endorsements. The organization leaders made it clear that they didn’t want some of these candidates endorsed but said they would leave it up to them to appeal to the members who showed up. The fact that the leaders did this offended said candidates so much, that every single candidate did a whole monologue about how they were “for the people” and they didn’t want the DSA’s endorsement. They heavily painted it as the DSA not understanding the “minority plight”. This included a woman who was a restaurant owner who paid her employees minimum wage and outright said she is NOT a socialist. That didn’t stop her from doing a sob story speech about THE LATINO COMMUNITY!  The members ate it up and thought that the leaders of the organization were being racist for not endorsing these candidates, despite there being very good reason in being hesitant. Someone even stormed off threatening to punch a member in the face. punk rebel ecks fucked around with this message at 22:55 on Dec 16, 2021 |
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Dec 16, 2021 20:11
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achillesforever6 posted:the socdem caucus whose idea of socialism in the US is just a shittier Nordic Country Wait a minute, there's a club for me?
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Dec 16, 2021 22:43
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