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Against my well-stated reservations my boss and the boss of the electric cart users thought it would be totally awesome to purchase a super sweet Changli (Coco Truck when sold here). It's a hilariously bad piece of poo poo. There are a couple of Youtube videos out there and Donut's is a good primer on what these things are like, but I don't think they really got across just how crappy these are. Donut ordered one from China and it cost like $8k+. We ordered one from a dealer in the midwest US somewhere and it was $12k somewhere I believe (incl. tax + delivery to CA). Our guys use electric carts to putter around in an industrial setting and are in and out of them multiple times a day, carrying dirty tools and slimy things. The Coco is NOT, in any loving way, set up for that way of life but they keep buying overly expensive, street legal types of carts with heaters and crap that they don't need, but I digress... Here it is in all it's glory. There were some lovely hubcaps but we tossed them because they didn't actually lock onto the wheels, they were just held on by friction and could be pulled off easily with a pinky finger.  This thing has not been put in service, it has been sitting for a couple months. The headlight is already hosed. Note the absence of a front badge.  The hood prop is just a bent piece of rod that is held in position by a nut tack welded to the body. There is no way to secure the prop when not in use, it just rattles around. The washer tower's angle makes it next to impossible to align the eyeball type nozzles to spray onto the windshield in a useful manner and it mostly hits the wiper. Speaking of the wiper, it doesn't auto-park, it stops wherever you switch it off.  This this has AC! (That sorta works.) These are the aerospace engineered brackets that hold in the condenser.  The electrical engineering is a marvel to behold. The entire vehicle is like this to some extent.  Down there under the wires and insulation is the brake master cylinder. Want to check the brake fluid? Go gently caress yourself.  The alignment and build quality of the tailgate/bed is enough to make Tesla blush. The tailgate needs to be slammed to hell or you have to push on the bed side/end while closing it because the rear of the bed actually spreads out a little bit away from the tailgate.  The tail lights are held in by two screws run through the plastic and into the sheetmetal at the bottom and some kind of rubber/tar seam tape everywhere else. Headlights are similar. Need to replace one? Go gently caress yourself.  Like Donut's video showed, the 100% legit mega-extreme roll bar is held onto the bed rails by 4 sheetmetal screws. They were all stripped when it arrived. Every industrial cart needs ROPS, right?  The church confessional pew masquerading as a rear seat. It folds forward to reveal a portal to hell. That thing on the floor is the supplied (how generous!) EXTERNAL charger. They couldn't even be bothered to mount it under the body somewhere so figure out a nice dry place to put it on your property somewhere, you foreign devil! 
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Apr 29, 2023 05:39
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The deceptively inviting interior will lull you to sleep while it rapes your mother. The center console lid is flimsy and hits both seats on its way up. Nothing in here feels good to the touch. It is all faux everything that is as cheaply made as humanly possible. I cannot stress that enough. The seats are uncomfortable. You will die in a 5mph collision. The speaker grille on the door is fake, of course. We'll get to the kickin' rad Bose/Harmon-Kardin/Playskool stereo later. The gold lever is to engage *Ultra-Mega-Granny-Low-Gear*! The gear change is actually inside the differential and, I swear to god, has a ratio of what seems like 20:1. It feels very weird to try and drive it in this gear. It tops out at what seems like 5mph(?). I cannot foresee any real use case for this unless you plan on putting on paddle tires and slowly climbing sand dunes or some poo poo.  The exquisitely detailed dash beckons you to experience the luxury of recycled plastic bottles smashed into the general shape of a dash. What does the ill-fitting steering wheel cover say? "Bash face here", probably. The Mercedes-Benz sourced control stalks are absolute poo poo that look and feel like they were made by a chimpanzee at a Fisher-Price factory. The wiper stalk has 2(!) speeds but the wiper motor only has one, low, which is activated by switching the stalk past "low" to "high". Do not question the superior design. The silver dash vents are fake. Air only comes out of the defrost vent at a leisurely pace regardless of the fan setting. Next to the wheel on the right we have what is labeled as an Engine Stop/Start button. "What does it do?", you ask like the idiot you are. Gottcha Bitch! It's actually a central power lock/unlock button. The two red accessory switches do nothing. The blank spot next to them mirrors the one in my soul. And, as you can see, half of the passenger footwell is taken up by the HVAC Unit Of The People. On top of the dash at the far left is a display for the rear bumper proximity sensor/backup alarm that actually loving sorta works if you can believe it! The top right side of the dash has a very simple fan speed knob and AC/Fan/Heat switch that also work I guess.  The CCP approved suction cup rearview mirror so you american pigs to look over your shoulder for when the brave Chinese soldiers come for you.  HVAC part 2. I poo poo you not. Two poo poo-rear end computer case fans, a light, and a heinously flimsy pop-up sunroof.  This futuristic poo poo is called a "screen". A touch screen! In this budget-mobile!... No, you fuckwit. There are actually garbage physical buttons in the center of the screen area under the plastic fascia where the blue icons are. Smash away with your sausage fingers. The bluetooth actually loving works! And without downloading malware onto my phone. I trust them. I did not plug in a USB to try video or anything else. The gauges are not in, and cannot be changed to, Freedom Units. Even though this this has only been driven a couple kilometers the odo reads 43km. The speedo is inaccurate as hell. IDK how fast it actually goes but it feels like 20mph in "D" and 25mph in "S", which I disabled because our plant's speed limit is 10mph. There is no way to limit it to 10mph. Have fun bombing over manhole covers and poo poo like them Duke boys! Also, fake-rear end, no way to make functional, steering wheel controls. Since we're here; the steering is 4 turns lock to lock. It takes one full rotation of the wheel to make the vehicle turn any appreciable amount. The turning radius is larger than the CCP's corruption issues.  I promised to bathe you in the wonders of the sound system and here it is. The one 4" speaker unceremoniously ziptied behind the dash when there is actually a proper spot/grille for in in the bottom center of the dash. DO NOT QUESTION THE ACOUSTICAL ENGINEERING.  The lithium ion batteries that will not cause the horrible, burning death of a coworker, or me, right under your rear end. The "parking brake" does nothing more than pull down on the regular brake pedal. The regular hydraulic service brakes ARE the emergency/parking brakes. This is efficiency at it's finest. I feel safe as can be. Speaking of the brakes; they are weak, numb, poo poo. The pedal has an odd 75-80 degree bend to it and the pedal pad sits low so that it causes you to try to brake by smashing the toe of your boot onto the pedal arm instead of the pad.  The charging port. Made from what feels like cut up Coke cans. The door has to be finessed to actually close fully and there is no weatherstripping.  The bed is welded to the cab with pride and quality workmanship. Suck eggs Tesla.  Gratuitous booty shot. 
Joe Mama fucked around with this message at 06:19 on Apr 29, 2023 |
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Apr 29, 2023 05:39
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Porsche has been trying to unravel the secrets of this front suspension. Good luck mein herr. More quality workmanship. Fastening the brake lines to the body is an art really.  More of the same. Notice the reinforcing tabs on the axle tubes by the center section. Tuk-tuk axle not strong enough? It is now, bitch!  Engineering at its finest. Do I really need to explain this?  This is actually the inside of the rear "bumper". 20ga sheetmetal with NASA grade reinforcement. I forgot to mention that there is also a backup camera that works as well!  Lower rear of the battery house. It's as flimsy as it looks.  The carefully drilled (with pride and craftsmanship) hole for the granny gear cable.  All you wannabe welders out there open your loving eyes and gaze upon this glory. This is how 80% of the welds are.  The suspension engineering is a sight to behold. You will never see this on a Porsche. Dumbass Germans.  Beauty shot of the seat upholstery. It has a laughably bad fit. No joke, I could probably do better. The material is beat to poo poo already in the typical driver outside bolster AND IT HASN'T BEEN PUT INTO SERVICE YET.  And as an odd little gently caress you; the A, B, and C pillar trim were clearly meant to be capped off with a long header piece here but there is none. 
Joe Mama fucked around with this message at 05:55 on Apr 29, 2023 |
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Apr 29, 2023 05:40
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is that a DIN-rail-mount circuit breaker on the side of the seat?
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Apr 29, 2023 05:53
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IDK dick about anything other than 12v stuff, but probably.
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Apr 29, 2023 05:56
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well it's amusing to see in an automotive context, at least. is it actually being used as a circuit breaker, or is it a glorified on/off switch for something?
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Apr 29, 2023 06:11
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I believe it's the main breaker for the battery pack. Can't be sure because what the gently caress is a service manual?
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Apr 29, 2023 06:22
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I forgot to add a gif that goes along with this. Good old Men At Work. "GET IT OFF ME, FROST!" "IT'S poo poo IT'S poo poo!!!!"
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Apr 29, 2023 06:26
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So what I'm getting from this is that it's better than a Tesla Model 3?
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Apr 29, 2023 07:06
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Raluek posted:is that a DIN-rail-mount circuit breaker on the side of the seat? Definitely looks that way. Now taking bets on if that breaker is rated to interrupt DC under full load. AC and DC breakers are completely different animals, DC likes to share the (arc) love, though I suspect this thing doesn't have a battery capable of putting out Tesla levels of amperage. Guessing it's just meant as a disconnect tho. gschmidl posted:So what I'm getting from this is that it's better than a Tesla Model 3? I mean... it's nowhere near as quick, and as much as I hate to admit Tesla did something right, they really do know how to handle crash safety as long as the car doesn't lose power in the accident (otherwise you're trapped unless you know how to, oh god, MANUALLY pull a cable with your HANDS to open the door... instead of using the electric poo poo.. or bash a window out). Having a reusable disconnect right next to the seat is pretty solid IMO, but I'm betting it's not rated to interrupt DC under any real load (it's probably meant as a disconnect instead of a breaker). It might be an actual DC breaker, but DC breakers take a ton more abuse. Tesla has two disconnects that are one time use - fireman loop on the RH side in the frunk, fireman loop on the RH side behind the RR quarter window, tucked behind trim. The RR one is easier if the car is actively trying to kill you with fire IMO. Both require a full harness replacement if you use them.
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Apr 29, 2023 07:53
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STR posted:Definitely looks that way. Now taking bets on if that breaker is rated to interrupt DC under full load. AC and DC breakers are completely different animals, DC likes to share the (arc) love, though I suspect this thing doesn't have a battery capable of putting out Tesla levels of amperage. Guessing it's just meant as a disconnect tho. if it's a real UL489 it could do both! what are the chances it's actually rated, though? what voltage does this thing run on, anyway? the DC rating on those things is usually pretty low, to your point.
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Apr 29, 2023 09:21
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Lol thanks for posting. I've seen another review before Donut got theirs and it looked ok for like $2-3000 + shipping and seemed to hold up pretty well after more than a year. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sgDpqd38HtQ But at $12k is pretty nuts. Is there any reason you couldn't use a Kei truck instead?
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Apr 29, 2023 10:42
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gschmidl posted:So what I'm getting from this is that it's better than a Tesla Model 3? If we had the budget, I'd take the 3s. As it is we're already trying to get 2 Ford Lightnings for the fleet to go along with our multiple Chevy Bolts that have gaudy "Look at us! We're GREEN! Suck us off!" decals on them. Raluek posted:if it's a real UL489 it could do both! what are the chances it's actually rated, though? I'll look on Monday. mobby_6kl posted:But at $12k is pretty nuts. Is there any reason you couldn't use a Kei truck instead? For the price of the GEM carts we used to have and the loaded Columbias that replaced them we could have easily gotten Mitsubishi Mirages. But quiet, small, zero emission vehicles are just better for what they need. They used to use 3 wheeled bicycles, or tricycles if you will, back in the day. What they don't need is what they keep buying; street legal, heaters, doors, lights that never get used, materials that can't stand up to abuse of any kind, etc. When I first started there they had Taylor-Dunn carts which are basically made out of diamond plate and angle iron and had solid rubber tires. You know, an industrial cart. They lasted forever but once they saw the GEM carts they just HAD to have those plastic-fantastic pieces of poo poo (that I would easily choose over the Coco). If I remember right the GEMs were like $12-13k and that was 10-12 years ago. Columbias were $14-15k 5-6 years ago. Normally we keep things for at least 10 years but the GEMs literally started falling apart. The original 3 Columbias we got were like a fancy industrial golf cart, which were good, but they redesigned them the following year to be much more like other street legal carts and they lost some of the industrial-ness but are still decent. I guess they have an R+R budget available to buy carts every 6 years now? IDK, I just work here, on these drat things sometimes. Joe Mama fucked around with this message at 17:12 on Apr 29, 2023 |
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Apr 29, 2023 17:04
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As far as the seat-side circuit breaker goes it's a GB10963 2 pole. A standard panel type breaker. Battery is 60vdc.
Joe Mama fucked around with this message at 20:40 on May 3, 2023 |
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May 3, 2023 20:36
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Joe Mama posted:What they don't need is what they keep buying; street legal, So what I'm understanding from this is that, against all common sense and any sense of decency, the Changli is street legal?
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May 3, 2023 21:34
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Yep. LSV- Low Speed Vehicle regulations. They have to have all of the lights, wiper, plates, and be able to go 25MPH.
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May 4, 2023 01:21
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Joe Mama posted:As far as the seat-side circuit breaker goes it's a GB10963 2 pole. A standard panel type breaker. Battery is 60vdc. looks like that's a chinese standard for CB rating, probably similar to our UL489 or UL1077, but i haven't looked further than that to see what exactly it contains. anyway, there are breakers that are rated to that standard which are actually rated for 60V DC, so it might not actually be too out of place. a little strange to see industrial parts like that used in an automotive context, but with this car i suppose i shouldn't be surprised!
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May 4, 2023 03:37
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But at least it has good corrosion protection, right?
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May 4, 2023 09:07
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bolind posted:But at least it has good corrosion protection, right? I didn't mention that but you bring up a good point, it has absolutely none underneath aside from the primer(?), and we are situated close to the SF bay and we definitely get rust on things. Especially on things that sit a lot or get driven through puddles of "water" that was spilled somewhere in the sewage-to-treated water process.
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May 4, 2023 16:09
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Lol, you guys over paid for a assisted living cart and are now complaining about it. It serves its target function perfectly fine, grand parents picking up grand kids and groceries in the Chinese country side, don’t know why anyone expects more from something like this.
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May 4, 2023 17:29
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And people were pissing and moaning about the Citroën Ami? I kinda love how janky this thing is.
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May 4, 2023 17:35
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GlassEye-Boy posted:Lol, you guys over paid for a assisted living cart and are now complaining about it. It serves its target function perfectly fine, grand parents picking up grand kids and groceries in the Chinese country side, don’t know why anyone expects more from something like this. This is pretty much my point, but they bought it anyway. And it was two managers who bought it, with public money, and thrust it upon us. But even for it's target function it is very poorly designed and constructed. I mostly blame David Tracy and the like for bringing this garbage to the American audience but in their defense it was all for giggles, not to be serious about importing them, let alone being sold at powersports dealers with the added costs of that.
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May 4, 2023 22:51
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Joe Mama posted:Against my well-stated reservations my boss and the boss of the electric cart users thought it would be totally awesome to purchase a super sweet Changli (Coco Truck when sold here). Thank you for doing this so that we don't have to. Please keep this thread up to date with its reliability and maintenance, which I'm sure will be stellar.
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May 5, 2023 00:42
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EVERYWHERE 
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We'll see, honestly I'm not expecting much any time soon because I think there's only one guy that is currently using it. In 6mo, year, 2 years I fully expect the poo poo show to progress nicely. It'll start out with requests to modify some things, which I will probably have to reject because it would require altering fundamental functions. For example, the first "feeling out" question I've received was if I thought the brakes could be upgraded, which I wouldn't because that would put me on the liability hook. Eventually the repair requests will start coming in little by little until, at some point, there will be things that can't be fixed without ordering strange poo poo from China and most of the "luxury features" won't be working and the seats will need to be reupholstered and you get the picture. This is why I have so much vitriol for this loving thing because I can see it coming and I will be the one dealing with this crap while they whine about the thing always being out of service and whining that the AC doesn't work or whatever. I just hope this thing doesn't injure anyone, I'm not being hyperbolic here. The way the steering acts could easily cause someone to hit something they thought they could otherwise avoid in the other carts. The throttle starts moving the cart with barely any pressure on the pedal. The batteries and their enclosure kinda scare me and, as I'm sure most of you know, the Li-Ion batteries are always one of, if not the most expensive parts of any electric vehicle and this things only goal in life is to be CHEAP. I haven't heard any horror stories about these batteries yet but "cheap battery + China = Fire or worse" tends to be the way poo poo goes. And as a little anecdote about the management environment this thing is under... The GEM carts we used to have had heat and defrost, the old Taylor-Dunns had nothing of the sort. GEM decided to use a heater that could possibly draw up to 30 amps and was powered by a circuit board that had printed right on it "15 amp max" with a 25 amp fuse in holder, from the factory. Color me shocked when the circuit started to fry the board. They wanted their heat back and I said no because of that. Manager then ups the game of chicken by claiming it was a safety issue. I respond by saying it's a fire hazard and heat is a luxury. He then asks if I can build my own circuit to power the heater. I say no, after what happened to the factory installed stuff I'm not going to be liable for it. Hissy fits get thrown and I end up being ordered to just install a new fuse and pray a fire doesn't break out. Then they get rid of them anyway for the Columbia carts. The Columbia Summit/SU5 (old version and new) have weird parking brakes that don't seem to have fine enough holding teeth, it's always like it just barely doesn't hold on an incline and the next tooth can't be reached. And our charging area for them is on a bit of an incline. So I get asked if I can basically reengineer the parking brakes. Once again I say no. I can't wait to see all the poo poo they want me to unfuck on the Coco but hopefully some lessons have been learned and they'll send it to auction and try to get most of their money back. Joe Mama fucked around with this message at 04:27 on May 5, 2023 |
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May 5, 2023 03:47
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I was just going to let this thread die but I have tremendous news! We're going to get rid of it. One of the plant guys who had never driven it before was so horrified by it (in comparison to our good carts) that he wrote up a safety work order and listed a few of the bigger items here. That prompted an email chain that I responded to with basically a shorter, very toned down version of what I put here and management decided not to defend their idiotic purchase any more. So if anyone is interested in buying a lightly used Coco, our loss is your gain! It'll probably be posted to Govdeals.com at some point. I can direct anyone to if you're actually interested. It's even had some value-added work done to it! The "roll bar" is now held on by 1/4-20 rivnuts instead of stripped out self tapping screws! edit: I forgot that I also welded a chunk of square tubing on top of the brake pedal pad to raise the height and to change the angle of it. So much easier to actually, effectively press the drat brake pedal. What a concept! edit2: Also forgot that the window tracks and weatherstrip in the doors are so bad that they cannot handle the stress of repeatedly rolling up and down the windows without the glass going out of the track on at least one door. It's as if they never actually expect you to roll down the windows more than a few times. Joe Mama fucked around with this message at 23:12 on Aug 24, 2023 |
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Aug 24, 2023 22:41
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A fitting end to a great thread. Thank you for your service.
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Aug 25, 2023 00:21
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