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Today I found out how many Level 3ish Wasps with shields it takes to kill 2 overlords with factories flanking me. Then I found out the anti-air upgrade and a junior is what it takes to destroy 4 with added regeneration. I can't believe I survived that round, but we went on to discover that about 5 wasps will clear out as many overlords as will fit if they are distracted by a war factory pumping out balls and phoenixi.
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Jan 11, 2024 09:17
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| # ? May 4, 2024 21:55 |
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Sometimes this game feels incredible and sometimes its so frustrating. I prefer to play at long ranges and toward eco - when I try to play tempo and aggro I just get absolutely slaughtered, I have no idea how other people make it work. I need to stop trying to force carry fangs, it is not that good of a strategy now.
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Jan 14, 2024 12:28
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Been aggressively doing hacker-builds lately and man is it wacky. Sometimes you in 1 round go from barely accomplishing anything to absolutely wiping the enemy.
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Jan 18, 2024 19:07
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The only thing funnier than a hacker build is when your opponent goes counter hacker.
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Jan 18, 2024 21:13
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Hacker rules, still laughing about the time I was hacking and winning and my opponent started moving toward fang carry and I was like "surely THIS will be the time that multi hacker doesn't betray me." Multi hacker betrayed me. Two things that I'm a little lost on right now. Vertical deploys. I get it for crawlers, I can see a lot of use for that, but other vertical units baffle me and they show up all the time in recommended formations so they must do something I just feel like I'm missing something. Vertical storms in particular feel like...why would I do this, everything about this seems worse. What am I missing? Steel Balls. I took a break around the time the deployable anti-missiles came into the game, and back then Steel Balls were like...they had their uses. But now they feel so insanely vulnerable that I don't know what I'm doing with them at all. They seem bad against basically everything in the game to boot, for giants they're way worse than MPs, and for medium scale units they're way worse than scorpions, so I'm just at a loss.
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Jan 18, 2024 22:04
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Balls still beat Rhinos on the flank and defence. But yeah, not much else to it. Sledges overperform on vertical against chaff. Makes the unit fire in a volley for much higher effect.
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Jan 18, 2024 22:28
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In theory vertical storms are less vulnerable to blowing their load on crawlers set to run from the front line. In practice I find putting them behind the tower works fine. Balls are bad now? I've had a fair amount of luck having them screen for crawlers in the opening. Four balls aren't that much more firepower than one ball, compared to how quickly crawlers lose firepower. If the enemy gets fast firing stuff for the crawlers take the armor. Blowing up into crawlers evens the odds against non vulcan giants. Not sure I would spend 50 to unlock them outside of supplementing a War Factory.
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Jan 18, 2024 23:57
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So this is mostly me just organizing my thoughts a little from having been on a pretty successful climb recently in MMR (from about 600 to 1000). How I feel about my opponent deploying a given unit My 'favorite' way of deploying, to the extent I really have that much control over what I can get, is fangs + phoenixes, starting pretty far back and symmetrical. I like having the options to force my frontline more in the late game, I like making it harder for my opponent to have too easy of targets for battlefield spells, I especially like having the option of deploying stuff like fire or smoke on my side of the field so my opponent can't shield them (if they're going very forward). Obviously this is not what I do 100% of the time but I'll definitely bias towards it. Marksman Not super worried. I check if they've got assault marksman cuz that can really change things, but in general I spam phoenixes, which isn't the best counter to this but it's certainly a demoralizing one that I think is really funny so I'll keep doing it. Fang Fangs are amazing, I try to figure out of they're going to fang carry or not. If that looks more likely than not, I gotta start figuring out ways to deny them XP even if that involves me losing a few rounds. Crawler I mean c'mon they're crawlers. They're amazing. I'd be insane not to be ready for crawlers. Arclight Anxious. I feel like I have to check and evaluate their entire tech loadout because if they go carry arclights that can be big trouble and you don't want to figure out they're going carry arcs when they've got 9 level 5 ALs out. Rhino Amused? I look out for them having the self destruct but since I tend to deploy pretty far back these tend to be one of the worst units going into my set up just from the get go. Wasp Scary, but people tend not to make them often at my ranks. They can pivot toward either chaff or carry like fangs and that is a bit nerve wracking. I used to like aerial arcs or HE mustangs for this, I'm leaning more and more toward Wraith as my main counter if I can't handle them with my existing units. Mustang Another one that scares me. Just way too good at cleaning out Fangs and I'm far less confident about what to do about them compared to Vulcans. My response recently has been to flank with Crawlers so that they get to battle after I've killed more of their front. I do like to try and bait them into taking upgrades that are only medium helpful, especially the anti-missile. One of my funniest wins was a guy who went hard into Mustangs and I pivoted into armored Overlords late. Mustangs with HE do not do appreciable damage to armored overlords. Multiple rounds used all 120 seconds. Steel Ball Not generally something I'm super afraid of. I tend to go very heavy on chaff. Of the units that are in the HP range that really fears balls, the ones I use most are Hackers and Scorpions, who are pretty good at killing balls! Stormcaller Pain in my rear end. Always have to weigh what choices I'm going to make about counters when these come out. If somebody goes heavy I just try to focus on developing my board to the best of my ability and set up for a late game War Factory with anti-missile, but if somebody does the far more normal "two of them that they never level up and tech into either flames or ECM" I tend to prefer splitting crawlers a lot and interfering with their targeting wherever possible. Sledgehammer Honestly a complicated unit to respond to. I've seen a lot of people at my terrible MMRs doing sledge only frontlines with no crawlers or fangs, which is baffling and very easy to deal with. But if they're used more intelligently they can be very tough to counter effectively for me. Ideally I'd want to see how much I can coast on phoenixes but sometimes you really gotta bust out the scorpions. Phoenix Bah, this is a matchup I feel like I have to monitor closely. I do build a lot of fangs and favor trash wasps, both of which are very good at dealing with Phoenixes, but Phoenixes are still very versatile and nimble, and in particular they can be a huge problem for Wraiths. Hacker Amused, people seem to be awful at using hackers as a rule. Mostly I am trying to figure out what they want to target with their hacker, since my favorite units are not good candidates for hacking. Wraith Worried. Wraiths are obscenely good at killing chaff and the degen field is a scary rear end ability. I've seen them less since the most recent patch which I find surprising since I find them more threatening now. Scorpion I don't see them super often but I did run into a guy who used them as his main frontline with armor plating, that was weird. They're insanely good at killing SBs, which I rarely use, and SHs, which I frequently use. As is often the case my strategy for these is to try and make sure that my flow of crawlers and fangs to the frontline is smooth and continuous. Vulcan Inevitable. They're the best counter to most boards I make so them showing up is fully expected. Sledges or SB with Armor have become a fixture of my responses to this because its very funny to watch a Vulcan animation lock for a million years on one guy. Fortress A little surprised but not super much. Quite a few people take it as a phoenix counter which...well, I'll just say its a very expensive counter that I can generally manage. The shield is very worth thinking about and in general my response to Fortresses is very situational. Melting Point These things used to scare the everloving hell out of me, but now I don't tend to fear them that much. Them being at all effective is dependant on your opponent clearing your chaff efficiently, so sheparding chaff longer tends to be my approach. That or I just drop 3 more crawlers and upgrade a ton of stuff. Overlord Often scares the crap out of me. Sometimes I'm set up to deal with this really well, but sometimes I'm not. As much as I harp on about phoenixes its not that odd for Fangs to be my main AA threat and that is a bad situation to run into OLs. If people do it early then that's one thing but if somebody drops 3 of them in round 7 and I wasn't expecting it that tends to be a bad time. War Factory Flat out have not seen enough of these to have developed an emotional reaction. Ignite fangs and MPs do good, haven't actually seen the fabled "backline WF" yet.
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Jan 22, 2024 02:07
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I'm having a real hard time adjusting to the fact that turn 4 war factory is suddenly seen as viable and will win games. Like I literally don't understand why that is.
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Jan 27, 2024 07:26
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Basically a War Factory is several Fortresses stacked on top of each other except with even better stats and techs that let them beat Melters. You need a lot of damage output to kill even a basic factory and a strong combined arms force to take down teched war factories. Putting that together when early factories are being rammed down your throat is a nightmare. It's always been viable but it wasn't getting much play so they gave it several buffs to its hp, damage and range which really made it go wild.
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Jan 27, 2024 08:26
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How're people doing it as a strategy? Are they just not spending anything for several turns in a row?
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Jan 27, 2024 20:11
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T2Q0NI14uDk Basically yeah
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Jan 28, 2024 00:09
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A giant player that is a real sicko could go: 200 (-100 for recycle) + 200 from unit = 300 300 + 400 + 200 from unit = 900 for a round 2 naked war factory Not seeing any buys for round one or two trips my personal "build phoenixes or something they are making something big" alarm. I got hit by a round 1 wraith with that method.
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Jan 28, 2024 04:44
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Steel Balls need to be changed to fill a new niche or something needs to be done about Scorpions. Scorpions are such a hard counter while being generally good that they've completely erased Steel Balls from the game. I suppose you could give Balls an energy shield upgrade but that's easily counter-countered by the Scorpion double shot.
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Jan 28, 2024 21:38
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sirtommygunn posted:Steel Balls need to be changed to fill a new niche or something needs to be done about Scorpions. Scorpions are such a hard counter while being generally good that they've completely erased Steel Balls from the game. I suppose you could give Balls an energy shield upgrade but that's easily counter-countered by the Scorpion double shot. The niche is when the extended range steel balls card comes up and then you tech range on balls and sit so far behind your chaff screen scorpions are irrelevant. I do think they're the weakest of the tier 2 units at the moment, having even less of a niche than Rhinos, though funnily enough I think crawler/ball is probably one of my highest winrate openers. As for countering war factories, acid scorpions remain the best option in my experience. War factories just haaaate acid.
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Jan 28, 2024 23:05
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Surrey says he got these numbers from the devs directly as of 12 days ago (hackers are red because they're so underused they don't consider the stats reliable). And these are the starting pack win rates 
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Jan 29, 2024 01:05
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I knew forswearing the mustang/marksmen combo was right! Amazed scorpions are so unpopular.
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Jan 29, 2024 04:34
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Yeah I never take a combo that doesn't have basic chaff.
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Jan 29, 2024 05:09
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Rhino is being reworked by the developer. I think steel balls and fortress need to go next. They could just give fortress back their old targeting with the rocket punch and they would be good again. I echo the sentiment above that I really don't understand the nuances of vertical/horizontal deploy. I wish someone did a video that showed the effects in real time like Rat did with the different types of chaff and how they tank against different units. Seeing a video of sledges/arclights firing on crawlers vs fangs and the difference in time to kill was very interesting.
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Jan 29, 2024 06:01
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Well this is going to be interestingquote:Three experimental features
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Jan 31, 2024 18:56
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Ugh, that sounds terrible. At the very least the players better get the same choices. Even then, what if one side was already prepared to deal with the level 7 unit by having a melting point strategy and the other isn't?
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Jan 31, 2024 19:25
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I don't like the idea of free units but if they at least work like "Improved x" (can't show up if a player already has an x) it might not be terrible. Otherwise whoever teched that unit first will win and anger will result. Duplicate equipment or call ins I'm fine with. Duplicate ranged or skill expert just sounds obnoxious. I thought the point of the different maps was to make the deployment zones a little bit different? Also they plan on making Absorption Module better? I've been holding off on throwing it on sledges or a vulcan for cost reasons but now...
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Jan 31, 2024 21:29
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This is shaping up to be an extremely silly patch. The free units injects a ton of money and you get wacky guessing games of "is my opponent going to pick the level 9 rhino, and if so where is it gonna go??" I got a game with double tech expert on rounds 2 & 3 and it was a lot of fun even if it did devolve into an extremely dumb factory mirror.
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Feb 1, 2024 16:05
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Played and got 9 groups of leveled wasps for free, opponent picked 3 free overlords, things did not go well for them.
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Feb 1, 2024 17:04
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Saw someone with tech specialist get offered a lvl 7 hacker and not pick it. I can't even imagine how much poo poo a lvl 7 hacker with upgrades would steal. Even a lvl 3 hacker with upgrades can be absolutely domineering.Diplomat posted:Played and got 9 groups of leveled wasps for free, opponent picked 3 free overlords, things did not go well for them. Skill issue. EDIT: Got offered three meltings points turn 7. I didn't have the tech so that's an insane net value proposition. My opponent picked three vulcans and that was that. MiddleOne fucked around with this message at 17:57 on Feb 1, 2024 |
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Feb 1, 2024 17:23
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After playing for a while, I think the war factory is at its absolute peak right now with this new ruleset. Its innate weakness is that rushing it leaves you exposed. But since the new unit cards lets you establish your board with carry units like mustangs, boats or wraiths at no cost it simply doesn't matter anymore.
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Feb 2, 2024 10:03
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MiddleOne posted:After playing for a while, I think the war factory is at its absolute peak right now with this new ruleset. Its innate weakness is that rushing it leaves you exposed. But since the new unit cards lets you establish your board with carry units like mustangs, boats or wraiths at no cost it simply doesn't matter anymore. I played 5 games the other day and the only one I won was because I got 2 war factories as my free pick. My opponent went with about 4 overlords to complement their 4 or 6 stormcallers. It certainly throws me off my personal tempo. I'll be glad when its over but I hope it becomes an option for private games.
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Feb 4, 2024 05:26
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I think after the fine-tuning the unit cards have actually reached a point where they contribute to balance. Instead of absolutely dominating their rounds they enable non-standard counters. A set of balls, high level rhino or lone boat can now alter the tempo of the board and it feels people are playing less symmetrical again as a result. Wonder where they're going to take it in the end.
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Feb 29, 2024 06:48
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the late game ones can be pretty ridiculous though. like sure, eight units of balls for free because HEY WHY NOT
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Feb 29, 2024 07:21
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Yeah, I think my time with this is over. I really did enjoy the "what are they going to put down next" part of the game. And semi-randomly getting a bunch of stuff screws that over for me. I don't regret the time I spent, just that that era of the game has went.
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Feb 29, 2024 07:51
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Rare units are now in the game. They fill some interesting niches. Not sure how I feel about them yet overall. The way they work is you can only pick them in the free random unit cards, but once you pick them you can buy more. The new UI look is badddd
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Apr 9, 2024 16:43
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| # ? May 4, 2024 21:55 |
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The new tank unit is laughably undertuned. The thing has mediocre damage, no splash and very little tankyness. Assmen have a similiar statline at half the cost. I don't get what they thought they were doing.
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Apr 10, 2024 15:18
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