|
With the growing number of supermotard riders around here I figured its time we had our own thread to discuss why we are so much better than normal riders. Hopefully we can convince some of them to come over to the dark side. A quick history of the supermotards (blatantly stolen from wikipedia): Supermoto has its origins in the 1970s where ABC’s Wide World of Sports was the highest-rated sports show in the United States. In 1979, ABC commissioned a made-for-TV event to be included in the series, named Superbikers, whose intention was to find the ultimate all-around motorcycle racer. Superbikers was then manifested as a yearly event run at southern California's Carlsbad Raceway. The show's tarmac-and-dirt courses were intended to draw on talent from the worlds of off-road, flat-track and road-racing. World and National Championship-winning motorcycling greats such as Kenny Roberts and Jeff Ward, whose respective sports at the time were road-racing and motocross, participated in the races. The Superbikers quickly became a huge Nielsen rating contender, running until 1985, at which point ABC was forced to cancel the show due to new management and cuts; its cancellation also initiated a long sabbatical of the sport in the USA. The European racers who participated in the sport at Carlsbad, however, brought it back to Europe with them, where it quickly gained popularity in countries such as France. Which Supermotard to get? Plenty of companies make supermotards or bikes that are easily converted to an SM. The most common one is probably the Suzuki DRZ400SM, but there are a bunch. Heres a random selection: Suzuki DRZ400SM Yamaha WR250X Husqvarna SM510 Husqvarna SM610 Aprilia SXV450 Aprilia SXV550 KTM Duke KTM 690SMC KTM 690SMR So why ride a supermotard? That http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zpHC8HQyKgE seems http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_r-1t6D5E6U pretty http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fXnQ3KYSiwA obvious. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fYu7DQn5vAI Supermotards are really easy and fun to ride bikes that make you feel like superman in a way no other bikes can. More exactly (from BARF's newbie guide to SMs by Michaeln and XRsick50): 1) Their upright seating position is comfortable and provides great visibility. In the city you can see over traffic, and in the twisties you can see over obstructions on many corners (like tall weeds), giving you a preview of the corner coming up that you wouldn't see on a racer-tuck sportbike. On steep bumpy downhills, you don't have all that weight on the handlebars that you have on a sportbike 2) They're narrow. This makes them easy to maneuver and move around on. They're perfect for lane-splitting. 3) They're simple in design and technology. Virtually all SuperMotos are thumpers (single cylinder engines) with either liquid or air cooling. They're very low-tech, and very reliable. 4) They're light. Most street SuperMotos weigh less than 300lbs. The average sportbike is well over 400lbs. 5) They're powerful... at least in the range that is the most useful to most riders. Thumper power characteristics tend to feature lots of low and midrange torque, with horsepower ranging from 40 to 60 on street motors. That may not sound like a lot, but the power to weight ratio is quite favorable, and SuperMotos are also geared low (most top out at around 100MPH). The gearing and the light weight make the most of the engines, and from 0-80MPH they are as fast as all but the hairiest sportbikes. 6) They have powerful brakes. SuperMotos usually have a 320mm single disc with a 4 pot caliper in the front, giving the ability to do stoppies with one finger on the lever. That's a LOT of brake for the weight of the bike. 7) They have long travel suspension. SuperMotos are based on motocross and enduro bikes, and most have 10-12 inches of travel front and rear. This makes the ride very plush over nasty surfaces. 8) They're quick handling. The light weight with the 17 inch wheels and sticky tires makes SuperMotos formidable weapons in the twisties. The twistier and rougher the road, the more advantage a SuperMoto has. 9) They're relatively immune to crash damage. SuperMotos are based on dirt bikes, and dirt bikes are designed to crash well. Most of the time when a SuperMoto goes down, you just pick it back up (the engine will even probably still be running) get back on and ride away. The same minor lowside on a sportbike would result in hundreds of dollars worth of rashed plastic and broken parts. 10) They're very cheap to insure. Most insurance companies seem to consider SuperMotos (even factory ones like the KTM) to be medium displacement dirtbikes, and so they don't get penalized with exhorbitant rates like sportbikes do. Check with your agent, I think you'll be very pleasantly surprised. Some links http://www.supermotojunkie.com/ - A great SM specific forum. Lots of info on SMs and how to ride them. http://www.thumpertalk.com/ - A great forum dedicated to "thumpers" (single cylinder motorcycles). Lots of good info on modifying many SM models. http://www.supermotoschools.com/ - A great SM school. http://www.supermotoxschool.com - Another good SM school.
|
# ? Mar 18, 2009 18:36 |
|
|
# ? May 13, 2024 10:10 |
|
For posterity sakes, my bike: 2006 DRZ400SM w/ FCR39MX carb, 3x3 Airbox, Yoshi RS-2, and a vacuum leak from somewhere I need to track down. Does anyone have any suggestions for good books or websites for learning SM techniques?
|
# ? Mar 18, 2009 18:39 |
|
You make me really want one. And that's a bad thing because I'll die. This is how KTM does commercials, so absolutely over the top it's awesome: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sp88KPH8Wx4
|
# ? Mar 18, 2009 18:51 |
|
gently caress yeah a super moto thread! DRZ's have more fun yo Click here for the full 2048x1536 image. Click here for the full 1600x1200 image. 08 SM with not nearly enough done to it yet. Exhaust and 3x3. Needs a tune badly, poor thing. Best purchase I made was a set of these babies: http://www.motostrano.com/avdisuti.html Do surprisingly well offroad. I run around my back yard quite a bit now that I have a semi-offroad tire. Squirmy in the mud though, but what can you expect. Ride it out wuss! I've still noticed better grip on street than the stock tires give you, so overall I'm really happy. Now I'm just trying to discipline myself and not lock up the rear so much so hopefully they last more than 1,500 miles.
|
# ? Mar 18, 2009 19:19 |
|
Having been in and out of the supermoto scene a couple of times, I can say that they are stupidly fun, and basically like motorcycle crack. I had a 2005 DRZ400SM, and if I could go back and do it all over again, I would get another DRZ. They are down on power compared to the bigger displacement KTM's and Husky's, but the real world speed difference isnt really that big. If you do the FCR39MX mod on a DRZ and stick a nice pipe on it, its pretty much all anyone would need on the street. Throw the DRZ400E cam in for even more steam. If you currently ride a DRZ, you owe it to yourself to install an FCR39MX carb. Its like a motor swap. I do have to disagree with this though: quote:The gearing and the light weight make the most of the engines, and from 0-80MPH they are as fast as all but the hairiest sportbikes. Whoever wrote that has been out of the sportbike game for a while. Supermoto bikes are quick, but they arent sportbike quick. Which is one of the nice things about them, actually.
|
# ? Mar 18, 2009 19:21 |
|
I'm buying a supermoto as my next bike. Unfortunantly, probably not until after race season, unless I stumble upon a screaming deal. But they are awesome. Best KTM SM commercial: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2wsSL0RFEU
|
# ? Mar 18, 2009 19:25 |
|
Phat_Albert posted:
I ride an 06 DRZ400sm, and I was curious about this carb. How hard is it to install, and what parts do I need? Also, what is the 3x3 airbox mod? I've been riding my bike bone stock for about six months now, and I'd like to step up the power some. I have to agree with everyone else though, this bike is so much fun it should be illegal.
|
# ? Mar 18, 2009 19:48 |
|
Vampire Panties posted:How hard is it to install, and what parts do I need? Also, what is the 3x3 airbox mod? There is a ton of really good information at the DRZ 400 FAQ @ Thumpertalk The airbox mod is simple. Remove the side rear plastics, remove the seat, pop the computer out, and you'll be looking down the snorkel to your airbox. Remove the snorkel and dremel out the hole to be 3"x3" to increase airflow. This will make things run lean so you'll need to adjust your mixture.
|
# ? Mar 18, 2009 19:55 |
|
Vampire Panties posted:I ride an 06 DRZ400sm, and I was curious about this carb. How hard is it to install, and what parts do I need? Also, what is the 3x3 airbox mod? I've been riding my bike bone stock for about six months now, and I'd like to step up the power some. I have to agree with everyone else though, this bike is so much fun it should be illegal. It took me and my friend about three hours to get the carb in and ready to go. Its definitely worth the money, though keep in mind you'll need new throttle cables also. The airbox mod is 10 minutes with a knife at most, though you'll need to screw with jetting afterwards which can be a bit of a bitch. Has anyone taken the charcoal canister off a California model DRZ? Trying to decide if its worth the trouble. I hear it cleans up throttle response and drops 4lbs.
|
# ? Mar 18, 2009 20:28 |
|
Vampire Panties posted:I ride an 06 DRZ400sm, and I was curious about this carb. How hard is it to install, and what parts do I need? Also, what is the 3x3 airbox mod? I've been riding my bike bone stock for about six months now, and I'd like to step up the power some. I have to agree with everyone else though, this bike is so much fun it should be illegal. As above, see ThumperTalk for any DRZ questions, they are basically the mecca of DRZ info. I do have to say though, as much as I love TT, and the info they provide, dont buy the FCR39MX from them. Its often backordered for months, and they charge close to $600 for it. You can buy FCR39MX's on eBay all day long for around $150. After you buy the jetting needed for the DRZ, you're still right around $200. I didnt have to change the cables on my DRZ for the FCR, I did have to bend one of the cable mounts a bit, but it wasnt a big deal.
|
# ? Mar 18, 2009 20:33 |
|
Phat_Albert posted:I didnt have to change the cables on my DRZ for the FCR, I did have to bend one of the cable mounts a bit, but it wasnt a big deal. My cables were too long. Had way too much play even with them adjusted all the way out. The throttle was still usable, just real wobbly. I ordered the DRZ400E cables and they are perfect. I actually have an extra unused pair if someone needs them.
|
# ? Mar 18, 2009 20:36 |
|
pr0zac posted:It took me and my friend about three hours to get the carb in and ready to go. Its definitely worth the money, though keep in mind you'll need new throttle cables also. The airbox mod is 10 minutes with a knife at most, though you'll need to screw with jetting afterwards which can be a bit of a bitch. I disconnected the charcoal canister when I put on the clarke tank but I haven't removed it yet. It seems like the throttle response is better, but its hard to tell. I'll probably take it all off tonight, its just useless extra weight.
|
# ? Mar 18, 2009 20:58 |
|
Alright, I'm sure this will come off sounding a bit but why do people riding sumos always seem to drift everywhere? Are the tyres available in supermoto sizes just not sticky enough, is the surfeit of suspension travel to blame, or is it just because they can? I mean, I can understand if they're doing it just because it's fun, but you'd think that they would be a lot more predictable through the twisty stuff if they weren't breaking traction on every downshift.
|
# ? Mar 18, 2009 21:33 |
|
Simkin posted:Alright, I'm sure this will come off sounding a bit but why do people riding sumos always seem to drift everywhere? Are the tyres available in supermoto sizes just not sticky enough, is the surfeit of suspension travel to blame, or is it just because they can? I mean, I can understand if they're doing it just because it's fun, but you'd think that they would be a lot more predictable through the twisty stuff if they weren't breaking traction on every downshift. Basically the idea is it lets you square off the corner a lot more, scrub off speed faster, and get on the throttle sooner. Also it looks awesome. http://www.supermotoracer.com/SMR%20Tech%20stories/iss2_backitin.pdf
|
# ? Mar 18, 2009 21:42 |
|
Its not everyone. Basically its only people on the track, and even then not all of them do it. If you ever see anyone drifting on the street, count yourself lucky, its a rare (and probably illegal) sight.
|
# ? Mar 18, 2009 21:46 |
|
Thread would have also accepted: Because they can
|
# ? Mar 18, 2009 21:58 |
|
Simkin posted:Alright, I'm sure this will come off sounding a bit but why do people riding sumos always seem to drift everywhere? Are the tyres available in supermoto sizes just not sticky enough, is the surfeit of suspension travel to blame, or is it just because they can? I mean, I can understand if they're doing it just because it's fun, but you'd think that they would be a lot more predictable through the twisty stuff if they weren't breaking traction on every downshift. Because tail-sliding a bike into a parking spot is awesome?
|
# ? Mar 18, 2009 22:03 |
|
Alright, fun-ness aside, wouldn't it be quicker around a track to just rely fully on brakes (and engine braking, natch) when going into a corner, and just keep traction the whole time? It kind of sounds like the old argument for the scandinavian flick - it used to be faster to drive that way in rally, but once suspension and tyres reached a certain point, it was faster to just keep grip all the time.
|
# ? Mar 18, 2009 23:30 |
|
The TM 530 F Black Dream is super cool!
|
# ? Mar 19, 2009 04:11 |
|
Whoa I've never heard of TM They make some ugly bikes though That looks like a freaking pit bike but its a 660cc
|
# ? Mar 19, 2009 04:31 |
|
Simkin posted:Alright, fun-ness aside, wouldn't it be quicker around a track to just rely fully on brakes (and engine braking, natch) when going into a corner, and just keep traction the whole time? It kind of sounds like the old argument for the scandinavian flick - it used to be faster to drive that way in rally, but once suspension and tyres reached a certain point, it was faster to just keep grip all the time. It allows you to "cheat" the apex, time that you'd usually spend getting the bike turned, you can already be on the gas. Plus, SM tracks are slower with tighter corners, so they encourage a more loose style. You don't go faster backing it in on more open corners, but you do when you'd spend a lot of time at full lean, getting the bike to come around, so it works well on the really tight stuff. Plus it gets the bike wider and you take up more space on entrance.
|
# ? Mar 19, 2009 04:43 |
|
Alright, that makes a lot more sense. The only time I've ever had my rear tyre break loose in a (reasonably) controlled fashion, is on the track, on one particular corner, and that's under power, not under deceleration.
|
# ? Mar 19, 2009 05:16 |
|
Ok this poo poo has made me want to reconsider buying a SV650. With the DRZ400SM what sort of range would I be looking at for an average tank of gas? Are their any supermoto bikes that can handle longer range stuff comparable with a sportbike?
|
# ? Mar 19, 2009 06:01 |
|
Is the backing in/drifting stuff something an average guy can do on a supermoto? Or is it only reserved for super duper-moto riders?
|
# ? Mar 19, 2009 06:09 |
|
Gnaghi posted:Is the backing in/drifting stuff something an average guy can do on a supermoto? Or is it only reserved for super duper-moto riders? My friend was able to do it and he hasn't done much street riding. You just downshift aggressively and it makes the back wheel start to break loose while still spinning. As that article mentions it does really help if you have a slipper clutch, too.
|
# ? Mar 19, 2009 06:12 |
|
Okay, so after I fix a bunch of other poo poo in my life, I'm thinking about getting into racing. Right now I've gotten in narrowed down to: 1. A supermoto 2. A shifter cart 3. Buying another Miata and possibly doing a Spec conversion on it. Do any of you guys race sumos competitively? If so is there a national sanctioning body to sign up with or is it mostly local clubs? How much do you need to transport to the track? Do you steeple chase like on dirt bikes? And most importantly: Is that poo poo as fun as it looks? Because it looks like you should be cackling like a maniac from start to finish.
|
# ? Mar 19, 2009 06:54 |
|
Another of the DRZ army. Black SM with black frame (09) and motherfucking BARBWIRE bng's. No real engine mods, just the pipe and rejet done on delivery, (no 3x3). Plan's include setting up suspension for me and riding until the warrenty runs out, Then Pricing new gear and brake levers (or bending the OEM's so i can move them down without them hitting the frame) and Pricing a carb, cam and highseat, and seeing if that price will get me onto a 690SMC or keeps me with the Z+Mods. I don't think i can ever go back to a bike that i cant see over cars in traffic, its just so convenient. dietcokefiend posted:Ok this poo poo has made me want to reconsider buying a SV650. With the DRZ400SM what sort of range would I be looking at for an average tank of gas? Are their any supermoto bikes that can handle longer range stuff comparable with a sportbike? If your asking this its prolly not meant to be. Commuting i fill up at about 150km's, i could prolly hit 200+ but i dont have the balls to try. I commute 180km's each way when i ride to school, But i do have a corbin so its better than the standard seat and i dont do it often because I dont like loading up the bike with Km's when i can just catch the train. When on the throttle the economy drops, alot. Iv hit reserve at 100-110km's before.
|
# ? Mar 19, 2009 09:45 |
|
dietcokefiend posted:Ok this poo poo has made me want to reconsider buying a SV650. With the DRZ400SM what sort of range would I be looking at for an average tank of gas? Are their any supermoto bikes that can handle longer range stuff comparable with a sportbike? I only get about 100 miles until I hit reserve, though I'm pretty much railing the thing constantly. DRZ400SM + http://www.clarkemfg.com/cgi-bin/miva?Merchant2/merchant.mv+Screen=PROD&Store_Code=CM&Product_Code=11409&Category_Code=suzuki will get you some range, but its really not what supermotos are about. If you wanna do long distances comfortably consider the V-Strom or SV, if you want to be, as Gr3y put it, "cackling like a maniac from start to finish" get a supermotard.
|
# ? Mar 19, 2009 16:31 |
|
Gr3y posted:Okay, so after I fix a bunch of other poo poo in my life, I'm thinking about getting into racing. Right now I've gotten in narrowed down to: Where are you located? I know there's a number of Sumo orgs out here in Cali, as well as some weekend races at the kart tracks. Simkin, if you'd like to see the difference between SM style backing it in and backing it in on a streetbike, it's like this: Streetbike: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1960255438960244472&ei=u2bCSebaHp2wqAPs5om9AQ&q=siglin+backing+it+in&hl=en Supermoto: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8462378466997568582&ei=92nCSeL9Np2wqAPs5om9AQ&hl=en You'll see that Siglin's back in line before he even starts to approach the apex, whereas the SM guys will take it all the way to the apex and past it. There's some showboating in the SM video that makes look a little different, but the exaggeration there helps show the point.
|
# ? Mar 19, 2009 16:58 |
|
Thanks Z3n, I think I understand things a bit more now. Backing it in, with your knee down? loving awesome.
|
# ? Mar 19, 2009 17:31 |
|
Simkin posted:Thanks Z3n, I think I understand things a bit more now. Backing it in, with your knee down? loving awesome. Yeah, hayden's got the loving all over the place.
|
# ? Mar 19, 2009 17:34 |
|
I wish you guys would stop talking about supermotos. 1) I've had a raging boner for months now for SM's and my balls are starting to hurt. 2) You guys are making the prices on CL go through the loving roof. I've never even seen a TM before, are those availible in the US? They looks neat (expensive).
|
# ? Mar 19, 2009 17:48 |
|
pr0zac posted:I only get about 100 miles until I hit reserve, though I'm pretty much railing the thing constantly. DRZ400SM + http://www.clarkemfg.com/cgi-bin/miva?Merchant2/merchant.mv+Screen=PROD&Store_Code=CM&Product_Code=11409&Category_Code=suzuki will get you some range, but its really not what supermotos are about. If you wanna do long distances comfortably consider the V-Strom or SV, if you want to be, as Gr3y put it, "cackling like a maniac from start to finish" get a supermotard. I've put this tank on my 06 DRZ400SM, and I'm very satisfied. The range on the metal tank was just a little too short to do the day rides I like, so I switched it over. It was really easy to install and the plastic tank is considerably lighter then the metal tank (until you fill up the extra 3 gallons). I've taken my SM from san diego to huntington beach and that is about as far as I could ride it comfortably. The bike just isn't set up for long freeway travel.
|
# ? Mar 19, 2009 18:18 |
|
Vampire Panties posted:I've put this tank on my 06 DRZ400SM, and I'm very satisfied. The range on the metal tank was just a little too short to do the day rides I like, so I switched it over. It was really easy to install and the plastic tank is considerably lighter then the metal tank (until you fill up the extra 3 gallons). I've taken my SM from san diego to huntington beach and that is about as far as I could ride it comfortably. The bike just isn't set up for long freeway travel. Got any pictures? I put a small hole in my tank that I repaired with JB weld and I'm considering replacing it with the Clarke's tank, just seems to look a little goofy to me.
|
# ? Mar 19, 2009 18:20 |
|
Dubs posted:If your asking this its prolly not meant to be. Commuting i fill up at about 150km's, i could prolly hit 200+ but i dont have the balls to try. I commute 180km's each way when i ride to school, But i do have a corbin so its better than the standard seat and i dont do it often because I dont like loading up the bike with Km's when i can just catch the train. Well I just dont want to be filling the gas tank up ever single day when my commute to work is 30 miles round trip . The larger tank option does look great though. Do most dealers have the supermotos on display or is it generally a "you know what you want and you buy it on order" type of deal? I would love to see one in person to get an idea of the seating position.
|
# ? Mar 19, 2009 18:41 |
|
dietcokefiend posted:Well I just dont want to be filling the gas tank up ever single day when my commute to work is 30 miles round trip . The larger tank option does look great though. Do most dealers have the supermotos on display or is it generally a "you know what you want and you buy it on order" type of deal? I would love to see one in person to get an idea of the seating position. Most suzuki dealers will have a DRZ400 SM on the floor...they're pretty popular bikes. At least that's been the case at every suzuki showroom I've been to recently.
|
# ? Mar 19, 2009 18:44 |
|
Are replacement parts around the same price as a sportbike? Say going 10,000 miles on the average SV650 compared to the average DRZ400.
|
# ? Mar 19, 2009 18:49 |
|
Generally cheaper, as parts are both abundant and there is a huge aftermarket. I met a guy who had 65k miles on a DRZ400S (Same engine, chassis, different tires and suspension) who'd done nothing but standard fluid changes, adjustments and lubing the chain.
|
# ? Mar 19, 2009 18:56 |
|
dietcokefiend posted:Do most dealers have the supermotos on display or is it generally a "you know what you want and you buy it on order" type of deal? I would love to see one in person to get an idea of the seating position. My local Suzuki dealer generally has at least one in stock. They're pretty popular. If you're a short guy, it would behoove you to sit on one for a while and see how you like it.
|
# ? Mar 19, 2009 19:35 |
|
|
# ? May 13, 2024 10:10 |
|
Spiffness posted:Generally cheaper, as parts are both abundant and there is a huge aftermarket. Did he have any mods to the bike?
|
# ? Mar 19, 2009 19:36 |